Official SSP-800 Thread

[jericho]

It's been so long since I've used an AES/EBU balanced digital cable I couldn't tell you. I've not seen a product that has one and HDMI so right now there isn't a way to compare them.

Eric

McIntosh MCD-1000 has an AES/EBU balanced 110 Ohm digital output

[Kal Rubinson]

Well, for me it is hard to beat an AES/EBU balanced digital cable (I'm using Siltech as cable between SSP-600 and CDT-300) and I've never heard sound from an HDMI cable.

Except that AES/EBU is two channel, only.

Kal

[Harmonium]

Except that AES/EBU is two channel, only.

Kal

Who said it was only for 2 channels ? A digital audio flow from a transport to a processor is not only 2 channels to me.

[hifiguymi]

The only multi channel and AES/EBU will do is DD and dts from DVD-Video discs. It won't do multi channel PCM for things like DVD-Audio, and SACD (which the CDT-300 doesn't do). It also won't do DD+, Dolby TrueHD, dtsHD, and dtsHD Master Audio so you will never find it on BD players unless someone does it for two channel audio only.

Eric

[Kal Rubinson]

Who said it was only for 2 channels ?

I did. It is.

A digital audio flow from a transport to a processor is not only 2 channels to me.

Sure but not via AES/EBU unless it is a lossy/compressed format.

Kal

[Harmonium]

The only multi channel and AES/EBU will do is DD and dts from DVD-Video discs. It won't do multi channel PCM for things like DVD-Audio, and SACD (which the CDT-300 doesn't do). It also won't do DD+, Dolby TrueHD, dtsHD, and dtsHD Master Audio so you will never find it on BD players unless someone does it for two channel audio only.

Eric

Well, I should have said that I'm using my CDT-300 only for DVD-Video. Sorry about that !

So, will the sound will be better through an HDMI cable for a DVD-Video ?

François

[RebelMan]

So, will the sound will be better through an HDMI cable for a DVD-Video ?

Yes and no, but yes. No because the signal quality between both types of cables are audibly indistinguishable. Yes because the equipment supporting the HDMI interface has been improved over the equipment supporting the AES/EBU interface. Therefore, the overall net result will be yes.

[Harmonium]

Yes and no, but yes. No because the signal quality between both types of cables are audibly indistinguishable. Yes because the equipment supporting the HDMI interface has been improved over the equipment supporting the AES/EBU interface. Therefore, the overall net result will be yes.

Thanks for the informations. :T And what would you suggest as a HDMI cable ? I believe in cables and now I have a Siltech Golden Ridge as digital cable. But for the HDMI I have no idea what to choose.

François

[wettou]

What would you suggest as a HDMI cable ? I believe in cables and now I have a Siltech Golden Ridge as digital cable. But for the HDMI I have no idea what to choose. François

Here you are very good quality and great value http://www.bluejeanscable.com/store/...bles/index.htm

[wettou]

UPDATE I

Given the number of piecemeal threads floating around regarding the SSP-800 I felt it would be more useful to consolidate the information we currently know about the upcoming processor into a dedicated thread.

Will it have a USB port to support digital music!

[RebelMan]

Will it have a USB port to support digital music!

I believe the USB port is for service updates only not for audio signals but I am not 100% certain. Is it that important to you?

[wettou]

It would be nice just so you can plug in a hard drive as a music server

[wettou]

I heard that the Classé-SSP800 is delayed again until late June as more testing is needed! RebelMan any news?


At this rate it will be September before anything happens! August is a dead month in Canada just like in Europe everyone is on holiday, lucky them

Also maybe they will just release it with the new chips and new codec.

I would rather wait and have the quality instead of buying the first one off the assembly line and have all sort of problems even with 5 Years warranty.

[sikoniko]

FUD = Fear Uncertainty and Doubt.

[RebelMan]

Duplicate Post

[RebelMan]

I heard that the Classé-SSP800 is delayed again until late June as more testing is needed! RebelMan any news?

The information wasn't volunteered, I would have to follow up. Where are you getting your information from that leads you to believe a slip in the schedule has occurred? Classé will not knowingly release a buggy product, especially the SSP-800 where so much is riding on it. If more testing is required to ensure stability then it's the right call and I can wait.

Also maybe they will just release it with the new chips and new codec.

Sorry, not gonna happen.

[lgsdds]

Release update for SSP-800

I have some release data and it is from Dave Nauber. He said that there are some software issues with the video card which might push the release date past the anticipated "end of May' target date. I sold my SSP-600 and am anxiously awaiting its replacement, as you all are, since I am dead in the water as far as home theater goes.

[sikoniko]

With May being next week, wouldn't they be well past QA and ramping up production to prepare to ship?

[RebelMan]

With May being next week, wouldn't they be well past QA and ramping up production to prepare to ship?

Classe' tests each piece of equipment before it ships. It could be they caught more than just a few troubled systems in the process necessitating a full scale retest of certain component devices.

[wettou]

Better they test them well rather than ship units that are defective at $8G it better works perfect out of the box!!

I had a Classé amp once DOA and they exchanged it immediately so their customer service is first class as far as I am concerned

[yannparis]

HDMI vs AES vs Toslink etc...

We will have to wait ...
Denon processors have a better sound using denon link than HDMI!


External DACs have to be synchronized on incoming data and this is very difficult.

Many ways are used or combined to do so : PLL, ASRC, buffering + servo, etc...

The sound of my SSP600 depends on the source. The sound of the same record coming from my Sonos box is more detailed and clean than from my Marantz 8400. This probably means that the jitter of the Sonos+cable+SSP-600 is lower. This also means that the ability of the SSP-600 to reject jitter is not as good as Benchmark DAC1 one.

Jitter is very important if we really want to process 24 bits signals. The jitter limits the resolution.

The best way to reduce the jitter is to use a single clock near the DAC. This is why integrated players generally sound so good compared to transport+ usual external DAC.
Very good DACs have 'solutions' to reduce the jitter.
Wadia's DAC sends its clock to the transport. But the Transport has to be a Wadia... so where is the gain compared to a One box solution?
Benchmark DAC1 use a local clock. The incoming signal is synchronised using a PLL + an ASRC. The jitter rejection is very good but the local clock run at a single (110 Khz?) frequency meaning that the DAC input signal is always calculated by the ASRC. this is no longer the original signal. (N.B: The DAC1 is very good and not only for its price despite this theoric limitation. )



Regards

Yann

Paris-France

[wettou]

Which Denon are you using?

I have been debating between the new pre/pro from Denon and the Classé SSP-800.

$1K difference

[ryst]

<never mind, old info>

[RebelMan]

Update II

I have updated the original post with information regarding the SSP-800's new release dates and provided some concrete information regarding sample rates and DSD support among other useful tidbits. I also modified the post somewhat to improve readability. Enjoy.

[Hberg]

Rebel Man, thanks for the continued updates.

Did you get any feel for how confident Classe' felt about the Dealer Shipments (May/June) and Customer Delivery (June/July) dates?

[wettou]

I have updated the original post with information regarding the SSP-800's new release dates and provided some concrete information regarding sample rates and DSD support among other useful tidbits. I also modified the post somewhat to improve readability. Enjoy.

As usual, great update thank you Rebel Man.

At this stage I think we might be looking at Cedia in September for the release! That is fine by me I probably will wait until the SSP-800 ships with the new chip and supports all new codec DD True HD and DTS-Master HD so I have a unit where all the kinks have been worked out!

[RebelMan]

My pleasure Hberg.

Classé confidently expressed that they will meet the release dates (the video board issues have been fixed). But by the same token they also indicated that it will take some time to process their three month back log making the processor tough to get throughout the summer.

[RebelMan]

You are welcome wettou.

The SSP-800 will surface long before CEDIA, however, I am certain that Classé will be making their big announcement about it at the show. In both cases the product will not include the dual-processor board. If you intend to wait until it does then plan on it for next year.

[wettou]

Next year hey! Oh well I guess patience has it's virtues may I will buy it at the same time as their Blu Ray players.

Hopefully by then a few people will have tested it, reviewed it, analyzed it every which way and I will be able to make a better informed purchase decision.

I am still on the fence and would like to compare it with the new Denon pre/pro behemoth.

[RebelMan]

I am still on the fence and would like to compare it with the new Denon pre/pro behemoth.

By all means you should.

[Nolan B]

well i have to admit....this thing is looking pretty damn good. The promised update for those wanting to bitstream makes this about as "future proof" as anyone could ask for.

Honestly on the audio side I just cant see any new or "better" things around the corner like I have been able to in the past. My gut is starting to tell me there is a lot of value in this thing. Its also pretty enough that I dont have to hide it in my rack.


mmmmm....

[Nolan B]

One question for you ya rebelman..

When you say 2 CH is supposed to be the best yet from teh delta series does that mean sending a digital 2 channel source to the 800 from say optical or coax will yield a better result then the CDP-502 sending an analog signal and bypassing the 800?


Basically the 800 is the best 2CH performer of all products in the delta series regardless?

[wettou]

May be in the Delta series but not in the omega series, especially when you look how much they sell the Omega Preamplifier Mark III $16,000.

[RebelMan]

well i have to admit....this thing is looking pretty damn good. The promised update for those wanting to bitstream makes this about as "future proof" as anyone could ask for.

Honestly on the audio side I just cant see any new or "better" things around the corner like I have been able to in the past. My gut is starting to tell me there is a lot of value in this thing. Its also pretty enough that I dont have to hide it in my rack.

I enjoyed your last comment, it gave me a chuckle, but that's because I know exactly what you mean and how you feel about it. I couldn't agree more.

I also agree that it's difficult to see how all things audio could get better but rest assured that Classe' is working on it!

[ryst]

How come they left out an AES/EBU input?

[RebelMan]

One question for you ya rebelman..

When you say 2 CH is supposed to be the best yet from teh delta series does that mean sending a digital 2 channel source to the 800 from say optical or coax will yield a better result then the CDP-502 sending an analog signal and bypassing the 800?

I couldn't confirm one way or the other with any certainty. In theory the SSP-800 should perform better with the CDP-202/CDP-502 hooked up to it using the analog connections because this configuration mitigates S/PDIF induced jitter. It has been shown that interface induced jitter carries the same weight as transport induced jitter. The CDP-202 and CDP-502 attack transport induced jitter at the source thus improving the quality of the signal. Outboard DAC's (are really intended to correct transport jitter) which re-clock the signal can minimize the effects of S/PDIF induced jitter to some degree but then the original signal is altered in the process. It is likely the SSP-800 will re-clock the PCM stream to recover from the timing errors brought on by the S/PDIF interface but I don't expect it will exceed the capabilities of the CDPs to control jitter, maybe match it at best.

Basically the 800 is the best 2CH performer of all products in the delta series regardless?

Without ANY question the SSP-800 will be the best 2CH performer in Classe's entire arsenal (including the Omega Series) for now and for the foreseeable future. Although, Classe' has intentions to usurp its 2CH position with an updated pre-amplifier down the road.

[RebelMan]

How come they left out an AES/EBU input?

Because it is no longer necessary. People looking to the future will need HDMI support. The AES/EBU interface does not have the bandwidth to support MPCM nor the advanced bit-streams.

[kloepfr]

Rebel Man, thanks for the continued updates.

Did you get any feel for how confident Classe' felt about the Dealer Shipments (May/June) and Customer Delivery (June/July) dates?

I ordered now a SSP 800 in Germany. It will be shipped in July at 8500€ including a free upgrade to the HD formats later in the year 2008. Great:-))

[wettou]

I ordered now a SSP 800 in Germany. It will be shipped in July at 8500€ including a free upgrade to the HD formats later in the year 2008. Great:-))

So Classé made it official that the upgrade will be Free!!

[hifiguymi]

So Classé made it official that the upgrade will be Free!!

Yes they did. I posted that earlier (post #123) on this thread.

Eric

[wettou]

Do you have an official press release stating that the upgrade will be free?

[hifiguymi]

Do you have an official press release stating that the upgrade will be free?

It wasn't a press release per say. It was a dealer letter. I can't put it up here since it has other info just for us but it was there rest assured.

Eric

[wettou]

Ok well, when I see a press release I will believe it sorry I have heard to many rumors out there!!

[RebelMan]

Ok well, when I see a press release I will believe it sorry I have heard to many rumors out there!!

It (the free upgrade) shouldn't matter to you one way or the other right? After all you wanted to wait until the dual-DSP board was out (pre-installed) and you wanted to compare the SSP-800 to the AVP-A1HDCI. Are you reconsidering your options now? :W

[wettou]

That is correct but If I don't like the Denon, I might buy the Classé as long as the upgrade is free