dual bass arrays / active traps?

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  • capslock
    Senior Member
    • Dec 2004
    • 410

    dual bass arrays / active traps?

    I read up on bass absorbing panels, membrane absorbers and Helmholtz resonators. All very nice, but with a lowish SAF. How about active traps?

    1. classic DBA (delay between arrays)

    The one thing I came accross is a DBA (dual bass array), as it is known in German discussion boards (maybe there is another name for it in English, as I didn't get any hits on this board or diyaudio?). The idea is that you have two, preferably four subs along one side of the room, and an equal number along the opposite side. Then you feed the rear array with a signal that has been inverted and delayed by the speed of sound x the distance between the arrays.

    So, ideally, you have flat wavefront that emanates from the first array, propagates along the room and is completely absorbed by the second array, i.e. a perfect transmission line. Practically, you would still get some reflections from the side walls and ceiling to break the coherence, so cancellation is not perfect, and you would propably have to attenuate the signal to the rear array somewhat for optimum performance. Strangely, the discussions I have seen are very partisan and do not discuss the implication of those reflections. Has anybody tried this or can give a link to a more serious discussion of the effects?

    2. undelayed DBA
    An interesting variation on this concept would be to feed the rear array with the very same signal, i.e. not delayed, not inverted, as the front array. You would get cancellation along the center line of the room (or more correctly, the center plane between the two arrays) and have a transmission line from both front array to center line and rear array to center line. If you were to sit close to the rear wall, which is not unheard of, you would hear an essentially resonance free bass (which would be ahead of the midrange signal, so you would probably still want to use delay, but this time on both front and rear bass signals).

    The great thing about this DBA setup where front and rear signals are identical is that as long as the room and the arrays are symmetrical about the center plane, you also cancel all first order reflections. Surely, somebody has tried this?

    3. active bass trap
    Finally, one could use a conventional setup with one or two subs close to the main speakers and place active bass traps in two or more corners. These would consist of a sub and a microphone placed close to the sub, a low pass and a feedback circuit. There is an old patent by Nelson Pass on this, and from his comments on diyaudio, you can manage about 6 - 12 dB cancellation near the trap, which is a lot more than you can achieve with a passive absorber of the same size.
  • ThomasW
    Moderator Emeritus
    • Aug 2000
    • 10933

    #2
    #3 has been around for a long time.

    Would you post a link to the German thread where this is discussed? With the online translation sites one can an idea of what's going on.

    IB subwoofer FAQ page


    "Complicated equipment and light reflectors and various other items of hardware are enough, to my mind, to prevent the birdie from coming out." ...... Henri Cartier-Bresson

    Comment

    • dyazdani
      Moderator Emeritus
      • Oct 2005
      • 7032

      #3
      Cool ideas, though I'm not sure if there is much gain in SAF between arrays of speakers equipment and cables vs. the "static" types of acoustic treatments. I know my personal SAF would be quite low, especially with cost factored in.

      Interested to see more on the topic.
      Danish

      Comment

      • capslock
        Senior Member
        • Dec 2004
        • 410

        #4
        Doubt you need a translation for the first one, but a bottle of Schnaps would be in order before you will even stand a chance of understanding the machine translation of the subsequent links. I have a hard time following that rambling in my native language...







        Also hallo erstmal, es ist wohl an der Zeit, mal einen Thread für DBAs zu initiieren. Denn wer mit dem Gedanken spielt, sich ein DBA einzurichten, de


        Der Bau meines DBA-Subwoofers Wie ich schon häufiger in diesem Forum angesprochen habe, will ich mir ein schönes DBA bauen. Dies ist jetzt der offizi




        Comment

        • capslock
          Senior Member
          • Dec 2004
          • 410

          #5
          Originally posted by ThomasW
          #3 has been around for a long time.
          Yes, the concept is anything but new. But are there any reports as to how effective it is?

          Comment

          • ThomasW
            Moderator Emeritus
            • Aug 2000
            • 10933

            #6
            Originally posted by capslock
            Yes, the concept is anything but new. But are there any reports as to how effective it is?
            No reviews just articles and products.

            Looking at their pics makes me wonder how that approach compares with the Harman Int concept regarding the use of multiple subs?

            IB subwoofer FAQ page


            "Complicated equipment and light reflectors and various other items of hardware are enough, to my mind, to prevent the birdie from coming out." ...... Henri Cartier-Bresson

            Comment

            • AJINFLA
              Senior Member
              • Mar 2005
              • 681

              #7
              Looking at their pics makes me wonder how that approach compares with the Harman Int concept regarding the use of multiple subs?
              That's the one I'm fond of. Enough so that I'm basing my next design around it. 4-6 (sealed) subs around the room below 60-70hz and dipole mains above.
              Reduced, excursion and distorton on both subs and mains, as well as reduced (dipole) active eq requirements.
              This does look interesting, although I would need a bit more info before trying it with 6 subs. Reducing the (audible) effect of room modes should certainly be worthwhile, but so is reduced distortion from multiple output sources.

              cheers,

              AJ
              Manufacturer

              Comment

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