Macs and the Audiophile

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  • mjb
    Super Senior Member
    • Mar 2005
    • 1483

    Macs and the Audiophile

    Many of us use Macs in our systems, perhaps as music servers or sound analysers. I thought this thread could be a place to exchange idea's and software links. So fire away.....
    - Mike

    Main System:
    B&W 802D, HTM2D, SCMS
    Classé SSP-800, CA-2200, CA-5100
  • mjb
    Super Senior Member
    • Mar 2005
    • 1483

    #2
    For those who don't want to use iTunes to rip (or rip to FLAC), try XLD: http://tmkk.hp.infoseek.co.jp/xld/index_e.html

    Max is another, and it allows control over what type of error correction is used for audio extraction: http://sbooth.org/Max/
    Last edited by mjb; 29 August 2009, 02:06 Saturday.
    - Mike

    Main System:
    B&W 802D, HTM2D, SCMS
    Classé SSP-800, CA-2200, CA-5100

    Comment

    • littlesaint
      Senior Member
      • Jul 2007
      • 823

      #3
      I've been using Songbird for music playback. It has a lot to offer beyond iTunes, but I can't seem to cut the cord to iTunes entirely. Play from sbooth.org is nice as well.
      Santino

      The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.

      Comment

      • JonMarsh
        Mad Max Moderator
        • Aug 2000
        • 15261

        #4
        Just got an RME Fireface 800; plan to use it for playback (ultra low jitter clock system and 24/192 capability, plus using Pure Vinyl for analog ripping of SACD from my Marantz SA-11, particularly single layer disks with no hybrid layer.

        I've also just bought six albums from HD Tracks music, (including Robert Plant/Allison Krause "Raising Sand" and getting setup to play them - and of course, just got in a new hard drive and RAM upgrade for my Mac Mini- but time's a little short for getting that done immediately.

        BTW, no issues so far with upgrading to Snow Leopard- it does have some useful UI polish, and it is snappier than Leopard.

        I'll post about results as I get it pulled together- before RMAF I hope, as I plan to take the system there.
        the AudioWorx
        Natalie P
        M8ta
        Modula Neo DCC
        Modula MT XE
        Modula Xtreme
        Isiris
        Wavecor Ardent

        SMJ
        Minerva Monitor
        Calliope
        Ardent D

        In Development...
        Isiris Mk II updates- in final test stage!
        Obi-Wan
        Saint-Saëns Symphonique/AKA SMJ-40
        Modula PWB
        Calliope CC Supreme
        Natalie P Ultra
        Natalie P Supreme
        Janus BP1 Sub


        Resistance is not futile, it is Volts divided by Amperes...
        Just ask Mr. Ohm....

        Comment

        • Alaric
          Ultra Senior Member
          • Jan 2006
          • 4143

          #5
          Jon , how do you like 'Raising Sand'?
          Lee

          Marantz PM7200-RIP
          Marantz PM-KI Pearl
          Schiit Modi 3
          Marantz CD5005
          Paradigm Studio 60 v.3

          Comment

          • mjb
            Super Senior Member
            • Mar 2005
            • 1483

            #6


            Lee, I'm sure its amazing.

            Any on topic comments?
            - Mike

            Main System:
            B&W 802D, HTM2D, SCMS
            Classé SSP-800, CA-2200, CA-5100

            Comment

            • mjb
              Super Senior Member
              • Mar 2005
              • 1483

              #7
              Originally posted by JonMarsh
              I've also just bought six albums from HD Tracks music, (including Robert Plant/Allison Krause "Raising Sand" and getting setup to play them - and of course, just got in a new hard drive and RAM upgrade for my Mac Mini- but time's a little short for getting that done immediately.

              BTW, no issues so far with upgrading to Snow Leopard- it does have some useful UI polish, and it is snappier than Leopard.

              I'll post about results as I get it pulled together- before RMAF I hope, as I plan to take the system there.
              I've also just done a Mac Mini processor/ram/HD upgrade, and wow, what a difference! Also very pleased with Snow Leopard. No issues, and as you say, its much much snappier.
              - Mike

              Main System:
              B&W 802D, HTM2D, SCMS
              Classé SSP-800, CA-2200, CA-5100

              Comment

              • Hberg
                Member
                • Apr 2008
                • 95

                #8
                I use a 2009 Mac Mini 2.26Ghz, 4GB with a Newertech miniStack V3 1.0TB 7200 32MB Cache Drive attached via Firewire 800. I use it for all my iTunes that I record using the Apple Lossless method. I have upgraded to Snow Leopard, and everything seems to function properly.

                The only exception I have is with the Elgato TV Hybrid and EyeTV. Right now EyeTV is only allowing Stereo Output for all my OTA Broadcasts, and I am unable to use Digital Audio Out. Elgato is aware of the problem and trying to resolve the issue. It seems to be a problem for a number of individuals using the latest version of EyeTV and Snow Leopard.
                "If 'A' equals success, then the formula is 'A = _ X + Y + Z.' 'X' is work. 'Y' is play. 'Z' is keeping your mouth shut." -- Albert Einstein

                Comment

                • littlesaint
                  Senior Member
                  • Jul 2007
                  • 823

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Hberg
                  I use a 2009 Mac Mini 2.26Ghz, 4GB with a Newertech miniStack V3 1.0TB 7200 32MB Cache Drive attached via Firewire 800. I use it for all my iTunes that I record using the Apple Lossless method. I have upgraded to Snow Leopard, and everything seems to function properly.

                  The only exception I have is with the Elgato TV Hybrid and EyeTV. Right now EyeTV is only allowing Stereo Output for all my OTA Broadcasts, and I am unable to use Digital Audio Out. Elgato is aware of the problem and trying to resolve the issue. It seems to be a problem for a number of individuals using the latest version of EyeTV and Snow Leopard.
                  How's that working out with the ministack? I'm debating between picking up one of those or swapping out the internal drive with a larger, faster one.

                  Also, what are people preferences for audio transport -- USB or mini optical? I know some swear by USB, but I've also read that if you don't have drivers for your DAC, the USB is limited to 48/16. I'm purposely leaving out Firewire since those DACs are usually found on the recording side and not consumer gear. I have an M-Audio Firewire Solo which does a good job, but I need that for recording, so I'm going to replace it with something from the consumer side. Probably a DACMagic, V-DAC, or Emotiva's upcoming standalone DAC.
                  Santino

                  The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.

                  Comment

                  • Hberg
                    Member
                    • Apr 2008
                    • 95

                    #10
                    Originally posted by littlesaint
                    How's that working out with the ministack? I'm debating between picking up one of those or swapping out the internal drive with a larger, faster one.

                    Also, what are people preferences for audio transport -- USB or mini optical? I know some swear by USB, but I've also read that if you don't have drivers for your DAC, the USB is limited to 48/16. I'm purposely leaving out Firewire since those DACs are usually found on the recording side and not consumer gear. I have an M-Audio Firewire Solo which does a good job, but I need that for recording, so I'm going to replace it with something from the consumer side. Probably a DACMagic, V-DAC, or Emotiva's upcoming standalone DAC.
                    The miniStack off the Mac Mini works fine. The great thing is that I can access it and the files using my MacBook Pro. I have no sense of lag with the iTunes library stored on the miniStack, and the miniStack offers plenty of space.

                    Personally, I went with the mini-Toslink (mini optical) connection to my Classe' SSP-800. It sounds great! I did not see the need for a stand alone DAC.
                    "If 'A' equals success, then the formula is 'A = _ X + Y + Z.' 'X' is work. 'Y' is play. 'Z' is keeping your mouth shut." -- Albert Einstein

                    Comment

                    • Brandon B
                      Super Senior Member
                      • Jun 2001
                      • 2193

                      #11
                      We've got 2 ministacks (an older ATA and a newer SATA drive version) as well as one of their mercury elite pros and one of the little plastic mercury on the go units.

                      All are decent enclosures (put in my own drives). Only thing I would ding the ministacks on is that once they start to get a little dust clogged, the fans run a lot more than they need to. In our house, this took about 3-4 months. You can open them up and clean them out, but they clog back up.

                      I hav one of the WD greenpower drives in the newer one, and it is a lot better since that drive puts out a lot less heat.

                      In general, OWC's stuff is decent and they have great support. I'd upgrade the mini's drive too, if I were at it. Redundancy is always a good thing and you can get a 320GB drive for the minis for under $70.

                      Jon - any news back on Snow Leopard leaving the bitstream unsullied for sure?
                      BB

                      Comment

                      • JonMarsh
                        Mad Max Moderator
                        • Aug 2000
                        • 15261

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Alaric
                        Jon , how do you like 'Raising Sand'?
                        I like the album quite a bit, but I haven't gotten setup to listen to the High Rez version yet, there's a lot of stuff going on here lately! I'm curious to see how it compares, as I've been making other system upgrades, and a new "conventional" DAC on the way, too.
                        the AudioWorx
                        Natalie P
                        M8ta
                        Modula Neo DCC
                        Modula MT XE
                        Modula Xtreme
                        Isiris
                        Wavecor Ardent

                        SMJ
                        Minerva Monitor
                        Calliope
                        Ardent D

                        In Development...
                        Isiris Mk II updates- in final test stage!
                        Obi-Wan
                        Saint-Saëns Symphonique/AKA SMJ-40
                        Modula PWB
                        Calliope CC Supreme
                        Natalie P Ultra
                        Natalie P Supreme
                        Janus BP1 Sub


                        Resistance is not futile, it is Volts divided by Amperes...
                        Just ask Mr. Ohm....

                        Comment

                        • JonMarsh
                          Mad Max Moderator
                          • Aug 2000
                          • 15261

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Brandon B
                          We've got 2 ministacks (an older ATA and a newer SATA drive version) as well as one of their mercury elite pros and one of the little plastic mercury on the go units.

                          All are decent enclosures (put in my own drives). Only thing I would ding the ministacks on is that once they start to get a little dust clogged, the fans run a lot more than they need to. In our house, this took about 3-4 months. You can open them up and clean them out, but they clog back up.

                          I hav one of the WD greenpower drives in the newer one, and it is a lot better since that drive puts out a lot less heat.

                          In general, OWC's stuff is decent and they have great support. I'd upgrade the mini's drive too, if I were at it. Redundancy is always a good thing and you can get a 320GB drive for the minis for under $70.

                          Jon - any news back on Snow Leopard leaving the bitstream unsullied for sure?
                          BB
                          I haven't seen anyone running a test on it, but iTunes is not that tweaked yet; there's still carbon libraries in it, and as far as I know the "claimed" core audio performance has not changed at all.

                          Sometimes people make claims about iTunes not ripping as well as EAC, but I've tested it twice myself in the past, and found it bit perfect. Computer Audiophile has too. That's an interesting site for those following this path.

                          I've got a new high rez analog ripping software that I'm setting up, and it has a playback engine that works with iTunes, and optionally can provide an upsampling engine for 44/16 material using their own 64 bit engine; they also have custom decimation program for going from 24/192 or 24/96 down to 44/16. It's called Pure Vinyl, it's pretty neat what it does for a little over $200.

                          BTW, on the subject of HD in Mini's and mini stacks, I do have a mini-stack with an Hitachi Enterprise class 1 TB drive but I just got in a new 750GB WD to up grade the mini itself- with sleep modes, sometimes the external loses the connection. That will take me from 320 to 750; I didn't have any problems with upgrading my MBP from 320 to 500 last Christmas, so I'm hoping this one goes as smooth- upping the RAM at the same time.
                          the AudioWorx
                          Natalie P
                          M8ta
                          Modula Neo DCC
                          Modula MT XE
                          Modula Xtreme
                          Isiris
                          Wavecor Ardent

                          SMJ
                          Minerva Monitor
                          Calliope
                          Ardent D

                          In Development...
                          Isiris Mk II updates- in final test stage!
                          Obi-Wan
                          Saint-Saëns Symphonique/AKA SMJ-40
                          Modula PWB
                          Calliope CC Supreme
                          Natalie P Ultra
                          Natalie P Supreme
                          Janus BP1 Sub


                          Resistance is not futile, it is Volts divided by Amperes...
                          Just ask Mr. Ohm....

                          Comment

                          • numberoneoppa
                            Senior Member
                            • Sep 2009
                            • 535

                            #14
                            Originally posted by mjb
                            For those who don't want to use iTunes to rip (or rip to FLAC), try XLD: http://tmkk.hp.infoseek.co.jp/xld/index_e.html

                            Max is another, and it allows control over what type of error correction is used for audio extraction: http://sbooth.org/Max/
                            Yes, XLD is the only ripper for mac that allows for proper rips will full log and .cue support. If you can't use EAC, use XLD. :P

                            edit: I find it strange that any of you use iTunes with its horrible native file support. Any love for Cog out there?
                            -Josh

                            That feeling when things are finally going right. Yeah, that one.

                            Comment

                            • littlesaint
                              Senior Member
                              • Jul 2007
                              • 823

                              #15
                              You might want to checkout sbooth.org. The guy there has some very nice tools. Rip for high-quality rips to lossless and uncompressed formats. Max for conversion to other formats. Play for music playback. Play uses 32bit floating-point processing for all audio files, utilizes Apple's Core Audio and Audio Units for DSP effects. It also uses ReplayGain for volume normalization.
                              Santino

                              The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.

                              Comment

                              • Crimson
                                Moderator Emeritus
                                • Aug 2000
                                • 131

                                #16
                                Is anyone here running Amarra by Sonic Studio? I have it set up with RME, Wavelength, and Apogee dacs using OS 10.6 and everything works without any issues (and SS just released v1.0.2).
                                Q.

                                Comment

                                • littlesaint
                                  Senior Member
                                  • Jul 2007
                                  • 823

                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by numberoneoppa
                                  Yes, XLD is the only ripper for mac that allows for proper rips will full log and .cue support. If you can't use EAC, use XLD. :P

                                  edit: I find it strange that any of you use iTunes with its horrible native file support. Any love for Cog out there?
                                  Well, I only use Apple Lossless for my server, and iTunes Plus (256bit AAC, VBR) for my iPhone, so it's not horrible to me. As I use Rip, Max, and Play more, iTunes becomes more of a store front-end and less an audio solution, but I still stick with the Apple codecs.
                                  Santino

                                  The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing.

                                  Comment

                                  • Hberg
                                    Member
                                    • Apr 2008
                                    • 95

                                    #18
                                    Originally posted by littlesaint
                                    Well, I only use Apple Lossless for my server, and iTunes Plus (256bit AAC, VBR) for my iPhone, so it's not horrible to me. As I use Rip, Max, and Play more, iTunes becomes more of a store front-end and less an audio solution, but I still stick with the Apple codecs.
                                    I only import CDs in to iTunes, and I only use Apple Lossless.
                                    "If 'A' equals success, then the formula is 'A = _ X + Y + Z.' 'X' is work. 'Y' is play. 'Z' is keeping your mouth shut." -- Albert Einstein

                                    Comment

                                    • Brandon B
                                      Super Senior Member
                                      • Jun 2001
                                      • 2193

                                      #19
                                      Trying to run a 24 bit 44.1Khz FLAC through iTunes. I can get it to play using Fluke, a program that relabels the files as .mov and they will then play in iTunes, but will not stream to other output devices (an aTV in this case), nor are they visible as part of the library when browsing from the aTV. Anyone find a way to get this to work with something other than Fluke?

                                      I'd just convert them to ALAC, but then they go from 24 bits to 16. Which brings up another question - anyone think there will be an audible difference between 16 and 24 bit files if they are both at 44.1Khz? Or are we already past the point of diminishing return for SNR at 16 bits anyway?

                                      Comment

                                      • mjb
                                        Super Senior Member
                                        • Mar 2005
                                        • 1483

                                        #20
                                        Fluke adds the necessary library components for FLAC support, but not on the ATV which would need them too for playback, assuming the file even gets that far which I doubt. (http://blowintopieces.com/fluke/)

                                        There is a huge difference between 16 and 24 bit (bit depth), the question is whether you can hear it! Why not convert a copy of the files to ALAC and see if you're satified with the results?
                                        - Mike

                                        Main System:
                                        B&W 802D, HTM2D, SCMS
                                        Classé SSP-800, CA-2200, CA-5100

                                        Comment

                                        • Brandon B
                                          Super Senior Member
                                          • Jun 2001
                                          • 2193

                                          #21
                                          Equipment-wise, I am unable to do that for a month or so as I am replacing the speakers in my second system.

                                          How would you characterize the difference in the sound when increasing bit depth only?

                                          My curiosity basically is built around the Beatles FLAC release. I bought the mono box set, and was unlikely to pick up the stereo set, but might try (if they do another prodution run) if the quality is a decent jump from the RBCD version.

                                          Comment

                                          • mjb
                                            Super Senior Member
                                            • Mar 2005
                                            • 1483

                                            #22
                                            In case you missed it, Apple has just dropped the price of the Mini in non-US markets.

                                            If your answer to the question "how would you change Apple's Mac mini" was to give it a lower price, rejoice, for Apple has listened to your sage advice. Unamerican markets around the world are waking up to the news that the mini desktop computer has shrunken in price -- by €100 in Europe and by £50 in the UK -- but the same can't be said about Apple's home turf, with the US starting price remaining stagnant at $699. This is probably in response to the dollar's continuing decline relative to other currencies, and the quiet nature of this pricing alteration leads us to suspect that it won't, sadly, be jumping to the good old USA any time soon. C'est la vie. [Thanks, Andre]


                                            And in the UK:

                                            - Mike

                                            Main System:
                                            B&W 802D, HTM2D, SCMS
                                            Classé SSP-800, CA-2200, CA-5100

                                            Comment

                                            • wettou
                                              Ultra Senior Member
                                              • May 2006
                                              • 3389

                                              #23
                                              Building a Movie Server based on Mac Mini

                                              Hello

                                              I would like to build a movie server using a mac mini.

                                              Here is what I am interested in doing:
                                              - Replace the hard drive with a SSD

                                              Now I am completely ignorant as to Windows and programs that will allow me to burn blu ray to hard drive.

                                              Any help would be appreciated :T
                                              Farming looks mighty easy when your plow is a pencil, and you're a thousand miles from the corn field."Dwight D. Eisenhower

                                              Comment

                                              • mjb
                                                Super Senior Member
                                                • Mar 2005
                                                • 1483

                                                #24
                                                You can use MakeMKV (http://www.makemkv.com/) to RIP a BLU-RAY on the Mac (there's a PC version too).

                                                Run the resulting MKV file through Handbrake (http://handbrake.fr/) if you need to turn it into an MP4 to play in iTunes or on a PS3.

                                                The MP4 files can be stored on your Mac server, in or out of iTunes.
                                                - Mike

                                                Main System:
                                                B&W 802D, HTM2D, SCMS
                                                Classé SSP-800, CA-2200, CA-5100

                                                Comment

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