RSP 1098 Wish List V2.0

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  • Aussie Geoff
    Super Senior Member
    • Oct 2003
    • 1914

    RSP 1098 Wish List V2.0

    Hi,
    This is my attempt at a V2.0 Wish list of enhancements for the Rotel RSP 1098

    This updated list is based on feedback on the V1.0 list published in a separate thread within this forum and a second consolidated view of all the other threads I can find in this and several other forums. Thank you to everyone for their feedback and encouragement so far. If I have missed a posted suggestion from one of you, I apologise just add the suggestion to this thread and it won’t get lost .

    Specifically I have:
    • Restructured the list to focus more on the requirement first before looking at any implementation details.
    • Tried to take on board all feedback and new suggestions since the original list was published.
    • Simplified and shortened the explanations where possible.
    • Given some sense of competitive coverage of similar features.
    • Separated out features that are expected to require hardware upgrades.


    All my previous disclaimers / comments apply. Netted down:
    • The 1098 is a great sounding processor with an impressive set of features for the price. This list is about options of making it even more flexible rather than any criticism of the current unit.
    • This is the Club Rotel users list, not mine.
    • Not all features will suit everybody, the question is do they add worthwhile value or flexibility to the 1098.
    • Known faults are not included as these are tracked and handled separately by Rotel.
    • Club Rotel member’s don’t expect Rotel to necessarily implement all the suggestions (though it would be nice ) – just that they seriously consider each of them for a future release in the same way as they did for the RSP 1066.


    In terms of competitive comparison I have focused on:
    • Anthem - The Anthem AVM 20 running software version 2.1
    • B&K - The B&K Reference 50
    • Lexicon - is the Lexicon MC-8 and the MC-12 (which I know is way more expensive but still shows what it possible...)


    For the purposes of grouping wish list requests I have used the following classifications:
    • Firmware – A change that can probably be implemented using one or more items of firmware in the RSP 1098 (including the DSP firmware and the TFT firmware).
    • Hardware – A change that is expected to require a hardware upgrade to the RSP 1098 (e.g. a new board replacing an existing one).
    • New Model – A change that is likely to require a new model processor to implement (in the same way as some of the requested changes to the RSP 1066 required the 1098!


    Lastly (before we get into it) it would be easy for a non 1098 owner to read this list and think "wow there's lots wrong with / missing from the 1098". The reality is the RSP 1098 sounds awesome (beating even the Lexicon for many ears) and is a world class processor with many features not found in most other HT processors (such as 500ms group delay, HDCD support, component video up-sampling etc). It's just that this list focuses on things that Rotel 1098 owners (or others who have considered the Rotel) would also like to see (hard to please some people)! We HT lovers are a dedicated bunch and it is these kind of "pushing the envelope" requests that have continued to make HT processors and the HT experience better and better!

    Based on the great ideas people have come up with, the responsiveness of Rotel with the RSP 1066 improvements, and the awesome calibre of the RSP 1098, the next 2 years should be an exiting journey.

    Enjoy!



    Bass Management – Firmware

    Summary of requests:
    • Bass Peak Level Management – Option to limit the maximum bass peaks on the SUB channel to a specified number of Db (based on calibration to reference level)
    • Deep Bass Filter – Option to filter out deep bass from the SUB and LARGE speakers to avoid over excursion for bass that is below the frequency the SUB or LARGE speaker can handle (different filter frequencies for SUB and speakers)
    • Bass Redirect from SMALL to LARGE – Option to redirect bass from SMALL speakers to specified LARGE speakers
    • Centre Speaker LARGE – Option to set the Centre Speaker to Large even when the Front speakers are small
    • Room Resonance Filter – Notch filter for offsetting bass room resonances.
    • Bass Test Tone – Support for a special Bass Test tone of (say) noise from 16 to 100 Hz.
    • Varied Subwoofer settings by listening mode – Allow ADVANCED setting where subwoofer set-up can be varied by listening mode (2ch PCM, DTS, etc)


    Bass Peak Level Management

    Benefit: Avoid overdriving subwoofers with high volume bass.

    Competitive Perspective: Included in Anthem, B&K and Lexicon processors under various names. Part of THX certification requirement.

    Implementation: Additional parameter on the SUB output with a value of OFF or the number of Db to limit the volume at. Db level is set based on reference calibration of subwoofer.

    Deep Bass Filter

    Benefit: Avoid overdriving subwoofers or speakers with deep bass below their output capabilities.

    Competitive Perspective: Not available in 3 reference processors.

    Implementation: Additional parameter on the SUB and LARGE speaker outputs. Would have selectable cut-off frequency (e.g. for Subwoofers 20, 16, 14, 12 and 10Hz, and for LARGE speakers 40, 36, 32 etc).

    Bass Redirect from SMALL to LARGE

    Benefit: Allow configurations with full range LARGE speakers to send redirected bass from SMALL speakers to them while still having LFE bass sent to the SUB.

    Competitive Perspective: Versions of this feature (with varying implementations) are included in Anthem, B&K and Lexicon processors. As you would expect the Lexicon is the most sophisticated with tiered bass redirection across multiple speakers.

    Implementation: Parameter on LARGE speakers to specify whether the speaker is to receive redirected bass and if so the source (all, left speakers only, right speakers only). Redirected bass sent to LARGE speakers would not also be sent to the SUB

    Centre Speaker “LARGE”

    Benefits: Supports set-ups with a dedicated subwoofer slaved off the speaker outputs of the centre channel.

    Competitive Perspective: All three competing Dolby and THX certified HT processors referenced above (Anthem, B&K and Lexicon) support this.

    Implementation: Upgrade on firmware to remove current restriction that sets stops a CENTRE setting of LARGE once FRONT is set to SMALL.

    Room Resonance Filter

    Benefits: Allows compensation for the bass standing wave effect that creates a “boom” in the low bass in many HT rooms.

    Competitive Positioning: Implemented in the Anthem and B&K Processor.

    Implementation: Support an optional notch filter for the bass to compensate for room resonances due to standing waves. The filter would have a variable centre frequency, width and volume cut (e.g. filter centred on 43hz, with a width of 6hz and filter depth of -7db).

    Bass Test Tone

    Benefits: Provides a tailored signal for setting subwoofer levels.

    Competitive Positioning: Implemented in the Anthem and B&K Processor as a single frequency and a sweep tone.

    Implementation: Firmware change to allow a bass test tone to be generated with a range of options at:
    • Nominated frequency (e.g. 21 hz).
    • Bass Noise in a range (say 16hz to 100hz)
    • Frequency Sweep over a nominated range.

    The bass noise would be used for general subwoofer level setting, while the frequency sweep is used to detect room resonances for the notch filter.

    Varied Subwoofer Settings By Listening Mode

    Benefits: Recognises differences in bass requirements between listening modes. For example, set sub to MAX only for 2 channel stereo mode (2ch PCM) and only to YES for all other formats (DTS, DD, etc.).

    Competitive Positioning: Implemented in the Lexicon, Anthem and B&K Processor via various forms.

    Implementation: Under advanced speaker settings enable varied Subwoofer settings by listening mode (2ch PCM, DTS, etc) E.g.
    a) Choice of NONE, YES, MAX, etc depending on mode
    b) Vary the low pass crossover points depending on mode
    Currently the subwoofer options by mode under Advanced Speaker Settings are not adjustable.


    Bass Management – Probable New Model requirement

    Summary of requests:
    • Adjustable Bass Redirect Frequency for the Mult-Input – Support an adjustable frequency for the Bass redirect on the analogue Multi inputs (currently this is fixed at 100hz)
    • Separate Control over 2 SUB outputs – Ability to separately control parameters for the two SUB outputs including features such as distance, the type of bass sent to the output etc.
    • Third SUB Output – Support for a third SUB output, also able to be separately controlled in terms of features such as distance, the type of bass sent to the output etc.


    Adjustable Bass Redirect Frequency for the Multi Input

    Benefits: The problem being solved is the interaction between the original signal in the multi-inputs and the processing of the directed bass sent to the subwoofer. Take for example typical large front speakers that have native bass down to the 30-40Hz range. With the current fixed 100 hz implementation, the bass between 30 and 100Hz will be duplicated at the same volume in the subwoofer, effectively creating a 3db bass boost until the natural drop off of the main speakers counteracts this. This feature would avoid this by allowing tailoring of the level of redirected bass to match the speaker’s natural roll-off.

    Implementation: Digitally processing of the duplicated multi-inputs to apply variable bass filters for each channel approximating the roll off of each speaker to create the bass channel. The original analogue multi inputs are sent unchanged to the speakers as pure analogue signals. Believed to require A/D converters for the duplicated multi-inputs (understood to be not currently in the RSP 1098).

    Separate Control over 2 SUB outputs

    Benefit: Allow configurations with two separate subwoofers to control them separately, reflecting aspects such as different physical characteristics or placements of the subwoofers.

    Competitive Perspective: In the Lexicon MC-12 but not the MC-8. Not in the B&K or Anthem.

    Implementation: Separate parameters for each subwoofer including features such as distance, type of bass sent, bass level etc. Under ADVANCED options would be customisable for different sound modes (STEREO, DTS etc). Understood to require both a second Digital Signal Processor (DSP) and additional and D/A converters.

    Third SUB Output

    Benefit: Support for complex home theatre configurations with 3 separate subwoofers (e.g. One for LFE, one for redirected bass from the left hand speakers, and one for redirected bass from Right hand speakers.)

    Competitive Perspective: In the Lexicon MC-12 but not the MC-8. Not in the B&K or Anthem,

    Implementation: Separate parameters for each subwoofer including features such as distance, type of bass sent, bass level etc. Under ADVANCED options would be customisable for different sound modes (STEREO, DTS etc). Understood to require both a second Digital Signal Processor (DSP) and additional and D/A converters.


    Sound Processing – Firmware

    Summary of requests:
    • Speaker Levels in 0.5db Increments – Option to adjust speaker levels in 0.5db increments as part of set-up to more finely balance relative speaker volumes.
    • Volume Control in 0.5db Increments – Option to have the Volume Control operate in 0.5db increments.
    • Variable Speed Volume Control – Option to have the speed of volume changes increase the longer the volume key on the remote control is pressed.
    • Finer Control of Speaker Distances – Ability to control speaker distances (and hence delay times) in increments of less than 0.3m
    • Adjustable Crossover Settings for Contour Control – Option to vary the crossover point for the Contour control
    • Dolby ProLogic IIx – Support for the Dolby Labs ProLogic IIx format..
    • THX Ultra Processing – Support for a THX Ultra Processing features.
    • Dynamic Range Compression on all Source Types – Support for option of varying degrees of dynamic range compression for all source types (DTS, Prologic, etc.) instead of just Dolby Digital.
    • Master Level Nominalisation by Source – Option to vary the master level by plus or minus a specified number of Db for specific inputs and source type in order to better match the relative volumes between sources.


    Speaker Levels in 0.5db increments

    Benefits: Finer balancing of levels between different speakers.

    Competitive Perspective: Available in all three competitive processors.

    Implementation: Firmware change, could either make 0.5db standard (as it is on other high end processors) or an option if Rotel prefers that.

    Volume Control in 0.5db increments

    Benefits: Finer control over master volume.

    Competitive Perspective: Available in all three competitive processors.

    Implementation: Additional Volume Control setting of FINE.

    Variable Speed Volume Control

    Benefits: Allows both the fine volume adjustment of the “SLOW” setting and the rapid adjustments of the “FAST” setting.

    Competitive Perspective: Not available in any of the three competing processors.

    Implementation: Additional Volume control setting of “VARIABLE” to complement the “FAST”, “MEDIUM” and “SLOW” settings. Variable would start moving in 0.5 or 1db increments and progressively speed up to 3db if pressed for an extended time.

    Finer control of Speaker Distances

    Benefits: Finer matching of sound field between different speakers.

    Competitive Perspective: Available in all three competitive processors.

    Implementation: Firmware changed to support increments of either 4 inches (0.1m) or 0.5ft (0.15m) depending on ease of implementation for Rotel.

    Adjustable Crossover Setting for Contour Control

    Benefits: More precise adjustment of for speaker characteristics.

    Competitive Positioning: Each competing processor has its own (fairly flexible) sound equalisation options.

    Implementation: Option to vary the crossover frequency for the high and low contour controls (e.g. low could be 200, 400, 800 Hz etc).

    Dolby ProLogic IIx

    Benefit: Provides enhanced 7 channel operation in some circumstances and support for the newest sound formats.

    Competitive Perspective: Not yet in any competitive processor, but expected in 2004.

    Implementation: Understood to require firmware upgrades to both the main firmware and the DSP firmware. Core firmware for the DSP processor in the 1098 has already been demonstrated by Cirrus.

    THX Ultra Processing

    Benefit: Rebalances many THX processed mixes, especially the rear channels. Also allows THX Ultra certification for the1098.

    Competitive Perspective: Available in all three competitive processors.

    Implementation: Understood to require firmware upgrades to both the main firmware and the DSP firmware. This includes extra THX Ultra parameters and options. Core THX Ultra 2 firmware for the DSP processor in the 1098 is available from Cirrus.

    Note: Some Club Rotel users have suggested that Rotel avoid this on the grounds that they believe the THX certification process would push the RSP 1098’s price up. This features is therefore requested ONLY on a cost neutral basis (i.e. no price rise).

    Dynamic Range Compression on all Source Types

    Benefits: Supports listening at times when very loud peaks etc aren’t acceptable.

    Competitive Perspective: All three competing processors support this for DTS. Many HT receivers (such as Sony) support if for all digital inputs.

    Implementation: Firmware only.

    Master Level Nominalisation by Source

    Benefits: Allows relative levels between sources to be set to avoid sudden changes in volume when switching between sources.

    Competitive Perspective: The Lexicon processor supports this for Analogue and Digital sources, while the Anthem supports this for all Analogue Sources.

    Implementation: Firmware only to support a SET-UP option of maintaining a relative adjustment of plus or minus a specified number of db for each source and signal type. For example adjusting the relative levels of the analogue and digital inputs for a CD player, or adjusting the level of a Satellite box to match that of a DVD player.


    Sound Processing – New Model

    Context: In looking at some of the requested features and the implementation across competitive processors and HT receivers it became clear that there is a fundamental limitation in most HT processors that relates to the combination of the capability of the DSP (Digital Signal Processing) chips and the number of D/A (Digital to Analogue Converters). Essentially most manufacturers (Rotel included) implement a single DSP from one of the major manufacturers. Increasingly the latest generations of these chips have 8 channels, supporting up to 7.1 processing or 5.1 with a 2 channel; second zone. Rotel use the latest Cirrus 8 Channel DSP in the 1098. Matching this, the vendors implement 8 channels of D/A converters (there is nothing that extra channels can do without the DSP to drive it. Now in the Lexicon MC-12 and some high end Receivers (e.g. the Denon 5803) vendors have 2 or 3 DSP devices. When matched with additional D/A converters this gives a dazzling range of possible features for the most sophisticated HT installations.

    The options below are all based on a “what if” Rotel had a new model 1098 (say the 1099) with dual DSPs and extra D/As in the same way that Lexicon have the MX-8 and MC-12. Essentially this would give up to 16 channels of controllable output.

    Summary of requests which all use the 8 extra channels:
    • 3 Separately Controllable SUB outputs – Separate control of up to 3 subwoofers (covered above under Bass Processing.
    • 5.1 Channel Second Zone – Second zone could be up to 5.1 channels (or even 7.1 if the 2 extra SUB channels or extra 2 CENTRE channels weren’t used.
    • Matrix Front Side Speakers – Option of using 2 outputs for a matrixed signal for the front side channel (derived using font and surround channels). There are some people (must have large HT rooms) that swear by this type of thing. Yamaha have had it for years on their high end receivers (they call it front effects speakers) and some others are adding variations to it.
    • 3 Separately Controllable CENTRE Channels – Option of using 2 or 3 centre channels to better position dialogue (as per commercial cinema sound implementations). The three channel set-up mimics the system used in larger commercial cinemas to better position dialogue behind the screen. In the commercial formats this is recorded as separate channels. Essentially there is a left centre and a right centre. This can (to an extent) be back derived on discrete 5.1 systems by matrix processing between the front left and centre and front right and centre. Apparently some HT installers are doing this already for some “big money” projection systems with the 3 centre speakers behind or below the screen.
    • Third Zone – A third 2 channel zone could be created for houses that just have to have music everywhere.


    I have not put in any more description, but would be happy to expand on the suggestions if queried.


    Display / User Interface Improvements – Firmware Upgrade

    Summary of requests:
    • Auto Blank Option for TFT Display – Option to have the TFT display automatically blank after a selectable number of seconds without a command.
    • Selectable Font Size for Volume – Inclusion of HDMI input and output ports.
    • -S-Video and Component Images on the TFT Display – Support for S-Video and Component images on the TFT display.
    • Digital Source Details Display – Option to display details of the digital source on the display (bit rate, channels. Dialogue normalisation level etc.
    • Scrollable List of Source Inputs – Show list of source inputs on TFT display when scrolling through to select. Unused inputs could be turned off, making scrolling even faster.
    • Scrollable List of Sound Modes – Show list of sound modes on display when scrolling through to select. Option of turning off sound modes not wanted by user to keep list short.
    • Primary and Alternate Settings for Each Source – The ability to define an alternative default set of settings for each input and toggle between them.


    Auto Blank Option for TFT

    Benefits: Allows for a “lights out” HT experience without the potential confusion of a permanently turned off TFT display.

    Competitive Perspective: No one else has a TFT!

    Implementation: Option where the TFT display automatically blanks out after a specified period of no changes to settings (e.g. 10, 15 or 20 seconds).

    Selectable Font Size for Volume

    Benefits: Allows visibility of volume setting at difference distances according to users preferences.

    Competitive Perspective: No one else has a TFT!

    Implementation: Support selection between several font sizes for the volume display on the TFT. Say from SMALL (what we have now) to MEDIUM and LARGE.

    S-Video and Component Images on the TFT Display

    Benefit: More flexible connectivity and wider use of the TFT display as many devices do not output a usable composite signal if a higher resolution signal has been selected.

    Competitive Perspective: No one else has a TFT!

    Implementation: Upgrade firmware (hardware if needed) to support display of S-Video and Component images on the TFT display (down-processed as needed to fit). I suspect that full implementation may require hardware, however it is possible that via firmware a degraded signal (e.g. every second scanning line) could be displayed to at least allow the picture to be seen.

    Digital Source Details Display

    Benefits: Allows details of input to be confirmed – supporting diagnosis of set-up issues with sources such as DVD players, CD players, Satellite boxes etc..

    Competitive Perspective: Included to varying degrees on Lexicon, B&K and Anthem.

    Implementation: Option to display detailed information about the nature of the digital source such as DTS-ES Discrete, Matrix, Dolby Digital 5.1 EX, HDCG etc as well as number of channels, sample size and frequency or bit rate, dialogue normalisation level etc.

    Scrollable List of Source Inputs

    Benefits: Allows rapid selection of source from the front panel by providing easy two way navigation through list.

    Competitive Perspective: No one else has a TFT.

    Implementation: Firmware change so that after selecting the PATH button a list on inputs is displayed, with the current one highlighted. Separate firmware change to SET-UP to allow source inputs to be disabled, in which case they would not appear in the list.

    Scrollable List of Sound Modes

    Benefits: Allows rapid selection of sound mode from the front panel by providing easy two way navigation through list.

    Competitive Perspective: No one else has a TFT.

    Implementation: Firmware change so that after selecting the MODE button a list of valid modes for this Source Input is displayed, with the current one highlighted. Separate firmware change to SET-UP to allow sound modes to be disabled, in which case they would not appear in the list.

    Primary and Alternate Settings for Each Source

    Benefits: Provides a quick way to jump to another favourite setting for an source input without having to toggle round in menus to do it.

    Competitive Perspective: Each competitive process seems to have variations of this. For example; The Anthem has the concept of Cinema and Music modes in turn affect the processing of its inputs.

    Implementation: Firmware change to provide the option of two different predefined settings that can be used for the one input source so that the user can quickly toggle between them. For example with a DVD / DVD-A player the default setting may be a digital coax and the alternative the multi-inputs. With a CD Player the two settings might be pure stereo versus Dolby ProLogic II I Music mode.


    Increased Connection Flexibility – Hardware Upgrade

    Summary of requests:
    • Second Multi-Input – Inclusion of an additional 5.1 multi-input.
    • HDMI Input and Output – Inclusion of HDMI input and output ports


    Second Multi Input

    Benefits: Support for an additional multi-input (5.1 is OK) to allow for connection of two different 5.1 sources (e.g. a DVD-A and SACD or Laser Disk player.).

    Competitive Perspective: Not available in competitive processors.

    Implementation: Allow reassigning of 6 RCA inputs to be a second multi-input (giving 5.1) or 8 RCA inputs giving 7.1. Included here as a hardware upgrade because it is likely that the switching on the current audio input board doesn’t allow this.

    HDMI Input and Output

    Benefits: Support for latest HDMI standard for combining high definition digital video and audio. This would enable (at last) direct digital input and processing for DVD-A and SACD tracks. HDMI sockets and chips are backwards compatible with the DVI standard allowing connection of DVI devices as well. HDMI delivers the highest quality video and audio signals currently available in the consumer market.

    Competitive Perspective: Very new standard. Not yet available in any processor. Has a high level of manufacturer sign-up with Pioneer announcing product already. General expectation is that this will be the way of the future, allowing all digital video and audio connections.

    Implementation: Would require one or two new hardware boards replacing existing composite and/or S-video boards. For example number of composite and s-video could be reduced to fit on one board, freeing up a slot for a new HDMI board.


    Additional Remote Control Features – Firmware Upgrade

    Summary of requests:
    • Direct Volume Setting – Remote control code .to directly set the volume level to a specified setting
    • Incremental Volume Setting – Remote control code to alter the volme setting up or down by a specified number of DB


    Direct Volume Setting

    Benefits: Would allow users with programmable remote controls to directly set the volume to a preferred setting

    Competitive Perspective: Understood to be in the Lexicon (needs confirmation).

    Implementation: Firmware change to implement the new codes.

    Incremental Volume Setting

    Benefits: Would allow users with programmable remote controls to quickly alter the volume by a specified larger value

    Competitive Perspective: Understood not to be in any assessed competitor (needs confirmation).

    Implementation: Firmware change to implement the new codes.



    I hope people continue to find this wish-list useful and I look forward to your continuing creative feedback.

    Geoff Costello
  • sikoniko
    Super Senior Member
    • Aug 2003
    • 2299

    #2
    these lists are great, and it makes me want to buy a 1098, but it also concernes me that the 1055 i bought a month or 2 ago is already obsolete and will be unsupported since the users of the 1098 have a louder voice and there seems to be more and more of them weekly.

    not telling you to stop by any means. just starting to question myself from the standpoint of upgradeability and support on the product i purchased.

    i do understand that there were problems that had to be fixed on the 1098, so im not trying to whine. just wondering if the product i got will be overshadowed by the 1098...
    I'm just sittin here watchin the wheels go round and round...

    Comment

    • Aussie Geoff
      Super Senior Member
      • Oct 2003
      • 1914

      #3
      Sikoniko,

      Good question. My understanding is that Rotel are still actively supporting and upgrading the 1055 and 1066 and have been through many software upgrades etc. Andrew Pratt runs a 1066/1055 enhancement list list in the FAQ section of this forum if you want to see what has been done to date. Rotel have an excellent history of continuing upgrades.

      The 1098 is a significantly more expensive and advanced model that does not supersede these earlier models. There are things on the 1098 that simply can't be added to the 1055 / 1066 because of hardware limitations such as memory (think of it as the difference between a Mercedes S class and E class - both are outstanding and indeed more people will buy and afford an E class than an S class - but there are some S class features that you just can't get on a E class) (By the way I can't afford an E class!)

      PS - You could always run a 1055/1066 wish list thread (there's lots of material in posts in this and other forums)

      Geoff Costello

      Comment

      • Aussie Geoff
        Super Senior Member
        • Oct 2003
        • 1914

        #4
        Hi,

        I have edited my main post above to include the two suggestions in Jerolm's "Suggested RC Feature" thread as the foundation entries for new RC Firmware Updates section at the end of the original list.

        Should inspire some more suggestons from all you dedicated Pronto programmers that need to take it to the limit...

        Geoff Costello

        Comment

        • Azeke
          Super Senior Member
          • Mar 2003
          • 2123

          #5
          Geoff,

          On behalf of the RSP-1098 community, your consolidation efforts are very much appreciated.

          Thanks,

          Azeke

          Comment

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