I POD and Rotel?

[Mitchell]

If I bught an IPOD and burned songs onto it, could I output it through my rotel Preamp (1070)? Apple claims that the newer formats are as good as a CD. I could use this for parties and get togethers where I want a mix of music and cant keep going back to the stereo? Any input would be helpful

[Azeke]

If I bught an IPOD and burned songs onto it, could I output it through my rotel Preamp (1070)? Apple claims that the newer formats are as good as a CD. I could use this for parties and get togethers where I want a mix of music and cant keep going back to the stereo? Any input would be helpful

Mitchell,

I have used my IPOD, with the RSP-1098. I don't believe the sound quality is a good as my RCD-1070 dedicated CD player, but it certainly it not that bad sonically, as long as you use good audio cables. It would be fine for parties and get togethers, because most people won't really care.

I currently use my IPOD for the deck during the warmer months, which is hooked to an old receiver I bought some years ago in a pawn shop.

Hope this helps,

Azeke

[PewterTA]

I have my entire CD collection on my computer in lossless format hooked up to my receiver (albeit not a rotel -- yet), which would essentially be the same as your I-POD. It works perfectly fine, and if anyone can actually tell the difference (I'm sure someone somewhere at somepoint would say they could tell)...I'd be extremely impressed. It works great for parties as well as I never have to touch the thing unless someone requests a specific song...then it starts to get fun because I just let people request what they want to hear. Makes for a good night!

[Mitchell]

Would the IPOD be able to output directly into the Preamp?
The logic here is that I was going to buy a cheap multidisk cd player and use it to vay music at parties. I figure it wouldnt sound like my Rotel 1072 but noone would notice. Instead I was thinking of getting the IPOD and using it since its approx the same price.

[ekkoville]

I haven't seen an IPOD, but my mp3 player connects to my 1068 with a mini plug to RCA adapter and a set of RCA cables. Connect it into an open input in the back of the pre/pro and you're all set.

Erik

[PewterTA]

Yep just get the mini 1/8 plug to RCAs and hook it into your 1070 and you should be all ready to go.

[chanlon]

Hi,

I own an iPod connected to a Rotel 1068. It works fine. Does it sound as good as my dedicated CD player (Arcam). Not even close. Should it? -
Its not suppose to. Its great for parties and portability. Long live Apple and Rotel !

[phillipk]

There are a lot of variables... but if the iPod is pumping out analog then it's doing the D/A conversion itself. I suspect it's not nearly as good as a good CD player. Also, the way in which you ripped your CDs matters. Error correction for example.

I've been doing all my CDs as FLAC (which is just a lossless compressed WAV not much different than Apple lossless). I use www.slimdevices.com product called squeezebox which has similarities to the airPort express--though different because it has a display and a remote. The thing is, it can output digital. If you compare this to the best CD player in the world (while that CD outputs digital) then I really believe it's the same sound. (In fact, because the CD player has to do error correction on the fly it could be worse if there's dust and such.) You just have to use the same DAC. (And cables whether or not you believe that stuff.)

I'm not trying to push that product, but it has REALLY changed the way I listen to music.

[Mitchell]

Glad to hear that my idea makes some sense. This forum is realy great
Thanks

[Adrian Smith]

I am looking at the Iriver H340 40Gb player due the ability to play Ogg Vorbis, I have done a couple of listening sessions and so far this codec has impressed me sound quality wise. Also the player appears on your pc as a removable mass storage device and therefore you do not need to use itunes.
Adrian

http://www.iriveramerica.com/products/H340.aspx

[kode3]

I haven't seen an IPOD, but my mp3 player connects to my 1068 with a mini plug to RCA adapter and a set of RCA cables. Connect it into an open input in the back of the pre/pro and you're all set.

Erik

What he said...


I have my iPod hooked up the same way to my Denon 3805 and it works great, the sound quality is good enough for casual listening. But if you really want to sit down and listen to your favorite CD, then pop it in a player :T

[phillipk]

I'm curious if others have done extensive tests with uncompressed digital files vs. CD. Provided the rip is good and the components are good there's no reason why a CD should be better. In fact, the error correction is done in real time on a CD player so that would lead to inherently lower quality. My best test has the squeezebox's digital out going into my 1056 vs. a CD player's analog out going into the same receiver. The squeezebox is definitely better, but I think that's just because my CD player isn't great. However, I've heard many people claim the squeezebox competes with even the best CD players.

[VGuarino]

Phillip,

I did some testing this past weekend. Not extensive though. It was more a proof of concept. I connected a laptop with a wireless adapter as well as a digital (coax spdif). The files were on a server elsewhere in the basement.

I thought I could percieve a difference between 128kbs mpgs vs wav files. But at 256kbs, I couldn't hear much of a difference if any. I may not have the best hearing though....

Do you find much of a difference between wav - flac - mp3 (256kbps)???

Vin

[phillipk]

Re: Do you find much of a difference between wav - flac - mp3 (256kbps)???

Well, WAV and FLAC should be the same... except for the modest computing power to uncompress them. That is, FLAC is just losslessly encoded WAVs. MP3s at 256 and above are hard to tell the difference--but in certain places in the music it's really noticable. For example, as music goes silent (quickly) MP3s seem to cut the sound more abruptly. Also, you can hear less body in the soundstage--but this is pretty slight... and because the volume is never identical, it's hard to really test this.

128kbps MP3s are really noticable. In any case, it's the nature of the music that affects how good/bad MP3s trash the original.

I'm most interested in whether a CD player will necessarily be better than WAV/FLAC.

[ajpoe]

It all comes down to the DACs being used. The DACs in the IPOD (since it's analog out) vs. the DACs in the receiver when using a digital out on either the Squeezebox, a CD player, or an HTPC. I would imagine the DACs in the Ipod would be the least favorable as far as quality is concerned, but it does give u a lot of portable music for parties and on the go. I use lossless encoding via Monkey's audio and use the digital out on my computer to my DAC1. I would have to guess that you wouldn't be able to tell the difference between a CD player or the HTPC in my setup, I can't. Many others tend to agree after auditioning the DAC1. I do have some MP3s on my computer and I can tell a difference on most of them from the original recording. Bad recordings aren't going to sound as good regardless so that is where you can get away with it being either high bitrate MP3 or FLAC or Monkey's and still having similar sound. The Ipod will work, but if you can setup a digital out on your computer or use the squeezebox digital out scenario, you will probably have the best sound since I'd have to guess the DACs in your receiver will be better than the DACs in the Ipod.

AJ

[VGuarino]

AJ,

That sounds reasonable and similar to what I've found.

I guess the next question would be on the digital source side, ie: sound cards. Do they make a difference? I'm guessing they may. Someone has posted previously about m-audio as one of the better sound cards. My next step is to buy a USB m-audio and connect it to the laptop.

I started copying my cd's at mpg 256kbs. Before I go much further, I will try FLAC. Again, I don't think my ears can tell the difference, but you never know!

Vin

[ajpoe]

Yeah, I don't know much about FLAC other than it is lossless, too. I decided on Monkey's Audio because it was also lossless and appears to have a higher compression rate. Either will work fine.

As far as audio cards, I have also heard the M-Audio Audiophile is a great card for an HTPC. I believe it's around $110 and can be had for a lot less on pricewatch I'm sure. May be Aud19 can help out here since I believe he has that card. I have a cheaper version of it, the Maddog Multimedia Entertainer 7.1 which was around $55 but can be had for less also. The cards look almost identical and have the same chipset, but I'm sure the DACs in the M-Audio are better. That is kind of a null point if you plan on using the digital output only. But, the analog output on the M-Audio may be better than the DACs on your receiver, I'd test them both if you get that card and see what you prefer. With my external DAC1, I was able to save some money on the sound card by using the cheaper Maddog and just using the optical out. Many mobo's have built in optical output too now.

AJ

[phillipk]

AJ,

I started copying my cd's at mpg 256kbs. Before I go much further, I will try FLAC. Again, I don't think my ears can tell the difference, but you never know!

Disk space is pretty cheap... and you can always turn the FLACs into MP3...say, if you want to copy them to an iPod.

I did ALL my CDs at 256 and now (slowly) re-doing as FLAC. I just don't want to do it again.

[VGuarino]

I did more testing last night with the Dell Latitude C800. I have an adapter that has a coax digital out connected to the 1056. I was hearing a difference with the CD directly. I can't describe to you what that difference was. But it was there. I compared it to wav and mp3 (256k). Both wav and mp3 were close.

Then I remembered reading somewhere about changing my speaker setup. I set the fronts to large (Paradigm Studio 60's). Turned off the center. Turned the sub to max (PS1000). That setup made a huge positive difference with the digital files. So much so, that the gap between mp3 and cd was very close. I didn't compare wav to CD as it was getting late. But as I said, the MP3 quality improved dramatically.

Oh yes, I did notice after switching, using a CD, the 1056 was at 44.1khz. When using MP3 or wav, it was at 48khz. (Sound card upscaling?)

So the next question is, would something like the M-Audio USB sound card (sonic theater???) make a noticeable difference vs the on board sound card? Remember, I'm using digital out from the laptop.

Also, the C800 at 800mhz PIII was more than sufficient to drive the music via 802.11g network. About 10% CPU utilization. Memory usage was minimal. I used MusicMatch to record the MP3's. I'm not sure how this compares to other ripping software.

Vin

[FatMatt]

You might also want to try encoding your CD's using a program called 'Exact Audio Copy' (EAC) in conjunction with the LAME mp3 encoder.

Try it using Variable Bit rate (VBR), it will give you smaller files than Constant Bit Rate (CBR) 256kps and better results, as it can allocate more to 'busy' sections of music and reduce down on the quite sections.

One question about connecting the iPod to the processor;
As the o/p from the iPod isn't 'line level' (ie its amplified for earphones) don't you run the potential risk of damaging the 'line-level' input of the processor?

Finally, another suggestion for a streaming music into processor setup;
Use an XBox connected to your PC (via wired or wirelessly). You can connect using a digital o/p connection from the xbox to a digital i/p on the processor, thus eliminating an unessecery D/A conversion. (ala Squeezebox connection). This also has the advantage of being able to stream all other media from your PC to you processor. Even allows net surfing with a wireless keyboard.

fun fun fun