Lexicons EX/7.1

[Wes]

Can someone tell me how the Lex EX 7.1 speaker configuration is set up, and from what I understand there are no extra speakers installed for EX, is this true?

Wes

[Doug]

Wes, I have not read the manual concerning the EX addition. I am pretty bad about that sort of thing. It's my understanding to have EX do what it's supposed to do, you really need both rears and side speakers. You don't add the center rear, if that's what you mean. The sides take the place of that in a Pseudo rear center setup. EX Sound is steered to the sides. Really, it's just a slight variation of what Lexicon owners with Logic 7 setups already had. IMO? Not enough difference to warrant the fuss over. Either way, your talking about creating side channels from a standard 5.1 mix.

Lex





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[Wes]

Hey Lex,

OK, lets break this down and go around the room as the test tones do.

5.1 set up:
(Front Left, Center, Front Right, Surround Right Surround Left, LFE)

Dolby Digital EX set up:
(Front Left, Center, Front Right, Surround Right, *EX Rear center, Surround Left, LFE)
*EX is a Mono channel derived out of the Surround Left and Surround Right Channels of a 5.1 source.

Lexicon 7.1 set up:
(Front Left, Center, Front Right, *Side Right, Surround right, Surround Left, *Side Left, LFE)
*Side Left and Side right are stereo channels derived out of the Front and Rear channels of a 5.1 source!

Lexicon 7.1 EX set up:
This is where I'm lost! Is it:

(Front Left, Center, Front Right, Side Right, EX/Surround Right, EX/Surround Left, Side Left, LFE)

I just can figure out where Lexicon is putting the Mono EX info of an EX decoding? If its in what I labled as EX/Surround speaker then its not Logic 7 with EX its plain and simple EX. Can you set me straite on this.

Wes

[Lex]

Wes, as good an explanation as you gave, I am still not clear how to answer. Basically, EX material on a Lexicon uses the sides to play EX "licks". Now, does the Lex EX also play other material through there? That I cannot tell you. But I would assume that it differs from Logic 7 technically speaking, in tha Lexicon's algorithm determines what is played through the sides on L7, but on EX, it's the material on the disc that dictates what goes to the sides, and everything else is redirected to the rears. If it's the rears it messes with and not the sides, then my apologies. I just haven't been into the technical aspects of all this of late. Just to many other irons in the fire.

Lex

[Wes]

Lex, Do you have the EX decoding in your Lexicon?
Whether you do or don't can you do me a little test. I would amagine you have Toy Story 2. Well the Monster Inc. trailer I think is EX incoded. At the End of the trailer the dog growls if Im not mistaken in the EX only or mono in a 5.1 which then is decoded as EX. Play this trailer and get up and listen close to your Rear surrounds and then again to your sides and see if you have any dog growling cross talk between these two channels (Left Side and Left Rear).
Im just trying to get a better understanding of different processing.

Thanks

Wes

[Lex]

Sure Wes, I have EX and Toy Story box set, so I will try that this weekend.

Lex

[MRWILLL]

Wes...

With regular EX, you use one or two rear center spks in a mono config. With Lexicon's EX, the EX info is sent to the side spks in a stereo config.

With Lexicon, you can use any DVD to get the full effect of ES/EX. I don't use the ES/EX effect to much, because I DO NOT like the idea of sending all the LF info to the sub, and automacially setting the spks to small. With my system, this takes away from the full (even flow) force of LF/bass that I'm used to with full (25Hz front/rears, 35Hz sides) range tower spks. Hope this is helpfull!!




STOP!!...LOOK!!...LISTEN!!
DVD...Hear it from the people who
mixed and mastered it "LEXICON".

[ukexpat]

The Lex implementation of EX is as per the THX specification - the EX rear channels go to the rear channels of Lex processor - so you have a "standard" DD 5.1 set up with the surrounds at the side plus two rear channels - the same configuration as you would use for a Logic 7 system. So if you played an EX source with EX turned off in the processor, the rears would be silent and the discrete surround info going to the sides. With EX on, the processor extracts the rear channel from the surround channel matrix and sends it to the two rear speakers. It is as simple as that. I think you will find however that most of us with 7.1 Lex systems listen to EX sources in one of the Lex proprietary modes, where the processor decorrelates the rear channel into stereo rears, but it's a matter of personal taste.




Nigel Pond
SMR Group (http://www.smr-group.co.uk)

[Wes]

"With regular EX, you use one or two rear center spks in a mono config. With Lexicon's EX, the EX info is sent to the side spks in a stereo config."

I find this statment hard to believe, EX is mono info with in the rear channels. It would not be placed in the side speakers as the EX channels would have to be the farthest back speakers or your sound field would be all messed up. Now Lex could have mixed it with the Surround R/L (logic 7 Rears/5.1's Surrounds) and placed the now DSP'ed EX in the rear channels. But then where does the 5.1 surrounds go? Perhaps the 5.1 surrounds are done away with or just mixed with the EX and Lex leaves thier own processed sides at the side. That still does not make sence as the EX is already mixed in to the 5.1 surrounds. I know just by having the 5.1 surrounds at the rear of the room it sounds like EX just becouse of speaker placement. I dont know!

I tryed the same EX test I asked Lexman to do on a Home brew EX set up. I will wait to post my findings, No second thoughts I will post it now!

The dogs growl on the Monsters Inc. trailer is I would have to say 90-95% in the rear EX speakers inwhich almost completly removes it from the Side Surround speakers of this EX set up. This is for the most part what I had expected from this EX set up.

I would like to have others if you would'nt mind preform the same test but on a real THX EX and also a Dolby Digital EX and the Lexicon Logic 7 EX.

I would find it intresting to hear about the results!

Wes

[ukexpat]

Wes

I find this statment hard to believe, EX is mono info with in the rear channels. It would not be placed in the side speakers as the EX channels would have to be the farthest back speakers or your sound field would be all messed up. Now Lex could have mixed it with the Surround R/L (logic 7 Rears/5.1's Surrounds) and placed the now DSP'ed EX in the rear channels. But then where does the 5.1 surrounds go? Perhaps the 5.1 surrounds are done away with or just mixed with the EX and Lex leaves thier own processed sides at the side. That still does not make sence as the EX is already mixed in to the 5.1 surrounds. I know just by having the 5.1 surrounds at the rear of the room it sounds like EX just becouse of speaker placement. I dont know!

It is hard to believe because it is not correct. If you set up your Lex with 5 speakers instead of 7, the matrixed rear channel EX information is ignored and the Lex sends the discrete surround channel information from a 5.1 mix to the side channels, as it does with any non-EX 5.1 material. In fact in a 5 speaker set up, you cannot engage EX processing at all -- it is only an option if you specify side and rear speakers in your speaker set up. It is misleading to talk of the EX rear channel being "mixed" into the surrounds -- it is "matrixed" into the rears, so if no matrix processing is applied to "unmatrix" it, it is ignored, just as in any non-EX processor.

Hope this helps.




Nigel Pond
SMR Group (http://www.smr-group.co.uk)

[Lex]

Wes, my apologies, as I haven't gotten around to the test you requested. I just seem to have so many irons and so little time. In fact, little time for my irons either, lol.

Maybe soon, I can do this test.

Lex

[sfdoddsy]

Nigel is of course correct.

However, like most Lexmen, I tried out EX and immediately went back to Logic 7.

Full range stereo surrounds for sides and rears create a much more immersive experience.

Steve




Steve's DIY Dipoles