704 is just not there - upgrades?

[olddude]

I just responded to a thread by ssalvari and told him that the 704's are a fine loudspeaker and assured him that the 704's are not muddy, bloomy or lacking in the mids - a decent all-arounder, although they are more laid back than the 703's.
With that said, I must admit that, for my ears, the 704's leave me wanting more. I am accustom to listening to electrostats - very open and more forward-sounding than conventional drivers. I just purchased the 704's and use them for 2 channel stereo only. I have them biwired and powered by a very hearty Audio Research SS (D-240) and round out the SS sound with a smooth tube preamp (Musical Design). They are broke in now and sound very good - very quick, tight low end and decent mids and highs. The problem is, for me, they do tend to sound laid back on some recordings and overall the sound is "small" (restricted). Remember, I used to own ML Sequel II's that gave a very big and open sound.
Now, I'm torn on upgrading to the 703's (at this time, another $800 is my absolute max - wife & kids have better use of my funds). So, I can upgrade to the 703's now or live with my 704's for a year or more and then look into the entry level 800 series.

I'm looking for advise from owners of the 703, 704, 804 and/or experience with all. What are your feelings about the difference between the 704 and the 703; as well as between the 804 and 703? In your opinions, is the upgrade from the 704 to the 703 a significant difference (can you actually hear a big difference?) What are the shortcomings of the 703? Also, how much better does the 804 sound than the 703?

As with most of you, I want the upgrade now! I can have the 703's now, but will have to wait if I’m going to get into the 800 range (probably the 804). What would/have some of you done in similar instances??

Thank you.

olddude

[Aussie Geoff]

Oldude,

A nice dilemma to have...

For my money (2 cents worth) etc - I suspect that the 804s will leave you wanting the 803s for the extra bass depth and midrange clarity....

So - I'd be taking the 703s now (they have a lovely midrange and tighter / deeper bass than the 704s)... then save hard for the 803s (about the same extra over the 703 as the 804 is over the 704) That way each upgrade you are a step ahead of what you would be if you stayed with the 703 now...

However only your ears can tell what sound you like. So find a dealer that cares - bring in the CDs you love and listen to the 704, 703, 804 and 803 and you'll know for sure...

PS - Make sure the 703 and 704s you hear are "broken in" by the dealer - out of the box the treble is relatively harsh - so if you compared one new and one that had been played for 20-30 hours you could get the wrong impression...

Geoff

[olddude]

Thanks Geoff

I'm compulsive; I want the 703 demos right off the floor today! But, my dealer/friend needs them for auditioning. I'll have to wait a whole 4 days for the new ones to be shipped. Darn, I could change my mind by then! More likely, my wife may change my mind for me!!

I think I'm going to trade up to the 703, unless I don't like what I hear during my demo today.

By the way, are the 703's any more sensitive to wall-placement than the 704's?

Thanks Geoff.

Olddude

[whmacs]

Hi Guys,
I additioned the 704's and 705's last week and found the 704's lacking in the highs (compared against the Focal JM-Labs 826's I was also comparing). The 705's sounded very good (nice and detailed with clear highs), but I'm after a bit more bass. When I was directly switching between the 704's and 826's it was almost like you where lifting a 'veil' off the sound (sorry, I can't think of a better way to describe how the highs improved on the 826's). I didn't get a chance to hear the 703's, how are the high's compared to the 704's?

Thanks,
Stephen

[Aussie Geoff]

Stephen,

Hi - I can see you working up to your pure stereo set-up...

You need to listen to the 703's - I like them a lot more than the 704s - silkier Midrange and highs - especially when broken in. Essentially the 703s have the proper Nautilis FST midrange and the upper midrange is very very clear. This also takes pressure of the tweeter giving (to my ears) a very nice sound...

Either way - listen for yourself - same room, CD amp etc and make sure that the speakers are broken in...

PS - Those Focals are very nice (even better the 926 which is up with the Nautilis series in sound quality) so it will come down to personal taste in the sound that you like...

Geoff

[Aussie Geoff]

703's generally need less rear space :-)

Olddude,

The 703's are front ported and don't have the extra rear port that the 704's have. This means that they (generally) need less space behind them to keep the bass open, tight and airy etc... I've found (in demo rooms) you can have them 30 cm from the wall and they're fine - where the 703's need more smace. As always - listen for yourself and decide...

Geoff

[olddude]

Inherent Problems With 700 Series?

Describing the 704's as slightly vailed, as above, may be the best description that I've heard. They're not a bad sounding speaker, just lacking some transparancy in the mids. Before I jump to the 703's, does anyone have some input as to whether or not the 703 suffers from the same dilemma? Of course, I will audition the 703's, but it will be interesting to get others' perspective on this. Three thousand dollars is a very sweet range for very good sounding speakers. Without asking if there are better speakers than the 703's, I will simply ask whether or not the 703's "cut-the mustard" for the dollar???
So far, from what I've heard from responses, the 703's eleminate the "vailed" response problem of the 704's (probably due to the actual 3-way design with the "FST" driver). Just the same, I would like to know the brutal truth about the inherent qualities, or lack of, with the 703.
By the way, $3,000 is my limit.

Thanks. After this, I'll let this thread die.

Big Cheers and Happy Fourth of July - God Bless America.

Olddude

[will1066]

I have not heard the 703, but I've read that they're more forward. So, apparently, B&W has not changed the relationship from the CDM 7NT and 9NT to the 704 and 703. The respective formers are relatively laid-back, while the respective latters are more dynamic and forward. I have the CDM 7NT, the 704 predecessor, and I would like more detail.

Three-ways like the 703 have the advantage of dedicated mid and bass drivers, so you may well gain transparency but three-ways mean two crossovers and pose potential frequency response integration problems.

[whmacs]

Hi Geoff,
Thanks for the info. Yes, I'm slowly starting to work on that two channel system...
Next time I'm in Sydney I'll audition the 703's up against the 926's. They are both around the same price so it should be interested to see how they compare.

cheers,
Stephen

[Aussie Geoff]

Stephen,

Excellent... Let us all know how you go with your B&W 703 vs Focal 926 comparison ... There's no Perth dealer that caries both so you need to "dealer hop" to try

I'm doing a home demo of the Focal Electra 936 or 926 to check ot the sound... I'm hoping for Nautilis 804 or 803 equalling or bettering sound... (Secretly hoping to match or better the 802 based on some threads in another forum) Should be interesting..

Geoff

[will1066]

Geoff and Stephen, I'm about to be in the same boat. Screw my student loan payoff. This week, I plan to visit a dealer and audition some JM Lab and Dynaudio monitors that are comparatively priced to the Signature 805. I think I will "downgrade" from towers (CDM 7NT), because I have a small room without a lot of free space around the speaker positions. I am naturally biased toward the S805 since I want to keep within the B&W family. But I will be firm and objective.

[olddude]

Just one more thing!

Guys,
Thanks for the input. I'm not familiar with the JM Labs that you have mentioned...???
Regarding the 703's, I think we've come to the same conclusion that they are not "vailed" or as laid back as the 704's. However, almost all of the reviews that I've read of the 703's say the same thing; that they are a bit on the forward side with a little brightness in the mid to top end. While auditioning the 703's and deciding for my self is the only realastic option, I truly do appreciate input from other audio-obssessive-compulsives types like myself (after all, we are linked to this site. Probably Audiogon before we call it a night!!!)

[DrBoom]

I would still recommend auditioning the 804's side by side with the 703's.
They aren't THAT much more expensive, but I can assure you they're a totally different league.
The worst thing that can happen is that you like them more than the 703's, which will end up costing you $500 more.
But the good thing is that you'll never have to worry about that "What if I'd listened to the 804's ?" feeling
I'm just saying, there's no harm in comparing them, it's actually much wiser to do so.
Suppose you go ahead and buy the 703's without listening to 804's, and in a few months you happen to stumble upon a store demo with 804's and go "wow, I wish I'd have bought those 2 months ago", nothing is worse than that.

I was absolutely sure I was going to buy a complete 700 series setup, but when you compare them to the 804's or even 805's, the difference is pretty obvious.
Or it's also possible you don't like them at all (it could happen i suppose), but at least you'll have peace of mind.

[will1066]

Regarding the 703's, I think we've come to the same conclusion that they are not "vailed" or as laid back as the 704's. However, almost all of the reviews that I've read of the 703's say the same thing; that they are a bit on the forward side with a little brightness in the mid to top end.

--------------

Personally, I like the laid-back sound of the 7NT/704. I don't want anymore brightness. I don't want forwardness, either. But I do want more inner and low-level detail that is not getting through the slightly "veiled" mids.

I really think the S805 will be my solution. Still, I'm gonna go audition said brands before making a decision.

[olddude]

Thanks to all

Great advice.
My local dealer doen't carry the 804 and since he will give me full retail on a trade, I don't want to look elswhere. Thus, I'm a bit limited. The 800 series is going to be updated/upgraded and that will most likely mean the new 804 will end up being a grand more than the 703. If he carried the 804's, I'd probably go for the additional $500 and buy them now.
For now, I think I'm going to get the 703's. I auditioned them today. I liked the more refined mid range, over the 704. However, there was a bit of an edge. Call me a sucker, but I tend to agree with the dealer (who happens to be a friend) that this bit of forward edge or brightness was probably due to the newness of the speakers. My 704's calmed way down after about 100 hours of real listening.
Anyway, I can always trade up. For now, I'll take advantage of the full trade-in. I'll let you know how the 703's sound - if anyone cares.

Thank you for all the great input.

Olddude

[Miroku]

Well it looks like I am too late to offer my opinion as you're already going for the 703's. I'd say get some used CDM 9 NTs and save a bundle of cash.