Have B&W forgotten their roots?

[Mikael]

Is it just me or have B&W forgotten their roots. aside of the new 800 series a couple of years ago we haven't seen a new affordable speaker line instead of the old 7 series, and the 6 series has about 8 years of running. Instead of all their inwall and airplay headphones it is time for some real B&W products ie speakers to place in the room, just my 2 cents.

[PewterTA]

They just re-did the 600 series to the 68x series last year and brought out the CM series in place of the 700 series... I think a speaker manufacturer can only support so many lines and B&W is really to the end of what I think they can support at one time.

Their normal turn around to either upgrade or create a new line is about 4 to 5 years... So I think they are right on par with things for the moment.

They really need to update the Nautalis line! ha ha. Well maybe upgrade the drivers in them.

[Grasynoll]

The 600 series to the 68x series was a number of years ago.

[emig5m]

Time flies anymore. I got my first 600 series, the 684's back in 2008. Feels like yesterday but it was five years ago. Where does the time go?

[Kevin D]

They haven't forgotten their roots, no one is buying their roots. The box speaker market is still crashing hard. The unfortunate truth is without headphones, airplay ipod speakers, computer speakers, and architectural speakers; there would be no B&W right now. Same reasons you can find some of the line at Best Buy and in new Jaguars.

Putting their(our) passion before business is a sure fire way to be left with only their(our) passion.

Kevin D.

[mjb]

Agree totally with Kevin, I think B&W are doing what they must to stay relevant. People don't tend to buy new speakers every year, so you've got to find other stuff to sell. It doesn't change the fact that B&W still produce some of the best high end speakers in out there, and I should imagine finding ways to improve them - and then selling it - isn't very easy.

[fozzer424]

Kevin nailed it. I don't see a new line developing soon, although I won't be surprised if they eventually add models to accompany the PM1 and slowly phase out the CM line; kinda like a couple years ago when the CM phased out the 700 series.

[Dmantis]

As much as I enjoy seeing new lines or updated , I think B&W is doing just fine with the current product line. The only thing I think right now B&W is lacking is a surround speaker for the CM series. They need a wall mounted model in monopole and Bipolar. Or some kind of hybrid design in a mono/bipolar. Currently there is only a book shelf model that is non wall mountable.

[Mikael]

I migth get in trouble in here with this remark, but I think that the CM9 is the worst sounding B&W speaker ever. A very brigth sounding mid and treble and a bass that sounds shut in and not comming out of the box, The 683 does a far better job with the bass and mids, but has an even poorer sounding treble. I cant afford the 800 series, so when I heard the new treble for the PM1 I was sold, I think it is that good, so I was hoping to see aleast a 3 way floor model in the PM series, but I guess that will never happen.
Then they go and make the new CI800 series wich is fine by me, it has the treble and mid and bass that I want(CWM8.3) but since I don't have the oppertunity to build them into my walls, they are not for me sadly. I think there would be a marked for a boxed version of those new CI800 models, or atleast a on wall version.

[stevek]

I migth get in trouble in here with this remark, but I think that the CM9 is the worst sounding B&W speaker ever. A very brigth sounding mid and treble and a bass that sounds shut in and not comming out of the box, The 683 does a far better job with the bass and mids, but has an even poorer sounding treble. I cant afford the 800 series, so when I heard the new treble for the PM1 I was sold, I think it is that good, so I was hoping to see aleast a 3 way floor model in the PM series, but I guess that will never happen.
Then they go and make the new CI800 series wich is fine by me, it has the treble and mid and bass that I want(CWM8.3) but since I don't have the oppertunity to build them into my walls, they are not for me sadly. I think there would be a marked for a boxed version of those new CI800 models, or atleast a on wall version.

hey Mikael,no trouble here,i own the cm9,s and have been through a number of different set ups because I was unhappy with the sound.i went from an avr to an avr with emotive mono blocks to a processor with the emo.s to now "krell".I think the 9.s require quality gear to make them shine.i have a nad processor and a krell s275 amp running the 9's now and they have come alive,the sound stage is huge and the sound almost 3 dimensional and the entire frequency range just totally changed.while the cm9's are in no way comparable to the 800's they are one hell of a good speaker and value when treated to quality power.the 600 series cant touch them

[fozzer424]

My only gripe is the insane price jump from the CM to the 800 series.

[Grasynoll]

They have a big hole in price point between the CM9 and 804. Alot of competitors are selling alot of 4-6k floorstanders.

[PewterTA]

That's where the PM1s fill (along with the floor standing 'PM1' model they are working on).

[fozzer424]

That's where the PM1s fill (along with the floor standing 'PM1' model they are working on).

Pewter they are indeed working on a floorstanding model? If so that's great news, I hope the price is right around the CM9 area.

[Grasynoll]

I guarantee they will be more than the CM9.

[dan87951]

I think home audio gear in general is out pricing their clientele. The 800 series is a good example of that... I remember when 802's were $8k new and 805's were 2k new. The fact of the matter is house hold income hasn't kept up with the rising costs of goods/services. It's a shame but if these high end business don't get their costs under control I think they might not survive. Probably why B&W is now gearing themselves towards the big box stores, which could be a gamble and hurt brand image.

[mjb]

I think home audio gear in general is out pricing their clientele.

True. I hope a "reality check" for manufacturers is on its way.

[Kal Rubinson]

I think home audio gear in general is out pricing their clientele. The 800 series is a good example of that... I remember when 802's were $8k new and 805's were 2k new. The fact of the matter is house hold income hasn't kept up with the rising costs of goods/services. It's a shame but if these high end business don't get their costs under control I think they might not survive. Probably why B&W is now gearing themselves towards the big box stores, which could be a gamble and hurt brand image.

First, let me say that I do agree with you. However, my first reaction was that B&W is not the company nor is the 800 series the products that I would point at as whipping boys for this. IMHO, the 800 series is of higher value than competitive high-end speaker lines which run to many multiples of their prices.

[Rod#S]

I think home audio gear in general is out pricing their clientele. The 800 series is a good example of that... I remember when 802's were $8k new and 805's were 2k new. The fact of the matter is house hold income hasn't kept up with the rising costs of goods/services. It's a shame but if these high end business don't get their costs under control I think they might not survive. Probably why B&W is now gearing themselves towards the big box stores, which could be a gamble and hurt brand image.

First, let me say that I do agree with you. However, my first reaction was that B&W is not the company nor is the 800 series the products that I would point at as whipping boys for this. IMHO, the 800 series is of higher value than competitive high-end speaker lines which run to many multiples of their prices.

The manufacturer that immediately comes to mind with high prices is the current gen Focals. My God have they jumped in price. My dealer has a previous gen Alto which I'm going to check out just out of curiosity to compare how it sounds to my ears vs my 802's. I was curious about the previous line as I knew next to nothing about which consisted of the Nova, Alto, Diva towers and of course the Grande. What struck me was how "affordable" the Diva and Alto were and for that matter even the Nova when you consider the Scala now goes for 30k, the Masestro 50k and the Stella 90k. It would seem the new line's adjustable mid and high frequency tech was very expensive to design into the cabinets. I would love to hear both the Scala and Maestro though.

[RebelMan]

I migth get in trouble in here with this remark, but I think that the CM9 is the worst sounding B&W speaker ever. A very brigth sounding mid and treble and a bass that sounds shut in and not comming out of the box, The 683 does a far better job with the bass and mids, but has an even poorer sounding treble. I cant afford the 800 series, so when I heard the new treble for the PM1 I was sold, I think it is that good, so I was hoping to see aleast a 3 way floor model in the PM series, but I guess that will never happen.

I've said this before and it bears saying again the CM5 is the best of the lot. I have suspected since its introduction that the PM1 is the first of its kind but unlikely to be the last.

[RebelMan]

I guarantee they will be more than the CM9.

So you have heard? But have you seen?

[RebelMan]

IMHO, the 800 series is of higher value than competitive high-end speaker lines which run to many multiples of their prices.

I concur B&W is far and away the high performance value leader and according to CEPro take the lions share of top brands.

[Mikael]

hi RebelMan
I really don't like CM5 either so as you might have seen, I got the CT7.5 speakers and I love it. it doesn't go that deep in the bass but it has a very full and pleasent sounding bass and midrange and a smooth sounding treble only the sligtest hint of s and t sound on bad recordings.

[RebelMan]

Partnering equipment has a greater influence on the resulting outcome than people give credit for. Under different circumstances you might think differently. If you're still using Rotel equipment then silk dome tweeters will play nicer than aluminum.

The CM5 is a sleeper product. It uses a similar tweeter motor found in the 805S but an identical mid/bass driver and crossover system found in the 805D2 and 805S respectively. All housed in an fairly inert MDF cabinet, the CM5 performs nearly indistinguishably from the 805S. Well coupled to a mass loaded stand not only puts the CM5 in a class leading position but makes it the price/performance king in the entire B&W lineup.

[lastexit]

Hello there, just thought I'd bump the thread to ask if there is any information regarding the PM1 floorstander which poster (Pewter) had mentioned earlier in this thread.

[PewterTA]

I actually had talked to my dealer about this for a friend. From what he understands, B&W could not make the cabinet look right and as of this moment, the plans have been put on hold, but they may pick this back up later. So there's no real date of any kind on these (if) they will even be made.

Talks have now switched to doing something with the CM line (just my guess, but maybe a CM10 or something), though I don't know what that would be.

[Audio_ElF]

Pictures of the CM10 out on the web now...

http://www.digitalversus.com/home-cinema-speakers/bowers-wilkins-cm10-p16591/bowers-wilkins-presents-cm10-floor-standing-speaker-n29962.html

(amongst others: Google gives several more links).

Eloise