Best gear choice for 802D

[Fsb]

Hi
I have my b&w 802 d connected to the follow system:
Integrate amplifier - musical fidelity kw550
Cd player- musical fidelity dm 25 (transport and DAC separatly)
Interconnect- kimber select 1016
Speaker cables - kimber select 3033

Any body hear a system like this?
What to do to improve sound stage focus and musicality?

Thanks

[IceG]

I would always play with the room before spending money on equipment, especially if your target is sound-stage and musicality. The 802s can deliver prodigious bass, especially with a decent power amp like yours to control things but this can light up your room. You need to get rid of smear and distortion caused by reflections and bass modes. Get the speakers away from the rear and side walls, play with toe-in and your seating position. Use soft furnishings, carpets and rugs to stop the room ringing.

M2C

[Fsb]

Thank you for your reply.
Do you ever heard this b&wand Musical fidelity combo?
Whats your opinion of it?

what do you recommend to do in te living room?
what is the minimum distance of the speakers to the rear wall?what could e the ideal distance of bettew the speaker and from the speakers to the listen point?

Thanks you and good weekend

[htsteve]

Fsb,

I agree with IceG. Working on your room will yield improvements in the areas you desire.

First point reflections and bass traps are the first areas to really look at.
Do a search in the B&W forum. this topic and how to determine the 1st point refelctions have been recently discussed.

As for B&W and MF, I know there are some on the forum with this combo.

I believe that MF will drive the 802D's quite nicely.

If the room treatments do not do all you desire, then a more powerful amp can be considered.


Hope this helps.

[mjb]

First point reflections and bass traps are the first areas to really look at.....

If the room treatments do not do all you desire, then a more powerful amp can be considered.....

Agreed.
Although, a more powerful amp tends to add bottom end, so if bass boom is a problem, bass traps might be more helpful than a bigger amp.

[madmac]

I find speaker placement and it's affect on sound reproduction fascinating!. You can move or toe in a speaker only an inch and if you have good sound perception, you will hear a difference. As a general rule, the farther a speaker is from walls, the more faithful it's music reproduction will be. Obviously, there are limitations to what we can do in this regard due to room 'appearances' . I would however set the minimum distance to the back wall at 1 yard and at close to that as well from the side walls. Mine are about those distances and I'm sure if I moved them even further, my sound would improve........but not my relationship with my wife!!!!.

Now as for bass and subs, that's a whole different ball game. From 20hz to 150hz, I am a HUGE believer in EQ'ing bass to counter the whole standing wave issue that occurs with bass in our boxy listening rooms. Traps are ok, but finding and EQ'ing your room's standing wave frequency will likely solve most of your bass issues. And, normally there is only one limited frequency range where these standing waves occur. All you need is a bass test disc and an SPL meter to plot a graph and figure out where your problem frequency is in your room.

[mjb]

As a general rule, the farther a speaker is from walls, the more faithful it's music reproduction will be.

madmac, you don't need to put your speaker in the middle of the room, you need NOT to put it at a distance which is in phase with any standing wave the opposite walls might be reflecting. As you say, moving it inches one way or the other can make a big difference - there's lots of room for experimentation (forgive the pun).

[IceG]

Hi fsb, sorry for the delayed response.

I agree with the comments above which provide some very good ideas for room tuning. In my room I had the opportunity to do a major rebuild because a wall had become unstable. Bear in mind that I live in the UK and we build our houses differently to other parts of the world. I had the following done:
- rewired all wall sockets to separate distribution unit, splitting the load across many breakers
- removed a chimney and fireplace
- insulated under the floor with 4 inches of fireproof expanded material (to save energy and control bass thrumbing)
- had the wooden suspended floor re-layed to remove spring, bounce and squeaks
- positioned the electronics on a concrete slab where the fireplace had been (this has since been changed as the position was wrong - dammit)
- installed a large sofa across the room
- installed thick noise-reduction curtains across the windows which keep road noise out (I live in London) and prevent reflections in the bay
- installed a carpet with thick underlay

I rotated the whole system 90 degrees in the room so there was more side-to-side space and allowed the speakers to move out. The resulting room is slightly brighter than before (the clap test rings a little where it didn't at all before) but with much better bass, imaging and detail. I haven't used bass traps but may install some padded wall panels to reduce that ringing.

The only hi-fi change I made was to go from Audioquest bi-wire speaker cables to VdH mono-wired. This was purely because the cables were the wrong length. I don't really hear speaker cable changes unless the price differential is stupid.

On the subject of the system, I am not a fan of Musical Fidelity as they appear to be unreliable (a friend had one catch fire) and they sound cold. My preference is Chord amplification.

Hope that helps.

[kcsun]

I have been reading this thread and being a new member have been whizzing around the other threads and forums.
You are all saying that by moving speakers slightly or adding bass traps etc you can improve the sound of your speakers - even 802Di's. The last poster was saying he has installed thick carpet, thick curtains and big settee which will soak up all the reflections
So why.................
when I look at all the "photos of my equipment" threads do the majority of owners still have tiled/wood flooring, leather suites, no curtains, yet the owners of these properties spend 10's of thousands on speakers and amplifiers. Surely they are missing out on the quality the equipment could provide???

kc

[madmac]

I have been reading this thread and being a new member have been whizzing around the other threads and forums.
You are all saying that by moving speakers slightly or adding bass traps etc you can improve the sound of your speakers - even 802Di's. The last poster was saying he has installed thick carpet, thick curtains and big settee which will soak up all the reflections
So why.................
when I look at all the "photos of my equipment" threads do the majority of owners still have tiled/wood flooring, leather suites, no curtains, yet the owners of these properties spend 10's of thousands on speakers and amplifiers. Surely they are missing out on the quality the equipment could provide???

kc

Hummmm...no, that's a generalization!!

[mjb]

So why.................
when I look at all the "photos of my equipment" threads do the majority of owners still have tiled/wood flooring, leather suites, no curtains, yet the owners of these properties spend 10's of thousands on speakers and amplifiers. Surely they are missing out on the quality the equipment could provide???

Because there's a perfect HiFi world, and then there's the WAF.... :rofl:

[IceG]

I was given carte blanche to do what I wanted by SWMBO - lucky me.

The decor is mid-European chic, those in the north (Germans/Scandies) like plain wooden floors with rugs, those in the south like tiles (Italians/Spanish) because they are more practical in the heat. In the UK, older houses often have suspended floors and high (mine is 11 foot / 3.3 metre) ceilings while newer ones will still have fake fireplaces even though the chimney is non-functional.

Those houses you observe in pictures often have wide open rooms (not so common in typical UK houses which sell on number rather than size of rooms) which can obviate any ringing tendency. We Brits need curtains because (i) our insulation and central heating is archaic and (ii) because urban houses are too close together but we like our privacy. This is a good example of how material cultures and culture constructs are influenced by environment and population density.

[IceG]

kc, you wouldn't try sticking a pair of 802Dis right in the corners of a room pointing parallel down the sides. The bass and imaging would be predictably execrable. Extreme example I know but given the nonsense that is talked about how cables can "transform" the sound of a system, not unreasonable to illustrate what is possible.

[madmac]

I'm a huge fan of a simple throw carpet in the middle of the room.......not too heavy drapes on the windows, and oil paintings on the walls (They basically act as sound/bass traps). Done !!.

Oh ya....and of course.....proper speaker placement and calibration!!.