Question about Center Channel

**lawpoke87** · 05 January 2011, 23:43 Wednesday

Your 803Ds will expose poor upstream components and need loads of clean power to sound their best. Classe, Mac, and Krell all sound nice with 803ds. However, they all have very different sound. Only you know which one you prefer.

**stuofsci02** · 06 January 2011, 00:00 Thursday

I agree with your dealer on this one.. Can you move your speakers apart further.. I read in another thread that your room was 16' wide..

**dukester** · 06 January 2011, 00:22 Thursday

If I remember correctly your room is about 16' wide? If so, 7' is narrow IMO...and i guess you cannot do the obvious and move them further apart? That said, my 803Di's are 7' apart with a few degrees of toe-in and i have the HTM2Di...not muddy at all, timbre is perfect IMO and i sit 8' away. Although this is temporary and i will definitely give them more room to breathe, i am am very satisfied w/my set-up and i'm actually anxious to hear what they'll sound like w/more distance between them.

What sound are you trying to achieve since, curious, i did not read anywhere your sound impressions? Are you not happy with the sound/synergy or did i miss something? I recently added a McIntosh MC302 through my NAD T785 AV Rcvr's pre-outs to power the mains and the sound is exponentially better in all aspects. I do like the Rotel gear sound was actually my second choice to the NAD. My only recommendation for whichever you decide is to buy one with at least double the output.

I do not see any problems with upgrading to the HTM2Di if you are not happy with the HTM4Di, and recommended that in one of your previous threads, as this would future-proof any main speaker (ie. 802Di) upgrades.

Interested in your sound impressions, 2 and 3 channel.

**spykids777** · 06 January 2011, 00:44 Thursday

The HTM4d sounds much better than my previous Infinity center channel but they are missing a little of the mid-tones, sounds a little skewed towards the high pitched sounds. I agree that I do not have a Mac or Classe Amp to bring out their best. I am hoping that if I change to HTM2D and add a nice 2 or 3 channel amp I can bring out the best in them. 150W perchannel for mains is not much for these power hungry speakers.

"dukester" - any reason you went with Mac and not a Classe. Any opinions about the other amps that I have asked about?

Thanks

**stuofsci02** · 06 January 2011, 00:55 Thursday

I auditioned the Rotel 1575 heavily.. I did not like it... It always seem like it was just missing something. As it turns out it is Class D, which I am not saying is the reason, but hey.. Go figure..

I ended up going Chord in the end..

**lawpoke87** · 06 January 2011, 01:00 Thursday

I have 803Ds as the mains and an HTM2d as the center. I auditioned both Classe and Mac and just felt the Mac sound was a little more inviting. My old system was Rotel and 703s fwiw. Using 402s for the main and a 501 for the center with a MX120 processor, MIT magnum cables and interconnects....all bought second hand including the speakers. Hope to add two more 501s for the mains and use the 402 for the rears eventually.

**spykids777** · 06 January 2011, 01:11 Thursday

Hi dukester, With your speakers 7' apart and with HTM2Di how is the sound stage? WHen you are watching movies is the sound localization perfect or is it confusing as to where exactly is the sound originating from? Did you look at HTM4D?

Thanks for your input.

Originally posted by dukester

If I remember correctly your room is about 16' wide? If so, 7' is narrow IMO...and i guess you cannot do the obvious and move them further apart? That said, my 803Di's are 7' apart with a few degrees of toe-in and i have the HTM2Di...not muddy at all, timbre is perfect IMO and i sit 8' away. Although this is temporary and i will definitely give them more room to breathe, i am am very satisfied w/my set-up and i'm actually anxious to hear what they'll sound like w/more distance between them.

What sound are you trying to achieve since, curious, i did not read anywhere your sound impressions? Are you not happy with the sound/synergy or did i miss something? I recently added a McIntosh MC302 through my NAD T785 AV Rcvr's pre-outs to power the mains and the sound is exponentially better in all aspects. I do like the Rotel gear sound was actually my second choice to the NAD. My only recommendation for whichever you decide is to buy one with at least double the output.

I do not see any problems with upgrading to the HTM2Di if you are not happy with the HTM4Di, and recommended that in one of your previous threads, as this would future-proof any main speaker (ie. 802Di) upgrades.

Interested in your sound impressions, 2 and 3 channel.

**dukester** · 06 January 2011, 01:35 Thursday

Originally posted by spykids777

The HTM4d sounds much better than my previous Infinity center channel but they are missing a little of the mid-tones, sounds a little skewed towards the high pitched sounds. I agree that I do not have a Mac or Classe Amp to bring out their best. I am hoping that if I change to HTM2D and add a nice 2 or 3 channel amp I can bring out the best in them. 150W perchannel for mains is not much for these power hungry speakers.

"dukester" - any reason you went with Mac and not a Classe. Any opinions about the other amps that I have asked about?

Thanks

To over simplify, i auditioned Denon, Rotel, & NAD rcvrs, and Classe, Mac, NAD, Levinson, & Naim 2 ch amps, and preferred the mac sound...very distinct...listen to one and you'll understand. The Classe is a very good but a bit anemic; almost 'too clean', if that makes any sense. The Rotel was also good but a bit too constricted (soundstage) for my taste, the Denon included. I prefer a more laid back, warmer sound of Mac.

**dukester** · 06 January 2011, 01:41 Thursday

Originally posted by spykids777

The HTM4d sounds much better than my previous Infinity center channel but they are missing a little of the mid-tones, sounds a little skewed towards the high pitched sounds. I agree that I do not have a Mac or Classe Amp to bring out their best. I am hoping that if I change to HTM2D and add a nice 2 or 3 channel amp I can bring out the best in them. 150W perchannel for mains is not much for these power hungry speakers.

"dukester" - any reason you went with Mac and not a Classe. Any opinions about the other amps that I have asked about?

Thanks

To over simplify, i auditioned Denon, Rotel, & NAD rcvrs, and Classe, Mac, NAD, Levinson, & Naim 2 ch amps, and preferred the mac sound...very distinct...listen to one and you'll understand. The Classe is a very good but a bit anemic; almost 'too clean', if that makes any sense. The Rotel was also good but a bit too constricted (soundstage) for my taste, the Denon included. I prefer a more laid back, warmer sound of Mac.

**spykids777** · 06 January 2011, 01:56 Thursday

Hi dukester, With your speakers 7' apart and with HTM2Di how is the sound stage? WHen you are watching movies is the sound localization perfect or is it confusing as to where exactly is the sound originating from? Did you look at HTM4D?

Thanks for your input.

Originally posted by dukester

To over simplify, i auditioned Denon, Rotel, & NAD rcvrs, and Classe, Mac, NAD, Levinson, & Naim 2 ch amps, and preferred the mac sound...very distinct...listen to one and you'll understand. The Classe is a very good but a bit anemic; almost 'too clean', if that makes any sense. The Rotel was also good but a bit too constricted (soundstage) for my taste, the Denon included. I prefer a more laid back, warmer sound of Mac.

**dukester** · 06 January 2011, 02:25 Thursday

Originally posted by spykids777

Hi dukester, With your speakers 7' apart and with HTM2Di how is the sound stage? WHen you are watching movies is the sound localization perfect or is it confusing as to where exactly is the sound originating from? Did you look at HTM4D?

Thanks for your input.

They are a bit close but i have no problems discerning details and perspective. The timbre is pretty spot on IMO. I really appreciate the HTM2Di in multi-channel music...very powerful. I had the HTM2Di in mind from the get go so I did not audition/consider the HTM4Di.

**specialized** · 06 January 2011, 05:12 Thursday

What sound are you trying to achieve since, curious, i did not read anywhere your sound impressions? Are you not happy with the sound/synergy or did i miss something? I recently added a McIntosh MC302 through my NAD T785 AV Rcvr's pre-outs to power the mains and the sound is exponentially better in all aspects. I do like the Rotel gear sound was actually my second choice to the NAD. My only recommendation for whichever you decide is to buy one with at least double the output.

Can u please describe the sound of MC302 ? Did u consider MC452 as well? Any chance to compare MC452 and MC302? Any chance to compare MC302 to older models like MC252 or MC402?

Greetings

**scanido** · 06 January 2011, 11:07 Thursday

spykids777,

If your placement options can accomodate the HTM2Di I would definitely start there and make that work. You can always get a stand for the larger center. Not only are the drivers identical to the 803Di the x-over points are as well which would impact the coherency of your front stage in multichannel sources. Based on this, I believe the 803Di & HTM2Di is the ideal setup for multichannel. The HTM4D is a much better match for the 805D.

As far as electronics goes; your receiver will do fine for now at normal listening levels. I would focus on all the speakers first then on the electronics. Heck, I ran my 803S and HTM3S on a Rotel RSX-1057 (75w x 5) with decent results. Having said that, the 803Di ideally needs a high current amp to get the best out of at any volume level. I would be looking at the MC302 at a minimum if you decide to go MAC.

**emig5m** · 06 January 2011, 20:17 Thursday

Originally posted by scanido

spykids777,

If your placement options can accomodate the HTM2Di I would definitely start there and make that work. You can always get a stand for the larger center. Not only are the drivers identical to the 803Di the x-over points are as well which would impact the coherency of your front stage in multichannel sources. Based on this, I believe the 803Di & HTM2Di is the ideal setup for multichannel. The HTM4D is a much better match for the 805D.

As far as electronics goes; your receiver will do fine for now at normal listening levels. I would focus on all the speakers first then on the electronics. Heck, I ran my 803S and HTM3S on a Rotel RSX-1057 (75w x 5) with decent results. Having said that, the 803Di ideally needs a high current amp to get the best out of at any volume level. I would be looking at the MC302 at a minimum if you decide to go MAC.

I like this guys thinking ^^

Also, I just measured my front speakers in my small temp setup while I remodel the main room and they're exactly 7 foot 6 inches from tweeter to tweeter and I'm using one of the bigger centers (HTM3S). Definitely get the matching center if you can. Although I always try to target the equilateral triangle with listening position with the tweeter pointed just behind your head. But nothing is more important than speakers / acoustic treatments IMO. Amp vs amp wont have as big of an impact. I've heard other peoples systems with better and pricier equipment (their Classe vs my Emotiva) and their system sounded like total crap - even 803D vs 683. Great equipment poorly setup is worse than entry level more properly setup. I wasn't going to bother since I'm only setup in this room temporally, but I just threw up four acoustic panels on early reflection points just so I can be happier with the temp setup until I'm done with the other room and boy what a difference! I spent all afternoon listening to music! Room treatments blow away any amp difference! :T

Speakers + Room treatments should be the main objective. Small differences between electronics should be worried about after room treatments. If you have to have your speakers a little closer to the wall where it might make a little muddiness a problem, I've noticed crossing over higher to your sub helps a lot (100Hz instead of 80 and below).

**dukester** · 07 January 2011, 14:46 Friday

Originally posted by specialized

What sound are you trying to achieve since, curious, i did not read anywhere your sound impressions? Are you not happy with the sound/synergy or did i miss something? I recently added a McIntosh MC302 through my NAD T785 AV Rcvr's pre-outs to power the mains and the sound is exponentially better in all aspects. I do like the Rotel gear sound was actually my second choice to the NAD. My only recommendation for whichever you decide is to buy one with at least double the output.

Can u please describe the sound of MC302 ? Did u consider MC452 as well? Any chance to compare MC452 and MC302? Any chance to compare MC302 to older models like MC252 or MC402?

Greetings

This is my first Mac so i cannot comment on any differences from it's predeccessor (mc252). What i have noticed after about 30hrs of listening is the control it has on my woofers. Drives them without strain and with excellent clarity. My bass has much better definition even during low level listening (had poor soundstage before), even more so at higher lvls. Soundstage is laid back (as expected thankfully) in Mac tradition but the entire soundstage has a presence that is powerful but remains very fluid (draws me in). I did not hear the mc452 but my dealer was setting it up when i picked up my 302 so i'll have to ask him his impressions on any differences with the new technologies. I plan to go back to my NAD to confirm my impressions...but i'm enjoying the sound so much it might be a while

Question about Center Channel

Question about Center Channel

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment

Comment