B&W 802 diamond placement

[cossie0]

Hi I am posting for a friend of mine who has tried to register but keeps getting errors for some reason..

He is looking to get some 802 diamonds to put in his cinema room. He is also looking at buying the HTM2 diamond as a centre speaker.

There is a question as to whether the speakers would work in the position they would need to go. I have placed a link to his pictures to give you some idea.

The room is fully acoustically treated with Auralex base traps along the sides of the screen from floor to ceiling. It is also treated on the side walls up to about 5 feet. The columns you see are also designed to act as absorbers.
The screen wall is 4" thick acoustic foam to absorb rear reflections.

As you can see in the picture the screen fills most of the wall so the only place they can be placed is right at the far edges toed in to the listening position.
We know that 802's like space but the walls are treated so are wondering if the proximity to the wall would be too much of a problem.

The crossover would be set at 80hz on the processor so most of the base would be going to the sub. The speakers would also be fully EQed using the Lexicon MC12HDEQ.

Thanks for any advice you can give.


regards

[cossie0]

145 views and no advice. I thought that as this was a dedicated B&W forum I would ask for him here.

I will tell him to just ask in the avforums or avsforum.

[mrciave]

I'm more of a 2-ch audiophile rather than home cinema fan, but just my simple opinion, if the crossover is going to be set at 80Hz, is it really worth going for the 802D/Di? Wouldn't an 803D/Di do the same job? In this way, the thinner speaker would probably be easier to place.

I also think the front reflex port of the 803 would be more forgiving when placing the speaker close to the walls, with respect to the bottom as in the 802...

But, BTW, how much space is there between the screen and the ground? Maybe sacrificing 10cm of screen would allow to place the speakers in any position!

[Kal Rubinson]

I'm more of a 2-ch audiophile rather than home cinema fan, but just my simple opinion, if the crossover is going to be set at 80Hz, is it really worth going for the 802D/Di? Wouldn't an 803D/Di do the same job? In this way, the thinner speaker would probably be easier to place.

I also think the front reflex port of the 803 would be more forgiving when placing the speaker close to the walls, with respect to the bottom as in the 802...

But, BTW, how much space is there between the screen and the ground? Maybe sacrificing 10cm of screen would allow to place the speakers in any position!

I agree. I would suggest a narrower screen or, better yet, an A-T screen with the speakers behind.

Those treatments are too thin (especially considering that they are foam) to deal with the low frequencies that conspire with corner placement and that are involved with SBIR. He will be heavily dependent on electronic speaker/room EQ if he chooses to place the 802Di or 803Di (or any other potent system) in those corners.

[cossie0]

Thanks guys.

The space between the screen and the groind is only 33".

The room is too small to have the speakers behind the screen as it is 20 feet x 12 feet wide. The screen is a 2:35 ratio screen and is almost 10 feet wide.
If the speakers wer placed behind then the screen would be much too close to the front seats.

He has decided to look at the Aerial speakers LR5's after seeing your reply but will also look at the 803di as well. The LR5's can be placed below the screen angled upwards.

Do you think these speakers are more 2 channel designed and the centres are just an afterthought for anyone that does want something to watch movies with?

best wishes

[Kal Rubinson]

Do you think these speakers are more 2 channel designed and the centres are just an afterthought for anyone that does want something to watch movies with?

best wishes

No. It is just that you cannot ram them into a system where the screen is too big for the application. :

[cossie0]

Once you go scope there is no going back (so he says anyway).

Hence the question and the reliance on experienced people like your good self who help us lesser mortals not to make expensive mistakes.

We are now facing the fact that the 802 no matter how beautiful they are are not suitable
That the Aerial LR5's are the way to go no matter how ugly they are (he would not see them in the dark anyway)

Thanks very much for taking your time to reply to the questions.

best wishes

[Kal Rubinson]

Once you go scope there is no going back (so he says anyway).

If you say so. The only video display in the system with my 802Ds is a 5" LCD for player menus. :W

Hence the question and the reliance on experienced people like your good self who help us lesser mortals not to make expensive mistakes.

Yeah. We've probably made more than our share of mistakes, so the experience counts.

We are now facing the fact that the 802 no matter how beautiful they are are not suitable
That the Aerial LR5's are the way to go no matter how ugly they are (he would not see them in the dark anyway)

I am not sure that speakers set up below the screen are any more suitable. It is a tradeoff.

Good luck.

[Skyblue]

If you say so. The only video display in the system with my 802Ds is a 5" LCD for player menus. :W .

Would that be the 802d's or the 802di's?

[Kal Rubinson]

Would that be the 802d's or the 802di's?

The former, for now.

[Skyblue]

The former, for now.

Well, if you've had them for some time, how do you like them?

I always loved this review of the 800d's: How do the speakers sound if you have them for several years and build the system around it..

http://www.dagogo.com/View-Article.asp?hArticle=137

[Kal Rubinson]

Well, if you've had them for some time, how do you like them?

Why do you think I have kept them for 5 years?

http://www.stereophile.com/floorloudspeakers/1205bw/index.html

[Skyblue]

Why do you think I have kept them for 5 years?
http://www.stereophile.com/floorloud...5bw/index.html

Well, after 5 years. What do you think now? You must have reviewed a lot of speakers in the meantime, so I just thougth it would be fun to do a new review and compare it to the old. How is the lasting impression as opposed to the "initial" impression?

Or do you want to save if for the 802di review?

[Kal Rubinson]

Well, after 5 years. What do you think now? You must have reviewed a lot of speakers in the meantime, so I just thougth it would be fun to do a new review and compare it to the old. How is the lasting impression as opposed to the "initial" impression?

I only do that if inspired for some reason. It is hard to compare current and abiding perceptions to the memory/notes of the original impressions.

Or do you want to save if for the 802di review?

Possibly.

[Skyblue]

I only do that if inspired for some reason. It is hard to compare current and abiding perceptions to the memory/notes of the original impressions.

Possibly.

Well, I'll await the review in my mailbox then.

However, I do hope you would write abit about the difference between having a speaker for a couple of months, and for a couple of years.

[Kal Rubinson]

However, I do hope you would write abit about the difference between having a speaker for a couple of months, and for a couple of years.

It is an interesting point. I find that the longer I live with a speaker that I like, the more I like it. This is not surprising as most humans tend to adapt to recurring stimuli.

[1oldguy]

For anyone interested:
For Sale (3) Bryston 7B SST Squared Mono Amplifiers
$3500.00 Each, New ,Factory sealed in Box,Never used
Serial numbers
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[cossie0]

He is getting a home demo of the 802 diamonds next weekend so we can try them.
The dealer does not seem to be overly concerned at the placement (maybe he is just hoping it will be fine to get the sale).

Will report back on here. I intend to take my laptop and run REW when they are in position and set up. He is going to borrow the Lexicon mics as well so we can switch the EQ on and off and see what difference it makes.

cheers

[cossie0]

The demo has been done and to be honest the results were stunning.

At the listening position the sound was in a different league to the current speakers. They were a few inches from the side walls and this caused the bottom corner of the screen to be in shadow by about 1 inch which is no problem. It would only occur when the film was a 2:35.1 format anyway.

There was also some audio electronics set up as well to test them both in 2 channel mode and in full cinema mode by swapping the speaker cables.

I would post a picture but it keeps telling me its too big and I dont have a clue how to reduce it in size.

[Skyblue]

The demo has been done and to be honest the results were stunning.

At the listening position the sound was in a different league to the current speakers. They were a few inches from the side walls and this caused the bottom corner of the screen to be in shadow by about 1 inch which is no problem. It would only occur when the film was a 2:35.1 format anyway.

There was also some audio electronics set up as well to test them both in 2 channel mode and in full cinema mode by swapping the speaker cables.

I would post a picture but it keeps telling me its too big and I dont have a clue how to reduce it in size.

If you use windows, you can open it in paint and resize it. Save as jpg.

Hurry up!

[cossie0]

Here is the pic thanks for the tip. Obviously the centre is wrong and will be replaced with a HTM2.

[HDBLU]

it look nice also with the Musical fidelity Gear I love MF stuff but your setup is awesome

[Skyblue]

Here is the pic thanks for the tip. Obviously the centre is wrong and will be replaced with a HTM2.

Very nice! Looks like a great cinema

[htsteve]

cossie0,

Very nice setup. It will really be nice once the HTM2D is in place.


Also, any chance to bring the 802D's forward and a bit out from the wall? I'm thinking this will lessen the impact those columns will have on the sound.


What sub is that?

[cossie0]

Thanks for the comments.

They can be brought forward a bit but it would get to the point where the width between them is wider than the distance from the front listening position.

They were only in the room for a couple of hours so we did not have much chance to experiment. They can be optimised when the permanant pair arrive. The front seats can be moved back slightly but not too much as the stage is in the way for the rear seating.

The sub is a Velodyne HGS18 but may be replaced with a Paradigm Sub 2 or 2xSub 1's

cheers

[htsteve]

cossie,

Good to hear there is some ability for placement flexibility. As best as you can, try to form an equal triangle between the mains and the listening position.

As to the sub. The HGS18 reminded me of my old Velodyne DD18. I replaced it with a JL Audio Fathom F112. It was almost 1/2 the size and it performed better than the DD18.

The Sub 2 certainly looks quite impressive.

You might consider one, or a pair, of the JL Audio's for that room (F112's or F113's). There is also the F212, similar in concept to the Sub 2. I've attached pics for comparison (DD18 vs. the F112). The pictures are small, but illustrate the size difference.

The smaller footprint might come in very handy in a room like that.


Hope this helps