My New SYSTEM WOOP

[jamesdaman]

Changed my system from a quad 909 quad 99 pre with cyrus cd8se with psx-r to..... a rotel 1068(got it at a steal) rotel 1080(another steal) and a rotel 1565(also a steal) all going through 805S and HTM4S. Im literaly blown away and ive not even set it up properly or even have a sub sorted yet. IM IN LOVE. Ill post some pictures when i can guys but really EVERYTHING has improved so much :P :P :P :P :T :T :T :T :B :B :B :B :B ;x( ;x( ;x( ;x(

[AV-OCD]

Congrats James! So is it just the front-end that is new, or are the 805's new too?

[jamesdaman]

Well I was going to get the new 805d but it to me just didn't make sence, I've got so much more for my money doing this And increased sound quality. Gotta sort out a sub and surrounds. Might get either a rel or velodyne, not sure which is better though. Also any advice on a good blu ray player with analog out???

[htsteve]

Excellent. That's the kind of feeling you want when you make a major move.

Enjoy getting the rest in place and really enjoying it.


I have no experience with it, but I've read many good things about the Oppo BR player.

As for subs, I owned a Velodyne DD sub. Very nice. Very good performer.
I've since moved to a JL Audio F112, which is an awesome, reference sub. If you have the budget, it's one to consider.


Hope this helps.

[jamesdaman]

I live in the UK and i dont think i can get the JL audio stuff over here which is a shame. yeh ive now been told by a few people the oppo is very good so im thinking thats the way to go How important would you say the surrounds are. Im thinkng of getting something B&W but nothing over the top to save money to put into the blu ray and the sub. Also gotta say that rotel 1080 really is a beast

[KahunaCanuck]

I run a REL 305 with my 805s and am thrilled with it...picked it up used...very musical! What about a pair of used 805s for surrounds, that would be the perfect setup!

Enjoy! :T

[jamesdaman]

well i was thinking the B2 so if you recon the 305 is good the B2 should rock haha

[stuofsci02]

Well I was going to get the new 805d but it to me just didn't make sence, I've got so much more for my money doing this And increased sound quality. Gotta sort out a sub and surrounds. Might get either a rel or velodyne, not sure which is better though. Also any advice on a good blu ray player with analog out???

I strongly recommend the Oppo BDP-83SE. I think it is the best all around blu-ray player available for <$3000 and costs $899.. I also own a Rotel RCD-1072 CD player and I find that the Oppo is actually a better CD player too..

[jamesdaman]

Ok I'll see if I can find an oppo here in the uk. I'll try and put some pictures up later today

[htsteve]

James,

As noted, another pair of 805's would be ideal as surrounds. However, I understand the plan to have good rear speakers and put money towards things like the BR player and sub. A good plan.

You should look to get B&W speakers for the rears. This will lead to the best sound integration, timbre matching, etc. In an HT or multichannel music situation, the rear sepakers are pretty important.

Another thing to consider is that with the HD audio formats (which Blu Rays have), the sounds coming out of the rear speakers are better than ever. You might consider tower speakers for rears. Used B&W towers (I'm thinking 600 series) might do the trick.


Hope this helps.


PS - JL Audio does have a distributor in the UK. They are called Celsus. The phone number is 44 1202664390.

http://www.celsusice.co.uk/contact.php This looks like car audio, but I did specifically ask about home subwoofers (I called JL Audio directly), so hopefully this will work out.

[stuofsci02]

I Agree with HTSteve. A 2nd set of 805s would be top notch for the full 5.1 system. That said if money and space are tight you can get some halfway decent speakers that are small and cheap..

I originally bought a set of these Tannoy Mercury F1's for $199 Canadian about 4 years ago as a stop gap solution until I could afford something better and I had more space.. I have been constantly amazed by the sound of these little guys. So much so that I ran them as stereo mains for a few days just for kicks.... I would say they are similar in sound to the small 600 series speakers, but cheaper and smaller. Well since getting them I have not felt a big need to go out and replace them a fast as I thought I would. Now I am finishing my basement. When I do, the 804s will go down there, the HTM61 will be sold and replaced with HTM4S or 3S, and I will get 805s for the rears.

I have been seriously considering doing all Tannoy Mercury F1s 5.1 off my NAD reciever in my family room when my current stuff goes downstairs to my new HT room.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Tannoy-Mercury-F1-Custom-included/dp/B000VPJE5Q

[jamesdaman]

wow so would you say those tannoys are as good as the old 600 series or even the current ones? At £100 or so thats a steal if they are

[stuofsci02]

wow so would you say those tannoys are as good as the old 600 series or even the current ones? At £100 or so thats a steal if they are

Sound quality wise I think they are very close to the small DM600, although maybe a little lighter on the base since the cabinet is a bit smaller. It has been a long time since I listened to the 600 so I find it is tough to compare. One thing I find is the Tannoy has a very neutral voicing so I find it matches well with my B&W stuff.

The Tannoy F1 however, is really a plain Jane speaker. There is nothing about the speaker that makes it look nice. The 600 series looks way better. It is just a box with some plain looking drivers. I think that is why it is so inexpensive.

I mounted mine on some telescopic stands at the rear, so for movies I can put them up high and for SACD etc. I can match the tweeter height with my 804s.

[jamesdaman]

You make an interesting case for
these tannoys. I may see if I can get some b&w for around the same price on
eBay or I'll buy these

[stuofsci02]

Keep us up to date..

[weijst]

Do yourself a favour and give the 800 series surround speakers SCMS a try too! These speakers are basically 805S meant for wall mounting (ref B&W website).

I'm powering 805S, HTM4S and SCMS with a Classe CA-5100 (sub Velodyne SPL-1200R, blu-ray Oppo BDP-83SE) and can't stop being amazed!

Don't know about the Tannoys, but I used to have a set of DM600 S3 as surrounds. I'd skip those if I were you... The difference with the front channels is just too big, noticable even when used for surround effects only.

Good luck and enjoy!

[stuofsci02]

Do yourself a favour and give the 800 series surround speakers SCMS a try too! These speakers are basically 805S meant for wall mounting (ref B&W website).

I'm powering 805S, HTM4S and SCMS with a Classe CA-5100 (sub Velodyne SPL-1200R, blu-ray Oppo BDP-83SE) and can't stop being amazed!

Don't know about the Tannoys, but I used to have a set of DM600 S3 as surrounds. I'd skip those if I were you... The difference with the front channels is just too big, noticable even when used for surround effects only.

Good luck and enjoy!

Yeah SCMS is also a good solution for rears (esp where space is tight), but he indicated he didn't want to go over the top on price. Now you can only get the SCMS used and I think they will still be at least $1000/pair.

For sure nothing in the price range of <$1000 is going to come anywhere close to matching his 805s in SQ, so the I guess he will need to decide if he throws a couple of hundred $ as a solution or doesn't run any rears at all.

[jamesdaman]

i cant seem to upload puctures as they are to big,

[htsteve]

i cant seem to upload puctures as they are to big,

I run into that as well. I use a site like Flickr to be able to make them smaller. then I upload them.

[jamesdaman]

hey guys, which do you think would be better, ds3 or CM1 for surrounds. Both at the same price?

[AV-OCD]

I would think the CM1's would be the better match. The drivers used in the CM series are much closer in quality and design to the 805S's you have.

You are going to want to cross the CM1's over at 100 - 120Hz though because they are a small speaker. You'd have more headroom in output for HT if you step up to the CM5, and the mid/bass driver in the CM5 is much closer to the design of the mid/bass driver in the 805S. The CM5 will cost you $500 more, but it would be a better fit than either of your current choices.

[htsteve]

hey guys, which do you think would be better, ds3 or CM1 for surrounds. Both at the same price?

I vote for the CM1. The DS3 is strictly on wall. Very nice, but limited in placement. The CM 1 can work on the wall (mounted), and on shelves or stands.

The CM1 also has the nautilus tweeter, which will be better for smoother and more natural highs. With the HD Audio formats, the rear signals are very clean. The better the rear speaker, the better the overall preformance. I believe the CM1 is better.

I've found that the rears are best behind the listening position (I've had rear speakers just about everywhere). If you can do this, that would be very good.


Hope this helps.

[jamesdaman]

Well I'm finding it hard to get rid of my
quad gear so spending anymore is kind not possible. Spending £400 is more then I wanted already

[hifiguymi]

If you can't place the DS3s on side walls then the CM1s. You can cross the CM1 over at 80 Hz without a problem though. They are a pretty capable speaker on the low end just not very sensitive because of their size.

Eric

[jamesdaman]

ok so probably go with the CM1 then. Also i can get a monitor audio rsw12 sub for £350 brand new which seems like a fricken steal. I think for £350 i cant go to wrong?

[AV-OCD]

If you can't place the DS3s on side walls then the CM1s. You can cross the CM1 over at 80 Hz without a problem though. They are a pretty capable speaker on the low end just not very sensitive because of their size.

Eric

The low end may be in good balance with the rest of the range on the CM1 at reasonable listening levels, but for higher level HT playback you are going to run into bass compression and the risk of overdriving the speaker, which is why I recommended the 100-120Hz x-over. If he keeps the volume low enough though, 80Hz would work.

[hifiguymi]

The low end may be in good balance with the rest of the range on the CM1 at reasonable listening levels, but for higher level HT playback you are going to run into bass compression and the risk of overdriving the speaker, which is why I recommended the 100-120Hz x-over. If he keeps the volume low enough though, 80Hz would work.

It would take a pretty high volume to reach compression on the CM1 with the crossover at 80Hz. Even the 686 doesn't have issues with 80Hz at fairly high volumes. James should try it both ways to see what sounds best but 80Hz will work fine for those speakers.

Eric

[jamesdaman]

Thank you guys you really are very helpful . What should be the crossover for the 805 and htm4s?? Also i cant get Oppo here in the UK without alot of hassle. Any other good blu rays with analog outputs on them??

[hifiguymi]

I'd keep the 805S and HTM4S at 80Hz as well.

Look at the European model of the Pioneer Elite BDP-23FD. I think it's call the BDP-LX52 but I'm positive of that. It's a wonderful sounding player and would work great with the RSP-1068.

Eric

[AV-OCD]

It would take a pretty high volume to reach compression on the CM1 with the crossover at 80Hz. Even the 686 doesn't have issues with 80Hz at fairly high volumes. James should try it both ways to see what sounds best but 80Hz will work fine for those speakers.

Eric

I suppose it all depends on his reference for what "high volume" is and how far away he sits from the speakers. Soundstage.com measured compression setting in from 200Hz on down starting at 90dB @ 2M, as you can see in the graph below.

B&W CM1 - Deviation from Linearity at 90dB

[jamesdaman]

Yeh I think I'll go with the pioneer lx52. Anybody listen to the MA rsw12??

[AV-OCD]

Yeh I think I'll go with the pioneer lx52. Anybody listen to the MA rsw12??

I wouldn't recommend any MA sub. What other options do you have?

[jamesdaman]

Are they not very good subs then? What else is there with out going mad? I can always get second hand??

[hifiguymi]

I suppose it all depends on his reference for what "high volume" is and how far away he sits from the speakers. Soundstage.com measured compression setting in from 200Hz on down starting at 90dB @ 2M, as you can see in the graph below.

It's still pretty linear at 80Hz. Below that it's not the best I agree. As useful as measurements like that are, I still use my ear and from my experience 80Hz works great for the CM1.

Eric

[hifiguymi]

Are they not very good subs then? What else is there with out going mad? I can always get second hand??

Have you listened to B&W woofers? The 600 Series woofers are quite good. They are very fast and musical and the 10" models can play pretty loud when needed. Some of the Velodyne woofers are OK but they can be a little dry at times. You should try to listen to as many as you can before you decide.

Eric

[jamesdaman]

Yep my folk have a 610XP. I dont overly rate it to be honist, dont get me wrong its good and maybe better in my room being its smaller but the MA is in the same league and dirt cheap lol it means either all my budget on a sub with no surrounds or blu ray or brake the cost up

[jamesdaman]

Right I'm going to build my own sub. Seems that I'm going to get alot
more for my money then anything I can buy

[jamesdaman]

Velodyne CHT-12Q is this any good?

[jamesdaman]

Can anyone help, please

[hifiguymi]

I don't have enough experience with that series (it's call the DEQ-R Series in the US) to give you an honest opinion. I'm more familiar with their in wall and DD Series woofers.

Eric

[BassThatHz]

If money is tight the Velodyne CHT-12Q is decent, but don't expect much below 30hz out of it. I would recommend going with at least the SPL-12 if you can, its much more musical sounding.

[jamesdaman]

ive gone for a good old british sub made here in the uk. Its called the bk eletronics Monolith and its a fricken beast. It weighs 46.75KG lol