Sub options with 703's . . .

[NMG]

Okay so here's a question. I currently have 703's and a Paradigm PW-2200 for sub duty. I was considering upgrading my sub and got reading various threads on options, etc.

I'm wondering if it might be better for me to simply add another PW-2200 and have the two subs, as opposed to going with one better single (say a Servo 15, DD 15, Seismic 12, ASW 750, etc.). It would be a much lower cost option and in theory, it may provide benefits that a single could not. I like the 2200, although I realize that there are more musical subs out there.

Any thoughts on going this route? I couldn't afford to go duals on the better subs. System is roughly 65/35 music/HT.

Thanks in advance!

[beden1]

Dual subs are very good for HT. It is the only effective way for your subs to not be localized.

[ac81017]

asw750

You can´t go wrong with a asw750 or two!!! :T

[bigburner]

Hi NMG,

I have an ASW750 in a 2-channel configuration which I use 95% for music (CD and DVD) . It integrates very nicely with my B&W CDM9NT floorstanders (the predecessor to the 703).

If you have a single sub and your main interest is music I believe that significant benefits can be gained by placing it dead centre between your front speakers. Nearly all music is mixed with the bass guitar and kick drum dead centre. Integrating your sub is therefore easier when it is dead centre because the volume of the sub becomes less of an issue.

If you listen to a lot of live music as I do (mainly DVDs) then this is an important consideration because the bass guitar and kick drum are frequently more prominent in the mix.

All of this assumes that you are sending a minimum of 60Hz and below to your sub (I send 80Hz and below). If you are in the school that believes subs should only receive 45Hz and below then you can put it anywhere (your garden shed included).

Nigel.

[pbarach]

dual subs don't always help and sometimes make things worse

Dual subs are very good for HT. It is the only effective way for your subs to not be localized.

I'd disagree with your second sentence, as would most writers on home theater. If the crossover point is set sufficiently low (most people say 80 Hz or lower), then the human ear appears not to detect the left versus right ear differences that enable us to localize sound. There are some situations where you COULD conceivably localize something; e.g., if the sub was exciting a room mode at a certain frequency, you might be able to localize it when that occurs, or if unwanted resonances at certain frequencies draw attention to the sub's cabinet or objects near it that have been set into vibration.

There are listening situations when two subs cause pressure waves that are in opposite phase to each other at the listening position at some frequencies. When that happens, there will be dips in frequency response at those points, and overall the frequency response curve can be very uneven. There are other times when the results are more fortunate. I doubt if anyone other than an acoustical engineer could reliably predict when 2 subs will improve versus worsen things.

[NMG]

Thanks for the replies everyone. Currently I do use 80 Hz as my cutoff and to be honest, I haven't run into any localization issues. The overall output is also fine so perhaps I should just look at improving the SQ as my primary goal.

[scanido]

fathom F112 and don't look back!

[NMG]

fathom F112 and don't look back!

Yes, I did intend on adding the JL subs to my list of options

[beden1]

I'd disagree with your second sentence, as would most writers on home theater. If the crossover point is set sufficiently low (most people say 80 Hz or lower), then the human ear appears not to detect the left versus right ear differences that enable us to localize sound. There are some situations where you COULD conceivably localize something; e.g., if the sub was exciting a room mode at a certain frequency, you might be able to localize it when that occurs, or if unwanted resonances at certain frequencies draw attention to the sub's cabinet or objects near it that have been set into vibration.

There are listening situations when two subs cause pressure waves that are in opposite phase to each other at the listening position at some frequencies. When that happens, there will be dips in frequency response at those points, and overall the frequency response curve can be very uneven. There are other times when the results are more fortunate. I doubt if anyone other than an acoustical engineer could reliably predict when 2 subs will improve versus worsen things.

I will stand by what I said, although I would agree that room size and dynamics, along with seating position may offer differing results. Another posters' comment that placing the sub in the center between the main speakers would also be effective, but it's not typically a physical option for many.

Many/most sub manufacturers currently agree that multiple subs are the best soltution. And, as I'm sure they have motives to sell more products, a lengthy conversation I had with Velodyne a couple of years ago was very convincing and proved beneficial in eliminating the localization of my single sub setup at the time.