Amp & processor advice for B&W 802D based HT

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  • MilesD
    Junior Member
    • Feb 2008
    • 6

    Amp & processor advice for B&W 802D based HT

    I'm looking to build a new home theater. I would like to have a 7.1 surround. I need some opinions on this set up. This is what was suggested to me:

    2 B&W 802D (Left Right)
    1 B&W HTM1D (Center)
    4 B&W DS8S (Surround)
    2 JL Audio f113
    3 Rotel RB-1092
    2 Rotel RB-1080
    1 Rotel RSP-1068

    I know I want to have the B&W speakers. Does anyone have any info on the amps and processors or any suggestions on other amps and/or processors. Also what kind of speaker wires and interconnects would you suggest?

    Thanks, MilesD
  • htsteve
    Super Senior Member
    • Sep 2004
    • 1216

    #2
    Give McIntosh a listen

    Originally posted by MilesD
    I'm looking to build a new home theater. I would like to have a 7.1 surround. I need some opinions on this set up. This is what was suggested to me:

    2 B&W 802D (Left Right)
    1 B&W HTM1D (Center)
    4 B&W DS8S (Surround)
    2 JL Audio f113
    3 Rotel RB-1092
    2 Rotel RB-1080
    1 Rotel RSP-1068

    I know I want to have the B&W speakers. Does anyone have any info on the amps and processors or any suggestions on other amps and/or processors. Also what kind of speaker wires and interconnects would you suggest?

    Thanks, MilesD
    MilesD,

    I have 802D's, HTM2D up front and N804's as rears. I considered a similar Rotel solution as you did. However, I auditioned Krell and MAC to see what the next level up is. The next level up is outstanding. Ultimately, I chose a MAC MX120 and the MC205 5-channel amp (you would get the 7 channel version, the MC207). The B&W and MAC combo is awesome. They work so well together. Power and finesse all at the same time.

    My system has a Martin Lodan Depth sub. Not a huge sub. But the bass response from the system on the MAC's and ML is outstanding. I'm still amazed that I can hear tight, deep bass along with smooth mids and crystal clear highs all at the same time.

    You might consider getting one sub and putting the funds of the 2nd sub toward the electronics. I don't think the overall cost difference will be too great. I don't think you will regret it. I certainly don't.

    As to cables, the owner of this forum also offers cables, Cat Cables. Click on the logo on the screen. You can also send Doug an email. He will advise on a solution for you.

    Hope this helps.

    Comment

    • sikoniko
      Super Senior Member
      • Aug 2003
      • 2299

      #3
      Originally posted by MilesD
      I'm looking to build a new home theater. I would like to have a 7.1 surround. I need some opinions on this set up. This is what was suggested to me:

      2 B&W 802D (Left Right)
      1 B&W HTM1D (Center)
      4 B&W DS8S (Surround)
      2 JL Audio f113
      3 Rotel RB-1092
      2 Rotel RB-1080
      1 Rotel RSP-1068

      I know I want to have the B&W speakers. Does anyone have any info on the amps and processors or any suggestions on other amps and/or processors. Also what kind of speaker wires and interconnects would you suggest?

      Thanks, MilesD

      Rotel suits a certain range of speaker, and the diamond range will not fully be appreciated with Rotel gear. The popular choices on this board are Classe, McIntosh, and Krell. Start your hunt there. We all have very strong opinions on which brand is the best, so do yourself a favor and try to do your own demo's. Its a lot of money to spend on someone else's opinion.
      I'm just sittin here watchin the wheels go round and round...

      Comment

      • RobP
        Ultra Senior Member
        • Nov 2004
        • 4747

        #4
        Miles, that is a great setup you have picked out there, with those new Jl's you should not be lacking in the bass department. :T


        As far as the upstream electronics go I think Sikoniko sums it up best with his comments, while Rotel is great equipment, you will never see the full potential of what that speaker system is capable of.

        Cables and interconnects wise I would talk to Lex here, he owns Catcables which is our forum sponsor, he makes a great product which many forum members use as well as myself, his Kingcat silver interconnects are wonderful.

        You can check out reviews and such here:

        Robert P. 8)

        AKA "Soundgravy"

        Comment

        • Minardi2
          Member
          • May 2007
          • 63

          #5
          What he said.

          If you're going to do the Diamond series, don't skimp on the electronics (not that Rotel is anything to sneeze at). I will say you'll love the JL Audio f113. I have one and absolutely love it.

          Comment

          • MilesD
            Junior Member
            • Feb 2008
            • 6

            #6
            Originally posted by Soundgravy
            Miles, that is a great setup you have picked out there, with those new Jl's you should not be lacking in the bass department. :T


            As far as the upstream electronics go I think Sikoniko sums it up best with his comments, while Rotel is great equipment, you will never see the full potential of what that speaker system is capable of.

            Cables and interconnects wise I would talk to Lex here, he owns Catcables which is our forum sponsor, he makes a great product which many forum members use as well as myself, his Kingcat silver interconnects are wonderful.

            You can check out reviews and such here:

            http://www.htguide.com/forum/forumdisplay.php4?f=29
            Thanks for the advice. I thought of starting out with Rotel mainly because of its price. I was later planning on upgrading to Classe' or Mac. This is the kind of stuff I want to hear. Thank you.

            Comment

            • kallagtunet
              Member
              • Jan 2008
              • 37

              #7
              Originally posted by MilesD
              Thanks for the advice. I thought of starting out with Rotel mainly because of its price. I was later planning on upgrading to Classe' or Mac. This is the kind of stuff I want to hear. Thank you.

              I have heard the 802D and HTM1D (own them) with Classe top of the line mono blocks and ICE amps (not Rotel) and even if there are a differece in quality i dont think it justifies the big difference in price... Try to get the possibility to listen blind at a dealer and you will be suppriced :- )

              Comment

              • Aussie Geoff
                Super Senior Member
                • Oct 2003
                • 1914

                #8
                Miles :-)

                Some good choices there... Here's my 2 cents worth:

                If you are going to go Rotel consider a RMB-1077 or 1076 for the rears rather than the 1080... I like the match better in tonailty..

                Yes the Classe is better... But the RMB-1092 is amazing for the money... Depending on your display and pictures source you may want to consider a reciever like the Onkya 905 or Denon 4308 to get the high end Dolby True HD etc formats. If you are not going Blu Ray HDMI the Rotel is unbeatable vlaue... But if you want the latest HD formats... One of the top end recievers makes good pre-pro... There is always the hard to onbtianIntegra 9.8 Pre-Pro

                With the Amps i hihgly recommend comparative listening.. Use the same speakers and music if you can... Some people find a big difference with the Classe.. Others its so subtle that they don't dfind it worth the money..

                For me the Rotel is good enough... I'd need a very high end processor (like the Classe SSP600 or better or the Bel Canto to hear the differenc well enough to justify the price... But with the right processor and speakers - the Classe are amazing, truely special...

                Geoff

                Comment

                • skuzzyb
                  Senior Member
                  • Mar 2006
                  • 106

                  #9
                  Originally posted by MilesD
                  I'm looking to build a new home theater. I would like to have a 7.1 surround. I need some opinions on this set up. This is what was suggested to me:

                  2 B&W 802D (Left Right)
                  1 B&W HTM1D (Center)
                  4 B&W DS8S (Surround)
                  2 JL Audio f113
                  3 Rotel RB-1092
                  2 Rotel RB-1080
                  1 Rotel RSP-1068

                  I know I want to have the B&W speakers. Does anyone have any info on the amps and processors or any suggestions on other amps and/or processors. Also what kind of speaker wires and interconnects would you suggest?

                  Thanks, MilesD
                  MilesD, great set up you have there. Are you primarily doing this for HT or is music important as well? If HT your processor choices are a lot more varied that if you will be listening to a lot of 2 channel as well. Is the plan to use the JL Audios primarily for HT or are you planning on using your subs while listening to music as well? Have you actually listened to the set up above? If not, go spend some time listening to is as well as other combinations (I hope your B&W dealer has a few options) and trust your ears. Take your time so that when you come to a conclusion you know it is the right one, it took me three years to finally select something!!

                  Rotel makes good amplifiers and I do not think you could go wrong with it. It does however depends what you are looking for and what is important to you. Looking at your proposed set up I would think that advanced HT audio is something that would be important to you as you are going with a 7.2 set up, if that is the case then I would recommend getting a processor that can handle the new lossless formats such as DTS MA and Dolby True HD, I do not think the Rotel 1068 is capable of doing that. A good Denon, Marantz, Onkyo or Integra would give you that capability. While none of the ones mentioned above will give you the sound of a Classe or a Mac, they may be good enough and they handle the advanced formats today.

                  I will withhold recommendations on cables and interconnects because CAT cables sponsors this site

                  What are you planning on for source? Blu Ray, a good CD player? HD content via a cable box, a music server, all of the above? Selecting the speakers and amplification is just the beginning.

                  Have fun.

                  Comment

                  • Edgeyboy
                    Member
                    • Nov 2006
                    • 86

                    #10
                    How about the Denon AVPA1HD and matching 10 channel power amplifier ?

                    Comment

                    • rodH
                      Member
                      • Aug 2002
                      • 71

                      #11
                      Guys, I am confused, why are we saying "Rotel is good enough" or "for the price, they are good" to someone that is considering buying $14k speakers in the 802d??? The choice in speakers tells me that he isn't on a big budget, frankly I think he would be disappointed with 802ds with Rotel.

                      Maybe it isn't popular to say, but I think I outgrew my Rotel stuff just with my N804. I got a Marsh 2x200w amp for my 804 and noticed a difference (this is a $2400 amp). I am switching that out with a Mac MC150 and using an MC7205 in a bi-amp configuration to power my center and rears. Also getting a MX132 pre/pro to replace my Rotel pre/pro. Mac and B&W are soooooo good together.

                      Do not overlooks the amps!!!!

                      Comment

                      • cug
                        Senior Member
                        • Jan 2008
                        • 286

                        #12
                        Originally posted by rodH
                        Guys, I am confused, why are we saying "Rotel is good enough" or "for the price, they are good" to someone that is considering buying $14k speakers in the 802d??? The choice in speakers tells me that he isn't on a big budget, frankly I think he would be disappointed with 802ds with Rotel.
                        The speaker makes the biggest difference in the whole system. If he is into getting good quality of sound, he's best with investing the biggest part into the speakers and way less in electronics as these often don't make any audible difference.

                        There is a difference between a music lover and an audiophile: the music lover loves good music (with good representation through the system), the audiophile often enough loves to upgrade his gear just for the fun of it and because he spends so much money he must imagine a big enough difference to justify the price.

                        So, my wife has a great feeling for music. She loves listening to music. But there is no way she would spent 5 times the price on something to get a (questionable) 10% performance benefit.

                        So, think twice before you spent big bucks just on a brand name, only to have it.

                        Comment

                        • rodH
                          Member
                          • Aug 2002
                          • 71

                          #13
                          I am not sure that someone is just a "music lover" and spending $14,000 on a pair of speakers. Just seems sort of weird to me to spend $14000 on a pair of speakers and NOT be willing to at least get a $3000-4000 amp for it to get the most out of it.

                          I AM NOT saying that everyone needs to go out and spend that much money on an AMP just to "listen to music", at the same time, I wouldn't spend that much money on a pair of speakers for the same reason.

                          I have seen both extremes, running a $5000+ amp with speakers 1/2 that price (805) and seen $14000 speaker run with a reciever, I think the ideal is somewhere in the middle.

                          Originally posted by cug
                          The speaker makes the biggest difference in the whole system. If he is into getting good quality of sound, he's best with investing the biggest part into the speakers and way less in electronics as these often don't make any audible difference.

                          There is a difference between a music lover and an audiophile: the music lover loves good music (with good representation through the system), the audiophile often enough loves to upgrade his gear just for the fun of it and because he spends so much money he must imagine a big enough difference to justify the price.

                          So, my wife has a great feeling for music. She loves listening to music. But there is no way she would spent 5 times the price on something to get a (questionable) 10% performance benefit.

                          So, think twice before you spent big bucks just on a brand name, only to have it.

                          Comment

                          • rodH
                            Member
                            • Aug 2002
                            • 71

                            #14
                            Originally posted by cug
                            So, think twice before you spent big bucks just on a brand name, only to have it.
                            A LOT of people say the same thing about B&W speakers.

                            btw, who would buy audio gear based on a name. Thats why people buy Bose.

                            My freinds are not audio people and have NO idea what audio gear names there are, if I say "Mac" they probably think of a computer, if I say "B&W" they probably think I am talking about a black and white TV. Frankly I don't buy audio gear based on name brands because NONE of my friends know the name brands, and I couldn't careless what other people think, kind of stupid to buy stuff to impress those who you don't know.

                            Comment

                            • cug
                              Senior Member
                              • Jan 2008
                              • 286

                              #15
                              Originally posted by rodH
                              I have seen both extremes, running a $5000+ amp with speakers 1/2 that price (805) and seen $14000 speaker run with a reciever, I think the ideal is somewhere in the middle.
                              Yep. And everybody has to listen for himself whether he can hear a difference between a $2.5k Rotel and a 5k Classé. If there even is a real one (and not just perception, taste, imagination). Brains are too easily fooled by knowing something (price, look, ...) about the competitors.

                              Comment

                              • rodH
                                Member
                                • Aug 2002
                                • 71

                                #16
                                Originally posted by cug
                                Yep. And everybody has to listen for himself whether he can hear a difference between a $2.5k Rotel and a 5k Classé. If there even is a real one (and not just perception, taste, imagination). Brains are too easily fooled by knowing something (price, look, ...) about the competitors.
                                EXACTLY!!!!

                                And after listening to my dads 803s with Mc amplification and processing, that is what sold me. Nothing convinces me more than multiple auditions. I have now been looking like crazy for a way to afford Mc power and pre/pro. Good thing because after scouring Audiogon, ebay, and craigslist, I just ended up finding a 2 channel amp for about $1300 shipped and I happen to have a really good freind in the industry that is getting me a pre/pro and a 5 channel amp (bi-amp my center channel and then run my rears) for a smoking deal.

                                Comment

                                • MilesD
                                  Junior Member
                                  • Feb 2008
                                  • 6

                                  #17
                                  Thank you all for some much needed advice. I think my next step is an A B comparision of Rotel and Mac. Classe may however come in the future. My pockets dont really go quite that deep at the moment. Hopefully soon I can let you know how it goes. Thanks again, MilesD

                                  Comment

                                  • Frankster72
                                    Member
                                    • Feb 2008
                                    • 54

                                    #18
                                    nobody mentions here Audionet, What about the Map V1 instead the 1069 or the 1068? Also Audionet got good multichannel amps.
                                    another company known for cheap and excellent amps is Atoll...

                                    i also believe the preamp does more then a double expensive power amp

                                    Comment

                                    • Jasondtx
                                      Junior Member
                                      • Mar 2008
                                      • 4

                                      #19
                                      A really good combination is Classe equipment with 800 series speakers. That is the equipment that B&W uses when they do the final listening tests and tweaking to the 800 series speakers. Also try MIT speaker cable and interconnects. What an awesome sound together!!! It was a good enough combination for Abbey Road and Skywalker Ranch. I have seen this in person.

                                      Comment

                                      • wettou
                                        Ultra Senior Member
                                        • May 2006
                                        • 3389

                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by MilesD
                                        I'm looking to build a new home theater. I would like to have a 7.1 surround. I need some opinions on this set up. This is what was suggested to me:

                                        2 B&W 802D (Left Right)
                                        1 B&W HTM1D (Center)
                                        4 B&W DS8S (Surround)
                                        2 JL Audio f113
                                        3 Rotel RB-1092
                                        2 Rotel RB-1080
                                        1 Rotel RSP-1068

                                        I know I want to have the B&W speakers. Does anyone have any info on the amps and processors or any suggestions on other amps and/or processors. Also what kind of speaker wires and interconnects would you suggest?

                                        Thanks, MilesD
                                        Suggestions here is what I would go for:
                                        2 B&W 800D (Left, Center, Right)
                                        4 B&W 803D (Surround)
                                        1 JL Audio f113 (unless you room is huge)
                                        1 Classé SSP-800 Processor
                                        3 Classé CA-400M
                                        1 Classé CA5200
                                        Farming looks mighty easy when your plow is a pencil, and you're a thousand miles from the corn field."Dwight D. Eisenhower

                                        Comment

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