802D's arrived today

[DavidB]

My new 802D's arrived today, complete with spikes which was a pleasant surprise. Unfortunately they will be staying in the packing cases for a week or two as I've had a lot of building work done so am gradually moving back into my house over the next two weeks.

Going to be a long two weeks!

[VictorHRS]

Mine will come in today also, in a few hours!

Can't wait to go to home and set them up!

[tboooe]

you guys are in heaven...i received my 802D about 2 weeks and i have been in audio bliss since...davidb, you are more man than me. i could not sit and wait a few weeks before opening the crates. heck i was up until 2am the first evening i received my speakers. enjoy!!!!! still waiting for my spikes though...

[dyazdani]

My new 802D's arrived today, complete with spikes which was a pleasant surprise. Unfortunately they will be staying in the packing cases for a week or two as I've had a lot of building work done so am gradually moving back into my house over the next two weeks.

Going to be a long two weeks!

Give me your address and I will come pick them up - that way they will be broken in when your house is ready :rofl:

[DavidB]

I'm not actually living there yet so it's not that hard to resist! Can't wait for the big day though!

Thanks for the offer of running them in...very considerate! I actually should probably be doing that myself but I'd rather they were still wrapped up for the moment as there are builders still in other parts of the house. Don't want anyone trying to take the microphone off the top.

[ED K]

Enjoy your new speakers!!!! Got mine about 9 months ago. Took some time for the bass units to break in but, they stll sounded great from the start. They are the best sounding speakers I have heard.
ENJOY !

[kurtholz]

i got mine a few weeks ago, they sat at the dealers for 2 weeks running almost constantly as i didn't want to go thru the break-in time

bliss, great speaker, i totally understand 2 channel now, even though i have a 7.1 set-up

you will love em

regards

Kurt

[Guy]

I got mine five weeks ago. I think they are great both sonically & visually. Still breaking them in. I think I've done about 70 hours so far and they are still improving.

[VictorHRS]

They came in yesterday... Right out of the box amazing speakers! Detailed, open, involving, so real! Can't put it into words...

They replaced my Nautilus 802s and 803s, and seem to improve on every area. I have just one preocupation for my room, it's the bass. Very different from my previous speakers, much more present, tight, maybe a little too much for my room. I'll do measurements this week from 100hz below, I've seen "the hump" on Stereophile, hopefully it will not be an issue because my wife certainly wouldn't approve any kind of bass traps in the room....

And of course, they are brand new, need to be broken in properly, maybe it will solve this first and only small problem I have.

[tboooe]

victorhrs:

I just purchased a test cd from rives and a sound meter from radioshack. I will be doing some measurements as well this weekend. I am in the same boat as you. My wife would not appreciate too many room treatments since my listening room is actually the living room. I think I can probably get away with some nice bass traps like the ones from GIK.

[JKalman]

I have just one preocupation for my room, it's the bass. Very different from my previous speakers, much more present, tight, maybe a little too much for my room. I'll do measurements this week from 100hz below, I've seen "the hump" on Stereophile, hopefully it will not be an issue because my wife certainly wouldn't approve any kind of bass traps in the room....

QFT

Even in a large room it can get bothersome. I don't know how much freedom you have for room placement, but this method has been the most helpful for me in terms of limiting interaction between the speaker and the room modes (Cardas Method for Room Setup). The speakers already have that measured "hump" you mentioned in the bass region, so limiting the room interaction is a must IMO.

[JKalman]

victorhrs:

I just purchased a test cd from rives and a sound meter from radioshack. I will be doing some measurements as well this weekend. I am in the same boat as you. My wife would not appreciate too many room treatments since my listening room is actually the living room. I think I can probably get away with some nice bass traps like the ones from GIK.

Someone posted links for sound treatments which are covered in artwork before, so that is always an option. I'm sure there are places that will put custom covers for them as well. I don't see why the wife wouldn't approve of those... Actually I'm lieing, my wife probably wouldn't, which is why I have my own dedicated room in the basement.

The only problem is, you can't place most of those in the corners, and if you do it would look odd. In order to make a decent difference in bass buildup, you need to be able to treat the corners completely with a material that will absorb the fundamental room modes. Other areas along the wall should be treated as well, though doing so will result in less significant effects bass wise. Unfortunately, you can't do anything about the "hump" itself, since that is a characteristic of the speaker and not the interaction between the speaker and the room.

A few things... One, ASC makes tube traps that can be made to order with custom fabrics, perhaps one will match your decor. Two, some companies make traps that go in corners that are square and round pedestals which you can place objects on. The pedestal isn't a complete solution, but it is better than nothing. Three, some companies sell soffits as well that you can put around the edges of your room and paint any color you like. I'm sure I'll think of more things later, take a look at the ASC, RPG, Real Traps , and Sonex (if you can do ceiling tiles) sites.

[dyazdani]

victorhrs:

I just purchased a test cd from rives and a sound meter from radioshack. I will be doing some measurements as well this weekend. I am in the same boat as you. My wife would not appreciate too many room treatments since my listening room is actually the living room. I think I can probably get away with some nice bass traps like the ones from GIK.

You should set up a measurement system with your computer, makes things MUCH simpler... it's easy to do if you'd like to give it a shot.

[VictorHRS]

victorhrs:

I just purchased a test cd from rives and a sound meter from radioshack. I will be doing some measurements as well this weekend. I am in the same boat as you. My wife would not appreciate too many room treatments since my listening room is actually the living room. I think I can probably get away with some nice bass traps like the ones from GIK.

Thanks everybody for the replies.

tboooe and dyazdani, I'll do my sub 200hz measurements with my Velodyne DD18 subwoofer. In fact I should stop being lazy and set up a measurement system with my laptop, but the Velodyne's measurement will do it for now.

[VictorHRS]

QFT

Even in a large room it can get bothersome. I don't know how much freedom you have for room placement, but this method has been the most helpful for me in terms of limiting interaction between the speaker and the room modes (Cardas Method for Room Setup). The speakers already have that measured "hump" you mentioned in the bass region, so limiting the room interaction is a must IMO.

Hi Jeff, thanks for the help.

I'm aware of the Cardas Method, but unfortunately my room is very limited in terms of positioning the speakers. I though the bass wouldn't be an issue, because both the N803s and N802s did not have this problem, as the the listening position measurements for both speaker pairs, positioned the same, gave almost identical results. With a "hump" of about 4db at around 125hz and a dip of 4db at 80hz. The N803s gave in room output down to 20hz -10db, coming down gently from 60hz.

I thought the "bass hump" on the 802Ds might give me flatter response from 20 to 80hz, the problem being the 125hz hump I had. I'll measure tonight or later this week and I'll post here what I find out.

[VictorHRS]

Other areas along the wall should be treated as well, though doing so will result in less significant effects bass wise. Unfortunately, you can't do anything about the "hump" itself, since that is a characteristic of the speaker and not the interaction between the speaker and the room.

Jeff, I already have mild room treatment with this product below:

http://www.illbruck.com.br/sonex_placa_roc.asp

It is positioned on the first reflections points behind the speakers and behind the listening position, and some other places along the wall to damp the room. But as expected, this kind of product isn't efficient below 250hz, as can be seen on this graph below (blue line for me):

javascript:MM_openBrWindow('galeria_fotos/sonex_roc/grafico_placa.htm','fotos','scrollbars=no,width=38 0,height=380')

I'll look into the other options you've mentioned, maybe I'll find something my wife will aprove.

In the worst case, I won't be to treat the room and the bass will over the top. Hopefully when I move to another house later this year I'll have my dedicated room and I'll be able to deal with it properly...

[tboooe]

hey Danish, care to elaborate more on your comment about the pc based measurement? How is this better than my Radioshack approach? Will this give me more accurate results? I dont want to invest too much money because I dont see myself doing type of thing too often.

Jeff, thanks for the links to other room treatment providers. I have looked at all of them. Right now, I like the ASC and Echo Buster since they are available in quarter round tubes which should look ok. The Echo Busters also have a nice little corner triangle piece to treat the wall-wall-ceiling intersection. From what I understand the ASC is pretty expensive. I am still waiting to get some technical info from Echo Buster. In particular I am interested to see how much aborption their products give in comparison to others. The ASC and Realtraps products are pretty good in terms of absorption.

[dyazdani]

hey Danish, care to elaborate more on your comment about the pc based measurement? How is this better than my Radioshack approach? Will this give me more accurate results? I dont want to invest too much money because I dont see myself doing type of thing too often.

You would still use the RS meter, but the computer will record the response. Saves you from having to write down the numbers and graph them yourself.

All you need is the RS meter, a tripod to hold it, a computer with duplex sound, and a couple of cables.

[DavidB]

I am hoping bass build up won't be a problem for me. My listening room is also my living room, the living room is basically half of a double aspect room which in total is 46' x 15' with 11' ceilings. The othet half of the room is s dining room which has some B+W in walls in it.

[Eliav]

Hi guys
I can't help getting the impression that the 802d - if placed in an inappropriate room size/shape can be a pain in the B***, do you guys ( those who are struggling with humps and booms) find it worth the investments in these beasts ? do you find yourself spending more time ENJOYING the speakers or planning how to spend more money on traps and room changes ? please dont get me wrong, i am seriously considering the 802d as my next upgrade , however , having read threads like these make me think twice, shall I just keep my sweet 803s ?

Thanks

Eliav

[tboooe]

eliav, my apologies if you got the wrong impression. The 802Ds are fantastic but like most audiophiles, i am on a quest for absolute perfection! Perhaps by knowing what these speakers are capable of I am more inclined to do whatever i can to not waste their potential. For me, this is a fun process becuase i am not wasting my time trying to get something out of my system that it may not be capable of. I know that these 802d should last me a LOOOOONG time so I want to make sure I give it the attention it deserves.

[JKalman]

Hi guys
I can't help getting the impression that the 802d - if placed in an inappropriate room size/shape can be a pain in the B***, do you guys ( those who are struggling with humps and booms) find it worth the investments in these beasts ? do you find yourself spending more time ENJOYING the speakers or planning how to spend more money on traps and room changes ? please dont get me wrong, i am seriously considering the 802d as my next upgrade , however , having read threads like these make me think twice, shall I just keep my sweet 803s ?

Thanks

Eliav

LOL, Deja Vu! :

You know my opinion from the last thread about this topic. I'm not sure what other people here have for room dimensions. It might help you to ask them and see if anyone has similar dimensions to your room, or if they have rooms that are smaller than yours, so you can see if their bass conditions may coincide with conditions you will experience. Then again, some people like more bass than others anyway...

I'm sure it wouldn't hurt to go to a dealer and listen to them in a room in the dealership that might be similar to your own, and also to try out the 803D while you are at it to see if you like its bass output better.

No matter what speaker you buy, you should invest a good amount of money on room treatment.

[ED K]

You would still use the RS meter, but the computer will record the response. Saves you from having to write down the numbers and graph them yourself.

All you need is the RS meter, a tripod to hold it, a computer with duplex sound, and a couple of cables.

Been reading all the posts concerning the 802D bass issues. I guess I must be in the minority because the bass sounds great ,at least to me, in my room (14' by 19' with a ceiling height going from ~14' at the front position, where the 802Ds are, to 8' at the listening position). The back wall has floor to ceiling heavy drapes. Either that or I don't know what I'm missing. In any event, would you be able to send me more info on using a computer to set up the speakers? I have used the radioshack SPL meter and believe I have set up everythin correctly.

[JKalman]

...a ceiling height going from ~14' at the front position, where the 802Ds are, to 8' at the listening position...

Usually if someone has a sloping ceiling they would lay things out the opposite way (8' at the front and 14' at the listener) so the sound waves will tend to reflect away from the listener instead of towards him/her.

[ED K]

I agree but the room layout does not permit it. Some day I'll have room that's not backwards!
Thanks for your comment

[Guy]

Sorry to change the subject but B&W manual mentions that we should listen with the grilles off. Do they mean both the midrange & bass grilles or just the midrange with the 802D? Which way do you guys have it.

BTW I'm sure they could have found a better way to design those midrange grilles. The middle pins are easy to break. I have already had one replaced and I have only had them a few weeks.

[VictorHRS]

eliav, my apologies if you got the wrong impression. The 802Ds are fantastic but like most audiophiles, i am on a quest for absolute perfection! Perhaps by knowing what these speakers are capable of I am more inclined to do whatever i can to not waste their potential. For me, this is a fun process becuase i am not wasting my time trying to get something out of my system that it may not be capable of. I know that these 802d should last me a LOOOOONG time so I want to make sure I give it the attention it deserves.

Eliav, tboooe has said it all!

Anyway, the best thing you should do is try the 802Ds in your room, and see what happens, if that is possible. In my case, I already had tried both N803 and N802, so I thought that the D wouldn't present any problems.

[VictorHRS]

Yesterday I was able to take measurements of the bass response of my 802Ds using Velodyne's DD tools. It was not as bad as I expected.

With the mic positioned in the exact ear height listening position, I have one nasty +6db bump from about 55 to 75hz, with the known 80hz -4db dip following and another +5db bump around 120hz. But the good news is that if i move the listening position a little forward, I get a very flat bass response +-2db from 25hz. Problem easily solved!

[JKalman]

Sorry to change the subject but B&W manual mentions that we should listen with the grilles off. Do they mean both the midrange & bass grilles or just the midrange with the 802D? Which way do you guys have it.

BTW I'm sure they could have found a better way to design those midrange grilles. The middle pins are easy to break. I have already had one replaced and I have only had them a few weeks.

I keep the bass and midrange grills off, and have the additional/included metal peg/spike (whatever it is called) screwed into the midrange cone.

[tboooe]

victorhrs:

i am curious how the rest of the freq response looked? Did you get a flat response across the entire freq range?

i will be testing my response this weekend after i receive my test cd.

guy: i keep midrange grills off but leave the bass grills ons. to me this just looks way too cool. i dont know what it does to sound quality.

[VictorHRS]

i am curious how the rest of the freq response looked? Did you get a flat response across the entire freq range?

tboooe, the DD's measurement goes only to 200hz, so that's what I measured and where most of the room problems are located.

As for the grills, I keep them on and take them of everytime I listen to them. The mid grille does make difference, when of to me, but the bass makes little or no difference.

[RebelMan]

I keep the bass and midrange grills off, and have the additional/included metal peg/spike (whatever it is called) screwed into the midrange cone.

It's a phase plug.

[Guy]

victorhrs:

i am curious how the rest of the freq response looked? Did you get a flat response across the entire freq range?

i will be testing my response this weekend after i receive my test cd.

guy: i keep midrange grills off but leave the bass grills ons. to me this just looks way too cool. i dont know what it does to sound quality.

Yes I agree. Bass grilles on & midrange grilles off look cool. I'll keep mine this way too.

BTW for those of you who are interested in free frequency tone software to load on your PC go to http://www.nch.com.au

You can test the entire frequency range step by step from your laptop & with a handhelld spl meter make adjustments as necessary. Managed to get 805's & sub dialled in perfectly with this. Not yet tried this with the 802D's because I can't stop listening to them long enough :lol: