Need your advice N802 or 803D!

[Rob72]

Hello All,

First time poster here. I have found all your comments very useful as I am contemplating upgrading my B&W speakers.

I am in a position to purchase a pair of Nautilus 802's (16 months old) or a new pair of 803D's. I have always loved the look of the 802's but am not sure if I should go with the newer technology. The room size the speakers will be in are 17x32 ft with 12' ceilings. I do not have a full home theatre but will look for these to start one. What do you think is the better route to go? I have listened to the new 802D's and they blew me away. The 803D's were great until I listened to the 802's. My wife likes the looks of the 802 and they are also cheaper. How do they match up against the 803D's?

Please let me know your thoughts

Thanks!

[audioqueso]

If you're found a pair of Nautilus 802s in good condidtion and for cheaper than a new set of 803Ds, then I would jump on the 802s. Try a search on this forum. Someone recently asked the question on whether the new 803Ds would out perform the Nautilus 802s.

[PavelL]

Agreed a 100%. Go for NAUTILUS 802s. Great value now that prices are lower for the "old" model. No need to tell you that if you choose to upgrade to the 800D or 801D later on you will be able to sell N802 for about the same amount. Not the case with 803D:-)

[JKalman]

Go with what you liked best. I'm scared to buy used speakers myself, but if you are certain they are in great condition, and you like them better, it seems like an easy decision.

[Rob72]

Thanks so far for the advice. I think I have decided I may go with the N802's. They are apparently in Mint Condition and they are being sold via a dealer so I will get a 1 year warranty on them. I was nervous at first with them being used but was reassured by the dealer that they know the client and I will also be auditioning them before buying. It is hard to pass them up if they are only 16 months old.

I am just waiting to schedule the appointment.

I will let everyone know how the audition goes.

Thanks!

[JKalman]

Yeah, if it is through a dealer, I don't see much risk involved. A dealer is the only person I have ever considered buying used speakers from.

[PavelL]

Hey, I bought mine for only 3500$ - so do not forget to haggle. BUT I bought mine from a person who HAD to sell no matter what. A dealer MAKES MONEY when selling. Old or new. Might be making a bit less when selling used :-)). Anyway DO haggle

[dan87951]

n802 for sure I listen to both and it was obvious. Someone on here did a nice comparsion of the two.

[Matt M.]

Hum, not that obvious...

I too, made this comparison (802N vs. 803D), with my own power amp (Classe CAV 180).

This is the report I wrote on this forum a few weeks ago:

The 802N is a bit more "opened" (the soundstage is "enhanced", they give
a better impression of "pushing walls away"), but the 803D is more neutral,
more airy, more dynamic.
Medium and (obviously), trebbles are quite better.
803D's tone (like all the 80XD range) is really outstanding. For instance female voices are really wonderful...and far beyond what we had with both 803N and 802N.

Moreover, the 803D is less demanding , in term of amplification
and room !

I too owned a pair of 803N. After my comparison, my conclusion was that
the 802N is a 803N "enhanced" (they are very similar, and the
802N is a bit better, on all aspects). Whereas the 803D is quite different
from 803N and 803D, and is, on the whole, better than both of them, IMO.

So, I bought them.

However, the 802N can also be interesting because it can be found at very
attractive prices.
Then, my piece of advice is: listen to both of them, and make up your own mind !

[Rob72]

Thanks for the advice Matt. I will be auditioning the N802's fairly soon.

I too had a chance to listen to the 803D vs the 802D and thought both were nice but the 802D was the obvious winner in that audition. I have always wanted to like the lower level nautilus line like the 804 and 803 but never really got into them. The 803D's were a definite improvement. I just have not had a chance to compare the 802N side by side with the 803D.

My intended use for these will be Home Theatre as I will have a dedicated 2 channel system in another room. This is why I may lean towards the N802. Well see.

[Matt M.]

Thanks for the advice Matt. I will be auditioning the N802's fairly soon.

I too had a chance to listen to the 803D vs the 802D and thought both were nice but the 802D was the obvious winner in that audition. I have always wanted to like the lower level nautilus line like the 804 and 803 but never really got into them. The 803D's were a definite improvement. I just have not had a chance to compare the 802N side by side with the 803D.

My intended use for these will be Home Theatre as I will have a dedicated 2 channel system in another room. This is why I may lean towards the N802. Well see.

The 803D and 802D are both outstanding, indeed.
They have in common exceptionnal tone quality, warmth and neutrality,
which is the case for all the new 'D' range.
The 802D is logically better. In particular it is more "opened" and a bit more
airy, mainly due to its marlan head.

As I wrote, the N802 sounds like a N803 improved, whereas a 803D is
noticeably different, and, on the whole better, IMO.

With a 802D, you would have all the exceptionnal qualities of 803D
(tone quality, etc), but with the quality of marlan headed models
(sound "opened", etc).
However, it is more expansive...

[PavelL]

The 803D and 802D are both outstanding, indeed.
They have in common exceptionnal tone quality, warmth and neutrality,
which is the case for all the new 'D' range.
The 802D is logically better. In particular it is more "opened" and a bit more
airy, mainly due to its marlan head.

As I wrote, the N802 sounds like a N803 improved, whereas a 803D is
noticeably different, and, on the whole better, IMO.

With a 802D, you would have all the exceptionnal qualities of 803D
(tone quality, etc), but with the quality of marlan headed models
(sound "opened", etc).
However, it is more expansive...

I have a question. If you use room calibration and get your speakers' freq. response FLAT what will the difference be between N802 and 802D? Asked B&W this question weeks ago - their responce is somewhat flat - that is no response at all... Any thoughts?

[Matt M.]

I have a question. If you use room calibration and get your speakers' freq. response FLAT what will the difference be between N802 and 802D? Asked B&W this question weeks ago - their responce is somewhat flat - that is no response at all... Any thoughts?

The main differences between 802N and 802D, IMO, concern neutrality,
trebble, an above all, the tone quality, which is noticeably better in the
new model.

With a thorough calibration, you can eliminate room resonance, which is
very important for global result of a high fidelity system, but that's got
nothing to do with the tone difference between two speakers...

[PavelL]

The main differences between 802N and 802D, IMO, concern neutrality,
trebble, an above all, the tone quality, which is noticeably better in the
new model.

With a thorough calibration, you can eliminate room resonance, which is
very important for global result of a high fidelity system, but that's got
nothing to do with the tone difference between two speakers...

So tone difference has nothing to do with speaker's freq. response? Is that what you are saying? Again, after calibration/equalization it is FLAT. I understand if overall fidelity, clarity etc. is improved, but tonal balance?!?!

[RobP]

With a thorough calibration, you can eliminate room resonance, which is
very important for global result of a high fidelity system

Matt, can you explain how you did this feat just by calibrating the speakers? Because I am battling room resonances myself and would love to hear any tactics used to minimize problem areas.

[Matt M.]

Matt, can you explain how you did this feat just by calibrating the speakers? Because I am battling room resonances myself and would love to hear any tactics used to minimize problem areas.

I wrote too quikly !
In fact I should have written "attenuate". For instance, some specific preamps (like TACT) include such function.

But the most efficient way of eliminating room resonance is of course to treat acoustic.

[Matt M.]

So tone difference has nothing to do with speaker's freq. response? Is that what you are saying? Again, after calibration/equalization it is FLAT. I understand if overall fidelity, clarity etc. is improved, but tonal balance?!?!

I'm not sure to understand what you mean.
Do you think two different speakers, after a calibration and a flat curve
could provide the same sound ?

The freq response is not the only factor that characterizes a speaker sound.
Unless you got exactly all the same harmonics, and in addition,
exactly the same phase curves in both case, which is obviously not possible.

[sikoniko]

For me, there would have been a significant price difference to upgrade to the 803d vs the N802, which I decided on.

the 803d would be more expensive first, but then I would also NEED to upgrade my htm1 to the new htm2d to get the soundstage. it would have been a slippery slope.

now, i am happy with all nautilus and i will wait until the next series in 5 years before i worry about changing speakers again.

I do not like to listen to the 802d's, because there is an obvious difference between the two speakers. the d's are more distinct and alive.. if that means anything.

[PavelL]

I'm not sure to understand what you mean.
Do you think two different speakers, after a calibration and a flat curve
could provide the same sound ?

The freq response is not the only factor that characterizes a speaker sound.
Unless you got exactly all the same harmonics, and in addition,
exactly the same phase curves in both case, which is obviously not possible.

Thank you for your input. I think I need to start a new thread and ask other forum members who have real life experience in this field. Meaning systems with equalization. Thank you once again

[Blazar]

For me, there would have been a significant price difference to upgrade to the 803d vs the N802, which I decided on.

the 803d would be more expensive first, but then I would also NEED to upgrade my htm1 to the new htm2d to get the soundstage. it would have been a slippery slope.

now, i am happy with all nautilus and i will wait until the next series in 5 years before i worry about changing speakers again.

I do not like to listen to the 802d's, because there is an obvious difference between the two speakers. the d's are more distinct and alive.. if that means anything.

the htm-1 soundstages GREAT with the 802D. Don't try to convince yourself you need the very expensive diamond center, especially if you already have an HTM-1 like I did.

[Matt M.]

For me, there would have been a significant price difference to upgrade to the 803d vs the N802, which I decided on.

the 803d would be more expensive first, but then I would also NEED to upgrade my htm1 to the new htm2d to get the soundstage. it would have been a slippery slope.

You're right !
It is also an aspect to take into account.
It would have been so simple, for me too, to upgrade my Nautilus 803s, by Nautilus 802s and to keep my HTM1 Nautilus...
Unfortunately, the 803D sounded so well. :roll:

[Matt M.]

the htm-1 soundstages GREAT with the 802D. Don't try to convince yourself you need the very expensive diamond center, especially if you already have an HTM-1 like I did.

HTM1 Nautilus is a great center (I owned one too) However, it is very
close to 804N/803N, and is not totally coherent with 802D/803D (its sounds
quite differently, like a 803N is noticeably different from a 803D).

It is of course possible be satisfied with, to associate with 803D or 802D
(they all are BWs and keep in common a certain "tone philosophy"), but in
that case you will not have a perfect homogeneity between the 3 front speakers.

[Rob72]

Hi Blazar,

I am interested in your set up. I will be getting a pair of N802's soon and am concerned about what center to place with it if I can't get a second hand HTM-1. You have the 802D's with htm-1 do you notice the differences?

[JKalman]

Matt, can you explain how you did this feat just by calibrating the speakers? Because I am battling room resonances myself and would love to hear any tactics used to minimize problem areas.

There is an article in HiFi News about a room correction pre-amplifier. TacT RCS2.2X is the name. It looks pretty cool, but it is expensive. It allows you to use a mic and computer to fix sound in rooms with bad acoustics.

[JKalman]

I wrote too quikly !
In fact I should have written "attenuate". For instance, some specific preamps (like TACT) include such function.

LOL, I wrote too quickly also, I just read through the thread and noticed you had already mentioned the TacT preamps. Anyway, there is an article in Hi-Fi News where they interview someone who uses it in their setup.

[Matt M.]

LOL, I wrote too quickly also, I just read through the thread and noticed you had already mentioned the TacT preamps. Anyway, there is an article in Hi-Fi News where they interview someone who uses it in their setup.

I never used it personally. However, I know some people here in France who own the TACT, and who are very satisfied of its room correction (notably for
the bass).