RIAA upto no good again...

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  • Andrew Pratt
    Moderator Emeritus
    • Aug 2000
    • 16507

    RIAA upto no good again...

    RIAA wants $$$ from ISPs for music swapping
    Should ISPs and telecoms be responsible?
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    posted 12:48pm EST Mon Jan 20 2003 - submitted by Thomas
    NEWS
    Hillary Rosen, chair of the Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA), gave the keynote address at the Midem Music Conference in Cannes, France this past weekend. In her speech she announced a plan to "... hold ISPs more accountable" for music-swapping over the Internet. The music industry has seen further decline in sales, and is expecting to see a 6% decline in 2003. This would be the fourth year in a row to see decline. The RIAA blames Internet file-swapping, and Rosen wants to regain that lost income from ISPs and telecommunications companies.

    She explained: "Let's face it. They know there's a lot of demand for broadband simply because of the availability (of file-sharing)... It's clear to me these companies are profiting to the tune of millions and millions of dollars. They must be held accountable." Mario Mariani, senior vice president at Tiscali, a major European ISP, said, simply, that this sort of thing could not be enforced. He did admit to the fact that peer-to-peer traffic accounts for an estimated 30-60% of traffic in any given network, but said such traffic could not be controlled.

    Rosen also encouraged major labels, including Sony, Warner, EMI, Universal, and BMG, to ramp-up their online offerings, making sure to make good use of copyright-protection technology. Currently the major labels offer music via pressplay and MusicNet, but both services point out that legal issues keep new songs from being sold online, limiting their potential success.

    :roll:




  • Burke Strickland
    Moderator
    • Sep 2001
    • 3161

    #2
    RIAA kind of sounds like the buggy whip manufacturers belly-aching about their decline in sales because the "broad band" horseless carriage transportation alternative was eating into the demand for their products. :>)

    Burke

    PS -- I already know that isn't a perfect analogy, but rather than point that out again, I'd like to see a better one. A lot of folks insist they'd buy more CDs if the content were better and the price per disc more reasonable. Maybe there is an analogy that better fits that model than beating the "Internet downloading is killing our business" dead horse. :>)

    What you DON'T say may be held against you...

    Comment

    • Kevin P
      Member
      • Aug 2000
      • 10809

      #3
      Making ISPs pay for music piracy would be like making the highway department pay for shoplifters. After all, if you drive to the store and shoplift a CD, you're using the public highway system as a means of committing the theft, right? It makes no sense. But then the RIAA is like any corporation, the execs get these big DOLLAR SIGNS in their eyes and any sembalence of common sense blows right out the window...

      Like has been said a BILLION times before, the solution is better product at lower prices. I don't download music, only because there isn't anything worth downloading! I don't buy many CDs either, for the same reason, with no effort to promote the good stuff, all we hear is the crap day after day. Who wants to buy that stuff (well, besides teenagers)? :roll:




      Official Computer Geek and Techno-Wiz Guru of HTGuide - Visit Tower of Power
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      Comment

      • Gordon Moore
        Moderator Emeritus
        • Feb 2002
        • 3188

        #4
        If they're trying to make up for mediocre talent then why not look internally an do a little housecleaning...trim some of those multi-million dollar salaries before targeting ISP's. It's silly and a way to gain long-term income.

        Microsoft and Oracle have tried to do the same thing with their new(and confusing) fee structure and Oracle's already back-peddling to make it less confusing and offer more options. This days companies are looking for easy(no effort) steady income rather than work for their money.

        The RIAA should consider cleaning up the crap and start offer products that people really want.

        They should start taking alook at what people download and take the hint. Barely anyone downloads a whole album...it's usually 1 or 2 "hit" songs from an artist because the rest of the album is mediocre at best and the public knows it and isn't going to waste 15-20 on it. Why is second hand and CD trading places so popular? Because that's the price you should really pay new 5-10 tops. By creating 1 hit wonders the industry shoots itself in the foot. Sustainable TALENT is going to bring SUSTAINABLE income! They should look alot harder and quit trying to find the American IDOL, the Canadian Popstar, The "they have the look, we'll teach them how to sing" boy band.

        One things for sure about the early days of Rock-and-Roll, Everyone could play and everyone could sing!

        They should take a page from the theater owners...in Winnipeg, we are testing low priced movies to see if it brings in the masses so pricess are 6.99 and 7.25 instead of 9.99 and on a Saturday night you get turned away from the theater due to sell-outs WAY more often.
        =======================================
        How does the Canadian proposed media levy play into all of this? I thought this legalized mp3 downloading to a degree. Is the feds going to kick some of this over to the RIAA.

        Actually the media levy is very confusing to me...all I know is that businesses would get dinged for what equates to having very little to do with MP3's yet paying through the nose for recordable hardware.

        Don't get me wrong it's not my money ...or is it? The more my employer pays for equipment, software, ISP monthly fees(Don't think that the ISP's wouldn't pass this on to us...the downloaders) etc... the more my employer starts looking to cut a person or two (the consulting business is very cutthroat). If I don't get cut then I'm expected to do the work of a couple of extra people('course I'm already doing the work of 3 'cuz that's how many we lost at our location).

        Believe me, when things cost more...the trickle down effects are HUGE!
        Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.

        Comment

        • Andrew Pratt
          Moderator Emeritus
          • Aug 2000
          • 16507

          #5
          it just got worse

          ISP ordered to trace online pirate

          By TED BRIDIS -- Associated Press

          WASHINGTON (AP) -- A federal judge's decision significantly raises the risks for computer users who illegally trade music or movies on the Internet, making it much simpler for the entertainment industry to tie a digital pirate's online activities to his real-world identity.

          U.S. District Judge John D. Bates ruled Tuesday that Verizon Communications Inc. must identify an Internet subscriber suspected of illegally offering more than 600 songs from top artists. He said Verizon argued a "strained reading" of U.S. law and that its courtroom argument "makes little sense from a policy standpoint."

          The Recording Industry Association of America, the trade group for the largest music labels, had sought the user's identity with a subpoena approved under the 1998 Digital Millennium Copyright Act. The law doesn't require a judge's permission for such subpoenas, a central complaint in the dispute.

          The ruling means consumers using dozens of popular Internet file-sharing programs can more easily be identified and tracked by copyright owners. Even for consumers hiding behind hard-to-decipher aliases, that could result in warning letters, civil lawsuits or even criminal prosecution.

          Verizon promised to appeal and said it would not immediately disclose its customer's identity. The ruling had "troubling ramifications" for future growth of the Internet, said Verizon's associate general counsel, Sarah B. Deutsch.

          "The case clearly allows anyone who claims to be a copyright holder to make an allegation of copyright infringement to gain complete access to private subscriber information without protections afforded by the courts," she said.

          Deutsch said Verizon planned no immediate changes to disrupt sharing of computer files among its customers.

          Cary Sherman, president of the recording association, said piracy is a "serious issue for musicians, songwriters and other copyright owners, and the record companies have made great strides in addressing this problem by educating consumers and providing them with legitimate alternatives."

          The judge acknowledged the case was an important test of new subpoena powers Congress granted copyright holders. He said the 1998 law permits music companies to force Internet providers to turn over the name of a suspected pirate upon subpoena from any U.S. District Court clerk's office, without a judge's order.

          Critics of the procedure said judges ought to be more directly involved, given the potential privacy issues involved when a corporation is asked to reveal personal information about customers over an allegation of wrongdoing.

          "This puts a huge burden on Internet service providers," said Harris Miller, head of the Washington-based Information Technology Association of America, a trade group. "It turns them into judge, jury and executioner just because someone makes an allegation about a problem."

          The entertainment industry traditionally has fought illegal trading by suing companies that operated file-sharing networks. But technology has made it possible to decentralize these networks, allowing users to trade from computer to computer without a service like Napster's.

          In response, the industry has increasingly worked to trace users individually, either threatening them into shutting down their collections or persuading Internet providers to pull the plug. It also has resorted to seeding networks with fake files and clogging network connections to frustrate people looking for free music.

          The Computer and Communications Industry Association predicted the music industry "will be cranking up its presses pretty quickly" to send legal warnings to Internet users sharing songs and movies.

          "This has the potential to really mushroom out of control, to be very burdensome," said Will Rodger, a spokesman for the computer group, whose membership includes one firm, Streamcast Networks Inc., that distributes file-sharing software.

          Napster, the Web site that led the way for computer users to swap recordings for free, has been down since July 2001, when a judge found that its operations violated copyright law and ordered it to remove copyright recordings.




          Comment

          • Brandon B
            Super Senior Member
            • Jun 2001
            • 2193

            #6
            Originally posted by Burke Strickland
            I already know that isn't a perfect analogy, but rather than point that out again, I'd like to see a better one.
            There isn't a really good one. Movies on DVD are similar. But no one wants a 4 minute segment of a movie to watch in their car, or while they're working out. That combined with the high bandwidth required to pirate them kills the analogy.

            E-books would be a little closer, if there was such a thing in wide spread use. Magazines or newspapers, except they have no enduring value. And you can't put ads in music (I hope).

            Music sort of holds a unique place in that people use it in all areas of their life, but rarely (except for crowds like us) are using it and focussed on it to the exclusion of other things. So it needs to be portable. Which now means digital. So there really is no good way to contain it, without the sort of protection in software and hardware the RIAA wants (although I do DONT think that is the solution). If you could add value to the hard CD copy somehow (video?) that would help, but then people are still going to strip out the music part and pirate it, as that's the important part of the product.

            Probably the only realistic solution (other than the RIAA's) is a literal devaluing of music. Authors spend a great deal more time writing a single book, and their return is far smaller. And no one would argue that there is more or less creativity involved. I think the days of big rich record comapnies and millionaire musicians (the few there are) is numbered. Unless they can shift the high revenue to live performance or some other aspect.

            This is fine with me, since the only useful aspect of record companies in my opinion is the promoting and exposure they provide for new acts. Since the internet can perform that function far better and with greater equality, they are pretty unnecessary at this point.

            So in that sense, I guess we are back to Burke's buggy whip makers. They were rendered completely unnecessary too.

            And for the record (ha!), I don't and haven't ever downloaded music. MP3 sounds like crap to me, and I like to have the original CD. And since they have resold millions of albums to people on CD who already owned them in vinyl or tape format, I think they are probably as worthy of the name pirate (or criminal) as anyone downloading.

            If you have bought an album on vinyl format, are you entitled to download the digital version for portable use? Sure they incurred some overhead converting formats. But not $17.99. Whatcha think?

            BB

            Comment

            • Kevin P
              Member
              • Aug 2000
              • 10809

              #7
              The Recording Industry Association of America, the trade group for the largest music labels, had sought the user's identity with a subpoena approved under the 1998 Digital Millennium Copyright Act. The law doesn't require a judge's permission for such subpoenas, a central complaint in the dispute.
              This is one of the many reasons the DMCA needs to be fought and repealed. It's unconstitutional, and it's being used in unconstitutional ways.

              Going after ISPs and individuals who download music online is like trying to take out a hive one bee at a time. It just isn't going to work. If they'd put as much effort into stopping the mass piracy that happens in China as they are in denying us our Constitutional rights, they might actually get somewhere in their quest.

              Piracy will never go away, no matter what they do. They stopped Napster, 4 or 5 new systems pop up and take their place. If they start performing unreasonable search and seizure, file traders will start using RSA encryption or something. The RIAA needs to wake up and smell the coffee. Maybe if they stop treating their customers like criminals, maybe we'll stop acting like them.

              KJP




              Official Computer Geek and Techno-Wiz Guru of HTGuide - Visit Tower of Power
              My HT Site

              Comment

              • Gordon Moore
                Moderator Emeritus
                • Feb 2002
                • 3188

                #8
                As a side note

                RIAA chief Rosen to quit by year's end

                By Agam Shah
                January 23, 2003 5:28 am PT


                HILARY ROSEN, CHIEF executive officer of the Recording Industry Association of America (RIAA), will step down from her post by the end of this year, the organization said Wednesday.

                Rosen is leaving to spend more time with her family, the RIAA said in a statement. She became CEO in 1998 and spent 17 years overall with the RIAA, the recording industry's lobbying group.

                Rosen will work with Cary Sherman, the RIAA's president, to search for a successor, the statement said.

                The RIAA represents music labels including Universal Music Group, Warner Brothers Records, EMI Group, Sony Music Entertainment, and BMG Entertainment.

                Amid sagging music sales, the RIAA has waged a legislative and legal antipiracy battle targeted at online file-sharing programs and music pirates who illegally distribute copyrighted material. Rosen played a key role in the legal battle by the RIAA that ultimately led to the shutdown of Napster's file-sharing service last year.

                The RIAA has also taken Internet service providers to court, asking them to release information about Internet users whom the RIAA accused of illegally downloading copyrighted material.

                Rosen's resignation comes just one day after a federal judge asked Verizon Internet Services to hand over to the recording industry the name of an Internet user who downloaded more than 600 songs in a single day.

                The ruling was generally considered a victory for the recording industry in its crusade to prevent copyright infringement.

                Under the supervision of Rosen, the RIAA has also been working with the IT industry to develop technology that helps prevent the distribution of copyrighted material. The RIAA recently announced an agreement with two IT trade groups, Business Software Alliance (BSA) and the Computer Systems Policy Project (CSPP), establishing joint policy procedures to combat piracy.
                Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.

                Comment

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