hey hey, you guys seen this?

[Lex]

That's a Samsung DVD-HD1000 DVD player, reputed to upconvert 480P DVD to 1080i or 720P! However, there is a catch. DVDs that are copy protected will cause the screen to flicker, then it's converted back to 480P. I do understand there's a mod for this, that I assume would make it upconvert to 1080i or 720P any DVD.

Player retail is 1500-2000. Construction looks to be bulletproof.

Quoting one store that's taking pre-orders only:

Samsung DVD-HD1000 HD DVD Player

Samsung Electronics invested heavily in this masterpiece. Technical cooperation was pursued with both US and Japanese partners to improve the fidelity of the audio produced by the DVD-HD1000 DVD player, and overseas audio specialists were repeatedly brought in to evaluate and improve the product.

The DVD-HD1000 targets audiophiles and is designed to reproduce the world’s best audio and video quality. It comes equipped with a Shannon & Fluency filter, produced in a technical tie-up between Samsung Electronics and Luxman, to deliver sound quality as close to the original as possible. A liner “O“-core transformer reduces noise generated by the power source to offer even better overall sound quality

Moreover, the product is carefully structured to eliminate distortion, resonance, vibration and interference, thereby providing the world’s very best audio performance. It is designed for DVD audio, which is four times better sound quality than compact disc. As such, this product targets professional users and produces the very highest and lowest notes in high fidelity. The exterior is finished with aluminum to enhance its image as one of the best DVD players available on the market today.
Importantly, the DVD Player is equipped to accommodate HDTV, offering higher quality video imagers than regular DVD players do. It retails for W3 million as the ideal product for digital TV owners who want to build a high-end home theater around their DVD player.

Samsung Electronics plans to aggressively market its new DVD player through large retail outlets. The company’s priority on quality is aimed at positioning its DVD player line at the very top of the market.

HD Output DVD - 720p, 1080i
Incredibly, the quality of the output achieved is more vivid than the source.
Using a 480i source in the DVD, it outputs 720p, 1080i quality at the HDTV level.


*Notice: If playing a copy-protected DVD, 720p output or 1080i output is automatically converted to 480p output. Picture flickering may occur for 1~2 seconds during the shifting process.


Premium Audio Performance
Using the Noise Filter, and the best and most advanced DAC,
the DVD-HD1000 offers the very best in sound quality!
The BMC Insulator and FB Chassis prevent even the smallest of mechanical disturbances.
Now you can have undisrupted DVD sound quality!!

DVD Audio
Vibration-Resistant Chassis
3D Digital Noise Reduction
Multi-bit Audio DAC
R-Core Transformer
Separated A/V Block


Video Performance
480p Output,
- 720P/1080i Output
- HDCD Decoder
- 12 Bit/54MHz Video DAC

Deluxe Design
Audio/Video Reference Model with Copper Chassis 8O and Matched Components
Aluminum Front Panel

I can see that player with the Mod fullfilling my dream machine status. Stay tuned for more about this new piece. Not that I am advocating bypassing DVD copy protection with mods. But hey, as long as you aren't recording it, what's the difference for personal viewing?

Lex

[Chris D]

I've seen this one listed on their international website for some time, starting with international production. I would consider it, but it doesn't look like it has SACD capability, so it's not a universal player.

For now, the Denon DVD-5900 is still my "dream machine".




CHRIS
Luke: "Hey, I'm not such a bad pilot myself, you know"

[Andrew Pratt]

There's other DVD players that can upconvert as well...in fact I've tried one and it wasn't all i'd hoped it would be. As chris pointed out I don't think this particular model is available yet but you're right it does look to be built much better then the Liteon & Bravos etc

[aud19]

Looks to be built like a beast but the lack of SACD at this point in time and at that point of $ by any manufacturer seems just stupid to me. I'm still waiting for a true HD-DVD and SACD/DVD-A player before I upgrade again. (Yes I realize that will probably be a good couple of years.)

Jason




Need a new display? Questions about new display technologies? Visit RPTVs, plasmas, and other monitors @ HTguide

[Lex]

Stupid for 900 bucks? 12 bit video, Faroudja processing, built like a tank, DVD Audio to boot? Well, if so, call me stupid, cause I bought one used with a 4 year warranty today. Won't get until next week likely.
I examined my options for a DVD player upgrade. 800 for a Denon 2900, 1600-2000 for a 5900. To me, 900 for this player seems like a pretty good option. I don't need DVI at this point, so I am not really that worried about that. After all, I do know a good source for high grade component cables.

Lex

[aud19]

Sorry didn't mean to ruffle feathers.... What I meant is that at around the $1000 mark most companies are including Faroudja or equivelent (though some might say there is no equivelant ) processing, DVD-A and SACD. It just seems a little silly to me at this point in time for a company to obviously put a lot of thought and resources in to developing a VERY good product (which this sounds like it is) and not include both high-res audio formats. Maybe a year ago sure but not now.

Strangely I was going to recommend in your other thread that you look for a good quality player for video that doesn't do either of the high-res formats...lol Looks like you found something close to that anyways Plus now at least you have the option to listen to DVD-A (trust me it sounds good :P ) I'm sure you'll be very happy with it

Jason




Need a new display? Questions about new display technologies? Visit RPTVs, plasmas, and other monitors @ HTguide

[spiffnme]

What has the word been on this new Pioneer model? It seems to be in direct comepetion with the Denon 5900, but I've heard very little buzz.

DV59-AVi

I've seen it sold for as little as $950 new-in-box




www.funnyfarmcomics.net
All Daredevil, All the Time!

[Lex]

Well, the Denon 2900 does not have Faroudja processing, or pure cinema. It's something else. Not necessarily bad, but not the creme either I don't think.

sounds like a nice player on the Elite.

lex

[Chris D]

Holy schnikies! That Pioneer looks awesome! I'll start a new discussion thread on that model




CHRIS
Luke: "Hey, I'm not such a bad pilot myself, you know"

[JonMarsh]

You know, I still have to scratch my head sometimes at the mix of features some of these guys are trying to offer. Keep in mind, it's not necessarily because of THEIR choice, but also because of the "box" they're put into because of the DVD license retrictions.

So, typical thing, a lot of thew newest "moderate" price players are offering 12 bit or better DAC's, which three years ago were the exclusive province of players like the Ayre D1. That's cool. Then you can use higher frequency over sampling and filtering interpolation to get smoother graduations in color and eliminate much of the banding in darker areas often seen on less expensive DVD players.

Also, many players are now offering upscaling, as HTPCs have had for a long time, to 720P or 1080i. That's also cool, except that they're only usually offering this feature on DVI or HDMI outputs. This is almost certainly the case with the Pioneer, which is a very nice looking unit. But vague in the spec sheet.

Hmmm, DVI outputs; seemingly the "new holy grail" for high end DVD playback- bypassing the bandwidth limitations of inexpensive component outputs (which often are several dB down by 5-6 MHz). Unfortunately, the real reason behind DVI is the HDCP copy protection, not giving the consumer better video (unless you're comparing to an inexpensive component or S-Video output stage)

Oh, BTW, don't forget DVI is only 8 Bit color, so your nice wideband DAC and it's post filter don't buy you anything through a DVI output.

And if you're feeding the analog 12 bit signal from one of these new players into your new digital projection, rememberr it only has 8 bit ADC's in the front end, and if it's DLP, there's some dithering and other stuff going on to try to acutally simulate an 8 bit dynamic range. :roll:

Yeah, sorry if this post is a bit "bah humbug"! Taken individually, a lot of these features could be pretty cool.

So, maybe you try that new Panny, or the Pioneer, but first rip the DVD to your hard drive, remove the macrovision and encryption, then burn a new disk you can play on your new set top player and get all it's capable of on the analog outputs. Probably be a good idea to feed those outputs to a carefully calibrated CRT RPTV or FPTV while you're at it.

I'm "re-purposed" my MyHD card these days; because you can get so little HD over the air where I live (not a usable signal in most cases), but it does a cracker jack job of playing back DVD, upscaled to 1080i by the Janus MPEG decoder chip. Just have to do a little digital projectionist work and prep the DVD to the HD.

BTW, if you've been considering a DVD burner, my obvious suggestion is to wait until April or so, when the dual layer versions and media come out, and you can handle big movies without having to go to the HD or re-author them to two disks.

Happy Holidays to all.

-Jon




Earth First!
_______________________________
We'll screw up the other planets later....

[Lex]

Jon, I can't pretend to keep up with your video posts. Your out there man.

The original post was really about the Samsung DVD-HD1000. I don't think it actually has DVI or HDMI It's gonna be good old component. For the record, I agree on DVI and HDMI. I do believe it's all about copy protection, not about giving the consumer anything. In fact, I see this as eventually, all they are gonna want to give us is a fully controlled connection.

While I see the benefits of all the HTPC stuff. Myself, I don't have the time or inclination to go there. When I watch a movie, I just want to press on on the Pre-pro, turn the DVD player and projector on, and watch it. That's all I personally want to do. My one attempt at an HTPC failed miserably, so perhaps I am just snake bit in that regard. I spent a lot of money trying, and just came up short.

l8er,
lex

[Sonnie Parker]

Denon would have you think their's is the creme of the crop. The 2900 is powered by the Silicon Image/DVDO PureProgressive (SiI504) Decoding Engine. Supposedly the highest quality progressive decoding engine available (Denon claims so). I believe it uses a 12-Bit video DAC. For audio Burr-Brown 192KHz/24-Bit DSD-1790 DAC's are used.

The Samsung uses Faroudja's DCDiTM technology and uses a 10-Bit video DAC (well the manual says 10-Bit but the above info says 12-Bit). For audio 96kHz/24-Bit DAC's are used (not sure who makes them).

The Elite uses Pure Cinema with a 14-Bit video DAC and has Burr-Brown 192kHz/24-Bit DAC's for audio.


I think I've got the apples to apples comparisons right but I wonder what technology is the Pure Cinema based on?

Of course the bottom line is how do they perform.

I'm interested in hearing what Lex has to say about the Samsung, especially the upconversion. It reads like it should be a nice unit.

Congrats Lex!






SONNIE

Cedar Creek Cinema

DVD Collection

BFD Comprehensive Setup Guide

[Lex]

Hey Sonnie, I see you got your picture in your Avatar space finally. :LOL:

Good writup on the units. Well, I'd say go by whatever Samsung says on their site as far as whether it's 10 or 12 bit. I don't put a lot of stock in that difference alone anyway. Really, all I tried to do (realizing sometimes that's hard not being able to physically compare all units) was to pick a player that's a big bang for the buck. I mean I am using a 100.00 Toshiba for progressive scan right now. lol.

I'm not trying to get the best or the most expensive or even the most feature rich for 2K new. You see, I am in the belief that whatever we buy in a dvd player will either

1. wear out in several years due to the movement mechanisms in cd or dvd players, sensitivity of optics etc...
2. be obsoleted by newer (HD maybe) technologies anyway.

So, why run out and spend 5K on the biggest and bestest now? Or even the Krell standard 8K, or whatever else is even higher than that in the esoterics.

Maybe, just maybe, I could have bought a better unit for 1500 or 2000. But I firmly believe that for 900.00, I'd be hard pressed to beat this Samsung, regardless of upconversion. Sure, SACD would have been nice. But I saw this player and to me it just exuded quality. All copper chassis, Faroudja, Burr Brown 24 bit. After all, this is a 1500 to 2K player new. So, I really look to be pleased with this piece. I really do. Even if I am not, I shouldn't loose much money on it if I opt not to keep it. It should be pretty easy to sell in the near future.

Lex

[Chris D]

Good info here. Jon, based on the things you're saying, doesn't that really highlight advantages of HDMI in comparison to DVI, with 12 bit? (could you explain what exactly that means, 8 bit vs 12 bit?)




CHRIS
Luke: "Hey, I'm not such a bad pilot myself, you know"

[JonMarsh]

Hi Chris,

There's some potential misinformation re the "12 bit" ness of HDMI vs. standard DVI. In reality, HDMI can make tradeoffs between the bit count in luma and chroma signals, but the "total" bits per pixel is still 24- which in RGB terms is 8 bits per color channel.

Now, DVD isn't an RGB source- it's encoded in YUV, and there's only about half the choma information as there is B/W info (luma). But one it's converted to signal ready to be output to your TV or projector, with, for example, a 12 bit 216 MHz DAC, it can be 4X oversampled and dithered and/or interpolated, giving smoother transistions under the control of the output reconstruction filter in the player, instead just the frequency roll-off "integration" of the display video circuits. This is the same kind of thing going on with the better audio DAC's which do upsampling/oversampling with a dither signal combined with the 16 bit digital data, fed to a 24 bit DAC.

Where HDMI and DVI shine is getting a true 8 bits of data per color channel, even in high frequency detail, to the set, whereas with typical "standard" component connections, you don't really get anything like 8 bits of data at high frequencies when you have an HF roll off of 1-2 dB ast 5 MHz, as many sets or players themselves do have.

In the HTPC world, this is the advantage of using the VGA RGB output, which typically has 350-400 MHz DAC's with 10 bit resolution. Analog data is passed on even at the upper range of the display frequencies without any roll off (6.5 MHz isn't much of a challenge for a 400 MHz DAC)

(Lex's disappointment with HTPC, in my estimation, is because he didn't have a display which would work with the VGA output, and was disappointed (not surprisingly) with the S-Video output from a standard video card, which is really just designed to do a passable job of getting medium resolution games to the "big screen").

Best regards,

Jon




Earth First!
_______________________________
We'll screw up the other planets later....

[Lex]

At the time, I didn't even think about that, but your right, my display did not support component or VGA. That's the first big problem I had. Though it might be different now, I have no desire to go back, really I don't.

Seeing as how I just sold my HTPC case, I'm officially out of that.

Lex

[JonMarsh]

BTW, one other commenton this topic- applicable to anyone "interested" in the new generation of DVI equipped DVD players, but not having a DVI input on your HD capable display (there's a lot of us out there in this predicament).

The natural solution would be a converter from DVI to VGA or component. If the DVI source is DVI-I, then a simple $10 adapter as comes with many video cards will do the trick- followed by a VGA to component transcoder. If the source unit is DVD-D only, then matters are more tricky, but not intractable.

You'll just need one of these. They also have great DVI cables, which I don't believe Lex is offering at this time so hopefully no conflict of interest.

The price of this unit should be considered in the context of the cost of some of the DVI sources you might use it in, but more in the context of extending the usable life of an existing $3K-5K HD capable TV or projector. In that context, it makes a fair amount of sense.



For example, you could readily use a new DVI output DVD player with this box and a CRT or digital projector lacking DVI inputs, but having RGBHV (VGA).

Best regards,

JOn




Earth First!
_______________________________
We'll screw up the other planets later....

[Lex]

Good info Jon. Your right, I don't currently offer DVI cables. It's an area for future expansion though. Currently, I have some other products I want to get to market as soon as I have time and energies. I seem to have lacked motivation to move forward lately for various reasons none of which I care to elaborate on here.

My situation with my new player is just the opposite. I have a DVI capable projector now (also new), but no DVI capable DVD player. That's right, I bought backwards technology with the Samsung DVD-HD1000. However, sometimes, you make a decision based upon "what your getting", and not "what your not getting". I could neither justify nor really afford to spend 1600-2K right now on a DVD player having just upgraded projectors along with all the upgrades I did already last year.

So, it was time to pay down some of what I already owed, and focus on a big bang buck player. At 900 bucks, I think I got that with the Sammy. faroudja processing, bulletproof construction not to unlike the Ayre DVD player, but at a fraction of the price. 720p and 1080i upconversion were also something I wanted to try. Keep in mind, the only progressive players I owned were less than 100.00 Sony and Samsung. So, this is a HUGE upgrade for me.

I'm going to do a separate review thread, so I won't go much further here.

Lex




Cable Guy DVD Collection