Combining AV reciver and a Pre Pro

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  • P-Dub
    Office Moderator
    • Aug 2000
    • 6766

    Combining AV reciver and a Pre Pro

    I was explaining to somebody about the multi-channel inputs on a receiver and how for most cases, it's pretty pointless as you'd just feed the digital signal from your DVD player to your receiver. But then it just hit me. I could probably buy a pre/pro and feed the signal out of that to my receiver and that would do the amplification.

    So with that said, is there a problem with my logic? I'd buy a pre/pro, say the Outlaw, and then just connect it to my Yamaha, via a set of Amp5 Cat Cables, and I'm rocking? I'll have all the latest sound decoding formats, and I'd just have to save up some for a dedicated amp.




    Paul

    There are three kinds of people in this world; those that can count, and those that can't.
    Paul

    There are three kinds of people in this world; those that can count, and those that can't.
  • GregoriusM
    Super Senior Member
    • Oct 2000
    • 2755

    #2
    Lots of people do this as an interim measure until they can afford a dedicated amp or separate amps.
    .
    Gregor

    Comment

    • Andrew Pratt
      Moderator Emeritus
      • Aug 2000
      • 16507

      #3
      This will work but given that you can pick up a HK 5800 5 channel amp for under $300 US you're usually better off selling the receiver and buying a budget amp. Also IMO one of the weakest links in a reciever is the amps not the pre pro area so by using a receiver as an amp you're not getting very good amplification...unlike using a reciver connected to an extrenal power amp...however for a short term sol'n there's no reason it wouldn't work




      Comment

      • Kevin P
        Member
        • Aug 2000
        • 10809

        #4
        It'll work, but why bother since the amps are usually the weakest links in most receivers these days. I would tend to opt for the opposite approach - add the outboard amp first and use the receiver as a pre-pro, and then get the dedicated pre-pro afterward.

        Also, if you want any of the 6.1/7.1 sound formats, you'll need an amp/amps for the center rear speaker(s).

        Lastly, the multi-channel inputs on receivers are useful if you have a SACD or DVD-A player.

        KJP




        Official Computer Geek and Techno-Wiz Guru of HTGuide - Visit Tower of Power
        My HT Site

        Comment

        • P-Dub
          Office Moderator
          • Aug 2000
          • 6766

          #5
          Originally posted by Kevin P
          It'll work, but why bother since the amps are usually the weakest links in most receivers these days. I would tend to opt for the opposite approach - add the outboard amp first and use the receiver as a pre-pro, and then get the dedicated pre-pro afterward.
          Well mainly because my receiver doesn't have pre-outs. I used to beleive that I had to go all pre-pro and amp, or just buy another AV receiver with pre-outs. But this way, I could start with a nice pre-pro, then buy a nice amp later. So I'd be saving money on the 2nd AV receiver and go straight to the pre-pro.

          My original upgrade plan was to buy a newer/better AV receiver with pre-outs. I'd have that as my main system and have my Yamaha in the bedroom or computer room. I'd then get a nice amp to power the speakers. Then I'd get a pre-pro. Once I got a pre-pro, I'd move the new AV receiver to the bedroom and then the Yamaha to the computer room. Why don't I just sell the old equipment, don't know, I'm just a pack rat, plus I'd like to have a receiver that I could take travelling with me.

          So knowing that what I proposed could work. I'd be looking at saving the money on the 2nd AV receiver and going with a nice pre-pro, then an amp. I'd have my Yamaha available for the bedroom or computer room.




          Paul

          There are three kinds of people in this world; those that can count, and those that can't.
          Paul

          There are three kinds of people in this world; those that can count, and those that can't.

          Comment

          • Andrew Pratt
            Moderator Emeritus
            • Aug 2000
            • 16507

            #6
            I'd still rather see you sell the first receiver and pick up a cheap 5 channel amp like the HK5800 (~$300US) then use the receivers amps but there's no reason why it wouldn't work.




            Comment

            • Lex
              Moderator Emeritus
              • Apr 2001
              • 27461

              #7
              Paul, I don't know the price of the Outlaw, but you might look at the Denon 2802 writeup I put here tonight. Might be a good interim solution that gives you lots of formats, just check to make sure it has pre-outs. then you can get the amp later, then finally a dedicated pre-pro, and move the Denon to the Bedroom. The Yamaha goes wherever.

              Lex
              Doug
              "I'm out there Jerry, and I'm loving every minute of it!" - Kramer

              Comment

              • P-Dub
                Office Moderator
                • Aug 2000
                • 6766

                #8
                Lex: The Outlaw I'm thinking of is the 1050, that lists for US$499, it doesn't have DPL II, but is a quality unit. I'd also consider the new Yamaha RX-V630 for US$499: 6x75W, pre-outs, all speaker binding posts, DD 5.1, DD Matrix 6.1, DTS, DTS ES, DPL II, HD Component switching.

                Postmaster Pr@: When all is said and done, I think I'd end up still going with my first plan. ie buy a new receiver. I think ease of use has to come into play and I don't think a pre-pro connected to a receiver is going to do it for me. So in a sense I agree with you, I won't be bothering to use my receiver's amp. If I go pre-pro, I go all the way. Otherwise, I'll be doing gradual upgrades.




                Paul

                There are three kinds of people in this world; those that can count, and those that can't.
                Paul

                There are three kinds of people in this world; those that can count, and those that can't.

                Comment

                • Uncle Clive
                  Former Moderator
                  • Jan 2002
                  • 919

                  #9
                  Hi Guys, how much wattage/specifications on the reciever are you talking about here, say, if my reciever specs for 135 discrete wpc are you saying that if I should add an amp to each of the outputs say rated @ 140 wpc would they give better amplification/output level and/or a cleaner sound?




                  CLIVE




                  HEY!! Why buy movie tickets when you can own a Theater?
                  CLIVE




                  HEY!! Why buy movie tickets when you can own a Theater?

                  Comment

                  • Kevin P
                    Member
                    • Aug 2000
                    • 10809

                    #10
                    Originally posted by Uncle Clive
                    ...if my reciever specs for 135 discrete wpc are you saying that if I should add an amp to each of the outputs say rated @ 140 wpc would they give better amplification/output level and/or a cleaner sound?
                    In many cases, yes. Many receivers' power ratings are measured at 1 KHz into 1 channel. So, that receiver that claims 125 wpc may only produce a clean 40-50 watts into all 5 channels over a broad frequency range. Higher end gear is rated at 20-20Khz into all channels, or at least a stated number of channels. Also, the THD spec comes into play as well, lower end receivers are measured at higher THDs to give the perception of more power, but it's not clean power.

                    So, if you compare a receiver rated at 135 wpc (1 khz into 1 channel @ .3% THD), with an outboard amp rated at 140 wpc (20-20Khz, 5 channels @ .05% THD), which is giving you the most clean power? If you were to measure that receiver the same way as the outboard amp (20-20KHz, all channels and no more than .1% THD) you'd be lucky to get 50 WPC out of it. Probably more like 30.

                    KJP




                    Official Computer Geek and Techno-Wiz Guru of HTGuide - Visit Tower of Power
                    My HT Site

                    Comment

                    • Andrew Pratt
                      Moderator Emeritus
                      • Aug 2000
                      • 16507

                      #11
                      Kevin is correct in that most receivers do not bench their rated power (there are a few exceptions though) Check out this site for some specific measurements on a varitey of receivers Recevier comparision

                      There's also the factor of noise to contend with. Assuming both the receiver and the seperate power amp both had the same power the seperate power amp should sound better since it isn't sharing the power supply with the rest of the processing that the receiver has to and it isn't surrounded by components that are giving off lots of noise that could be picked up but the amps.




                      Comment

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