SVS sub

[soundhound]

I just recieved my new SVS 25-31PCI sub this afternoon and fired it up. Pretty slick. It replaced a Klipsch SW-10 II. I had been nosing around the various threads on wich sub and why for a little while and figured for the $580 to the door I would see what all the fuss is about. ACCURATE, ACCURATE, ACCURATE, is the first thing that comes to mind. I don't use it for music, just the video side and it is very controlled and accurate compared to my Klipsch. The Klipsch would make stuff rattle, but not nearly as accurately as this little beast. It is a descent looking addition as well, goes well with the RF series Klipsch wich are black. Going to experiment a little bit with placement and all, but so far so good. I was wondering if for the money I should go with the bigger versions, but as of right now that wouldn't have been money well spent, as I think this one will do anything I will ever ask of it.
Just had to share another success story

[BlazeMaster]

enjoy, another good thing about SVS is that you have a 45 day satisfaction guarantee. I had the 20-39pci for a couple of weeks and exchanged it for a B-stock PB12plus/2. The b stock arrived without any cosmetic flaws and the bass from it is unreal. I also use it for only movies, the bass is fast, accurate and effortless.

[John Holmes]

Congrats on the new sub! :T

I've had my 20-39cs for 3yrs. And still feel it was the best money spent in my set-up.

Have fun and enjoy!!!

[DrJRapp]

Good choice! The Klipsch/SVS combination is nearly a perfect marriage. It seems a lot of us with Klipsch feel so, and have gone the SVS route vs staying all Klipsch. The 25-31PCi is an excellent choice to match with RF7s in a moderate sized room. I find in my HT setup that I run my RF7s as large and let the SVS handle everything below 80hz on the center and surrounds only.

[soundhound]

Sittin here watching Pearl Harbor and Oh My God, this little sub is incredible, bar nothing. As you say Jerry, it blends seamlessly, and ......I will have to go outside in a little bit to make sure the house hasn't moved off of the foundation.

[BlazeMaster]

another good scene to show off your sub that I found was the Lord of The Rings, the Return of the King Extended Edition. Towards the end where Frodo is about to drop the ring, and his heart beats as he contemplates. The bass beating like his heart beat was rocking all the windows in the house including the ones on the floor above. AMAZING. It's the favorite part of my system.

[PewterTA]

...yet another satisfied SVS Bass-a-holic.



Hi, My name's Dan, I'm a SVS Bass-a-holic!

Glad you enjoy it SoundHound!

Watch all the reference bass scenes you can find and be stunned by it.

...then watch as the upgradeitis hits and you want more!

I'm already looking towards the PB12-Ultra/2 or PC-Ultra x 2...though I love my PC+ 20-39.

[David Meek]

I've had my 20-39cs for 3yrs. And still feel it was the best money spent in my set-up.

All joking aside, that is as fine a testimonial to a piece of equipment that I can think of. That's impressive John.

[Nick M]

I've listened to the PCi 20-39, and haven't heard a better sub since.

I'm looking at getting one PC-Ultra which will be more than enough in my small 18x12' room. That PC-Ultra driver looks menacing!

Glad to hear you like your PCi! :T

[avpower]

Nicholas,

if you get the PC-ultra you will not be disappointed. The depth of quality bass from this unit is just astounding. Having a quality built in amp just makes the whole setup ez and very flexible for relocating for that optimal position. I am consistently astounded at the impact that feel in my body from this sub. Don't even get me started on the Matrix scenes. Wow!

I just watched some Harry Potter movies this week and the scene where the mad tree is trying to crush harry just kicks hard everytime that tree slams its "fist" into the ground. :g>

This sub is also really good at recreating that low level bass creep when the sound editors are trying to create atmosphere and make ya a bit edgy.

Plus - just as a guy thing - i love looking at the woofer - the construction and displacement on this monster is just outstanding. Sounds like i'm on the svs bandwagon for this one! :T

[Foxman]

Soundhound,

I have the Klipsch Referance 7 series and the SVS 20-39PC+. I would recomend that first you email SVS tech support with your question about one of the larger subs. You need to include your usage and room size and they will respond pretty promptly with their suggestions.

I for one advocate setting your crossover as low as your speakers will allow. In my case my sub is to the right of the primary seating location. As such when I had the crossover point set at 80 hz, the bass in music from the sub in particular was pretty apparent. Since setting the crossover point down to 40hz I have experianced a renewal of my musical enjoyment. Before I felt like I needed a second sub on the other side of the room and now I really can not tell when the bass transitions from the mains to the sub. I have ran several bass frequency tests and it really is amazing to me that there isnt even a hint of transition.

Movies are equally as impressive to me, but I notice the differance more with music than movies. I might not have noticed this as much if I were able to place the sub up front with my mains like some of you probably have, so it might be a bigger deal in my system than yours, but it gives you something to tweak this weekend. :T

[Nick M]

Great to hear avpower!

This sub is also really good at recreating that low level bass creep when the sound editors are trying to create atmosphere and make ya a bit edgy.

This is one of the biggest things I'm looking for. Personally I look for this effect (or the lack of) more than explosions that rattle the windows. 8O

I'm also looking for something that will blend well, and play clean for DVD-A, DTS Concerts, and 2 channel audio. I'm hoping the PC-Ultra will also fit this portion of the bill.

[Bent]

I found that the low frequency ambience in Event Horizon to do that very thing....

[avpower]

Nicholas, in any movie that uses the lower frequency range for atmosphere this sub will completely stoke you. I have a fairly shallow room - only 15 foot and about 18 wide. The sub is placed off to the side. This sub work extremely well with my three kef Q7's across the front. Since the Q7's each have 6x9 woofers in them they tend to provide a reasonable bass punch. The reason i mention this is because this sub puts out so much sound that there is a certain bass heaviness to the sound on the sub side of the room. For my system this is more on the detectable/noticeable scale than on the dominant annoying scale. i believe that if these weren't such good full range speakers than this directional bass effect would be stronger. That being said, one of the things I really like about the SVS cylinder sub (Pc-ultra) is that the sound doesn't just come from down from the floor. The whole cylinder emits sound, just like a full range speaker does and that effect provides a lot of musical enjoyment. When I first heard an SVS cylinder sub (PCI+ 25-31, i believe) it was the first time i thought a sub sounded musical. I was shocked and I have been totally pleased with my purchase. For me, I never turn the amp on the PC Ultra to even half way. its more like 35%. Still a tremendous amount of sound. And make sure you tune your system after you get this. As Foxman indicates, move the sub around and rerun your tests. Location will make a huge effect on the sound. I used the Avia disk to tune mine...

Tonight I have been listening to The Division Bell in PL II music mode. As I sit here writing this, my mom is just drifting with the music, head bobbing, eyes closed to "Coming Back to Life". What better testimony is there ??!! And she's in her 60's! Ya gotta love that!!
;b>

[Prozakk]

I have a PB12Ultra/2 & couldn't be happier! It replaced 2 Paradigm PW-2200 v.1's. Big time improvement in bass quality/quantity. :T

[Chris D]

Yup, I bought ***DUAL*** PC-Ultras to replace a Klipsch KSW-15, so go with my all Klipsch Legend system. The KSW-15 got moved to my bedroom.

You know, at first, I kept thinking, "man, where's all the power in these PC-Ultras?" I put on some of my favorite bass tracks, and it didn't have the punch of the Klipsch. But you know, I've given it several months, talked to the guys at SVS, and even went out and met Ron in person at his house/showroom. The answer is just what you other guys are saying--ACCURACY. I've come to realize that the Klipsch would boom and surge at lower frequencies, adding all sorts of volume and making it sound attractive. But I'm sure if I saw an output graph of the Klipsch, there would be some massive peaks and valleys. The SVS is about as flat as they come. I'm hearing lots of nuances in material now that I didn' hear before!

[Nick M]

The SVS is about as flat as they come. I'm hearing lots of nuances in material now that I didn't hear before!

Thats great to hear! (and very reassuring to me since the PC-Ultra is what I'm after).

Yup, I bought ***DUAL*** PC-Ultras

:E :E :E ... NICE! :T

[Sithlord]

After buying the B12-Plus/4 I haven't looked back. The best sub I've owned and it still scares me with every new movie I buy. AvP (Alien vs Predator) being the latest will push your sub and beyond. A great DTS track for testing ,very powerful but deep. It's nice to know everyone who owns an SVS is happy. Enjoy your new toy.

[popbumper]

SVS sub

A year ago, I put together an all Klipsch heritage HT setup (Forte mains/surrounds, Academy center, KG2 rears (not heritage)), and on recommendation from many other folks, went with the SVS 20-39PCi as my sub.

My room is 20 x 21 (lousy dimensions, but after employing a Behringer feedback destroyer, tuned much better). The SVS sub IS a good fit in my system, though I have found on more than one occasion it tends to bottom out on the very hard-hitting bass when the volume is up. A great example of this is in the film "Finding Nemo", where Darla is tapping on the aquarium glass - it just can't deal with it. On general usage, it is an OUTSTANDING unit, but I am inclined to upgrade to something that hits even harder when asked.

I HIGHLY recommend SVS, and am happy with the sub though I crave even more....

Chris

[mradem]

I also know alot of satisfied svs owners. Probably the successor of my REL 8) .

[Sonnie Parker]

Congrats Bob on your new SVS... it's amazing how they can do so well with a sub for literally chump change. I'd love to able to come out on selling my HGS-15 for the shot at one or two of those SVS's... not that my HGS-15 isn't a charmer of a sub... just feel like I spent way too much when I did.

Hey Chris... I use to own a pair Forte's... fine speakers. Still got a pair of KG1's somewhere too. Amazing little speakers.

An SVS bottoming out ?? ... from all I've read about SVS I thought that was almost impossible.

That would probably mean on U-571 with the depth charges you are bottoming out as well. How's your post-BFD measurements/graph look? Are you boosting any frequencies below 40hz or so?

I would also think that if someone was using a BFD on those Klipsch subs that you would be able to get it to be fairly accurate. It's obvious the SVS subs are tuned differently, but peaks and valleys are probably inherent in the response measurements of most subs due to the room boundaries, unless of course you have that perfect anechoic chamber.

[BlazeMaster]

Yea, there's alot of happy SVS owners on this forum and others. I kinda feel sad for people that just don't care about these things and thinking that only stores have anything worth buying, but we all know that can't be true at all, after hearing my PB12plus/2. It's funny watching people come over to my house and seeing that monster and think I've gone crazy overboard. But after I play a couple of demo bass scenes for them, they almost jump out of their seat when the deep bass starts kicking in. The people at SVS were very honest with me about what to expect by going bigger, from my original purchase of PCi20-39 and the performance increased was exactly the way they described it to be.

[Kevin P]

An SVS bottoming out ?? ... from all I've read about SVS I thought that was almost impossible.

It's not impossible but they can be pushed quite a bit before they do bottom. The first generation CS/PC series was easier to bottom but then they came out with the improved driver (CSi/PCi) which has a higher Xmax. If you're bottoming one of those in your room, you either need an Ultra or a 2nd sub.

I had a 20-39CS which I upgraded to a CSi when the upgraded drivers came out. I never bottomed that thing, even with the bass-fest movies. Unfortunately, my 20-39CS(i) was destroyed in a fire along with the rest of my HT. No doubt I'll be getting another SVS when I rebuild my HT though. Maybe a CS-Plus this time around.

[Sonnie Parker]

Kev... I figured you'd be getting at least a pair...

What amazes me is their little $429 10" sub...



I realize this is in an anechoic room but still flat down to 22hz or so and they claim it will play +/- 3db down to 15-16hz or so in real world conditions. Amazing for the price.

[Kevin P]

Who knows, Sonnie. My old SVS basically coasted in my 20x13x7 room. When we rebuild, the new room will be the same size but with higher ceilings, possibly sloped or cathedral, haven't decided yet. The added volume may dictate more subbage. Since even LOTR, Nemo, U-571 etc. didn't bottom out my old sub, there's a good chance I'll still only need one. Maybe a CS Plus instead of CSi.

We'll be laying out the room differently which could change the response curve somewhat too. The way the room was before, the sub was in a corner and the couch was against a wall with a window behind, which I think reinforced the bass where we were sitting. I had to cut some frequencies 10+ db with a BFD to get it reasonably flat. Thus the sub was running below average levels. With a different layout, who knows, I might need more.

[popbumper]

Bottom out - unfortunately

Sonnie:

Yes, unfortunately the sub goes into "appropriate" and very noticeable flapping when I ask it to "do too much". As far as the BFD, I had discovered an extreme peak at around 70Hz in my room that was about 30 Hz wide. I backed this down about 8dB, and found the result very PLEASING, needless to say. I did also boost my level of 30Hz by a few dB and it helped a great deal.

Interestingly, I just purchased and tried a CD called "Bass Mekanik" on my system to see what it would do. I tried the 60Hz-150Hz sweep (at 1Hz intervals) and found a lot of other "swoops and peaks" between 60 and 90Hz, and then everything settled down around 90dB to +/- 2dB.

Soooo...I really need to sit down and graph a response curve and attack the room reponse from that angle. Perhaps that is truly the issue - I REALLY have room problems, not a sub problem.

Chris h:

[Sonnie Parker]

Kevin... I have a massive boost around 30hz on my back wall as well. It's extremely heavy... but if I adjust it out then it's off in my prime listening area. I've been thinkin' about cutting out a big hole in the corner of my room where I have a hollow space and seeing if maybe I can trap some of that frequency... starting with a smaller cutout and progressively getting bigger until I find the magic size... then covering it with acoustic tile. Something to play around with anyway... one day.

Chris... if you haven't graphed your response yet I would definitely suggest you do so. You can use the MS Excel Workbook (download from BFD site). Post it on a separate thread and we'll deal with it. We may can fix your sub bottoming out problem... and leave you will a nice house curve if you like lots of bass.

[Shane Martin]

An SVS bottoming out ?? ... from all I've read about SVS I thought that was almost impossible.

Easy to do. I know of several discs that will send one flapping.

[Sonnie Parker]

I've never been able to bottom out my HGS-15 and it's -3db at 16hz. Of course I've never played it louder than about 130db either... that's loud enough to give my heart an extra beat.

What discs are you referring to Shane? Not that I want to bottom out my sub... just curious... are they DVD's are CD's?

[Shane Martin]

I've never been able to bottom out my HGS-15 and it's -3db at 16hz.

Likely because of a limiter.

What discs are you referring to Shane?

Titan AE will(chapter 1 and the ice fields), The opening THX splash to Episode 2 will, Haunting DTS will.

FWiW, there is a guy over at another forum(HTT) that replaced his HGS10 with a PC ULtra. It appears another critic of a ported design is silenced As I said I've heard the HGS 15 and my friend replaced his with a dual 25-31cs+ setup for less money overall and the difference between the 2 is substantial. That doesn't mean the HGS subs are poor though.

Because a friend of mine listens to movies at reference level, he has added a subsonic filter to his setup. He's still getting rather loud 120db+ passages of bass at 20 and pretty loud 100+ stuff at 16.

I haven't tried Black Hawn Down lately though. I know it has nasty bass in the 8hz region. Star Wars Episode 1 on laserdisc is in that same category. The pod race might bottom the svs but we haven't tried as my AC3 laserdisc player has been on the fritz. The LD has much deeper and more powerful bass than the dvd ever thought possible. The DVD is much easier to listen to though for most as its not recorded as loud.

[Patt]

Hello SoundHound,

Glad you like it :rollhead: You probably saw it but on the SVS website they have a list of some bass heavy scenes from various movies.

Nicholas mentioned a 12'x18' room and that's about the size of my room with a 2039+. The volume (gain) is rarely over 1:00 for movies which is plenty. I probably should have eMailed SVS for some advice but we may be moving into a bigger place so it won't go to waste.

[Sonnie Parker]

I would expect dual 25-31cs+'s to outperform my HGS-15 for sure as far as SPL anyway. If they didn't then something is definitely wrong. You have two TC Sounds 12" drivers vs. one 15" driver. The price difference is not that major though at $1425 vs. what I paid for my HGS-15 ($1575). I would be curious about SQ at the lower end though... I know my HGS-15 is absolutely the cleanest sub I've ever heard, but I've never heard the SVS subs, so I couldn't compare them. Are there any reviews on how clean the SVS's are. Generally speaking a ported design is not typically as clean as a sealed design is it? The 25-31cs+'s are tuned to 25hz so I would suspect their lower end would not be as flat to 16hz either as the HGS-15 but then again I haven't researched it.

I would have also purchased the SVS system had my original system not been in my great room and the WAF had not been in consideration. She would have none of a big tube sitting in the corner of her room... "that thing is ugly". The pretty square box had more eye appeal to her.

Today... if I could trade my sub for a pair of SVS's and come out okay then I think they would look great in my HT room... and probably fill my every need just as my HGS-15 does. Of course it would have to be a try them out situation which SVS offers so graciously.

My HGS-15 would probably sell for $1200-1400 and I'd be close to having enough but then I'd have to figure out how to ship such a heavy monster. I can barely pick up my sub... fact is... I can't pick it up by myself without fear of dropping it... especially after it is boxed with padding, etc.

Either way... I'm definitely not against SVS... I quite frequently recommend them as consideration for a sub. They are great subs... there are many great subs on the market today and several of them are bargains.

[PewterTA]

I switched from a HGS-15 to 2 SVS PC-Ultras. The difference was amazing. At first I was concerned that I wouldn't like them, but as soon as I got them calibrated (co-located in the corner btw), I was amazed at the difference in sound quality. Stuff that sounded like bass from the HGS, actually had "texture" to the sound. That's about the only way I can put it. It seemed like... (and this is not in reference to subwoofers) the same type of thing where one say a cheap pair of speakers, you hear a guitar cord strummed, but with a really good set of speakers you hear the pick hitting the strings, the metallic sound of the strings and all that "extra" detail in the sound.

Now I'm NOT saying the HGS-15 is like a cheap set of speakers...NOOOO way. But that's about the best analogy I can come up with. It's like when a car explodes in a movie, it sounds like a car explosion, yet when rocks are crashing down a mountain, rocks are crashing down a mountain... Just gives a different feel to all the sounds that I never got from the HGS-15.

I loved my HGS-15 when I had it, and I love my SVSs that I have... Course upgrading is a never ending cycle.

[Shane Martin]

I would be curious about SQ at the lower end though... I know my HGS-15 is absolutely the cleanest sub I've ever heard, but I've never heard the SVS subs, so I couldn't compare them

The gentleman whom posted his impressions recently on his PC Ultra which replaced a HGS10 had similar doubts regarding the ability of it to play clean down low. Needless to say he has no doubts now.

Generally speaking a ported design is not typically as clean as a sealed design is it?

I don't think you can say either way. There are great subs on both sides of the spectrum.

The price difference is not that major though at $1425 vs. what I paid for my HGS-15 ($1575).

The HGS 15 was alot more than that retail wasn't it? regardless comparing 2 drivers vs one isn't a very far comparison either way considering many subs use 2 drivers in it like M&K For instance. They use dual 12's in most all of their designs. I think their budget ones use a single 12.

[Sonnie Parker]

Impressive mini review Dan... I have often wondered what dual HGS-15's would sound like but that would be like throwing money away... considering a dual SVS setup would cost only a few pennies more than buying a used HGS.

I'll say I have my HGS calibrated pretty well if you look at my graph... and I believe I hear those "extra's"... maybe they are more pronounced in the SVS setup or maybe it has something to do with the tuning. I can actually tune my HGS with my BFD to produce a more pronounced sound on certain concert DVD's... which I have actually a pre-set already setup for those DVD's. The sound of any subs has a lot to do with the calibration and tuning of the unit itself.

Upgrading is a horrendous cycle on my pocket book! Makes me sick sometimes. Why can't I just ever be satisfied. :huh:

Yeah Shane... the HGS retailed for like $2500-2600 or so but I don't think many people paid that price. Street prices ranged from $1500 to $1750 for the most part... unless you were a first time buyer at the local retail store maybe.

Right... comparing two drivers to one is not a fair comparison. Price wise or sound quality wise. BUT... it does make sense that if you can get as good or better sound for less money... obviously go with the less money route. If we compared one HGS vs. one SVS... the sound comparison might be different, but then you'd be $6-700 difference in price... price no doubt favoring the SVS.

[Nick M]

Digging up a thread here...

Sold my convertible that was slowly becoming a headache to maintain. Paid my bills ahead a couple months, and I have $750 for a sub.

I'm really unsure about what to go with. I keep switching back and forth between the HSU VTF3-MKII ($750 Shipped) and the SVS PCi 16-46 ($675 Shipped). Originally the PC-Ultra was at the top of my list, but I don't think I need that much sub for my room. I'm looking for clean bass at moderate SPLs (75-85dB) as deep as my money can afford (budget is around $750). I need it to blend with 5 bookshelves in an 18'x11' room. My room is a half-octogon so the volume is actually only around 1400ft^3.

Then I read the review of the little PB10-ISD ($470 Shipped) at Secrets and gawked at their readings of +/- 1dB from 19Hz-100Hz (I realize my room will distort this). Even with a steep low-frequency roll-off, SVS claims it can produce effective in-room response down to ~17Hz! I also like the looks of the driver...



I'm really starting to wonder what I actually need, and what my eyes see and want. In a toss-up here. By the way, here is an ad I spotted on SVS' site thats kinda funny...

http://www.svsubwoofers.com/animation.htm

EDIT: Here is the review of the SVS PB10-ISD at Secrets...

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/volume_11_4/svs-pb10-subwoofer-10-2004.html

[Shane Martin]

Nicholas, you might want to read the news section on SVSubwoofers.com. Some juicy info including a new PB12ISD that looks outstanding. EQ is included. $699 price. It should have pretty gaudy #'s too.

[TimRawson]

I've had a SVS PB12-Plus/2 for a few months... More bass than I'll ever need. My wife can tell when I jam things (movie at ref levels or cranking music with sub add) as all the pictures are crooked.