Why replacing speaker jumper to expensive one?

[audiofan]

I see people replace original speaker jumper (steel bar) by more expensive jumper cables. These aftermarket jumpers are usually made of speakerwire and terminated with either spade or banana.

I was wondering if this will make any different in sound , even a slightly change? I have extra speakerwire and i want to try , but before i spend money on buying spade or banana, i would like to know your experience on this matter.

thanks.

[audioqueso]

Don't take it the wrong way, but if you have some spare speaker wire, why not try it now. You don't need spade or banana connectors to made a jumper. A long time ago in a galaxy far far away I use to have a pair of Klipsch towers that had the jumper bar. I had taken that out and replaced it with some thick gauge speaker wire and the difference was very noticeable. Then again, these speakers were playing an extreme amount of bass, so it made sense.

Right now I have a pair of B&W Nautilus 805s. I just ordered some new 10gauge speaker wire, and also purchased an extra foot of that same cable to make some custom jumpers. The ones that come with the B&Ws are not hard wire, they are a thick speaker cable. I think 14 gauge. I personally wouldn't buy a spade connector or anything else. I am going to spend the money on some silver-based solder instead. As few connections as possible. Flatten the speaker cable end, and solder it to make one solid connection. Not a lot of money, and if it makes a difference, then I guess it makes a difference. I'll let you know how it goes, but I suggestion you try it with as few connections as possible first.

[Burke Strickland]

In my opinion, in most cases, replacing the manufacturer-provided speaker jumper is like a lot of tweaks: if it makes you feel good, do it. If you want to save your money for something that will make a real difference in your system, don't do it.

It is hard for me to believe that the manufacturer of a well regarded high quality component is really sending out their product(s) with a single, easily replaceable substandard part that degrades the overall performance below their overall design specs. (Power cords fall into this category as well. The component will not function without one. Why would the manufacturer supply one that makes the unit work improperly or below its potential?) While it will usually not hurt (talking beefier wire here, not out-of-spec caps), "upgrading" a part above the standard they have set while engineering their own product will probably NOT have a noticeable effect on its overall performance. (The term "sub optimization" comes to mind.)

On the other hand, if they are purposely lessening the performance of their product to cut costs in this areas, then one must wonder what other parts of the assembly have also been cheapened, and then we get right back to the same place -- "upgrading" this one item is probably not going to make a major difference.

However, if you already have the parts in hand, it might be fun to try swapping out the jumper to see if you really could hear a difference. Assuming you decide to go that route, let someone else do the jumper switching for you without letting you know what is connected and see if you can guess, er, determine by listening, which jumper is in place.

Or trust the manufacturer to know what they need to provide as part of their product to make it perform properly and move on.

Burke

PS -- the above discussion does NOT apply to the throw-away interconnects that many vendors throw in the box for quick hook-up convenience. In almost every case, those cables should be seen as a stop-gap measure to confirm that the product will interact with the rest of the system, not as a permanent installation solution.

[audiofan]

Thanks all. Another question. I wonder whether manufacture makes connection inside speaker with some sort of speakerwire? or just bar connection like the brass jumper on outside? I think i will try with my spare speakerwire to see if it makes different. I'd be fun to try out.

[ThomasW]

If the original jumpers are ferrous (attracted by a magnet like those Magnepan uses), then it's a good idea to replace them, even if it's with just solid core house wire.

[OmegaSpeed]

Contrary to the post above, I found a great improvement using aftermarket jumpers vs. the ones B&W provides.

[audioqueso]

Contrary to the post above, I found a great improvement using aftermarket jumpers vs. the ones B&W provides.

What is it?

[Rolex]

I too have found significant difference, and have yet to see a pair of stock jumpers that weren't bettered by spending just a little money on aftermarket one. The biggest difference I noticed was the graininess went away. I've noticed this with B&W speakers as well as paradigm. Saying upgraded jumpers don't make a difference in sound quality is like saying upgraded speaker wires don't make any difference in sound quality.

Burke, to answer your question as to why a decent speaker manufacturer would send out their products with a subpar component....the answer is simple. They prefer and expect that you will biwire, but want to accomadate people that choose not to go that route.

[thyname]

Saying upgraded jumpers don't make a difference in sound quality is like saying upgraded speaker wires don't make any difference in sound quality.
.

Don't be surprised, they are so many people around there that think that speaker cable does not make any difference, as long as it can transport the electric signal!!! I think it does, or at least it did for me.

[i_amadeo]

all is fine and easy if its bi wire your talking about ...what about if you have a speaker with tri wire have it ( although i am not thinking of changing the jumpers they came gold plated from the manufacturer JBL ...or quadra wire...(will soon) that i think will be realy dificult to replace the jumper in that configuration

[Rolex]

It's true that replacing the jumpers on a tri-wire configuration will be a little tougher, but not impossible. At that point, I would try to incorporate spades in lieu of bare wire. I think it would be easier to work with..

[AndrewM]

It is hard for me to believe that the manufacturer of a well regarded high quality component is really sending out their product(s) with a single, easily replaceable substandard part that degrades the overall performance below their overall design specs.

Never seen "pack-in" cables in "quality" gear? I've opened up $1k DVD players, $500+ CD players that included interconnects that can be bought retail for around $1. How about the quality of parts used in some of this gear, I've heard of plenty of "higher" end speaker systems using $10 worth of x-over parts (again bought at retail price levels), etc.

Considering that most people won't care at all about the jumpers, why would a manufacture put something else on there and move their price point higher when it won't affect the "averages".

[Andrew M Ward]

Never seen "pack-in" cables in "quality" gear? I've opened up $1k DVD players, $500+ CD players that included interconnects that can be bought retail for around $1.

The interconnects are provided because most people don't have random Audio Quest cables hanging around the house. So something must be provided to test the unit and understand the required cable length and so forth.

How about this!
Most remote controls shipped with preamps and receivers completely blow. Classe' contemplated shipping the product with as cheap a remote as possible knowing that the end user will replace virtually any remote they would chooses to include... Follow that logic down the trail...

I happen to completely enjoy this topic in all it's forms regarding audio equipment.. just to see what's on peoples minds.

-Andrew Ward

[Andrew M Ward]

Contrary to the post above, I found a great improvement using aftermarket jumpers vs. the ones B&W provides.

You say: "Great Improvement"
Like a huge difference between the two, right?

I'm sure the engineers at B&W will find that astounding. I would never argue that cable make a difference, especially since my system includes in excess of $8,000 worth of various wire and connection devices. This entire make-over of approximately $8K created the slightest improvement (very slight) but it's an improvement I will not go without, no matter how slight.

But by swapping a jumper you get "great Improvement" ... sounds like all I needed to do was swap my jumpers and forget the other $8K



Just my 2 cents (and a dose of sarcasm)

[Chris D]

I'm one of those that could care less what manufacturers include in equipent for cables and remote controls. I always skip over the remote control part of equipment reviews, because I just end up incorporating the remote into my master remote control.

[Snap]

:agree:

[jimmyp58]

Amen Chris!!!

[Burke Strickland]

...to answer your question as to why a decent speaker manufacturer would send out their products with a subpar component....the answer is simple. They prefer and expect that you will biwire, but want to accomadate people that choose not to go that route.

Or perhaps it is just the opposite? Maybe they've engineered their product, including crossover, to be connected with a single wire-pair, but provide the biwire capability for "tweakers" who would otherwise have to tear their product apart to get it connected the way the tweakers want. .. oops, some do that anyway, since apparently some folks believe they know better than the product's designers what quality level and design of parts are required to make it work properly. :>)

As for interconnects included in the box, I "agreed in advance" (by posting the following comment earlier in the thread) with Andrew M Ward in the PS to the post which was partially quoted by AndrewM ("It is hard for me to believe..." etcetera):

PS -- the above discussion does NOT apply to the throw-away interconnects that many vendors throw in the box for quick hook-up convenience. In almost every case, those cables should be seen as a stop-gap measure to confirm that the product will interact with the rest of the system, not as a permanent installation solution.

[Rolex]

Manufacturers that use jumpers obviously feel they get better results when biwiring, otherwise, what's the point, why not just use a single connection. JM Labs and Audio Physic are two companies that come to mind that do not believe in biwiring. So they don't give you the option. I can't think of ONE high end component where the manufacturer did something to the product because they thought tweakers would appreciate it.

[i_amadeo]

i for one do believe in bi wiring ....but a coward ..when it comes to such things as tampering with my gear ..modifieing ...when i dont know much about it ...like how to bi wire or tri wire my speakers ..i am sure with biwiring and each signal frequency to the correct driver ..results will double in purity of the sound ..10 times better than what any cross over could do

[H.Donald]

Simply...if we could not modify or replace cables,interconnects,jumpers ect....what fun would this hobby be??
I replaced the metal jumpers on my speakers mainly out of curiosity and to make it easier to work with speaker cables.At the time I was usings cables that had oversized spades...and bought some banana jumpers.Did it change the sound?...not to my untrained ears.Would I do it again?...of course,for me it was a 50$ tweak.

[i_amadeo]

would you do that 50$ tweek to a 5000$ speaker?

[H.Donald]

I think the big money speakers come with a high grade jumper.Like with most things...
you can spend as much money as you want on upgrades.There are some jumpers that cost hundreds of dollars...perhaps you can hear more of a difference with those,for me...50 bucks was about right...just to see.

[Andrew M Ward]

H. Donald I believe gets to the root of it.
It's the journey as well as the final results (right?) part of our hobby is expirimentation and fussing about - results - real or imagined - are not always the ultimate point.

Just my 2 cents
Andrew M Ward

[David Meek]

I think the big money speakers come with a high grade jumper. Like with most things...

Wellllll. . . . define big money.

My Aerials (7Bs) came with a fairly standard stamped brass jumper and their MSRP is almost US$6000. Having said that, I biwire so the issue is a moot point for me.