My STATEMENTS II + STATEMENTS II Center build project.

[danwee12345]

I can't get to spleen's video from here, but a good reason to veneer before paint is to prevent MDF end "grain" from telegraphing through the paint. Bonding works, too, but is not fun to work with.

Bob, what is bonding?

[danwee12345]

More progress

Drawings are done.
Mid Tunnels done.

[BobEllis]

Sorry, I didn't have my glasses on and autocorrect replaced "Bondo" (auto body filler) with bonding.

[danwee12345]

Does anybody know what is the brace (H) frame width?

[danwee12345]

Finish

Before I cut the holes, I would like to decide on a finish.
I know it's ambitious, but I'm aiming for a brown high gloss finish for the sides, top and back. I want baffles to be of metal black mat finish.
Here are some images to get an idea.











So to achieve that, I assume I have to veneer the sides,back and top to get that woody high gloss finish. And for the baffle do I have to veneer it too? Baffles should not be gloss but kind of metal black mat (satin?) finish.

[BobEllis]

No, the painted baffles do not need to be veneered. They will need to be well sealed and smoothed. Auto body filler is one way to go. Just let it sit a week or more after application to ensure that it has shrunk as much as it is going to.

[danwee12345]

No, the painted baffles do not need to be veneered. They will need to be well sealed and smoothed. Auto body filler is one way to go. Just let it sit a week or more after application to ensure that it has shrunk as much as it is going to.

Thanks Bob.
Do you mind elaborating the sealing process. How to prepare the surface and what kind of paint/chemicals I have to use?

[BobEllis]

When I've painted I sanded MDF with 150 grit paper (Good dust mask a must), then applied a thin layer of body filler. Most of the surface will get very little, but work it into the joints and "end grain". Then sand the filler smooth with 220 grit, again with a good dust mask. Let it sit a week to see if the MDF moves. Sometimes the seams or end grain will shrink or swell due to application of the filler. If needed repeat filling and sanding. Then I primed with a high build auto primer. Mist on a very light coat of either another primer or topcoat in a contrasting color. Sand with 320 grit using the mist as a guide to show you when you have eliminated the high and low spots. You'll probably go through the primer in a spot or two, so reprime, repeat.

Then follow the procedure in the thread "A how to for high gloss finishing" http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/const...finishing.html which is essentially spray, sand at 320 or 440 between coats, then work your way up through the grits to 1500 or 2000 with care to change sandpaper when it shows the first sign of clogging and clean all of the grit and dust off before going to the next finer grit. Stopping at 1500 grit will give a nice satin finish. For the sides you'll continue with auto body polish and glaze.

[danwee12345]

When I've painted I sanded MDF with 150 grit paper (Good dust mask a must), then applied a thin layer of body filler. Most of the surface will get very little, but work it into the joints and "end grain". Then sand the filler smooth with 220 grit, again with a good dust mask. Let it sit a week to see if the MDF moves. Sometimes the seams or end grain will shrink or swell due to application of the filler. If needed repeat filling and sanding. Then I primed with a high build auto primer. Mist on a very light coat of either another primer or topcoat in a contrasting color. Sand with 320 grit using the mist as a guide to show you when you have eliminated the high and low spots. You'll probably go through the primer in a spot or two, so reprime, repeat.

Then follow the procedure in the thread "A how to for high gloss finishing" http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/const...finishing.html which is essentially spray, sand at 320 or 440 between coats, then work your way up through the grits to 1500 or 2000 with care to change sandpaper when it shows the first sign of clogging and clean all of the grit and dust off before going to the next finer grit. Stopping at 1500 grit will give a nice satin finish. For the sides you'll continue with auto body polish and glaze.

Thanks Bob.
So just to confirm that I got it right.
To get the woody high gloss finish on the sides, top and back VENEER those sides first and do the process described in http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/const...finishing.html . Work up to 2000 grit for gloss finish.

To get a satin finish on the baffles, do the above described process WITHOUT VENEERING and stop at 1500 grit.

Did I get it right?

[TEK]

One tip from up north. Focus on doing a good job on preparing the surface. Do NOT think that the paint will hide ANYTHING.
For the veneered parts, make sure you get a good grain filler and has a perfectly flat serface with no grains, cracks or dips before starting to apply paint.
For that glossy finished veneer you could also use french polish - but I think you can get a very good (better?) result with auto paint or other lacqure. It will for sure be more durable then fransh polishing. But french polishing might be better looking (have not seen it in real life - so I cant tell for sure)

[BobEllis]

Good advice from TEK. I didn't stress enough the importance of a flawless surface for paint or lacquer.

For either gloss or satin you can go to 1500 or 2000 grit. To go from a fine satin to gloss you need to polish. There are automotive polishes that will take over at 1200 grit equivalent. The 3M Polish and pads work very well. (Right Hank?)

[danwee12345]

Good advice from TEK. I didn't stress enough the importance of a flawless surface for paint or lacquer.

For either gloss or satin you can go to 1500 or 2000 grit. To go from a fine satin to gloss you need to polish. There are automotive polishes that will take over at 1200 grit equivalent. The 3M Polish and pads work very well. (Right Hank?)

Thanks guy. I think I only get the half of what you guys say, but will try to read some and get a better knowledge.

BTW, all the cuttings and grooving been finished and did a pre-assemble without glueing.
I think I have done a pretty good job.



Still waiting for the Solen caps from meniscus to be shipped, so will be another two weeks before I can them I think. And with days getting shorter and raining it's been slow progress.

[danwee12345]

And those clamps are home made exclusively for this project.

[TEK]

That's looking really good - nicly done!

[danwee12345]

That's looking really good - nicly done!

Thanks TEK.

[kevinm]

Hey Danwee, have you read any of PassingInterest's threads? He does a lot of finishing like what you linked to. His work is incredible and he does a fantastic job documenting his process. I would definitely recommend looking at his stuff!

[TEK]

Hey Danwee, have you read any of PassingInterest's threads? He does a lot of finishing like what you linked to. His work is incredible and he does a fantastic job documenting his process. I would definitely recommend looking at his stuff!

Any links?

[danwee12345]

Hey Danwee, have you read any of PassingInterest's threads? He does a lot of finishing like what you linked to. His work is incredible and he does a fantastic job documenting his process. I would definitely recommend looking at his stuff!

Thanks Kevin. I will look into that.

[danwee12345]

Sorry Kevin. Trying to find a thread by passinginterest but nothing comes up. Can you give me a link. Only this thread I can find started by passinginterest, but there is no useful info.

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php?39622-Anarchy-Dayton-TM-featuring-the-Curvomatic

[kevinm]

Whoops....sorry guys.

I've seen him post here, so I thought he would have more threads. Here is his online gallery of speakers:

Images not available

Here are some threads he has at AVS.

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/search.php?searchid=77950457

[danwee12345]

Some progress made in the past few days. Crossovers almost done. Acrylic board used as the circuit board and arranged around the port. Really happy with how it turned out.
Also mounting circles are cut on the baffle walls . Mid tunnels are done. Braces are done. Now only have to glue all the components together which will be starting hopefully tomorrow.
And base idea is somewhat similar to Spleen21's build. Thanks spleen.

[danwee12345]

Here is a picture of the Mid tunnels.

[sdl2112]

Cool...looking good! Is that copper tape on the Acrylic and did you solder directly on it?

[danwee12345]

Cool...looking good! Is that copper tape on the Acrylic and did you solder directly on it?

Its 0.5mm thick copper strips. So 4mm wide strip is effectively 14AWG copper wire. I bought a larger piece from the home center and cut it into pieces as I want. That part is the most difficult and time consuming. Then I soldered the leads onto the copper strips. Also I planned the layout even without the copper strips the leads would have enough length to connect each other. Copper strips are for the protection of the board and for the looks.

[danwee12345]

Cabinets are glued . crossovers done.
Next attaching acoustic foam inside the cabinet and wiring.

[Jim Holtz]

Everything looks great but I do have a couple questions.

Do you have the mid tunnels attached to the side panels? That adds strength to the cabinet. My rule of thumb is no spans greater than 12" without bracing.

Also, can the crossover board be removed once the cabinet is fully assembled? That's pretty important at least for folks like me that have an occasional oops! :W

Jim

[danwee12345]

Everything looks great but I do have a couple questions.

Do you have the mid tunnels attached to the side panels? That adds strength to the cabinet. My rule of thumb is no spans greater than 12" without bracing.

Also, can the crossover board be removed once the cabinet is fully assembled? That's pretty important at least for folks like me that have an occasional oops! :W

Jim

Thanks for the concerns Jim. But all have been thought out. The mid tunnel attachments are not yet glued because the cuts are bit wider. I have to shave off at least 1mm from the braces. Hopefully will do it tomorrow.
And for the crossovers, they will be mounted on a detachable base. You can see that extra brace at the bottom of the cabinet which was not in the original plan. Bases are going to be attached to it with 6 bolts and nuts so it will be removable if there is a need.

[Jim Holtz]

Perfect! Good planning!

Jim

[danwee12345]

Question time.
Should I add foam all the way down to the base or should I stop at the bottom brace around 30cm (12inches) from the bottom?

[Jim Holtz]

Question time.
Should I add foam all the way down to the base or should I stop at the bottom brace around 30cm (12inches) from the bottom?

Down to the brace is fine. The purpose of the foam is to prevent sound wave reflections into the back of the driver. I don't see how it could reflect from the bottom of the cabinet into the lower driver.

Jim

[danwee12345]

Down to the brace is fine. The purpose of the foam is to prevent sound wave reflections into the back of the driver. I don't see how it could reflect from the bottom of the cabinet into the lower driver.

Jim

Thanks Jim for the quick explanation. So it wouldn't be detrimental if I do foaming all the way down to the bottom I guess. Because Meniscus sent me a good load of foam material now I probably have an excess of it. I want to use them all as much as possible otherwise it will give me a headache looking for space to store them.

[Jim Holtz]

Thanks Jim for the quick explanation. So it wouldn't be detrimental if I do foaming all the way down to the bottom I guess. Because Meniscus sent me a good load of foam material now I probably have an excess of it. I want to use them all as much as possible otherwise it will give me a headache looking for space to store them.

Foam below the brace won't hurt a thing. Just make sure not to block the passage to the port and you're good to go.

Jim

[danwee12345]

Foaming is done. Baffle walls are completed and did a rehearsal fit to just to have an idea how they look. They look majestic indeed.
Bases are being built. So now am in the final part of the build. Only wiring and bases are the remaining tasks. Exciting times ahead.



And a question.
What should be the length of the port (with flares)? Is it 4 inches (10.2cm) in total? The precision port meniscus sent me is way longer than that. Do I have to cut it?



Please somebody help me here.

[Jim Holtz]

Curt will take a look and provide feedback.

Jim

[danwee12345]

Curt will take a look and provide feedback.

Jim

Thanks Jim. Appreciate it.
Mean while finishing the upper part of the base which will be sitting flush inside the bottom of the cabinet.







And closer look of the bolts used to attach the drivers to the baffle. Used torx screws with button head. (4mm for mids and tweeter, 5mm for the woofer)

[Curt C]

You will have lots of port tube left over for your next project...

The 3" port tube is cut to 4" long. Add the flares and you are golden! Total length is around 10" if I recall correctly, but don't quote me on this.

C

[danwee12345]

You will have lots of port tube left over for your next project...

The 3" port tube is cut to 4" long. Add the flares and you are golden! Total length is around 10" if I recall correctly, but don't quote me on this.

C

Thanks Curt but I don't get it. The ports meniscus sent me is 10" long in total (with flares). The middle part (tube) is only 4".
(Sorry, English is not my 1st language). If it's 10" total length there will be no tube left.

And I found this which says it should be 7" in total. Now I'm really confused.

https://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php?33392-My-Statements-Build-(How-to-hopefully)

[kevinm]

Wow! Those might be the cleanest crossovers I've ever seen!

Regarding the port tube, I believe meniscus pre-cuts it for you, Curt was referring to the port tube you would get if you bought it new from Parts Express (or other vendor).

[danwee12345]

Wow! Those might be the cleanest crossovers I've ever seen!

Regarding the port tube, I believe meniscus pre-cuts it for you, Curt was referring to the port tube you would get if you bought it new from Parts Express (or other vendor).

Thanks Kevin for the complement and clearing confusion. Appreciate it.

[danwee12345]

I finished my tower builds and have been enjoying them. What sounds they give me on HD movie tracks. WOW..
But since movies come with DTS-HD 5.1 sound to fully enjoy them I decided I have to build the center channel asap.

I was just wandering anyone here who built a center statements II how you build the cabinet to access the Xover later if the need arise?

[Jim Holtz]

I finished my tower builds and have been enjoying them. What sounds they give me on HD movie tracks. WOW..
But since movies come with DTS-HD 5.1 sound to fully enjoy them I decided I have to build the center channel asap.

I was just wandering anyone here who built a center statements II how you build the cabinet to access the Xover later if the need arise?

Excellent! I'm pleased to hear you're enjoying them!

First, decide which side of the cabinet you'll place the binding posts for close proximity to your electronics and then position the crossover behind that woofer near the back of the cabinet and close to the binding posts. It should fit fine and not having foam where the crossover is attached doesn't hurt a thing.

EDIT: I forgot to answer the question. ops: Cut the width of the crossover mount board so it'll slip in the woofer cutout opening which will allow removal if necessary.

HTH

Jim

[danwee12345]

Excellent! I'm pleased to hear you're enjoying them!

First, decide which side of the cabinet you'll place the binding posts for close proximity to your electronics and then position the crossover behind that woofer near the back of the cabinet and close to the binding posts. It should fit fine and not having foam where the crossover is attached doesn't hurt a thing.

EDIT: I forgot to answer the question. ops: Cut the width of the crossover mount board so it'll slip in the woofer cutout opening which will allow removal if necessary.

HTH

Jim

Thanks Jim. I forgot that option that you can always remove the sub to access the xover since I opted for base removal to open the cabinets in my tower build.ops:

And about the positioning, you mean I should place the binding posts not at the middle, but rather somewhere behind left or right sub? Is it going to be a problem if I place them right in the middle?

And on a different topic, what is the efficiency of Statements/Statements II?

[danwee12345]

Oh.. What I was thinking. If I place the xover at the middle I won't be able to access them later. right? But still I can place the binding posts in the middle I guess.

Please let me know the efficiency of the speakers if you happen to know. I'm trying to decide on a power amp to drive these beasts and I want to think if the power is going to be enough in the long run.

[Jim Holtz]

Oh.. What I was thinking. If I place the xover at the middle I won't be able to access them later. right? But still I can place the binding posts in the middle I guess.

Please let me know the efficiency of the speakers if you happen to know. I'm trying to decide on a power amp to drive these beasts and I want to think if the power is going to be enough in the long run.

There's only 1/2" clearance behind the mid compartment and the back panel so there's not room or any way to get to the binding posts internally for installation or connection. It really doesn't make any difference which side you place the binding posts and crossover, I just prefer to keep my speaker cable runs as short as possible so I pick the side closest to my amp.

The Statements (1 & 2),centers and Anthology's are all about 88-89 db. I suggest a separate amp with no less than 100 wpc @ 8 ohms and the ability to drive 4 ohm speakers. That describes just about any decent separate audio amp built for the last 30 years. I prefer stout power supply class A/B amps of 150 wpc or more. I'm currently using an Emotiva XPA-5 in my Statements II system and like it a lot. The only receiver that doesn't cost more than a good amp that I can recommend are the higher power Marantz models.

HTH

Jim

[danwee12345]

There's only 1/2" clearance behind the mid compartment and the back panel so there's not room or any way to get to the binding posts internally for installation or connection. It really doesn't make any difference which side you place the binding posts and crossover, I just prefer to keep my speaker cable runs as short as possible so I pick the side closest to my amp.

The Statements (1 & 2),centers and Anthology's are all about 88-89 db. I suggest a separate amp with no less than 100 wpc @ 8 ohms and the ability to drive 4 ohm speakers. That describes just about any decent separate audio amp built for the last 30 years. I prefer stout power supply class A/B amps of 150 wpc or more. I'm currently using an Emotiva XPA-5 in my Statements II system and like it a lot. The only receiver that doesn't cost more than a good amp that I can recommend are the higher power Marantz models.

HTH

Jim

Thanks for the input Jim.
You need the 4ohm capability because statements are 4 ohms?
I have been keeping my eyes on Emotiva XPA-5 btw.