On the hunt for a USB to I2S/DSD device and here's what I found.

[Hdale85]

So I'm in the middle of putting together a setup for my car that will be based on Android. The latest versions of Android support USB audio so I've been looking for a good way to get that audio out. Today I found this little device.

http://amanero.com/

It seems really interesting and there are a ton of people on another forum that have bought tons of them and seem to be working quite well. Will dull full bandwidth DSD, and 32bit/384khz PCM (I2S). This might be exactly what I'm looking for and the price is great as well. If I go this route I'll be using this and feeding I2S into a Buffalo III SE DAC which will accept up to 32/400 input over I2S, then from there it'll go to a MiniDSP 2x8 and then to my DACS. I plan on running an Android development board for the front end, either an Arndale, Ambrix, or possibly the Odroid/Odroid U2. Just thought I'd show it to some of you as I imagine some people may be interested as this would be an excellent way to get 384khz or DSD out of your PC's.

Anyone with experience with this device or suggestions and comments feel free to reply. From my small amount of research it looks nice, but maybe I'm missing something? I'm sure Jon will have something to say on the subject lol.

[JonMarsh]

What's your feeling about the overall sound quality, isolation, and output clocks of the Mini-DSP? I bought one of their relatively high end boards, but haven't had time to play with it. What kind of DAC's are you using in the system? Which input are you pondering using? Does the DAC use SRC? would Async USB be possible?

What's your overall performance target? When you mention full bandwidth DSD and octal rate PCM, I figure you're shooting for something pretty high- what about jitter and de-jittering this kind of source?

Have you ever read the review of the PWD MKII at Computer Audiophile? An interesting technology side case from this review, which I agree with based on other experience, is that the PWD MKII without the time lens 10msec de-jitter buffer is relatively midrange on any of it's standard inputs, especially because it's standard mode eschews SRC and the benefits and compromises that come with it. I'm curious how you see where this fits in to your system design, or is the high bit rate inputs just so you can handle special program when/if you have it. (I have an even newer rig for SACD extraction and a big pile of disks looking at me wondering why I haven't had time- I suppose it's because I'm spending too much time posting here!) :B

Just throwing out a few ideas to ponder. I've had some interesting experiences looking at a variety of DACs with a colleague in Munich and sharing info and results, as well as doing evaluations at his place. Going there this April again if all works out.

[Hdale85]

The DAC I plan on using is the TwistedPear Audio Buffalo III SE, which is based on the ESS Sabre 9018 32bit dac.

http://www.twistedpearaudio.com/digital/buffalose.aspx

It should have pretty top notch jitter rejection/correction so I guess I'm not too worried about that. Basically my goal is to get the best sound quality I can out of an Android based device. A lot of people do Android installs in cars but it seems most are using the headphone out and that is not going to fly for me.

I have not purchased or had time to play with a MiniDSP yet, a lot of people seem to like them and they have tons of functionality with different plugins which is what makes them rather appealing to me.

As for your other questions, going to take some research to figure out what you're talking about exactly lol! I believe more then likely I won't be able to get DSD type files to play from the Android platform, so more then likely I'll be shooting for 384khz PCM output if it's even possible. Who knows I might be locked in to 192khz with current Android apps, I haven't looked into this part too much yet but I'm hoping not. Performance target I'm just trying to get the best I can for the money I have to put in. It's going to be a 3 way active front stage with subs. I plan to use the new Dayton Ultimax 10" subs, and I'm pretty sure I want to use the SB Acoustics small format ring radiator tweeter. The mids I'm not entirely sure yet, possibly the Fountek FR89EX, and mid-basses I haven't even gotten there but Peerless seems to be pretty dang popular for car midbass duty. The midrange has to stay in the 3" range for the most part. I might be able to squeeze a 4" in my pillars, they also need to have good off-axis response as I plan to mount them off axis.

[Hdale85]

Well I ordered one, there is a group buy going on somewhere on the internets and the price for 1 with shipping was only 60 or so USD so I said for that kind of change I'll try one blindly. A lot of people have ordered them so they have to be doing something right.

[Leeuwarden]

I had a balanced minidsp. It was not silent and it had a huge turn on/off thump. The plug ins are nice, the hardware is not. Personally I don't recommend it. You can buy a lot of filter parts for the money you would send on buying amps...
I recently upgraded from an Opus dac to a Buffalo IIISE. Now that was a nice upgrade!

[Hdale85]

Well they have a new module intended for car audio that has a soft start and a filtered PSU onboard. So those issues are supposed to be taken care of.

http://www.minidsp.com/products/accessories/minidc-isolator

Although it says it doesn't support the 2x8...have to look into that. I may end up going for a different processor. But I'd really like to play with the MiniDSP.

[Leeuwarden]

It's fun to play with. Hope you like the sound of it. I think it can be done right but than you would have to use ADC>DAC with a lot better quality. Maybe something like the Buffalo. And that's a lot more expensive. But is fun to play with it.

[Hdale85]

I plan on using a Buffalo to feed the MiniDSP (as stated in my OP).

[Johnloudb]

I plan on using a Buffalo to feed the MiniDSP (as stated in my OP).

Why use the buffalo dac before the miniDSP? If all you sources are digital you don't need it, and can then bypass the A/D conversion and it sounds like you're going to use a computer as the source.

From minidsp:

"Digital input crossover configuration

If your configuration requires the option to input a digital input (SPDIF/TOSLINK), your system will require a miniDIGI. The miniDIGI is an SPDIF/TOSLINK input/output interface with embedded Asynchronous Sample Rate Converter (ASRC). The ASRC is a very important element since it allows connectivity to any digital audio source."

[Johnloudb]

"I'll be using this and feeding I2S into a Buffalo III SE DAC which will accept up to 32/400 input over I2S, then from there it'll go to a MiniDSP 2x8 and then to my DACS."

What DACs are you referring to after the minidsp?

[Hdale85]

The MiniDSP will be used analog. It's just going to be doing time alignment and crossover work. I'll be feeding analog RCA in from a high end DAC (Buffalo III). I doubt the MiniDIGIC holds a candle to the Buffalo III which is why I plan on using it. I'm going to be running an Android development board for the front end it's the Samsung Arndale, at least that's my likely choice.

http://www.arndaleboard.org/wiki/index.php/Main_Page

The MiniDSP 2x8 has 2 analog inputs and 8 analog outputs. http://www.minidsp.com/products/mini...2-x-in-8-x-out

[Johnloudb]

The MiniDSP will be used analog. It's just going to be doing time alignment and crossover work. I'll be feeding analog RCA in from a high end DAC (Buffalo III). I doubt the MiniDIGIC holds a candle to the Buffalo III which is why I plan on using it. I'm going to be running an Android development board for the front end it's the Samsung Arndale, at least that's my likely choice.

http://www.arndaleboard.org/wiki/index.php/Main_Page

The MiniDSP 2x8 has 2 analog inputs and 8 analog outputs. http://www.minidsp.com/products/mini...2-x-in-8-x-out

That minidsp board you linked to has both A/D and D/A converters in it.

yeah, I know the minidsp dacs are not the quality of the twisted pair dac, and that's why I suggest using the digital input configuration Minidsp because you can bypass the A/D conversion as well as the twisted pair dac. At least that's my take on it, but I haven't really looked into the minidigi boards.

http://www.minidsp.com/applications/digital-crossovers/stereo-34way-xover

"Digital input crossover configuration

If your configuration requires the option to input a digital input (SPDIF/TOSLINK), your system will require a miniDIGI. The miniDIGI is an SPDIF/TOSLINK input/output interface with embedded Asynchronous Sample Rate Converter (ASRC). The ASRC is a very important element since it allows connectivity to any digital audio source.

Systems Requirements

OPTION A

2 x miniDSP balanced/unbalanced kit
1 x miniDIGI board if all boards are to be stacked together, 2 x miniDIGI boards if you intend to separate the miniDSP + miniDIGI stacks
1 x 4 way crossover plug-in (Advanced,Graphic EQ)
Total of 6ch (3way) or 8ch(4way) channels power amplifier
1 x external DC Power supply or USB charger
OPTION B

1 x miniDSP 4x10 Hd
1 x 4x10 plug-in
Total of 6ch (3way) or 8ch(4way) channels power amplifier"

[Hdale85]

Hmm I'm not sure I guess I'll have to look into it a bit more. I didn't realize it does analog to digital conversion. Although I guess it would have to to use DSP effects. Although I wasn't planning on using SPDIF output, I was planning on using that USB device and connecting I2S so I can get higher bitrates out and what not, but if I feed the analog into the MiniDSP and it converts it back to digital, will those higher bitrates even matter? Hmmm......

[cjd]

You can also get I2S OUT of the MiniDSP, I believe, and send it to the 8 channel Buffalo... Definitely do NOT bother putting such a quality DAC in front of the miniDSP only to convert back to digital. Go straight to the miniDSP digitally, as others have noted. Probably would use the nanoDIGI.

Have you seen the miniDSP USB>I2S boards? You may also be interested in this The sample rates aren't sky high, but still not shabby at all when you consider the limitations of the miniDSP boards themselves.

[Hdale85]

Hmm... but at that point I could probably just use a USB to optical solution? Or I don't know. The I2S out and into the Buffalo 8 channel might be an idea though! I was just really hoping to get some higher bitrate out but it sounds like it might not help anything with the MiniDSP. Not sure how else to do the processing I need though? The android platform doesn't have anything that can do that, so I'd be stuck with going through another processor which would more or less be the same although maybe better quality.

[cjd]

Hmm... but at that point I could probably just use a USB to optical solution? Or I don't know. The I2S out and into the Buffalo 8 channel might be an idea though! I was just really hoping to get some higher bitrate out but it sounds like it might not help anything with the MiniDSP. Not sure how else to do the processing I need though? The android platform doesn't have anything that can do that, so I'd be stuck with going through another processor which would more or less be the same although maybe better quality.

I think Android > USB to I2s > I2S interface on MiniDSP, and either use their DAC or I2S>DAC-of-choice is viable. But the miniDSP bitrate is your upward limit, and that's 24/192 on the nonoDIGI, and 24/96 on the rest (from what I can tell)

C

[Hdale85]

So the Nano Digi will do everything I need then as I won't be converting to analog on the MiniDSP at all? I think I understand what you're saying now..... because I can get I2S out of the Nano Digi to feed my DAC.

Edit: Ok looked into it a bit more, and the miniDIGI does I2S stuff, but I'd basically be using it to convert I2S to Optical/Coax from what I understand of the manual? So I'd probably be better off just getting a USB to Coax/Optical device and feeding that into the nanoDIGI and then that to the DAC. Although I'd still need I2S out to get all 8 channels of a buffalo to work I believe.....So maybe I need both a nanoDIGI and a miniDIGI?

[Hdale85]

Well I just talked to Brian from TPA in an email and he said that they are talking to MiniDSP about building a SHARC based board that would interface with the Buffalo...... so if that will do everything I need maybe I'll see where that goes.

[Hdale85]

Well seems like the SHARC module will do pretty much everything I need as it sits, and it should be a bit better DSP as well? It has I2S inputs and outputs as it stands as well.

http://www.minidsp.com/images/documents/miniSHARC%20User%20Manual.pdf

There aren't as many plugins I don't believe for it, but it has the items I'd need like PEQ, XOVER, and so on.