Basic Woodworking Q&A

[Q45]

Thru extensive review of projects and assoc. pic's here within, I've noticed so many of ya'll don't appear to screw anything together. It looks like everything is glued only.

Are you guys just gluing or are you also using screws from the inner side?

I'm just wondering because I was going to screw and glue, under the assumption that you would cover up countersunk screws with puddy and laminate anyway. Am I overlooking something?

[dlneubec]

I typically use glue only. The screws really add very little to the strength of the joint and are simply a way to hold the pieces in place while you glue. It is very easy to split or expand mdf when screwing, nailing, etc. into the end grain, which can cause some problems with the finish later. Also, it's a lot of extra work to fill and sand the screw countersinks smooth. I much prefer to use rabbit or dado joints to help hold the pieces in place and increase the amount of gluing surface. Some folks like to use a nail gun and brads to hold the parts in place.

[Brian Bunge]

Most of us prefer to glue and clamp, although I use a brad nailer most of the time to speed things up. Screws are only recommended when you don't have clamps. Most of the time they cause more trouble than they are worth, though. Even with pre-drilled holes I often had problems with MDF splitting on me. But if you have to use them yes, the appropriate thing to do is countersink them anf fill with wood putty. Or totally remove them and then fill the holes.

[Silversmoky]

I agree. Not sure what sort of woodworking tools you have at your disposal but in my experience, which is somewhat limited, I really like the brad nailer approach. The screws usually are a bit of a pain with mdf and the glue is really strong when set. The brads are small, strong and very easy to fill later, if that is what you are doing, and they really speed up assembling a box although I usually do some clamping on the box as well to make sure everything is nice and tight. Good luck!

[MuaDibb]

While we're on the subject of clamping, Fine Woodworking magazine has an excellent article on clamping this month. Explains how clamping forces are actually applied to your workpiece and gives clamping strength of different types of clamps. While you may never have enough clamps its easier to work around than you might think. If nothing else give it a browse next time you walk by a magazine rack.

[---k---]

Just don't run a big round over bit over an edge with brads or screws....

[gmed]

Glue, clamp, may occasionally use brads, or biscuits, but screws are just used to keep things in place until glue sets. The glued joint, depending on the wood can be stronger than the wood itself.

So no screws for me.

[technimac]

Some time ago I decided to invest in clamps and not screws. I could not be happier. As others have mentioned here, screws tend to be more trouble than they're worth in assembling speaker enclosures.
Using glue-only, there's no split MDF, no hidden fasteners to worry about when doing roundovers and never a problem with excellent adhesion on clamped joints.
I also find that using rabbets and dadoes help make gluing-up and clamping far more precise and problem free.
I'm a fan of polyurethane glue (high viscosity and long working time) although I do frequently use PVA (yellow glue) as well.
~Bruce

[CBerg]

Personally I am a fan of the Kreg pocket hole system, fast, stops creep that on slow setting glues can drive me nuts with, and I can do many joints quickly without the setup and dry time in between.

If I need to do roundovers I can always back them out after the glue has set.

I couldn't imagine with clamps a situtation where I could easily do up an entire cabinet (speaker or as in kitchen cabinet) without this tool. Without a truck full of clamps anyhow...

Leaves the outside completely untouched.

The joint even without glue is amazingly strong.

Leaves my biscuit joiner left in it's case on most occasions.

I don't use too much MDF, I like appleply... Here in the Pac NW you can get it all the way up to 1.5 inches in like 26 ply layers... crazy strong. Holds a screw like you would never imagine.... :T

Just my .02$...

C.

[Brian Bunge]

Just don't run a big round over bit over an edge with brads or screws....

I've done this hundreds of times with brads. I wouldn't dream of doing it with screws though.

[jbateman]

Sometimes it's just not possible to use any external fasteners.

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[technimac]

...I don't use too much MDF, I like appleply... Here in the Pac NW you can get it all the way up to 1.5 inches in like 26 ply layers...

Appleply looks promising. After checking out "Chinese-made" 13 ply "birch" (delaminated overlapping core and many voids), I'm looking for something else that's close to BB and appleply may just be it.

Do you have a good source for appleply anywhere near Bellingham, WA?

Thanks, Bruce

[Q45]

Appleply looks promising. After checking out "Chinese-made" 13 ply "birch" (delaminated overlapping core and many voids), I'm looking for something else that's close to BB and appleply may just be it.

Do you have a good source for appleply anywhere near Bellingham, WA?

Thanks, Bruce

Brad nailer? I don't think so. That means a compressor, hoses, another tool...

I'm going to try the "just glue" route and see how it goes.

[Hank]

Screws are a waste of time and money and don't add strength to a well-glued joint. When I do large (tower) cabinets I tack some pieces in place with my brad nailer. THE most handy clamp I've found is the Merle band clamp from MLCS:

http://mlcswoodworking.com/shopsite_sc/store/html/smarthtml/pages/merlclmp.html

They force a cabinet into "square".

[Brian Bunge]

I use those Merle clamps all the time too.

[CBerg]

Hi Bruce,

I'm in Portland so don't know of anyone up in Bellingham.

Look around and see if you can get anyone local to source it. States industries is a local manufacturer, made in Eugene Or.

I was mistaken, on up to 1.5 inches, it's 1.25. None the less I can attest to that the machining of it is really nice. I like the look of the edges and it is void free. 13 layers in 3/4 inch.

They do sell it with various grade veneers but I couldn't find it in too high a grade. Good enough to finish but still had to be picky on what sheets I purchased and cut pattern.

My supplier down here stocks it in 3/4 in 4x8 or 4x10, I asked him about higher grade veneer and in 1.25 inch thickness and he wanted me to order >25 sheets... :E I like DIY and all but that seemed a tad more than I'd use in the foreseeable future...

Carl

[dCraig]

I use exclusively biscuit joints. Always helps align the wood pieces, superior holding power and allows you to dry fit the cabinet with no clamps. But, they do add expense and time. I am finicky that way. Screws, on the other hand, are just a massive waste.

[augerpro]

Personally I am a fan of the Kreg pocket hole system, fast, stops creep that on slow setting glues can drive me nuts with, and I can do many joints quickly without the setup and dry time in between.
C.

This sounds sort of like what Jed does. I need to try it sometime, I hate creep.

[kingpin]

Worst comes to worst the $5 clamps may not last but they are a good temp.

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Mike