Sadly Disappointed by the RB-1092

[BTB]

Hi All

I'm sticking my neck out here (as I know that most guys like to talk tech stuff only on these forums), but I think that an important aspect of this debate has not been explored yet. Mixed up in all this talk of SQ, specs and circuit topology, is the psychological impact of these amps not only being new products (and therefore upsetting the neat, accepted heirarchy of the current product line), but also the introduction of (for Rotel) a different technology.

Truth be told, we audiophiles are not as accepting of "new" things as our cousins the videophiles, or need I even say it... the whole iPod, MP3, "go faster", plug and play crowd. I remember years ago when heated debates raged regarding the (then) new fangled "evil" of the compact disc, which by now I dare say, has been accepted by most as being perfectly "OK". Even now the SACD/DVD A "format war" (both still being outsold by vinyl LP's in the UK market, if anyone needed evidence of "la resistance") threatens CD's current position. I suppose that what I'm getting at is that we (mostly) like things to stay as they are, and are sometimes hostile towards that which is not familiar to us. Given the pace at which we are bombarded with new technology (even though the current stuff works perfectly well), it's not suprising that most of us feel this way.

I have not heard these new amps yet and therefore don't presume to challenge the opinions expressed in previous posts, but I just thought this was an interesting aspect of the debate so far regarding products that will in all likelihood have their teething problems resolved (just like CD did) and eventually be accepted as being "OK" by those who enjoy their sound and ignored by those who don't. Just my 2 cents...

[shadow]

Suppose anything is possible, but I doubt that a new technology would be that foreign to posters here. This is not a 5 watt single end tube forum embracing 50 year old technology. I am confident that if any of the posters found the "digital" amps better, they would say so, regardless of what they currently own. There is a reason why so many of us change equipment so often. However, I respect both Jerry and Rebelman regarding what they each hear. My dealer now has the 1091 mono amps on display so I hope to listen in the near future and form my own opinions.

[Andrew M Ward]

Sure, we should probably hook up for a battle of the amps.....although the boys at SLM might think we're ganging up on them!

Finding time away from the baby-sitting chores isn't easy though.....You know how that is I'm sure :T

I'll be at SLM this coming Saturday the 8th... if you guys would like? 8)

[miner]

Where is SLM? I will be in AZ (Phoenix & Tucson) this weekend also. If it happens, mind if I join in?

Miner

[Andrew M Ward]

Where is SLM? I will be in AZ (Phoenix & Tucson) this weekend also. If it happens, mind if I join in?

Miner

Sounds Like Music
Desert Ridge Mall
21001 North Tatum Blvd
Suite 36-1310
Phoenix, Arizona 85054
(480) 515-0565

[Joey_V]

Hi All

Truth be told, we audiophiles are not as accepting of "new" things as our cousins the videophiles, or need I even say it... the whole iPod, MP3, "go faster", plug and play crowd. I suppose that what I'm getting at is that we (mostly) like things to stay as they are, and are sometimes hostile towards that which is not familiar to us. Given the pace at which we are bombarded with new technology (even though the current stuff works perfectly well), it's not suprising that most of us feel this way.

That may be true, but I can attest that when I went to audition, I was hoping that the Class D 1091 would smoke or atleast marginally sound better than the 1090. I removed whatever preconceived notion I had regarding Class D before the audition and I sat down, letting only the music get to me. What I heard, I mentioned in my thread somewhere on this forum.

The 1090 sounded different from the 1091 - was it better? That's debateable. But with my ears and that particular BW802D setup, I felt that the 1090 was the synergistic winner.

[Gump]

I'll be at SLM this coming Saturday the 8th... if you guys would like? 8)

That's a great offer Andrew, I'm locked up this Saturday due to a Birthday Bash at my house. My daughter turns 1 yr old this week. Between the preparation and the party itself, I don't see my wife giving me the :T on disappearing for a couple of hours to demo an amp!

Thanks for the offer...you and RebeMan will have to fight it out without me. Sounds like fun, I'm sorry I"ll miss it.

[peterS]

Attention:
Class D amplifiers are not new.

far from it.

full range class d is new to me... there have been some examples in car audio and i am sure in home stereo but definitly a radical move on rotels part to addopt only digital amps

[Andrew M Ward]

full range class d is new to me... there have been some examples in car audio and i am sure in home stereo but definitly a radical move on rotels part to addopt only digital amps

I don't see that happening, the adopting only digital amps thing... I see them expanding the line...

The RB1090 was being fased out regardless. it might be loved on this forum but on a world wide level it is not...

[miner]

Sounds Like Music
Desert Ridge Mall
21001 North Tatum Blvd
Suite 36-1310
Phoenix, Arizona 85054
(480) 515-0565

My dealer in Houston, The Home Theater Store, just bought that store. That is where my newly purchased RC-1090 came from. Nice to hear they have a dedicated 2 ch setup and room. My local dealer only has HT setups, no dedicated 2 ch room.

[grit]

As someone else pointed out, to each their own.

I'm didn't like the Rotel 1091 or 1077, but I never said it was a 'bad' amplifier. In fact, I pointed out what I noticed and did not like about it (imaging/forward presentation). And others have too. So, we're just sharing an opinion, not commenting on Rotel in general.

Also, I know we can't compare anywhere near close to the same environment or equipment, but consider the material. Some people base evaulations on 2-ch, others on HT, others on SACD/DVD audio. IMO, HT presents itself much differently than music. And finally, consider is being compared. I noticed one person preferred the 500 wpc of a 1092 to a 130 wpc RB-1070. Depending on the speakers and how loud they're being driven, that comparrison alone may impact one's opinion.

[mattburk]

I don't see that happening, the adopting only digital amps thing... I see them expanding the line...

The RB1090 was being fased out regardless. it might be loved on this forum but on a world wide level it is not...

Do you mean because of cost & weight or performance? I have never seen a bad review on the 1090.

[Joey_V]

I don't see that happening, the adopting only digital amps thing... I see them expanding the line...

The RB1090 was being fased out regardless. it might be loved on this forum but on a world wide level it is not...

How is the 1090 not loved?

[Kobus]

Do you mean because of cost & weight or performance? I have never seen a bad review on the 1090.

Must be demand ???

Rotel, unlike Krell etc. does not survive on low volume - high price.

This is purely a guess after a nice bottle of South African Pinotage.

Kobus

[MoonSpin]

"The RB1090 was being fased out regardless. it might be loved on this forum but on a world wide level it is not..."

That's a real shame because the Rotel RB-1090 is a real jewel of an amp, up there with the BIG BOYS but a real value when comparing with the rest. I compared it to some very expensive other brand amps and I still prefered the Rotel RB-1090 and at that price, a real steal that I felt Rotel really deserved my business!

I suspect it has more to do with "audio snob" than anything else because some people refuse to believe just how good the RB-1090 really is to some of the other brands. I've come across it often with audio snobs that haven't ever even heard it. :rofl: Even the dealer tried to talk me into spending $10,000 on an amp but I was no fool after hearing the RB-1090! It would be great if WorldWide they realized what a great hidden jewel this amp is!

[wkhanna]

This is purely a guess after a nice bottle of South African Pinotage.

Kobus

Uhmmmmmm...... I bet it is first press, too. Boy, I'd love to try some!
You guys have some good ones based on the few we get to try here.

Enjoy!

[Kevin D]

I don't have much to add, I haven't heard the 1092 and would probably be biased since I like my 1077.

That said, I really want to thank all of you for keeping this thread mature and positive. That's pretty hard to accomplish on a heated topic like this.

Thanks,

Kevin D.

[RebelMan]

I would love to do a RB1090 / 1092 side by side but alas cannot - still have the RB1080 to test it out with but seems an unfair comparison but will do it when I recover from the flu and have some time !!! Nothing like a blind test to sort the men from the boys !

Nice review RebelMan...sorry you were disappointed. I must say I found completely the opposite to ... but appreciate and respect your input!!!

Thanks for the compliments Steve. I had the fortune to AB the RB-1090 and the RMB-1095 with the 1092 and the results for me were real.

[RebelMan]

I'll be at SLM this coming Saturday the 8th... if you guys would like? 8)

This is good news. About what time?

miner, Will you be there too?

Sorry, to hear that you can't make it Saturday Gump, you'll be missed.

ShadowZA, it's not to late. You still have a couple of days to get here on time.

[MoonSpin]

I would love to join in but I don't live any where near Arizona!
Enjoy!

[ShadowZA]

... ShadowZA, it's not to late. You still have a couple of days to get here on time.

If I'm not there in the flesh, I'll be there in spirit

It'll be Saturday evening here ... at the time of the SLM morning invasion ... and so I'll put on some Diana Krall ... ease back on the sofa & think of you guys.

Enjoy :T

[Gump]

This is good news. About what time?

miner, Will you be there too?

Sorry, to hear that you can't make it Saturday Gump, you'll be missed.

ShadowZA, it's not to late. You still have a couple of days to get here on time.

If you have it set up and ready to go at about 2:00 pm I MIGHT (and, as you can see, that's a big might ) be able to slip in there for a quick listening session. An hour at most.

But if that's inconvenient for anybody else don't worry about me and go ahead and pick another time, cause it's a long shot that I can make it anyway.

[miner]

I'll be in Tucson Friday & Saturday. Won't be in Phoenix until Sunday to catch my fligth back to Houston. report back with observed/auditioned results. Sorry can't meet and put a face to names.

[Andrew M Ward]

Must be demand ???

Rotel, unlike Krell etc. does not survive on low volume - high price.

This is purely a guess after a nice bottle of South African Pinotage.

Kobus

demand is the reason, other than this forum, it's not in huge demand on a world wide basis. I think there are plenty to go around, it's not like it's going to vanish in thin air over the next 24 hours...

[Andrew M Ward]

This is good news. About what time?

miner, Will you be there too?

Sorry, to hear that you can't make it Saturday Gump, you'll be missed.

ShadowZA, it's not to late. You still have a couple of days to get here on time.

early afternoon

[Andrew M Ward]

I really want to thank all of you for keeping this thread mature and positive. That's pretty hard to accomplish on a heated topic like this.

Kevin D.

Hey,
There's still time... for it to get ugly (I'm always game) :rofl:

[Gump]

early afternoon

I"ll try to be there between 1:30 and 2:00 pm.. If that work's for you guys--great......if not, have fun and I'll have to catch you the next time.

[Andrew M Ward]

I"ll try to be there between 1:30 and 2:00 pm.. If that work's for you guys--great......if not, have fun and I'll have to catch you the next time.

works for me!

[RebelMan]

I"ll try to be there between 1:30 and 2:00 pm.. If that work's for you guys--great......if not, have fun and I'll have to catch you the next time.

I am expecting a package at 11:00 AM. Assuming there are no hold ups, 1:30 - 2:00 PM will work for me too.

[Mitchell]

This has been a great thread to monitor. This is the kind of thing that makes the web and particularly this forum so great. I love reading smart people debate something they are enthusiastic about. Thanks

[miner]

I am expecting a package at 11:00 AM. Assuming there are no hold ups, 1:30 - 2:00 PM will work for me too.

If you get the opportunity, ask the team at SLM how they like their new management from Houston, The Home Theater Store. These guys in Houston need to take a lesson or two from SLM and set up dedicated 2 ch listening rooms.

[Andrew M Ward]

If you get the opportunity, ask the team at SLM how they like their new management from Houston, The Home Theater Store. These guys in Houston need to take a lesson or two from SLM and set up dedicated 2 ch listening rooms.

try the friendswood HT store south of Houston...

[miner]

Thanks for the suggestion.

[mattburk]

My local hifi dealer no longer sells the rb1090. The rotel rep said the rb1090 is being discontinued to be replaced by the 1092. They are now pushing nad in place of rotel, for that price bracket.

[MoonSpin]

So NAD is going to pick up where Rotel's leaves off for that dealer?

I've never owned a NAD product before so not sure how I would like them, I mean, I seen them in the Audio Stores and sometimes like their designs but strangly never heard one.

[Gump]

Slm

If you get the opportunity, ask the team at SLM how they like their new management from Houston, The Home Theater Store. These guys in Houston need to take a lesson or two from SLM and set up dedicated 2 ch listening rooms.

Sounds Like Music was a privately owned high-end stereo store here in Phoenix for quite a few years. Last year the owner had some financial problems and had to bail out. The store went into receivership and the Texas based chain, "The Home Theater Store", bought it.

The transition from a privately owned business to a "chain" store ruffled a few feathers as you might expect. For example the salesman that I dealt with there for 9 years didn't like the policies and rules of the new ownership and quit. I'm sure there's pros and cons on each side.

At any rate, the dust has pretty much settled and it's still the only game in town as far as B&W/Classe/Rotel as well as some other high end EQ.

Something they did I didn't like----They got rid of the Marantz line and brought in Denon instead. (I'm a Marantz fan).

Something they're doing I do like-----They're in the process of bringing in the Mcintosh line and setting up a "Mac" room.

As far as the "2-channel listening room" goes; that existed with the prior ownership and THTS just decided to leave it as is.

That's probably more information than you wanted, but there you have it. RebelMan and Andrew can probably add more info if you need it.

By the way, sorry you can't make the demo session on Saturday----the more the merrier!

[MoonSpin]

Who goes will have to fill us in on your thoughts on your listening session! :T

[Andrew M Ward]

Sounds Like Music was a privately owned high-end stereo store here in Phoenix for quite a few years. Last year the owner had some financial problems and had to bail out. The store went into receivership and the Texas based chain, "The Home Theater Store", bought it.

The transition from a privately owned business to a "chain" store ruffled a few feathers as you might expect. For example the salesman that I dealt with there for 9 years didn't like the policies and rules of the new ownership and quit. I'm sure there's pros and cons on each side.

At any rate, the dust has pretty much settled and it's still the only game in town as far as B&W/Classe/Rotel as well as some other high end EQ.

Something they did I didn't like----They got rid of the Marantz line and brought in Denon instead. (I'm a Marantz fan).

Something they're doing I do like-----They're in the process of bringing in the Mcintosh line and setting up a "Mac" room.

As far as the "2-channel listening room" goes; that existed with the prior ownership and THTS just decided to leave it as is.

That's probably more information than you wanted, but there you have it. RebelMan and Andrew can probably add more info if you need it.

By the way, sorry you can't make the demo session on Saturday----the more the merrier!

Fun was had by all: as pictured Gump Andrew James Dean

[wkhanna]

Faces to the Names!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now you have destoyed the Myth!!!!!!!!!

Oh god, I feel soooo old....................

[Joey_V]

Sweeet... nice to know who's who..

So, how did the audition go? Come on... spill the beans!

[wkhanna]

......So, how did the audition go? Come on... spill the beans!

Joey, being that you are from Chi Town, you should know the type....these are the 'Bad Guys'.

they are gonna make us sweat!!!!

[ShadowZA]

Fun was had by all: as pictured Gump Andrew James Dean

Great stuff! Well done guys ... man, I wish I was there :T
Great pic, too

[Kobus]

Coming here was obviously the first thing I did this morning. Yes ShadowZA, I know you as well.

Thanking you guys in anticipation......

Kobus

[Gump]

Fun was had by all: as pictured Gump Andrew James Dean

Very enjoyable session. It was great meeting both you guys. Wish I could've stayed longer.

[ShadowZA]

Coming here was obviously the first thing I did this morning. Yes ShadowZA, I know you as well.

Thanking you guys in anticipation......

Kobus

Youuuuuuu betcha :P