The Clubs, a moratorium

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  • Lexman
    Super Senior Member
    • Jun 2000
    • 1777

    The Clubs, a moratorium

    Guys, a request for a Club Denon, combined with the limited activity of most of the clubs is causing me to rethink whether we should continue with the clubs we have, and add more potentially, such as the Club Denon.

    Or whether we should do away with the brand specific clubs, and narrow the focus to:
    1. Flagship pre-pro's
    2. Flagship amplifiers
    3. Flagship receivers
    4. Flagship video

    Of course, the advantage to this approach is, if someone is not talking about proceed for example, they might be talking about Lexicon. If someone is not talking about Denon receivers, maybe Outlaw. etc...

    I would like to get the opinions of you, the members, before I make a decision. Do you have preference on this? Of course, the irony of this decision is, Club B & K has been successful, though I haven't checked activity since the great black out of 01. Come to think of it, it wasn't so great either. (the blackout that is)

    Lex
  • Andrew Pratt
    Moderator Emeritus
    • Aug 2000
    • 16507

    #2
    I like that idea..though do we need a flagship amp section? That could maybe be lumped in with the pre pro area since you can't have one without the other




    Comment

    • Lexman
      Super Senior Member
      • Jun 2000
      • 1777

      #3
      Yes, that's doable Andrew, combined pre-pro/amp section.

      Another advantage of this whole concept is it would foster better and perhaps more comparisons between similar products and more friendly bantor.

      "We", meaning some of the moderators and myself have been a little concerned over the lack of use of our specialty areas, that it just looks bad to new members when they are evaluating us to become a member. Looks like we don't have much to say maybe. That's as honest as I can be about why we are looking at this decision.

      If we don't get much input here, then I will assume indifference exists. So come on, tell me what you really think!

      Lex

      Comment

      • Trevor Schell
        Moderator Emeritus
        • Aug 2000
        • 10935

        #4
        I bow to you Lex for coming up with such a great idea!

        I would agree with Andrew, The Flagship Pre/Pro plus Flagship Amp sections would be fine together into one. Then have a Flagship Receiver and Flagship Video/DVD sections seperately for 3 in total. You may also want to list the devices that are up for discussions in these areas...

        Adding these forums will definately expand participation..Count me in!




        Trevor
        My HomeTheater S.E.
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        Trevor



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        Comment

        • George Bellefontaine
          Moderator Emeritus
          • Jan 2001
          • 7637

          #5
          Flagship kinda restricts the interest. Not everyone can afford flagship A/V equipment.However, I do like the fact you may add Denon, eventhough the 3801 is three models down, and this is the model I own and am beginning to fall in love with.
          Regards,
          George




          My Homepage!
          My Homepage!

          Comment

          • Lexman
            Super Senior Member
            • Jun 2000
            • 1777

            #6
            George, you as well make a good point. Flagship might be a little to specific of a term.

            Trevor, I know who brought this topic up, and it wasn't me.

            Andrew and I have discussed the slow activity in the Clubs before. Mostly from a perspective of how we can drum business up for them. But maybe it is time to take a fresh look at this, and do what is best for all the folks, not just the few.

            Lex

            Comment

            • Andrew Pratt
              Moderator Emeritus
              • Aug 2000
              • 16507

              #7
              yes "flagship" might be a little bit of a misnomer regarding the labeling so what would you suggest?




              Comment

              • Trevor Schell
                Moderator Emeritus
                • Aug 2000
                • 10935

                #8
                Lex,,I am buttering you up.,,couldn't you tell.

                Flagship receivers are what really make up the club area..but with a small selection..A general section would expand on the number of models and brands to be discussed . Even though I own the Denon 5800,,I still like to keep up to date on the other brands out there and enjoy reading owners experiences with them and will continue to do so....In fact I always kept myself in the loop on the High End components before I bought the 5800..not even realizing that I would someday own this receiver. I would think that most that are into the HT Hobby would be interested in such a section just for the fact that we all like to dream of owning the biggest and best gear out there and therfore like to read about it. The interest would be high in my opinion.
                There is another Forum decicated only to Flagship components which is posted on frequently,,but if you look at the veiws you will see that there are a huge amount of people that read it without posting,,definately lots of interest there.
                This would be a very sucessful area.




                Trevor
                My HomeTheater S.E.
                Sonically Enhanced
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                Trevor



                XBOX 360 CARD

                Comment

                • John Holmes
                  Moderator Emeritus
                  • Aug 2000
                  • 2703

                  #9
                  I think that it would be nice to have a section dedcated to specific models. The flagships are always fun to read about even if you don't/can't or won't own one. My receiver is a step below the flagship in it's series yet, I don't feel insulted if it is not considered part of the talk. That is what "A/V Chalet" is for, us other folk.

                  And I have associates that own some flagships and have no clue about what their equipment is capable of doing. They just wanted the best and someone they know or saw had one so...
                  I can get knowledge specific to their unit and help them as well.

                  I say go for it!




                  "I came here, to chew bubble gum and kickass. And I'm all out of bubble gum!!!" My DVD's
                  "I have come here, to chew bubblegum and kickass. And I'm all out of bubblegum!!!"

                  Comment

                  • Lexman
                    Super Senior Member
                    • Jun 2000
                    • 1777

                    #10
                    Regarding the inactivity of the current clubs:
                    Well, perhaps we are being just a little to "passive" at times as a group. That contributes to infrequent posting. I mean if we all just want to read, there won't be much to read after a while.

                    I guess my point is, the success of any discussion forum, no matter if we make changes here, is a direct result of the number of people that are both members, and that get involved. Does that mean we expect you to post to be a member? Absolutely not. However, the slowness of some of our forums is partly a product of passive attitudes. This includes myself as well. I am sure there are many things I could post on in the Lexicon area for example. But due to time restraints and such, I am just not able to do it as much as I would like.

                    The long and short of this is, we have come a long way in a short time. Expectations are high, and sometimes we just can't meet our own expectations.

                    Another view, no matter the name of an area, we all must make an effort to participate where it makes sense for us to. Can we contribute? Do we have a question? Do we know the answer!

                    If we all try and be a little more pro-active, each discussion group of the forum will "feed" on that.

                    That's my food for thought today. and yes, sometimes we can all be a little to agreeable. If you disagree on a point, say so. Andrew has a fire extinguisher ready should it get out of hand. Fact is, some controversy breeds interest.

                    I mean, silver wire, coathanger, what is the difference!?! We want to spark some passion here guys, some fire! But not tooooo much.

                    Lex

                    Comment

                    • Robbie
                      Senior Member
                      • Aug 2000
                      • 256

                      #11
                      Lex,

                      I like the idea of grouping similar interests together. Maybe the term "Flagship" might be a little much and might be miss construed by some people but the idea has merit. I don't frequent any of the clubs because I don't have that particular equipment. Limiting the equipment restricts the usage of the clubs. IMHO as always.

                      Robbie Caldwell

                      Comment

                      • Ken McDaniel
                        Senior Member
                        • Aug 2000
                        • 170

                        #12
                        Damn, this topic drew a huge response in a relatively short period of time. I like the idea of Club Denon. Owning Denon's former flagship AVP-8000 and POA-8200, 8300; I like the idea of have a place to express Denon issues. Although I think I'm the only one that still owns a 20-bit dinosaur, I believe Denon's ability to issue cutting edge products should make for excellent conversation.

                        As far as 'flagship' topics: I don't think there are enough flagships floating around to justify the proposed multiple clubs.

                        How about a room entitled: Flagships. Let's face it, there aren't that many. Lexicon MC-1, Theta Casablanca, Meridian 881 (is that right?), Proceed AVP, and a few others. Amps: Theta Dreadnaught, EAD Powermaster 2000, Levinson, and others. All of these beauties can be admired in the same room.

                        (If someone already mentioned this I apologize. It was a rough day at work and I'm typing under the influence.)




                        Ken
                        Ken

                        Comment

                        • MRWILLL
                          Senior Member
                          • Aug 2000
                          • 107

                          #13
                          How about...


                          "OF SPECIAL INTEREST"


                          PRE-PRO/AMPS


                          RECEIVERS


                          SPEAKERS


                          ...and so on.




                          STOP!!...LOOK!!...LISTEN!!
                          DVD...Hear it from the people who
                          mixed and mastered it "LEXICON".
                          STOP!!...LOOK!!...LISTEN!!
                          DVD...Hear it from the people who
                          mixed and mastered it "LEXICON".

                          Comment

                          • Susan
                            Moderator Emeritus
                            • Jan 2001
                            • 105

                            #14
                            Doug,
                            I'm not so sure it's a matter of apathy as much as lack of time. It seems most people will gravitate to two sections or maybe three, but we just don't have enough time in the busy seasons to check into 6 or 7. I think that's why in most forums the beginning general area is always the busiest and contains subjects from all the areas: 1) that's what you have time to check out and 2) you're not gonna get as many answers if you post in a specialty area.

                            I'm not crazy about the "flagship" aspect..you're limiting the numbers vastly by creating all 'flagship' categories. One "flagship" and the rest just general categories of components to me would be more appealing. That way, if I'm into ungrading a particular component in the near future I could immerse myself in that information.I would rarely only consider the top of the line in any particular company's offerings.

                            Just my 2 cents...and that's about all it's worth!
                            Susan
                            an Adcom/Tannoy lady...

                            Comment

                            • Lexman
                              Super Senior Member
                              • Jun 2000
                              • 1777

                              #15
                              If you will excuse the expression, this is good shit, keep it coming!

                              Ken, you letting your wife influence you again? That is what you meant, right? :W

                              Susan, well said.

                              Lex

                              Comment

                              • KennyG
                                Moderator Emeritus
                                • Sep 2000
                                • 745

                                #16
                                I like Mr.Will's idea...I vote for a "SEPERATES" section, a "RECIEVER" section, a "VIDEO DISPLAY" section, and a "SPEAKER" section. If you go with top-O-the-line sections very few can post in there.

                                Comment

                                • Wireless
                                  Senior Member
                                  • Feb 2001
                                  • 140

                                  #17
                                  I think Mr Wills has a good idea. I must admit that I haven't seen my Proceed have its own discussion forum before and I liked having, but because of the very few posts its usefullness may not be realized.




                                  John
                                  My HT Picts
                                  John
                                  My HT Picts

                                  Comment

                                  • John Holmes
                                    Moderator Emeritus
                                    • Aug 2000
                                    • 2703

                                    #18
                                    I agree that Mr.Will has the right idea!




                                    "I came here, to chew bubble gum and kickass. And I'm all out of bubble gum!!!" My DVD's
                                    "I have come here, to chew bubblegum and kickass. And I'm all out of bubblegum!!!"

                                    Comment

                                    • Lexman
                                      Super Senior Member
                                      • Jun 2000
                                      • 1777

                                      #19
                                      Ahhh, so now you guys are sucking up to Mr. Willl?
                                      lol.

                                      Good thoughts folks, keep those cards and letters coming! The jury has not convened yet-

                                      Lex

                                      Comment

                                      • George Bellefontaine
                                        Moderator Emeritus
                                        • Jan 2001
                                        • 7637

                                        #20
                                        Yep, Mr. Wills is right on the money.




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                                        Comment

                                        • Patrick Sun
                                          Super Senior Member
                                          • Aug 2000
                                          • 1380

                                          #21
                                          I'm frugal, so I know I don't/won't frequent the flagship forums. But I would frequent forums delineated along the lines of groups of products, like receivers, DVD players, speakers, etc.




                                          PatCave; HT Pix;Gear;DIY Projects;DVDs; LDs
                                          PatCave; HT Pix;Gear;DIY Projects;DVDs; LDs

                                          Comment

                                          • Lexman
                                            Super Senior Member
                                            • Jun 2000
                                            • 1777

                                            #22
                                            Thanks for everyone's input so far, great stuff.

                                            I have not heard from the BK crowd specifically regarding their area. I will see how active that is now before making a decision on it. In this case, it might be better served by keeping it-

                                            But maybe those guys don't want to be under a microscope either, I dunno.

                                            Lex

                                            Comment

                                            • Trevor Schell
                                              Moderator Emeritus
                                              • Aug 2000
                                              • 10935

                                              #23
                                              Go for it!!,,

                                              Dividing the sections into Pre/Pro,,Receivers,,isn't such a bad idea.




                                              Trevor
                                              My HomeTheater S.E.
                                              Sonically Enhanced
                                              C5
                                              Trevor



                                              XBOX 360 CARD

                                              Comment

                                              • Greg Stone
                                                Senior Member
                                                • Aug 2000
                                                • 895

                                                #24
                                                I also like the idea of pre/pro, speakers, etc. I don't own a flagship and probably won't for a long time. But I don't and won't mind talking about my nice Denon AVR3300 in the receivers section.




                                                Greg's DVD's

                                                Comment

                                                • JonMarsh
                                                  Mad Max Moderator
                                                  • Aug 2000
                                                  • 15209

                                                  #25
                                                  I'll second Mr. Will, Kenny, and the rest; splitting it up into sections by equipment types makes more sense; and it's just as valid to discuss the best $1k Pre-pro or no holds barred; I think they belong together. Same about amps; it's reasonable for discussion about the best "value" in 5.1 combo amps to be discussed in the same amp forum with the more insane folks that may want to mix Palladium's and 8008X3's in their system. The area of interest and deployment are the samee, and will give readers and posters an opportunity to compare notes at various ends of the spectrum.

                                                  Regards,

                                                  Jon




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                                                  Just ask Mr. Ohm....

                                                  Comment

                                                  • DavidY
                                                    Member
                                                    • Aug 2000
                                                    • 67

                                                    #26
                                                    Currently, I only visit one or two "sections". I don't have the time or patience to go through the other "sections". I would prefer this forum to have fewer, more broad based "sections", more like the other HT forums (DTF, HTF, etc.). I really like the KISS method.

                                                    Just my 2 cents Canadian, which is worth only about 1 cent U.S.

                                                    Dave

                                                    Comment

                                                    • Lexman
                                                      Super Senior Member
                                                      • Jun 2000
                                                      • 1777

                                                      #27
                                                      Well, I made substantial changes tonight! I may play with it a little more, but right now, I think I about did what I set out to do. I may combine DVD and Music into one area, but I would want to move all the posts from one or the other, and at least discuss it before I do that.

                                                      I chose to currently keep the forums that have seen post activity, and those that I feel do fill a void or need. At which point they no longer serve a need, if that occurs, then we will re-evaluate them at that time. I think this narrows our focus a bit. You don't need to go beyond Primetime A/V, unless you want to.

                                                      Opinions on the changes?

                                                      Thanks,

                                                      Lex

                                                      Comment

                                                      • Bing Fung
                                                        Ultra Senior Member
                                                        • Aug 2000
                                                        • 6521

                                                        #28
                                                        I told ya Lex, we need a "CLUB JUNK YARD DOG" for my kinda folk :B




                                                        Bing
                                                        Bing

                                                        Comment

                                                        • Lexman
                                                          Super Senior Member
                                                          • Jun 2000
                                                          • 1777

                                                          #29
                                                          hahaha Bing. I tried to cut down on the number of forums, not increase it, lol.

                                                          Lex

                                                          Comment

                                                          • Trevor Schell
                                                            Moderator Emeritus
                                                            • Aug 2000
                                                            • 10935

                                                            #30
                                                            Can I order a drink from the Chalet pub.Heh!




                                                            Trevor
                                                            My HomeTheater S.E.
                                                            Sonically Enhanced
                                                            C5
                                                            Trevor



                                                            XBOX 360 CARD

                                                            Comment

                                                            • Lexman
                                                              Super Senior Member
                                                              • Jun 2000
                                                              • 1777

                                                              #31
                                                              What, so you can get on the roof to put yet a 4th dish up and risk falling? I don't think so, lol.

                                                              Lex

                                                              Comment

                                                              • RickS
                                                                Super Senior Member
                                                                • Aug 2000
                                                                • 1247

                                                                #32
                                                                Lex,

                                                                I do like the idea about sections for different components but, also having people like Buzz from Tag drop by is something I feel is very nice. I don't have a Tag product "yet" but, probably will use the Tag section more when I do!!

                                                                Rick




                                                                The Home Theater
                                                                DVD Collection

                                                                Comment

                                                                • Lexman
                                                                  Super Senior Member
                                                                  • Jun 2000
                                                                  • 1777

                                                                  #33
                                                                  I agree Rick. Having Buzz come around is a good thing. Few manufacturers are willing to put themselves out here, and post with us commoners. Buzz does, they offer what appears to be a great product, and I am glad to have the relationship with Tag that we do. This is unlike what many forums view this as. Simply, as a loss of advertising revenue. But I view it as not only a more intimate view of part of the electronics industry, as well as inticing to new members to see that we have a person very high up with a major company here, addressing questions they may have. I haven't seen Buzz around in a while, but I assume he will stop back in sometime soon.

                                                                  Lex

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