Outlaw update

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  • Andrew Pratt
    Moderator Emeritus
    • Aug 2000
    • 16507

    Outlaw update

    At this time, it has become obvious that an update is necessary on the status of the 950. While earlier delivery estimates have fallen short, this has never been our intention. However, as you know, shipping of the Model 950 has come to a stop. As you may also know, a small number of units have shipped with an abnormal level of hiss.

    The cause of this hiss has become the topic of heavy debate in the Outlaw Saloon as well as in other online forums. It has also become a significant burden to our engineers here in the United States as well as our engineering team in Malaysia. Literally working around the clock we have been able to isolate a few potential causes. Further complicating things is the fact that this problem is confined to a small sample of units making it harder, not easier, to solve. There are many individual factors pertaining to each installation which means a "fix" that works in the lab might not work in the field. The hardware and software engineering required to get to the bottom of things is a very time consuming process. If everyone had the same problem, it would be easy.

    The "good news" is, while the reports of problems sometimes seem magnified by postings on the forums, their actual number in proportion to the number of units shipped is very small. The "bad news" is that the small number of samples and the variations in the way in which the problems manifest themselves make the solution harder to reach.

    We are continuing to investigate the root cause for this anomaly, and will continue our commitment to resolving this issue for each and every consumer. Since several customers have contacted us regarding a lack of communication regarding both the status of the 950 and our intentions, here is our interim proposal:

    · If your 950 exhibits an abnormal level of hiss, please send an e-mail with the serial number of your unit and your name, phone number and address to 950service@outlawaudio.com. We will then send confirmation of your letter. Once a universal fix has been established we will process your request and tell you how to send the unit back to our warehouse and service center. We will arrange for a pick-up by FedEx Ground at our expense, and we will ship a modified unit back to you prepaid.
    · The timing for all of this will be worked out with you via e-mail.

    Given that anyone who was unhappy with their initial unit has already had the option to return it within the 30-day audition period, we feel that this is a reasonable way to accommodate those who appreciate the sonics and features of the Model 950.

    In addition, we will begin to provide more timely updates regarding the status of the product. What we can not do is provide estimates as to when individual units will ship. Calling/e-mailing the Sales and Support office regarding this status will only further hinder our ability to work efficiently at resolving the issue. However, we will continue to encourage any and all contact regarding the operation, use, and/or integration of our equipment.

    One last comment. While we have been extremely liberal regarding the use of our Saloon, we have NEVER stopped reading it or any other industry news boards. Due to the roller coaster like nature of the hiss problem we felt it would have done more harm than good to comment in many of the ongoing threads. Giving out information that ultimately proves to be inaccurate only makes the situation worse for everyone. These new, timelier updates will inform you of our continuing progress in dealing with this situation.

    We thank you for your patience and understanding.

    Best Regards,

    The Outlaws




  • SiliGoose
    Senior Member
    • Aug 2000
    • 942

    #2
    One thing I've learned about the Outlaws: they sure have long email announcements!

    At this point they just need to say, "it's STILL not right so we're going to try yet again."

    It's still a good value, but why anyone would continue to wait when the Rotel 1066 is ready to be had is beyond me. Outlaw is yesterday's news, IMO.




    -Sili
    www.campmurphy.net

    Comment

    • Andrew Pratt
      Moderator Emeritus
      • Aug 2000
      • 16507

      #3
      Yup another email from Outlaw saying its delayed again :roll:




      Comment

      • Ricky
        Senior Member
        • Aug 2000
        • 226

        #4
        Hhhmm, long yes, but probably not as long as previous ones.

        Hey, when will Rotel make an announcement that their 1066 prepro competes with products 2-3 times as costly? Or Rotel owners saying that their prepro has the same sonics as something that costs 10 times as much....like a loaded Meridian 861 or Theta CasablancaII with all Extreme dacs.

        Comment

        • Brandon B
          Super Senior Member
          • Jun 2001
          • 2193

          #5
          Boy I am glad mine is hissless. At least with the MMG's it is. I hope when my (7dB more efficient) newer speakers are done it doesn't suddenly manifest.

          As to why anyone would wait in lieu of a 1066, that would likely be the group of people for whom $899 is a stretch and $1300-$1500 is out of reach.

          BB

          Comment

          • Kevin P
            Member
            • Aug 2000
            • 10809

            #6
            As to why anyone would wait in lieu of a 1066, that would likely be the group of people for whom $899 is a stretch and $1300-$1500 is out of reach.
            People like me, that is.

            Although I won't likely be upgrading anytime soon, I've been teetering between the Rotel and the Outlaw, waiting for the famous Farstad shootout, which shows them to be pretty darned close sonically. If I could drop cash on either unit right now I'd probably go for the Outlaw because (a) it has a tuner, which my wife would want, and (b) it's $300-500 cheaper. Even if I might prefer the warmer Rotel sound for music, how often do I listen to music on my system. Not as much as I'd like to, I'm afraid.

            But, 6 months to a year from now, when I (hopefully) have the funds for an upgrade, heck, no one will be talking about the 950 or 1066 anymore since we'll all be talking about the next hot piece to come down the road!

            KJP




            Official Computer Geek and Techno-Wiz Guru of HTGuide - Visit Tower of Power
            My HT Site

            Comment

            • SiliGoose
              Senior Member
              • Aug 2000
              • 942

              #7
              Yea, within 6-months you'll have the Outlaw clones fully established, the new Sherwood pre/pro, a rumored (off and on) replacement to Sony's TAE9000ES (though that may cost closer to $2k) and who knows what else.




              -Sili
              www.campmurphy.net

              Comment

              • Jeff Aguilar
                Senior Member
                • Jun 2001
                • 126

                #8
                Kevin,

                Dusty and I were talking this morning about the differences between the Rotel and the Outlaw when it comes to 2 channel music reproduction. Yes, the Rotel does reproduce music differently, but how often do we get the chance to really sit down and experience that. With kids running around and life so busy it is almost impossible. It would be something different if I had a dedicated room for listening room where I could get away from the family, but then again most of my free time is now 'Family' time in this stage of my life. Besides, if I had a seperate room, I would want different equipment for 2 channel reproduction. So, to Dusty and I, the '$350-$500' difference could be spend somewhere else in our system. Just my opinion...

                Oh, and last night I was able to set up the tuner portion of my Outlaw. Man, is it nice to have the radio in our Family room and kitchen! With all of our other receiver's, the tuner part always sucked! 8O It made the wife really happy to hear her favorite radio station. All I need to do in life is score points with her. If my equipment spending can do that it makes the equipment even that much nicer. :LOL:

                Jeff Aguilar

                Comment

                • Kevin P
                  Member
                  • Aug 2000
                  • 10809

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Jeff Aguilar
                  Yes, the Rotel does reproduce music differently, but how often do we get the chance to really sit down and experience that.
                  So true. In my case, due to room dimensions and layout, I can't get an optimum soundstage for 2 channel anyway. A new house with a better room for HT would help my 2 channel performance more than the pre-pro of the month. And like you, if I had the time to do critical listening, I'd be doing the separate 2 channel system anyway.
                  So, to Dusty and I, the '$350-$500' difference could be spend somewhere else in our system. Just my opinion...
                  So true too. $350-500 would cover decent interconnects or something like that.
                  Oh, and last night I was able to set up the tuner portion of my Outlaw. Man, is it nice to have the radio in our Family room and kitchen! With all of our other receiver's, the tuner part always sucked! 8O
                  I take that as a thumbs up :T for the Outlaw's tuner then. Another point for the Outlaw, as my present receiver (hey, it's an Outlaw 1050!) is on all day on the tuner. It's all my wife listens to. So not only is the pre-pro cheaper but I also save a couple hundred more on the tuner.

                  I wonder if anyone's compared the 1050 with the 950 in terms of performance, using the same amps, speakers, etc. In any case, I'll be popping for amps well before popping for a pre-pro, so I wonder if the "1050 plus amps" combination comes close to the "950 plus the same amps" in terms of performance, not counting the added features of the 950 of course. In particular in 2 channel audio performance and tuner performance.

                  KJP




                  Official Computer Geek and Techno-Wiz Guru of HTGuide - Visit Tower of Power
                  My HT Site

                  Comment

                  • LarryB
                    Member
                    • Dec 2001
                    • 81

                    #10
                    Jeff:

                    but how often do we get the chance to really sit down and experience that. With kids running around and life so busy it is almost impossible.
                    If possible, try to expose your kids to music, even if it's just playing in the background. Theire lives will be richer for it, and one day they will thank you.

                    Free advice switch off.

                    Larry

                    Comment

                    • Jeff Aguilar
                      Senior Member
                      • Jun 2001
                      • 126

                      #11
                      LarryB,

                      I totally agree with you. We listen to music ALL the time. I like to try and leave the TV off and the music on. I grew up listening to music, and I love all types of music. What I meant about the 'getting time to listen to music', is listening to it critically.

                      Jeff

                      Comment

                      • Kevin C Brown
                        Junior Member
                        • Jun 2002
                        • 18

                        #12
                        Why I am still waiting for the Outlaw:

                        I want analog bass management on the 5.1 inputs. I have had my Sony TA-E9000ES for about 3.5 years now. I think I can wait another few months!

                        Cost isn't the issue. I almost pulled the triger on a B&K Ref 30 earlier this year ($2k), until I found it it didn't really have any modes to "expand" 2.0 through 5.1 movies sources to 6.1/7.1.

                        Here's a question actually for y'all with the 1066, how do you do bass management for SACD/DVD-A? I can't believe that *everyone* has full range speakers all around... ICBM? Don't worry about? No SACD/DVD-A? Just curious. :?:

                        Comment

                        • greggz
                          Senior Member
                          • Jun 2002
                          • 317

                          #13
                          Hi Kevin,

                          My SACD player (the Sony 500V) has some rudimentary bass management. I can set the speaker size to small and it has a built in crossover set at 100 Hz (if I recall correctly). I'm also eyeing getting a Panasonic RP82, which is rumored to have satisfactory bass management on DVD-A.

                          I must confess that at the time I made the decision to go with monitor/bookshelf speakers and subs I didn’t know what an issue bass management would become with full range speakers. Luckily my speakers run out of gas around 60Hz so I am more than happy to off load the bass duties to my sub.

                          If I had to give anyone advice considering buying speakers now and knowing that they would be predominantly used for multichannel content (home theater, DVD-A, and SACD), I would strongly recommend the monitor/sub combination over full range speakers. Decoupling the bass from the speaker and entrusting it to the sub gives you much better placement flexibility in tuning your room.

                          Gregg
                          Gregg

                          Our Home Theater

                          Comment

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