SSP-800 availability/upgrade board

[SRT-10 Viper]

I have 0064 installed and have the problem I stated above.

[Srrndhound]

I have 0064 installed and have the problem I stated above.

If perchance you have 0062, might be interesting to see if that has correct levels for you. I checked them against ref discs and found it was correct. Next week I'll check 0064. If you don't have 0062 and want it, PM me.

--Roger

[jtcseattle]

HDMI Handshake Issues

I just updated the firmware on my SSP-800 to 2.0.0. Prior to the update (and now after the update) I have been unable to get a picture from my Comcast cable box for non-HD channels. The sound comes through fine and the HD channels are all fine. Also, I have an Oppo DV-980H which, both before and after the upgrade, will not show a picture. I suspect something is going on with the HDMI handshake. Has any one had similar problems? If so, were you able to resolve them?

[hifiguymi]

Have you tried both 480i and 480p for your standard def channels? If not, do you know how to change it? If it's a Motorola box you press menu while the unit is off and a set up menu should come up. You can change it there along with color space and HD resolution.

Eric

[SRT-10 Viper]

I found another problem with the 0064 SW last night (other than the surround channel levels mentioned above). I had a problem with the bass from my (2) JL Audio F113 Subs playing too much bass even when set at the correct SPL levels. Last night I selected ebass to turn it on (highlighted) and the problem went away. I believe the button when selected is doing the opposite... It's canceling ebass when on... and when off ebass is running. This was giving my system too much bass.

[sikoniko]

I found another problem with the 0064 SW last night (other than the surround channel levels mentioned above). I had a problem with the bass from my (2) JL Audio F113 Subs playing too much bass even when set at the correct SPL levels. Last night I selected ebass to turn it on (highlighted) and the problem went away. I believe the button when selected is doing the opposite... It's canceling ebass when on... and when off ebass is running. This was giving my system too much bass.

Interesting. I've been wondering why I've noticed more bass.

[wxmanunr]

Classe Software QC?

Does it seem like Classe has rushed the software a little bit with this one? I know everyone has been clamoring for the long-awaited DSP upgrade, but I would NOT want to be buying an SSP-800 (now at $9k) and having these issues. At least our non-upgraded units work ok.

wxmanunr

[wettou]

Does it seem like Classe has rushed the software a little bit with this one? I know everyone has been clamoring for the long-awaited DSP upgrade, but I would NOT want to be buying an SSP-800 (now at $9k) and having these issues. At least our non-upgraded units work ok. :B

wxmanunr

!!! :cry:

[sikoniko]

Does it seem like Classe has rushed the software a little bit with this one? I know everyone has been clamoring for the long-awaited DSP upgrade, but I would NOT want to be buying an SSP-800 (now at $9k) and having these issues. At least our non-upgraded units work ok.

wxmanunr

It sounds like you believe this upgrade takes a step backwards. Your post leads me to believe you have not upgraded. Allow me to assure you that the current code is more stable then what you are running at this time.

Though - I did see that classe posted an updated code the same day they posted the new DSP code.

[wxmanunr]

Not at all...

Sikoniko, I don't think the upgrade is a step backward at ALL. That was not what I meant. I look forward to a fully functioning software build and then send my unit for the hardware/software update.

wxmanunr

[AV-OCD]

I have had an SSP-800 on order for some time now. I have just found out from my dealer that I will likely receive it sometime in the next 2-3 weeks. Finally, light at the end of the tunnel.

I suspect that the dual-DSP upgrade boards by themselves would get out much faster as Hedgehog has indicated in his recent post.

It will be interesting to see what improvements in sound, if any, the dual-DSP upgrade board will make in the performance of the SSP-800. I hope that people will chime in on this.

Jim

From Tom McConville with Classe regarding the sound quality of the DSP upgrade.

The two DSPs are designed to have identical sonic performance. We exhaustively compared their technical measurements and performed extended listening sessions involving the same team that created the SSP-800s original, much praised sonic signature. Technically the units do test identically on all signals and our ears support this conclusion.

[sikoniko]

I found another problem with the 0064 SW last night (other than the surround channel levels mentioned above). I had a problem with the bass from my (2) JL Audio F113 Subs playing too much bass even when set at the correct SPL levels. Last night I selected ebass to turn it on (highlighted) and the problem went away. I believe the button when selected is doing the opposite... It's canceling ebass when on... and when off ebass is running. This was giving my system too much bass.

enabling ebass did tame things a bit. I do agree that the setting appears to be reversed.

[Oddiophile]

I hope and I trust that all these problems are being reported to Classe.

Jim

[wettou]

I hope and I trust that all these problems are being reported to Classe. Jim

Done

[wcranston]

I hope and I trust that all these problems are being reported to Classe.

Jim

I emailed Classe about the calibration noise and e-bass today.

The email response from Classe is as follows...

"We extensively tested the noise generator both within Classe using Audio Precision and externally before the 2.0.0 release. This testing did prove that we were outputting a single reference level on channels. It is therefore difficult to account for the performance you are experiencing. Could you possibly retest?
Ebass is a way of directing low frequency information to your sub when your speakers are set to full range. Could you please confirm if you only experience this performance when speakers are set to crossed over?"

I originally calibrated my system using an audio calibration disk. Once I updated the firmware I listen to the internal calibration noise and it was low compared to the external source on the outputs for the surrounds and sub.

I will zero out my system tomorrow and redo the speaker levels using the internal and external source tomorrow. Also will verify the e-bass fuction.

If anybody else has the time, please post your findings.

[SRT-10 Viper]

I have done it a couple times and have the same results... Surrounds about 5db lower with the internal test tone vs AVIA disc.... If I leave it to the internal test tone generation levels the surrounds are too loud when playing BDs or Cable. The ebass when highlighted reduces the bass vs increasing the bass (seems like others are seeing this too). I assume the ebass button is reversed.

For those saying they are glad they haven't purchased this processor. You are missing out! This is still the best sounding processor I have ever owned in my system and I've owned Meridian, Anthem, Denon and others.

[sikoniko]

I have done it a couple times and have the same results... Surrounds about 5db lower with the internal test tone vs AVIA disc.... If I leave it to the internal test tone generation levels the surrounds are too loud when playing BDs or Cable. The ebass when highlighted reduces the bass vs increasing the bass (seems like others are seeing this too). I assume the ebass button is reversed.

For those saying they are glad they haven't purchased this processor. You are missing out! This is still the best sounding processor I have ever owned in my system and I've owned Meridian, Anthem, Denon and others.

I am having second thoughts on the ebass issue. When I enable it, all of my bass is sucked out. I'd rather lower the bass by 5db and leave ebass disabled.

[wcranston]

I have done it a couple times and have the same results... Surrounds about 5db lower with the internal test tone vs AVIA disc.... If I leave it to the internal test tone generation levels the surrounds are too loud when playing BDs or Cable. The ebass when highlighted reduces the bass vs increasing the bass (seems like others are seeing this too). I assume the ebass button is reversed.

For those saying they are glad they haven't purchased this processor. You are missing out! This is still the best sounding processor I have ever owned in my system and I've owned Meridian, Anthem, Denon and others.

Have you listen to the Avia reference tones that go between each speaker and the sub? On the surround/sub reference tracks I get nothing out of the sub. With the Low Freq. sub sweep tone I get nothing from the sub. But when I listen to program, it sounds balanced. I thinking that there is a problem with the avia disk.

[wcranston]

Re-calibrated my system today and the internal calibration noise generator is 5-6 dB low on the surrounds.

Concerning the sub, I am not sure if the internal calibration noise generator is off. Read my post above. I'm an audio mixing engineer so I just used my ears to get it in the ballpark with some source material that I'm familiar with.

The e-bass function is reverse.

[Srrndhound]

Cal noise levels

Re-calibrated my system today and the internal calibration noise generator is 5-6 dB low on the surrounds. I'm an audio mixing engineer so I just used my ears to get it in the ballpark with some source material that I'm familiar with.

Upgraded my 800 from 1.99 to 2.0. The noise/tone generation now works across the channels including the aux channel where I have a second sub now connected. I am having one problem with the levels. The rear channels and subs are much too loud when matched to the front channels. I set the levels via SPL to 75 across all channels. I then played a couple blu-ray music discs... The rears and subs were way too loud. I then utilized an Avia II DVD to set the levels. This confirmed the rears and subs where much too high (about 5+ DB).

I'm back in the saddle, so was able to load 2.0 0064 tonight. I find the noise levels correct in all 7.1 channels. I compared it to both Dolby and THX test signals. With the internal noise set for 75 dB, the test discs return 75 dB for all the main speakers when the master vol is set for 0. If either of you have a DVD with THX Optimode signals, could you give it a spin? Monsters Inc is the disc I used--but there are several titles with it. I don't have Avia, unfortunately.

[wettou]

I'm back in the saddle, so was able to load 2.0 0064 tonight. I find the noise levels correct in all 7.1 channels. I compared it to both Dolby and THX test signals. With the internal noise set for 75 dB, the test discs return 75 dB for all the main speakers when the master vol is set for 0. If either of you have a DVD with THX Optimode signals, could you give it a spin? Monsters Inc is the disc I used--but there are several titles with it. I don't have Avia, unfortunately.

So is there a problem or not? Classe says there are no problem, version 2.1 anyone !

[rompower]

wettou, did you finally bought the ssp-8?

[rompower]

I have a little bug with the SSP-800, I was wondering if anyone seen it too

I do have the dual dsp, upgraded to the last posted firmware on Classé Website. And well... when I switch from Hdmi to CD (analog input) I hear no sound at all... I then switch to by-pass 7.1 I finally got sound, then switched to Analog input, sound was ok too then, I switch to a Hdmi connection (can be Xbox360 or bluray player), no more sound at all... Trying to get back to analog 7.1 or analog 2 input.. No sound.
I just disconnect the AC, waiting few minutes to restart it 100%...

Anyone experienced this?

[rompower]

Well.. I found the bug
Anyone can try it please, just to confirm
I have a Denon Bd3800Bdci and a Xbox360, both results are the same.

First, play music CD on analog source, then switch back to bluray player, then turn off the bluray player, wait for it to completely shutdown, then switch back to CD's analog source. Do you still have sound?
If no, Restart your bluray player, then reswitch your source to Bluray player on your Ssp-800. Sound should get back. Then you'll be able to switch back to CD source again without shutting down your bluray player.

Anyone can test and confirm if the same results occurs?

Thanks

[Srrndhound]

I've been having some issues with HDMI inputs, too, in that when switching from a CD (S/PDIF) to HDMI, sometimes the audio quits. Cannot get it back unless rebooted. Was the same in all dual DSP code revs thus far. Classe has been notified. Might want to let them know what you're experiencing.

[Srrndhound]

So is there a problem or not? Classe says there are no problem, version 2.1 anyone !

There's some problems in the code, yes, but I cannot find a problem with the noise cal signals based on the tests I did, so was asking those who feel there's a level error to compare to a known reference we might all have in common, for a sanity check.

[rompower]

Srrnd, you now know how to get your audio back without rebooting everthing =)
Simply switch source to your last hdmi connection, bootup your hdmi device, wait for it to play (audio) then switch your audio to the source you want...

Really userfriendly, isn't? eheh

[wcranston]

I'm back in the saddle, so was able to load 2.0 0064 tonight. I find the noise levels correct in all 7.1 channels. I compared it to both Dolby and THX test signals. With the internal noise set for 75 dB, the test discs return 75 dB for all the main speakers when the master vol is set for 0. If either of you have a DVD with THX Optimode signals, could you give it a spin? Monsters Inc is the disc I used--but there are several titles with it. I don't have Avia, unfortunately.

Srrndhound,

Am I missing something? Using the internal noise gen., I get 87 dB for my fronts, center and sub. To get to a reference level of 75 dB, I would have to trim the levels of all these speakers -12 dB. My surrounds are about 72 dB with the internal noise gen. There is no control for the overall volume when using the internal noise gen. Correct?

[Srrndhound]

Srrnd, you now know how to get your audio back without rebooting everthing =)
Simply switch source to your last hdmi connection, bootup your hdmi device, wait for it to play (audio) then switch your audio to the source you want...

Really userfriendly, isn't? eheh

In my case the HDMI source was never turned off, and neither was the SSP. I just switch back and forth between 2 live inputs, and eventually it freezes the DSP. No, not friendly at all.

[Srrndhound]

Srrndhound,

Am I missing something? Using the internal noise gen., I get 87 dB for my fronts, center and sub. To get to a reference level of 75 dB, I would have to trim the levels of all these speakers -12 dB. My surrounds are about 72 dB with the internal noise gen. There is no control for the overall volume when using the internal noise gen. Correct?

Let me just confirm--your unit is running 0064? Earlier code revs (like 0058 ) had the noise levels set too high.

Correct, there's no MV control while the cal noise is running. But in order to compare it with an external reference, the MV has to be set to 0.

I checked into the e-bass, and it's mostly operating correctly. The reason the level drops is in order to compensate for the duplicated bass which will raise the overall level. The correction factor is only an approximation, so it might be too much or too little--depending--but once you pick whether it's on or off, you calibrate the sub and it's not an issue anymore. Also, the scale factor should adjust based on how many speakers are running full range. -12dB for all of them, and less when only 1 pair are full range.

The part that's not correct is when all speakers are set for "crossed over" the e-bass button is supposed to be grayed out. That will be so in future code.

[wcranston]

Let me just confirm--your unit is running 0064? Earlier code revs (like 0058 ) had the noise levels set too high.

Correct, there's no MV control while the cal noise is running. But in order to compare it with an external reference, the MV has to be set to 0.

I checked into the e-bass, and it's mostly operating correctly. The reason the level drops is in order to compensate for the duplicated bass which will raise the overall level. The correction factor is only an approximation, so it might be too much or too little--depending--but once you pick whether it's on or off, you calibrate the sub and it's not an issue anymore. Also, the scale factor should adjust based on how many speakers are running full range. -12dB for all of them, and less when only 1 pair are full range.

The part that's not correct is when all speakers are set for "crossed over" the e-bass button is supposed to be grayed out. That will be so in future code.

Yes, 0064. 5.1 setup. All speakers crossed over at 80 Hz. None set to full range.

[Srrndhound]

Yes, 0064. 5.1 setup. All speakers crossed over at 80 Hz. None set to full range.

Goot.

Do you happen to have any DVDs with THX Optimode cal sgnals? Would be interested to see how they read at 0 Vol vs the internal noise.

[wcranston]

Goot.

Do you happen to have any DVDs with THX Optimode cal sgnals? Would be interested to see how they read at 0 Vol vs the internal noise.

I think the newest Indiana Jones DVD has it. I will look. So, I will used the internal noise and lower the levels of each speaker (LF, RF C, Sub) to 75 dB.
Adjust the surrounds to 75dB. Then I will compare this to a disk with test tones @ 0dB.

Were you aware that the original THX Optimode cal signals were incorrect? THX Optimizer is the one you want to used. I wasn't aware of this until you mention the THX test tones and I did a search for DVD's with them included.

Please refer to this article...

http://www.techlore.com/forum/thread/16738/THX-Optimizer----/

[Srrndhound]

Were you aware that the original THX Optimode cal signals were incorrect? THX Optimizer is the one you want to used. I wasn't aware of this until you mention the THX test tones and I did a search for DVD's with them included.

I was not aware of the error. I'm using Monsters Inc, and it's correct. I also compared it to two different discs with Dolby cal signals, and all of them measure the same. The AIX test disc measures 10 dB louder, just for comparison.

I think the newest Indiana Jones DVD has it. I will look. So, I will used the internal noise and lower the levels of each speaker (LF, RF C, Sub) to 75 dB. Adjust the surrounds to 75dB. Then I will compare this to a disk with test tones @ 0dB.

That will work. But it's not actually necessary to mess with your cals.

All that matters is the difference between internal noise vs test disc for each channel. If LF reads 83 dB for both, then the levels are the same.

[wer4ccsn]

Well.. I found the bug
Anyone can try it please, just to confirm
I have a Denon Bd3800Bdci and a Xbox360, both results are the same.

First, play music CD on analog source, then switch back to bluray player, then turn off the bluray player, wait for it to completely shutdown, then switch back to CD's analog source. Do you still have sound?
If no, Restart your bluray player, then reswitch your source to Bluray player on your Ssp-800. Sound should get back. Then you'll be able to switch back to CD source again without shutting down your bluray player.

Anyone can test and confirm if the same results occurs?

Thanks

yes, same here having the same problem when i start to switching inputs. No audio at all! to get the audio back I have to restart the ssp-800, very annoying! :x . I have the latest software and dual dsp
Carlos

[Srrndhound]

Well.. I found the bug
Anyone can try it please, just to confirm
I have a Denon Bd3800Bdci and a Xbox360, both results are the same.

First, play music CD on analog source, then switch back to bluray player, then turn off the bluray player, wait for it to completely shutdown, then switch back to CD's analog source. Do you still have sound?
If no, Restart your bluray player, then reswitch your source to Bluray player on your Ssp-800. Sound should get back. Then you'll be able to switch back to CD source again without shutting down your bluray player.

Anyone can test and confirm if the same results occurs?

Not sure if this relates to your symptoms or not, but I received a note from Classe that says they found and fixed a problem related to loss of audio when going into and out of standby with certain HDMI conditions.

yes, same here having the same problem when i start to switching inputs. No audio at all! to get the audio back I have to restart the ssp-800, very annoying! :x . I have the latest software and dual dsp

This sounds the same as the problem I have encountered. Anyway, Classe are plowing thru the problems when they can figure out how to re-create them in their lab. If y'all are able to find some means to trigger the problem, that's good info to pass along.

[rompower]

srrndhound, good to hear that you received this note

[Srrndhound]

srrndhound, good to hear that you received this note

They also sent me a "beta" version of the code--not to say it's final yet, but to check about an HDMI problem I was having. And I finally have PLIIx running for all 5.1 sources. :T They are making good progress.

[wcranston]

I was not aware of the error. I'm using Monsters Inc, and it's correct. I also compared it to two different discs with Dolby cal signals, and all of them measure the same. The AIX test disc measures 10 dB louder, just for comparison.

That will work. But it's not actually necessary to mess with your cals.

All that matters is the difference between internal noise vs test disc for each channel. If LF reads 83 dB for both, then the levels are the same.

I verified that on my unit there is a difference in levels between the internal noise generator and the levels on a disk with Dolby cal signals for the surround channels only. The internal noise generator is 5 dB low for the surrounds.
Sometimes, by going in and out of the internal noise generator or between the internal noise generator and audio from a DVD then back to the internal noise generator, the surrounds will jump by 5 dB. Therefore being correct.
I can actually hear a glitch in the noise signal before this happens.

Emailing back and forth with Tom from Classe and now waiting for him to call me. He believes that it's hardware related.

[Srrndhound]

I verified that on my unit there is a difference in levels between the internal noise generator and the levels on a disk with Dolby cal signals for the surround channels only. The internal noise generator is 5 dB low for the surrounds.
Sometimes, by going in and out of the internal noise generator or between the internal noise generator and audio from a DVD then back to the internal noise generator, the surrounds will jump by 5 dB. Therefore being correct.
I can actually hear a glitch in the noise signal before this happens.

Emailing back and forth with Tom from Classe and now waiting for him to call me. He believes that it's hardware related.

Yes, there's clearly something more going on there if the levels are heard to change like that. Thanks for checking. I hope Tom gets things sorted for you quickly. Let us know what solves it once you know. Loose connector, loose socket, etc.

[AV-OCD]

Just got back my SSP-800 from repair and to have the new DSP installed.

I'm wondering what you all have your sub level set to in comparison to your main channels. Sure seems like there is a big gap in the levels between the two in my system.

I have my L/R's set to -6dB, and the sub at +9dB. That's a 15dB difference.

My main speakers have a sensitivity of 90dB, and the powered sub is a JL F112. Oh and I have the main channels hooked up via XLR and the sub with a standard RCA cable. So I think some of the difference is because the XLR connection is +6dB over the RCA?

[wcranston]

Just got back my SSP-800 from repair and to have the new DSP installed.

I'm wondering what you all have your sub level set to in comparison to your main channels. Sure seems like there is a big gap in the levels between the two in my system.

I have my L/R's set to -6dB, and the sub at +9dB. That's a 15dB difference.

My main speakers have a sensitivity of 90dB, and the powered sub is a JL F112. Oh and I have the main channels hooked up via XLR and the sub with a standard RCA cable. So I think some of the difference is because the XLR connection is +6dB over the RCA?

What is the Master Volume on the JL F112 Sub set to?

[Srrndhound]

I have my L/R's set to -6dB, and the sub at +9dB. That's a 15dB difference.

My main speakers have a sensitivity of 90dB, and the powered sub is a JL F112. Oh and I have the main channels hooked up via XLR and the sub with a standard RCA cable. So I think some of the difference is because the XLR connection is +6dB over the RCA?

If your mains had a sensitivity of 85dB, the trims would be +1-ish, so all that is looking perfectly correct. Since your mains are a bit more sensitive than that, they need some atten.

The overall gain ought to be the same whether you use XLR-XLR or RCA-RCA.

Fathom does not state the sensitivity of the sub for some reason. But as wcranston implies, you can probably tweak out most, if not all of the 15 dB difference by goosing the gain on the F112.

[AV-OCD]

Thanks guys. I've tried both the Reference volume setting on the JL and switching to manual volume on the sub and setting it to max. The reference setting is the louder of the two which puts me at the 15 dB difference.

[Srrndhound]

Thanks guys. I've tried both the Reference volume setting on the JL and switching to manual volume on the sub and setting it to max. The reference setting is the louder of the two which puts me at the 15 dB difference.

Something doesn't seem right. The JL website says:

>>Reference (fixed gain) or Variable from full mute to +15dB over reference gain<<

Which suggests you ought to get a lot more gas when using Variable set at Max.