Classe Warranty

[beden1]

Yes, I owned the D2 for about a week and it seemed to be a bit sharp sounding. Sibilance seemed to be highlighted a bit. But keep in mind that I find the differences in sound quality between most front-end gear to be very slight and only meaningful to those that have been in the hobby long enough to start searching for that last 10% improvement. So unless you had the D2 next to the Classe, you may not even know what you are missing.

What do you currently own in the way of a front end and speakers?

Current FL set-up: Classe' CP-500; Classe' CAM-350 (pair) for B&W 803D front L/R (bi-wire); Classe' CAV-150 for B&W HTM2D center and B&W 703 surrounds (bi-amp); Sony SCD-XA9000ES; Panasonic DMP-BD10 Blu-Ray; Sony KDL-46XBR3; and Velodyne SC-1250 and twin SC-15" subs.

I have been using a Pioneer Elite 82TXS as my pre-pro until I decide on a new SSP.

I've been an enthusiast since 1968 when I was in 9th grade.

[AV-OCD]

Current FL set-up: Classe' CP-500; Classe' CAM-350 (pair) for B&W 803D front L/R (bi-wire); Classe' CAV-150 for B&W HTM2D center and B&W 703 surrounds (bi-amp); Sony SCD-XA9000ES; Panasonic DMP-BD10 Blu-Ray; Sony KDL-46XBR3; and Velodyne SC-1250 and twin SC-15" subs.

I have been using a Pioneer Elite 82TXS as my pre-pro until I decide on a new SSP.

I've been an enthusiast since 1968 when I was in 9th grade.

Well you certainly qualify for the type that would appreciate the relatively small differences between prepros. I know you are a little sore right now from the recent repair mishap, but don't rule out the SSP-800 for that. At least give it a listen. I think you will like what it does. It has turned this 40 year old cynic into a believer.

[wettou]

Well you certainly qualify for the type that would appreciate the relatively small differences between prepros. I know you are a little sore right now from the recent repair mishap, but don't rule out the SSP-800 for that. At least give it a listen. I think you will like what it does. It has turned this 40 year old cynic into a believer.

Sim Audio, Meridian, Linn, Mark Levinson, Halcro all outstanding but a lot more money!

[sikoniko]

In my experience there are components / speakers that mighlight flaws in recordings and limit you to listening to only the best of the best. The SSP-800 does not do that for me. Even though the presentation of the SSP-800 is transparent and detailed, I still find all of my standard issue CDs quite a pleasure to listen to. It does not gloss over poor recordings, but it also does not make matters worse. Just my two cents.

OK, allow me to clarify. It isn't that your CD's will sound unlistenable, it is more that your better mastered CD's and SACD/DVD-A will end up getting more play time because you can truely appreciate the extra quality in recording, production and mixing.

[Nolan B]

Or maybe he is too busy listening to spend much time writing...

I think the biggest complaint you will get about the SSP-800 is that your poorly recorded CDs will sound poor, :T

can you elaborate on this a little more based one what you are hearing? I have ripped all my CDs using apple lossless.

[AV-OCD]

can you elaborate on this a little more based one what you are hearing? I have ripped all my CDs using apple lossless.

Not to worry. I rip all of my music in Apple Lossless and use these files to create compilation CD's for speaker auditioning. I have played these through the SSP-800 and they sound great.

Some original recordings are just crap to begin with-- overly compressed, bad EQing, sibilant, bright, etc. The SSP-800 will not make these sound any better, but it won't make them sound any worse either. It will just show them for what they are.

[sikoniko]

Not to worry. I rip all of my music in Apple Lossless and use these files to create compilation CD's for speaker auditioning. I have played these through the SSP-800 and they sound great.

Some original recordings are just crap to begin with-- overly compressed, bad EQing, sibilant, bright, etc. The SSP-800 will not make these sound any better, but it won't make them sound any worse either. It will just show them for what they are.

I agree completely with this, except I have no experience with the apple stuff. You will be hard pressed to find a player worth the extra expense that will outperform the SSP and a good transport. Classe has set a new bar, which will be fun to watch others try beat.

[beden1]

Share Your Classe Reliability Issues

The thing is, I'm concerned about the actual quality control and design/build of Classe products. For example, I have four Classe pieces, and two have needed service. My CP-500 needed servicing now twice, as I learned that the previous owner also sent it in.

As for the SSP-800, we have read about three incidents on this forum so far.

I've had a number of systems over the years including components from vintage Dynaco, vintage Harmon Kardon, vintage Luxman, vintage Marantz, McIntosh, Nackamichi, Pioneer Elite, vintage Rotel, Sony ES, and Yamaha, etc., and, Ive not had any problems with them except the Luxman volume control started to oxidize and caused static when adjusted.

I'm wondering if others have had to send their components into Classe for service? I'm also wondering what the turn-around has been for service, and were the issues solved during the first service?

To start it off, I sent my pre-amp in for a trigger issue (not solved and out for service for 8+ weeks), and sent my amp in for a strange sound through the speakers while powering off (not solved, and out for service for 8 weeks, and also now back in for service again to get it right) and the amp was also damaged in transport.

Thanks.

[wettou]

Reliability with Classé

Reliability:

When I purchased my 802D, I chose Classé for three reasons first is the synergy with B&W 800 speakers and the sound they produce together. Second the really cool industrial design, I was tire of black boxes, and the third what I had heard about Classé great customer service and the five year warranty.

When I bought my Classé CA-5200, I went through the recommended break in period, after a few weeks I started hearing very weird noises coming out of the amp!! I called the dealer, and he said he didn't know why this would happen but it should go away and not to worry about it.

So I called Classé and explained the problem to them. I explained what was happening but more importantly, I told them that I was very unhappy as this was a brand new product, and it should work flawlessly. After a couple of phone calls Classé Decided to send me a brand new amp as they said the unit could be defective. So for now my experience with them is good except that I had a defective product at the start, not a very good first impression. But I have had the CA-5200 beast for six months now and so far it is working well except that it get very hot.

I have had Integra Research, Parasound, Onkyo, Yamaha, Sony ES, Denon products in the past and Classé is my first adventure in the true highend world. I have never had any problems with any of this brands except for the Denon that I exchanged for the Sony ES. By the way my Integra Research, Sony ES and Parasound systems all have worked flawlessy, never had a down time are used everyday and they are 7, 11 and 10 years old.

Let's hope that Classé will work like that? It is interesting one thing I learned from my dealer was that for a few years they stopped carrying Classé because of huge reliability issues and poor customer service but that when B&W started investing and owning Classé that quality improved as well as customer service. Money and good management helps.:T

[beden1]

Reliability:

When I bought my Classé CA-5200, I went through the recommended break in period, after a few weeks I started hearing very weird noises coming out of the amp!! I called the dealer, and he said he didn't know why this would happen but it should go away and not to worry about it.

So I called Classé and explained the problem to them. I explained what was happening but more importantly, I told them that I was very unhappy as this was a brand new product, and it should work flawlessly. After a couple of phone calls Classé Decided to send me a brand new amp as they said the unit could be defective. So for now my experience with them is good except that I had a defective product at the start, not a very good first impression. But I have had the CA-5200 beast for six months now and so far it is working well except that it get very hot.

Let's hope that Classé will work like that? It is interesting one thing I learned from my dealer was that for a few years they stopped carrying Classé because of huge reliability issues and poor customer service but that when B&W started investing and owning Classé that quality improved as well as customer service. Money and good management helps.:T

I wonder where your CA-5200 went that was swapped for a replacement? I've never seen any Classe remanufactured products offered, has anyone else? Do they fix the unit and then sell it to someone else as new?

[mitch57]

Plus, it's made in the USA! :T

No, it's not made in the USA. It's made in North America. Specifically, it's made in Canada.

[wettou]

I wonder where your CA-5200 went that was swapped for a replacement? I've never seen any Classe re manufactured products offered, has anyone else? Do they fix the unit and then sell it to someone else as new?

That is a good question, they probably took it back in Canada figured out what was wrong repackaged it and sold it again ?

[hifiguymi]

That is a good question, they probably took it back in Canada figured out what was wrong repackaged it and sold it again ?

That doesn't happen. Classe doesn't sell any B stock product at all. Both B&W and Rotel do but not Classe. They use them at the factory or tear them down as far as I know.

Eric

[beden1]

That doesn't happen. Classe doesn't sell any B stock product at all. Both B&W and Rotel do but not Classe. They use them at the factory or tear them down as far as I know.

Eric

"as far as I know"

Using them at the factory or tearing them down would not make much financial sense.

[beden1]

That doesn't happen. Classe doesn't sell any B stock product at all. Both B&W and Rotel do but not Classe. They use them at the factory or tear them down as far as I know.

Eric

Where does B&W sell the B Stock? How would one buy these products?

[hifiguymi]

Where does B&W sell the B Stock? How would one buy these products?

Ask your dealer. It's real hit and miss on what they have however, (sometimes it's just a single speaker, that sort of thing) so you might not find what you want. Sometimes there are minor cosmetic flaws and that is luck of the draw. The box states that it's a B stock unit and they all come with full warranty.

Eric

[hifiguymi]

"as far as I know"

Using them at the factory or tearing them down would not make much financial sense.

As I mentioned, B&W and Rotel have B stock available. Sales staffs of their dealers can purchase the B stock, as well as their customers, at a slight discount. Classe doesn't do that at all for anybody. I know Classe doesn't have a stack of defective product in the corner of their factory and they don't resell it as new. They have to do something with it.

Eric

[wettou]

As I mentioned, B&W and Rotel have B stock available. Sales staffs of their dealers can purchase the B stock, as well as their customers, at a slight discount. Classe doesn't do that at all for anybody. I know Classe doesn't have a stack of defective product in the corner of their factory and they don't resell it as new. They have to do something with it.

Eric

Classé probably sells them to dealers as demos!

[hifiguymi]

Classé probably sells them to dealers as demos!

No, they don't. They don't sell any B stock at all.

Eric

[wettou]

No, they don't. They don't sell any B stock at all.

Eric

So do they recycle them? Take them apart and reuse the pieces?

[hifiguymi]

So do they recycle them? Take them apart and reuse the pieces?

As I stated in an earlier post I believe that is what they do, yes.

Eric

[beden1]

Well, it turns out that I'm not dim witted like I was starting to think I was, after trying to get my CAM-350's to trigger through my CP-500.

Back in June, I had a number of back and forths with a very nice service rep at Classe, who was getting to the point (I sensed) of total frustration when trying to explain to me how it's done. In the end, he had me send the CP-500 to Classe for service, and to check it out.

I got the unit back and it still does not work. On the advice of another, I also changed the mono wires used for triggering between two devices, and still nothing.

I decided to call the service rep at Classe today, and he starts apologizing profusely. It turns out that there is a compatibility issue with the CAM series and their Omega Series amps (pretty much the same architecture - their words not mine), and between the Delta Series. He now tells me that there are quite a number of people facing my same issue.

He did promise to find a solution, but at least I'm happy it's not me who is nuts.

[wettou]

Well, it turns out that I'm not dim witted like I was starting to think I was, after trying to get my CAM-350's to trigger through my CP-500. Back in June, I had a number of back and forths with a very nice service rep at Classe, who was getting to the point (I sensed) of total frustration when trying to explain to me how it's done. In the end, he had me send the CP-500 to Classe for service, and to check it out. I got the unit back and it still does not work. On the advice of another, I also changed the mono wires used for triggering between two devices, and still nothing.

I decided to call the service rep at Classe today, and he starts apologizing profusely. It turns out that there is a compatibility issue with the CAM series and their Omega Series amps (pretty much the same architecture - their words not mine), and between the Delta Series. He now tells me that there are quite a number of people facing my same issue.

He did promise to find a solution, but at least I'm happy it's not me who is nuts.

Maybe there is a happy ending?

[beden1]

Maybe there is a happy ending?

Only if they can come up with a solution.

[beden1]

I received my CAV-150 back from Classe via UPS this Wednesday. The box looked liked it was dropped again as one of the corners was crushed. Fortunately however, Classe packed it properly this time and there is no apparent damage to the amp itself.

They did a super job of repairing the previous shipping damage. The complete rear panel and handles were replaced with new. They must have replacement parts for legacy units.

I received it about an hour before starting my drive north, so all I was able to do was hook the speakers up to test if the signals were clear on each channel. So far so good . . . with no hisses or unusual noises like before. Each channel sounded clear as a bell.

Hopefully this ends my saga. :T

[wettou]

They did a super job of repairing the previous shipping damage. The complete rear panel and handles were replaced with new. They must have replacement parts for legacy units.

I received it about an hour before starting my drive north, so all I was able to do was hook the speakers up to test if the signals were clear on each channel. So far so good . . . with no hisses or unusual noises like before. Each channel sounded clear as a bell. Hopefully this ends my saga. :T

You see a bit of faith in Classé help, hope it all works great and then your can get the SSP-800 :T

[beden1]

I decided to call the service rep at Classe today, and he starts apologizing profusely. It turns out that there is a compatibility issue with the CAM series and their Omega Series amps (pretty much the same architecture - their words not mine), and between the Delta Series. He now tells me that there are quite a number of people facing my same issue.

He did promise to find a solution, but at least I'm happy it's not me who is nuts.

There is no solution to this issue according to Classe. There is no capatability with triggering between their legacy products and current Delta Series. No real explanation or solutions offered, other than to possibly use a universal remote to enter the codes and trigger the amps. This includes their Omega Series amps, which was said to make their top line customers less than happy as well, when considering their new SSP-800 for example.

I spoke with a dealer about this issue, and his only explanation is that Classe went through three complete management changes, and each with their own designs and approaches. Another I spoke with at length, and who has been the owner of a high line specialty dealer since the 1970's, said that even through the changes in management, their main architectures for amps have changed little as it would be too expensive for them to work off of a clean sheet of paper. He also supported my impression that any advances in the design of amplifiers have been more cosmetic and small features based (like CANBUS) than performance/operational . . . and making their legacy products a true bargain.

It's a shame they didn't keep compatibility issues in mind, at least for simple triggering features.

[Glen B]

Another I spoke with at length, and who has been the owner of a high line specialty dealer since the 1970's, said that even through the changes in management, their main architectures for amps have changed little

:T I would tend to agree with that assessment and have hinted along those lines previously, based on what I've seen.

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