Dipoles- Stryke AV12 woofers

[Lazz]

Hi guys just wondering if anyone has built a pair of open baffle dipoles using the Stryke AV12 woofers and how do they sound/ compare with the alternatives (DPL12, XLS12,TC2+,ETC) ?

[ThomasW]

Oops sorry I missed this question.....

To date I haven't seen any AV series Stryke drivers used in dipole apps.

[JonMarsh]

Be careful interpreting the specs. It's not clear if a series or parallel configuration is used for the voice coils, so the sensitivity figure is a little suspect; almost 88 dB from a 23 mm Xmax woofer would be VERY unusual; for example, my BPD1203's, which are 24 mm Xmax, are rather low sensitivity; they were also built by TC Sounds, and they have a much larger magnet than the AV 12's. The basket design is a good one for dipoles, so especially if you're going with active crossovers and have some power to burn, this might be one to consider. Especially at the pre-order price.

If you get them and try them out, let us know what you think.

In a purchase of a specialty product like this, there are many factors to consider, including price, performance, availability, and delivery. I've been very happy with all aspects of the TC2 purchase experience to date...
I've got too many boxes of woofers sitting in my garage as it is to get everyone that seems like it may be in the ballpark... someday have to have a garage sale!

~Jon

[Lazz]

Lazz

Jon have you had a chance to compare the sound quality of the TC2 with Thomas's DPL12's yet?,what difference's can you hear between the bass.

[JonMarsh]

Haven't had a chance to "listen" with music yet; measured distortion below 100 Hz is pretty close, slight edge to the TC2+. The "top end" on the TC2+ goes much higher; they may be usable up to 400 Hz or a bit more, as major modes don't kick in until above 800 Hz.

I'm considering using the TC2+ with my RD50 ribbons, crossover in the 400-500 Hz region; wouldn't dream of that with the DPL12's. The only challenge for the TC2+ will be whether they are "quiet" enogh with high level LF program; with a sine wave at high power free air, they seem OK. No pole piece whistle or the like.

~Jon

[JonMarsh]

Doing some swept tone testing, I can report that in spite of not using the edge spoke basket, these are very "quiet" at high excursions, and so far they're the only driver I've found in this sensitivity range and Xmax that can match or beat the DPL12's. They also go higher and cleaner...

Up till now, the DPL12 has been the distortion champ below 100 Hz, and it's still very close; these two seem to be clear leaders, unless you want to get into something with 24 mm Xmax or more, and much lower sensitivity.

Very nice balance of performance.


~Jon

[Davey]

Jon/Thomas,

Did you do any further evaluation of the SCC300 woofers for possible dipole usage? It looks as though the DPL12 would still be the preferred choice (I'm still using those in my H-baffle setup and they work great,) but I'm going to build another set of those for a friend to mate with Magnepan MMG's and I'm wondering (since the price is comparable) if I should use the SCC300 or TC2+ instead.

I'm not that familiar with the TC2+, but I did get to take a look at Al's SCC300 woofers the other day. As you've noted, the pole vent is much smaller than the DPL12, but I also noticed that the perforated screen behind the spider has been removed...for what that's worth.

You note that the TC2+ woofer goes considerably higher than the DPL12, but there would be IM distortion issues used in a dipole configuration would there not?

Anyway, if you guys don't mind I'm going to start hanging around here quite a bit more. Most of the other forums have turned into circuses (three-ring at MAD.) I can't even decipher who's bad-mouthing who anymore.

Cheers,

Davey.

[ThomasW]

If you look at the Arvo Pärt MkIII "Heavy Metal" Testing... thread you questions will be answered .... :wink:

[Davey]

If you look at the Arvo Pärt MkIII "Heavy Metal" Testing... thread you questions will be answered .... :wink:

Ouch. I didn't check recently, but will re-read it. Thanks.

Davey.

[JonMarsh]

Jon/Thomas,

Did you do any further evaluation of the SCC300 woofers for possible dipole usage? It looks as though the DPL12 would still be the preferred choice (I'm still using those in my H-baffle setup and they work great,) but I'm going to build another set of those for a friend to mate with Magnepan MMG's and I'm wondering (since the price is comparable) if I should use the SCC300 or TC2+ instead.

I'm not that familiar with the TC2+, but I did get to take a look at Al's SCC300 woofers the other day. As you've noted, the pole vent is much smaller than the DPL12, but I also noticed that the perforated screen behind the spider has been removed...for what that's worth.

You note that the TC2+ woofer goes considerably higher than the DPL12, but there would be IM distortion issues used in a dipole configuration would there not?

Anyway, if you guys don't mind I'm going to start hanging around here quite a bit more. Most of the other forums have turned into circuses (three-ring at MAD.) I can't even decipher who's bad-mouthing who anymore.

Cheers,

Davey.

I don't have the SCC300's any more for comparisons; I gave mine to Al. I've been listening to one of the Arvo's with TC2+ for about two weeks, now; I've been swamped with "work" work, spent almost all Labor Day weekend working on a magazine article, so progress isn't proceeding as quick as I'd like, though I have finished up the design basics for both a passive line level equalizer and a buffrered active version; need to layou the PCB's for the latter.

I like what I'm hearing so far with the TC2+. Other testers, who have rated the DPL12 tops in the past, find the TC2+ measures a little better, regarding distortion below 100 Hz, is cleaner above 100 hz, and is just as quiet in dipole mode. SO, for me, once I get done testing, this will probably be the "final" choice. Level's appear close enough matched that the system will work out with full passive crossover.

As it is, I'm really enjoying my one Arvo; voice, piano, and percussion reproduction is just amazing; the transparency and detail of headphones; femail voices especially, and Hammon organs, have a timbral richness and clarity lacking in many systems. I'm pretty convinced that a lot of the "magic" of old electrostatic speakers was not the panels per se, but the dipole system behavior. Just my 0.02.

BTW, this post is brought to you via my wireless connection at the Intel Developer's Forum, where we're exhibiting this week, in San Francisco.

I'd hoped to have the Arvo's ready for the No. CA DIY, but it just hasn't been possible to put the time into them because of work, and I don't want to rush things or do shoddy work. I did finish a new panel assembly, with a different construction technique; this one is also suitable for the RD50 + woofers dipole I'll be building next. Hopefully next weekend I can find some time for a little more progress. I'm traveling on business all the rest of September, and expect to be in Singapore in early October, so things are a bit hectic right now!

~Jon