"Blown" tweeter help/opinions needed

[whoaru99]

Noticed one of my Paradigm Studio 100v2 speakers wasn't sounding quite right and found this (attached picture) on closer inspection.

Contacted Paradigm and their opinion was that the failure resulted from overdriving the speaker. Well, the tweeter still plays and the voice coil is not discolored/burnt. I am certain that nobody has poked/prodded this dome. Besides, the damaged area is almost completely shielded by the tweeter's dispersion ring and that is in no way damaged/pushed in.

The tweeter in the other speaker looks just fine.

Of course, I'm curious about opinions on the overdriving statement by Paradigm, but also I need advice about replacement diaphragm.

Paradigm wants $60 for the diaphragm, but I found this on the Madisound website for ~$16. It appears virtually identical and the description seems to match the physical characteristics of the tweeter - except the appearance as a whole. 1" aluminum dome, VC diameter is 25mm, nominal impedance is listed as 6 ohm, I measure 5.7, and it says the tweeter is chambered as the Paradigm also seems to be.

So, for less that the price of one from Paradigm, I can order two from Madisound just in case of some slight differences they'd at least be matched.

Should I go with an OEM replacement from Paradigm, or get the Vifa diaphragms from Madisound?

[Rick Craig]

Noticed one of my Paradigm Studio 100v2 speakers wasn't sounding quite right and found this (attached picture) on closer inspection.

Contacted Paradigm and their opinion was that the failure resulted from overdriving the speaker. Well, the tweeter still plays and the voice coil is not discolored/burnt. I am certain that nobody has poked/prodded this dome. Besides, the damaged area is almost completely shielded by the tweeter's dispersion ring and that is in no way damaged/pushed in.

The tweeter in the other speaker looks just fine.

Of course, I'm curious about opinions on the overdriving statement by Paradigm, but also I need advice about replacement diaphragm.

Paradigm wants $60 for the diaphragm, but I found this on the Madisound website for ~$16. It appears virtually identical and the description seems to match the physical characteristics of the tweeter - except the appearance as a whole. 1" aluminum dome, VC diameter is 25mm, nominal impedance is listed as 6 ohm, I measure 5.7, and it says the tweeter is chambered as the Paradigm also seems to be.

So, for less that the price of one from Paradigm, I can order two from Madisound just in case of some slight differences they'd at least be matched.

Should I go with an OEM replacement from Paradigm, or get the Vifa diaphragms from Madisound?

Not sure about that damage being from too much power; however, the Madisound Vifa dome is an exact replacement.

[Pibborando]

Funny how such a nice and expensive speaker ($2,200 originally right?) uses such a cheap tweeter. I ordered a replacement tweeter for my Energy C-9s (from Energy) which cost $50, shipped. The RS Dayton tweeters probably sound better...

Well, that's why I want to DIY my next pair!

[fjhuerta]

I now shudder to think how much Monitor Audio will want for a pair of their (ultra cheap looking) "Gold" tweeters...

[whoaru99]

Not sure about that damage being from too much power; however, the Madisound Vifa dome is an exact replacement.

Rick, thanks.

The tweeters are branded as Paradigm and I cannot find any other identifying marks on them saying Vifa.

However, the parts just look too similar, seem to physically measure so similarly, and considering your opinion, I'm going to order them from Madisound.

Worst case is I end up spending ~$92 (parts from Madisound and Paradigm), vs. $60 (Paradigm part only). I accept the risk...

[Chris7]

Funny how such a nice and expensive speaker ($2,200 originally right?) uses such a cheap tweeter.

That's always the way things are.

[whoaru99]

That's always the way things are.

Yeah, I saw a poster in an insurance office one time that had some car parts broken down by estimated OEM cost and by service parts pricing.

The gist was about the high cost of auto repairs to insurance companies. If you paid service parts price for every bit on the car, it would cost like $300,000 vs the sticker price of $25,000. Something to that effect, anyway.

BTW, Madisound says I may have the parts by week's end so I'll soon enough know on no uncertain terms if they fit.

[whoaru99]

Well, got the parts.

Physically they seem the same size, electrically the voice coils have the same DCR.

However, there seems to be some difference in the surround material and the polish of the dome. Not too concerned about the dome polish, but what do y'all think about the surround being different - with respect to performance as a replacement part?

In the picture, Paradigm original is on the left, Vifa replacement is on the right.

[SQdude]

I'd say pop it in and give it a listen, if you can't hear a difference then its all good

[whoaru99]

I did put it in, and ran a REQW sweep on the pair of speakers. Worst case they were ~1dB difference.

The test was by no means a serious undertaking, I'm glad they came in remarkably close, IMO. About the only "held" dimension was the distance from the speaker to the mic - VIA tape measure. Probably +/- 0.5 inch. The rest was by eyeball.

Speaker with Vifa-branded diaphragm in red, Paradigm original diaphragm in green.

[Nathan P]

looks like Paradigm had Vifa make them those when the speakers first came out, and Vifa just decided later on to change the surround material on their own version. Looks close enough to save $60!

[Raptor550]

I'm really glad I stumbled on this thread. I'm trying to convince a friend to do DIY, hes looking at Paradigm. Paradigm dosnt seem like a bad deal but at any price level I think he could build a better speaker with one of the projects on this site.

I have read threds stating that paradigm makes all their drivers in house? Anyone know, is the Vifa a clone? Vice versa? Or did paradigm just buy Vifa, put on there own coating and a sticker and call it theirs?
I'm curious of what the other drivers are.

[whoaru99]

I thought I read that Paradigms from sometime in the 90's and forward have drivers built in-house.

That, IMO, doesn't necessarily mean they manufacture every component of every driver. It's very common for manufacturers to use other companies parts in a larger assembly and put their label on it. Sometimes there are tweaks to that part, sometimes it's 100% the same just with a different label on it.

[Chris7]

Paradigm does some in-house manufacturing, but the majority of their drivers are farmed out. Take what you read on their site with a grain of salt. For instance, they claim their cabinets are made of "acoustically inert high-density hardboard reinforced by strategically located radial braces." That may be true of *some* of their speakers, but it's easy enough to search around and find pics of the inside of some of their speakers where there is no bracing at all.

That's not to say they're bad speakers, far from it! Paradigm designs are based on measurements, unlike some other "audiophile" brands.

[ThomasW]

If they'll sell you a replacement diaphragm that's all you need.

[biggietx]

If they'll sell you a replacement diaphragm that's all you need.

that is $70 plus shipping... i am looking for a lower cost solution today due to monetary constraints.

[ThomasW]

http://www.madisound.com/catalog/index.php?manufacturers_id=153

[biggietx]

How can i determine which model will fit my speakers?

Image not available

Vifa Replacement Voice Coil Assembly for D19AD05

Image not available

Vifa Replacement Voice Coil Assembly for D25AG35

[Mudjock]

The D19 is a 19 mm (about 3/4 inch) dome. The D25 is a 25 mm (about 1 inch) dome. Physically measuring yours should tell you which one you need.

[Dennis H]

The difference is the diameter of the voice coil and dome -- approx. 19 or 25 mm.

Edit: Mudjock beat me to it.

[biggietx]

ordered today....thanks for the help guys.