First post, & I'm inspired....

[w8liftr]

I was about to pull the trigger on a PB12+/2, but have decided to go the DIY route after a lot of reading this week on various threads here. I want to build 2 sonosubs with the SS RL-p dual 4 ohm modeled after chasw98, and hopefully some input from you all. I look forward to posting here and learning as much a I can from you. Thanks ahead of time, Tommy

[chasw98]

If you have any questions, I will be glad to answer them to the best of my ability. You do realize that 2 of them are pretty imposing in an ordinary room I am still trying to get my wife to let me put a second one in.

Chuck

[DarrenE]

I just finished my first sub last night. I was a complete newbie to DIY so it is possible. You should be able to easily surpass the performance of the SVS. I am surpassing the performance of my 25-31 PC+ and I built a sealed sub so you should be able to destroy it with a ported sub. :T

[ssabripo]

2 sonosubs against a PB12+/2 ?? LMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! One of those sonotubes will put it to shame!

I've been to Chuck's house plenty a times, and it is awesome...almost as awesome as mine..hehe. You will be trilled with one, and two will put a Ultra/2 to shame. My AV15 box and the RP-L15 sono's are somewhere between the Ultra and Ultra/2 in performance, so 2 of them will be a sight to behold.

good luck and enjoy the journey!!

[SteveCallas]

I also had my sights on the Plus/2 early on, but boy am I glad I stumbled upon a few inspirational diy projects a couple of years ago.

[ssabripo]

I also had my sights on the Plus/2 early on, but boy am I glad I stumbled upon a few inspirational diy projects a couple of years ago.

don't let the "crew" over at avs and audioholics know... :rofl:

[---k---]

You do realize that 2 of them are pretty imposing in an ordinary room I am still trying to get my wife to let me put a second one in.

Chuck

I want to echo this. I recently saw Doc Holliday's ported RL-p15 sub, and it was much bigger than I expected. I beleive that it is similar in size to Chuck's.

1 will probably do you well, but if you must do 2, know what you are getting yourself into.

Have fun.

[SteveCallas]

don't let the "crew" over at avs and audioholics know...

Two years ago, it honestly didn't have any real competition (commercial) at that price point.

As for the size, if you use 20" diameter tube like chasw did, keeping the footprint small and using height to get your volume, two of them shouldn't be bad at all. It looks very manageable in this shot:

Image not available

Great looking setup by the way Chuck :T

[chasw98]

Two years ago, it honestly didn't have any real competition (commercial) at that price point.

As for the size, if you use 20" diameter tube like chasw did, keeping the footprint small and using height to get your volume, two of them shouldn't be bad at all. It looks very managable in this shot:

Great looking setup by the way Chuck :T

Thanks, Steve :T The part you don't see is the opening to the hallway on the right where #2 should go. I believe I can barely squeeze it in if I can get approval from the commandant of the compound. With it sitting in the corner like it is, after a while it just kind of goes away and you don't notice it there, unless it responds with nice smooth deep bass! The family watched Munich last night and there were some explosions at different points in the movie that had things moving in the house as well as 2 boys, a wife, and myself jumping occassionally. Good movie, BTW.

[---k---]

You know, Chuck's doesn't look that bad. Mark's seemed much larger to me in person. But his is 24" Dia x 43" tall.

Not trying to talk anyone out of it, just the opposite. But, I just want to make sure everyone knows what they are getting themselves into.

[w8liftr]

Thanks for the replies. I know what I'm getting into with two. I'm preparing for my dedicated HT when I build my new home. I ordered my sonotube today (they were out of 20"). A 12' section was only $74 so if I'm building, make two and never look back!!

[w8liftr]

Now to decide if I want to copy chasw98 or go with Steve's suggestion in the "ridicubass" thread. I'll be using the Behringer EP2500 for my amp.

Steve, didn't you suggest the dual 4ohm for ported enclosures?

[ssabripo]

Now to decide if I want to copy chasw98 or go with Steve's suggestion in the "ridicubass" thread. I'll be using the Behringer EP2500 for my amp.

just to confuse you more, you could try a vented box as well if you wanted....Steve nn has a monster dual driver with a 10" port, and I have a single driver with a 6" port.

decisions decisions decisions :T

[w8liftr]

I really thought about using a box, since I work with mdf everyday, I could knock a couple out in a day. I still might build one just for comparison, but I thought the tubes would be different.

[KeithM]

Sorry to get OT, but where can you buy a rl-p15? when googled it, I just found threads on building one.

[SteveCallas]

Now to decide if I want to copy chasw98 or go with Steve's suggestion in the "ridicubass" thread. I'll be using the Behringer EP2500 for my amp.

Steve, didn't you suggest the dual 4ohm for ported enclosures?

Recently, LMS at AVS has stated that there is something in the modeling software that doesn't allow the RLp15 to be modeled correctly in reference to the lack of linearity of the FR. He said it has something to do with how the Bl is interpreted, and that the true anechoic FR should be much flatter. If we are to take his word, and I believe him, then the differences between the dual 4ohm and dual 2ohm drivers become much smaller. For a single sub, the dual 4ohm models with a flatter FR and a little more output, while the dual 2ohm extends a bit lower.....if such an issue exists though, in reality, they would both model much more similarly, and the main issue for consideration would be which is more convenient for your amplifier. In most cases, this would be the dual 2ohm, as you can wire it in series to get a 4ohm load and power two subs from one amp.

[DarrenE]

Sorry to get OT, but where can you buy a rl-p15? when googled it, I just found threads on building one.

At www.soundsplinter.com

The direct link to the Premium driver page is here.

[w8liftr]

The RL-p15's are out of stock. I sent an e-mail for availability.

[derekbannatyne]

https://web.archive.org/web/20061023003023/http://www.acoustic-visions.com/~acoustic/products/subwoofer_drivers/SSRL-p/

Try there.

[dyazdani]

The RL-p15's are out of stock. I sent an e-mail for availability.

I got a note from Mike the other day, parts for the RL-p15s should be in in the next week or so.

[w8liftr]

I got a note from Mike the other day, parts for the RL-p15s should be in in the next week or so.

Thanks

[w8liftr]

https://web.archive.org/web/20061023...rivers/SSRL-p/

Try there.

Thanks for the link, they are available there, but I get a discount for multiple drivers buying direct.

[w8liftr]

I got an e-mail from Mike @ SS, the drivers will be available by the end of next week.

[chasw98]

OK, you are on your way. Good luck.

[w8liftr]

OK, you are on your way. Good luck.

I'll start a design/construction thread so I can get some advice and ask questions.

[steve nn]

I'll start a design/construction thread so I can get some advice and ask questions

Or you could just keep this one going? The longer a Thread is up on the boards the more it gets noticed and subsequently more help.

Your project to be looks quite interesting and I'm sure your going to be most impressed. As far as comparing two sono's to the /2, it's a no brainer, but a guy needs to remember that dual PB12-Ultra's will surpass the /2. The /2 is a compromise considering the enclosure doesn't increase in size proportionately to the driver increase, along with being higher tuned. With that being said.. it cant compete because of shipping purposes.

What your going to experience is that you will be able to build your own DIY option using the RL-p coming in with a lower tune and still be able to meet or exceed the performance of other subs mentioned with a higher tune in the higher FR...as the FR gets lower the RL-p will move even farther ahead. If you built a 25 Hz tuned RL-p option, God only knows what it would be able to achieve in the 30 to 50ish range? All this comes at a cost though, not necessarily $$ of course, because this is DIY, but in the fact that it'll take some work on your part. Going the sono option will require the least amount of work (in some ways) from what I hear. I like to cut wood, but admittedly I'll get around to doing a sono some time so I can have the experience. Building a sub doesn't take long at all, it's the finish process that can take the time and prepping the unit so it all comes out as clean as possible.

Looking forward to you sharing your impressions and experience.

Steve nn

[---k---]

Or you could just keep this one going? The longer a Thread is up on the boards the more it gets noticed and subsequently more help.

Yeah, no need to clutter things up with additional threads. You got our attention here.

Welcome to the RL-P15 club.

[w8liftr]

OK, then this is my design/build thread. I'm really looking forward to getting started on this project.

[w8liftr]

I was thinking of going this route that Steve posted in the ridicubass thread

This may be too big for you, I don't know, but a 20" diameter tube that is 64" tall will result in just about 300 liters after you subtract the driver, port, and end cap volume. A 7" diameter port that is 30" long results in ~16.6hz tune with a first port resonance at 225hz - feed it with 1000 watts and you are very solid. You may or may not need a high pass filter - chasw's is tuned a bit higher and he reported no problems playing loud without one, but I don't know if that is a risk you want to take.

[SteveCallas]

Well the problem there is that I don't think they make 7" diameter sonotube or PVC. I've since refined that design a bit to ~260 effective liters with a 6" diameter port that is 28" long for ~16.2hz tune. If you use a flare at the top, you can use 27" of length, or just accept the slightly lower tune (16hz), a miniscule difference either way. And the 750 watts from a Behringer ep2500 will suffice.

[w8liftr]

Well the problem there is that I don't think they make 7" diameter sonotube or PVC. I've since refined that design a bit to ~260 effective liters with a 6" diameter port that is 28" long for ~16.2hz tune. If you use a flare at the top, you can use 27" of length, or just accept the slightly lower tune (16hz), a miniscule difference either way. And the 750 watts from a Behringer ep2500 will suffice.

What length are we at for ~260l after subtracting internal volume for woofer, port, etc.? Is this what we need for optimal output for the sub with the EP2500?

[SteveCallas]

Using a 20" diameter tube, and taking end caps, driver, and port into consideration, this puts you at roughly 56" of tube height. Add legs, end caps, and a base plate, and the finished product should be just over 5' tall.

[Hdale85]

I'm kind of concidering doing that sonotube with the 10" port lol that thing just looks sweet....not sure if i could scale it down though shorter at least. What do you guys use to design sonotubes?

[w8liftr]

Thanks, I should be picking up my tube in the next couple of days. The supply company told me the first of the week. Two 56" tubes it is!!

[SteveCallas]

What do you guys use to design sonotubes?

Not sure what you are asking?

w8liftr, will you be using 3 layers of MDF for the bottom cap (2 inside) and 2 for the top cap, or how were you planning on doing it? One thing I would suggest is using the spare circle from the driver cuout to create a smaller ring that can be used as an extra layer for supporting the port on the top cap - this way you aren't taking up as much volume.

[w8liftr]

Yeah, I was planning on using 3 layers for the bottom and two for the top. I like the idea of using a smaller piece for supporting the port tube. I was going to ask about using fiberglass for supporting the port. I used to build boxes for car audio and would glass them inside and out for strength.

[Hdale85]

I'm asking what do you use to figure the volume of the tubes? What dimensions you need and what not?

[Dotay]

I'm asking what do you use to figure the volume of the tubes? What dimensions you need and what not?

Height of the tube X internal tube diameter (or twice the radius) X PI (3.14) = Volume

Or just use an online calculator. :T

http://www.csgnetwork.com/volumecalc.html

[SteveCallas]

Height of the tube X internal tube diameter (or twice the radius) X PI (3.14) = Volume

Actually I don't think that is correct, diameter x 3.14 gives you the circumference, not area. What you want to use to find the volume of the tube is:

(ID radius^2) x 3.14 x tube height

[Dotay]

Actually I don't think that is correct, diameter x 3.14 gives you the circumference, not area. What you want to use to find the volume of the tube is:

(ID radius^2) x 3.14 x tube height

Ooops, PI r^2 for volume instead of PI rX2...which is another reason I just use the online calculator. :B

[Hdale85]

Calculators work for me :B Ok now what are cubic units? Does the calculator use inches or somthing else?

Also i was wondering would it work ok if i did a sealed design and used 2 RLP-12's one on the top of the tube and one on the bottom? Or should i just use a wide tube like 30" wide or somthing and put them both on the bottom, or just make 2 sonotubes.

I put in 20inch radius, 50inch height and it gives me 62831.86 Cubic inches im guessing. Am i doing this right? I'm trying to remember what the radius is? is it half the width or the full width?

[SteveCallas]

To comfortably fit two 15" driver on a bottom cap would require at least a 40" diameter tube, and would present more problems then benefits - either make two subs or put one on top and one on bottom.

As for that calculator, no, you should not end up with 62831 cubic inches, I don't know what type of value that is showing. A 20" diameter tube that is 50" tall will give you a raw 16328 cubic inches, or 267 liters.

[Hdale85]

Well i said 2 12's RLP-12's. And the radius of a 20" tube is 10" is this correct?

[Dotay]

I'm trying to remember what the radius is? is it half the width or the full width?

Radius is half the diameter. In the case of a 20" sonotube the diameter is 20" so the radius would be 10".

[---k---]

Thomas has on his site a Sonosub project where he fired one up and one down. I think that is probably the best solution if you want to put two drivers in the same tube. The two drivers will help with vibration by cancelling each other out too.

And, why bother with an RL-P12? They are only very marginally cheaper than the 15". Get the 15" and never look back!