The Rotel/B&W combination

[AeroAg]

I've heard alot of good things about the Rotel/B&W combination. Can anyone attest to that?

What I haven't seen much of is B&W combined with other brands of separates/receivers. Curious to know how many out there have B&W speakers mixed with B&K, Denon, etc.

I've had my eye on the 604s3 for awhile now...does anyone own a pair and would they endorse them?

I've considered the CDM9NT, but a $1200 difference is steep. I've listened to both and I think the 604s3 are more bang for the buck.

Cheers-

:^x

[hanser]

I have the Rotel 1066 prepro plus the Rotel 956A 6 channel amp plus B&W CDM7NT for mains, CDM center and B&W Matrix1/II (my old mains, fired by my old integrated am HK 645VXi) for surround. Very happy with the combination. If the CDM9NT is to pricey for you, try the 7NT; I found not much difference between them.

[mazuly]

I have the RSP-1066/RMB-1075 combo with 3 X DM310 in front and 2 X DM600 in the rear (no subs). The sound is very good. I have also listened to 5 x DM 602 S3 at my dealer with the same pre-pro/amp combo and it even sounded better.

My Dealer carries only B&W speakers, Rotel and HK gear and therefore I have listened to different Rotel/B&W combinations there (including B&W 802 and RC-1070 with RB-1090 and it sounded very sweet). IMO Rotel really matches well with B&W speakers.

As for your question, you always get better sound as you go to more expensive range of speakers from B&W, but I do agree with you that DM604 S3 are best bang for the buck. Unfortunately I have only heard them in 2 channel music with Rotel gear (I think RX-1050) and they sounded very nice. I also like to caution you that I have been listening to B&W speakers for more than 10 years and I am really accustomed to their sound. This is to the point that I usually don’t like the sound of other speakers. Just want to be honest about it since speakers are usually such a personal taste thing.

At this time I am planning my next upgrade (my retailer has upgrading program):

First:

RSP-1066 to RSP-1098 (soon)

Second:

5 x DM602 S3 or
5 X CDM 1NT or (If I can afford it)
5 X Nautilus 805
no sub

Oh yes, and the best speakers I have ever heard, IMO, were a pair of B&W Nautilus ran by some Krell gear at my dealer. Now that was magical

Good luck with your purchase decision.

Maziar

[Kevin D]

B&W and Rotel are imported, marketed, serviced, supported, and distributed by the same company in the US.. Generally the dealerships for them go hand in hand.. This is why you almost always seem to see them paired together..

That said, it's a damn good thing they really match up extremely well!

Kevin D

[wng]

Rotel and B&W do combine well. The DM603 and 604 are great buys. I've heard the 603 with the RSX-1065 and it was very engaging. If you're not able to swing the CDM series, have you considered the CM series? I find the CM a bit more refined, neutral, and transparent than the DM.

I'm running RSP-1066 and RMB-1075 with CM 4, CM C, and DM600 S3 for surrounds.

[Nicholas Renter]

I, too, have a Rotel / B&W system:

• Rotel RSP-1066
  Rotel RMB-1095
  (4) B&W Nautilus 805s
  (1) B&W HTM-2

I do like the sound of the N805s, especially when paired with a REL Strata III (run at speaker level). IMHO, this pairing will give you far better sound in anything in the B&W line (up to the N802). However, at that price point, I feel you can do much better for much less (like Vandersteen 3A Sigs with a pair of 2Wq subs).

I've been pleased with the RMB-1095. Be sure to use quality interconnects and speaker cables. Solid stands help, too.

[mml7]

I'm currently running a 1066/1075 combo with B&W speakers and am very happy. My mother also uses B&W Nautilus speakers (804 and HTM1) with her Krell Showcase system and is also very pleased.

My system currently consists of:
B&W Nautilus 804 Mains
B&W Nautilus HTM2 Center
Celestion SL6si Rears
B&W ASW1000 Subwoofer

mike

[greggz]

Nicholas,

Are you saying that you are running your REL connected ONLY via the hi-level connection?

Is your 1066 config'd such that your L&R are large, the rest are small, and your sub to none? Also, what is your 1066's crossover set at?

I'm still fiddling with my setup and would be intersted in how you've got your 805/Strata combination configured.




Gregg

[Rich Wenzel]

I too have rotel and B&W

I have 2 pairs of DM605s2's and the LCR6S2 center

I have the rotel rsx1055

personally, i think its just a little too warm, borderline muddy for 2 channel.

for hometheater, its awesome.

i prefered my carver c1000a in 2 channel with my B&W's, that think kicked.

Rich

[Curtis Douglas]

My current setup:
Rotel RSP-1066
RMB-1095
604S3 as my mains
LCR600S3 center
602S3 surrounds

I love my 604's I think they are a very under rated speaker in the B&W line. I have heard 604S3 next to the Nautilus 802's powered by the same amp and same wires and I could never ever justify the difference in price because the difference was minimal.
The only reason I got to compare the speakers that way was because a buddy of mine was having a problem and the dealer thought it was the crossover in the speaker (turned out to be the amp) so he took them. The funny thing is that after they heard my buddy's 604's compared to 802's & 603's they started talking and acting like they going to quit carrying the 603's and start carrying the 604's.

[Nicholas Renter]

Greggz,

I run all 5 of my B&W speakers as "large" and the sub disabled in the RSP-1066 configuration. My REL's crossover is set at 42 hz. I then adjust the level of the REL using familiar music (not HT source).

Crossovers are like anything else in engineering - they are a compromise. Unlike many, I'm not a big fan of high-order crossovers with steep slopes and high phase shifts. Matter of fact, it's the crossover in the N805 that makes me stop short of declairing them (IMHO) a "near perfect" bookshelf speaker.

Listen to a speaker like a Vandersteen or Thiel (and their first-order crossovers). The imaging is amazing. If I had the room for Vandersteens in my room, I would not have a center channel. With time and phase accurate speakers, there is no real need (again IMHO). Using the internal crossover of the 1066 just puts ANOTHER crossover in the signal path. Could you pull this configuration off with ANY speaker? Probably not. The N805 seems to simply ignore frequencies that it cannot reproduce without impacting the range it can produce.

Also, I feel that if my system is optimized for accurate music reproduction, then my HT will be as intended (and not exaggerated at either end - particularly the low end - of the spectrum). This is why I run my REL at speaker level and not at line level.

Yeah, this flies in the face of may of the HT "standards", but I would rather trust my ears than a marketing pitch.

This is just my opinion...your mileage may vary.

[greggz]

Hi Nicholas,

Thanks for the reply. I may just give that configuration a try and see how it sounds. But first, I have to ask, aren't you losing most of the frequencies below 50 Hz that are sent to the center and surrounds? Your configuration sounds like it would work fine for 2 channel music, but what about SACD and DVD-A? With the 805's and HTM2 all designated as large and the Strata only inlined with the L&R 805's, I would think that the other 3 speakers would sound rather lean and it would effect the over all timbre of the soundstage for 5 channel formats.

I do however agree with you about crossovers. Perhaps some day I'll have 3 Strata's inlined with the 5 speakers so that I do not have to cross over in the prepro at all.

Also on this topic, have you had a chance to hear the new Signature 805's yet?




Gregg

[AeroAg]

I picked up the 604s3 today. I was very excited to get them. Unfortunately, when I wired the 604s one worked fine but the other had no sound coming from it. So I thought, check connections. Every connection was solid and in the correct order. Next I thought maybe the cable was messed up. I used the cable that was on the working speaker. Nothing. By this time I clearly bummed. Next I thought maybe my receiver posts have gone bad. That wasn't it either. Finally I switched the cable from the LFposts into the HF posts of the inaudible speaker. That did the trick. But the other working speaker has them plugged into the LF posts. So I'm assuming the LF posts on the one speaker has a bad connections inside the speaker? My next step was to biwire them, but I can't do that if the LF post connections are bad on one of the speakers. Does anyone have any comments? I'm taking it back next week to the dealer to have them check it out. The crazy thing about it is the box had a huge gash in it, but no external damage to the speaker. Those punks at the dealer hid the side of the box that had the rip in it as they were loading them into my car so I didn't see it until I got home. Well, everything is working now, but I'm still pretty bummed that I will have to take them back. Updates to follow....

C- :boohoo:

[ZX 6R]

Finally I switched the cable from the LFposts into the HF posts of the inaudible speaker. That did the trick. But the other working speaker has them plugged into the LF posts. So I'm assuming the LF posts on the one speaker has a bad connections inside the speaker? My next step was to biwire them, but I can't do that if the LF post connections are bad on one of the speakers. Does anyone have any comments?
C- :boohoo:

You do have the bridgeing plates installed right? If you are not bi-wiring(which you should be ) then you need to have them on. From the factory they are in place. I am guessing you probably do have them on but it could be a simple mistake that would cause the speaker not to work as intended.

P.S. Regarding your original question regarding the 604s and electronics, make good and sure they get PLENTY of power. They are big speaker and move alot of air. They need ALOT of juice to work to their full potential. In the Rotel line we usually reccomend the RB-1080 in stereo or the RMB-1095 in home theater to our clients. As for B&Ws compatibility with other brands it not's a problem. They will work fine with any electronics of good quality.

[AeroAg]

Thanks for saving the day ZX 6R.

This morning I went to check the binding plates and one was loose on the inaudible speaker. Simple error that I thought double checked last night.

Lesson to everyone....don't rush to judgement.

They sound great!!! I am a happy and somewhat embarrassed B&W speaker enthusiast.

:LOL: ops:




"...I'm your huckleberry..."

[Nicholas Renter]

But first, I have to ask, aren't you losing most of the frequencies below 50 Hz that are sent to the center and surrounds?

I don't really think so...The Nautilus 805 has a frequency response of 56Hz - 20kHz ± 2dB (on reference axis) and -6dB at 42Hz and 30kHz. When you listen to the N805s without a sub, they may not give you the sonic impact of sub-bass frequencies (30 Hz and below), however, I have never felt "cheated" by the low-end abilites of the N805. The bass they produce is tight and satisfying.

Also, remember that the specs quoted above are merely points on a curve. Will they reproduce a pipe organ with authority? Nope. But, again, what bass they do produce is satisfying, so I don't want to limit the voicing of these speakers (hense running all speakers "large"). When you have many speakers reproducing the same low-frequency information at differnt points about the room, you will have some measure of sound reinforcement and much better loading of room with respect to low frequency energy.

The only case that I can think of where this configuration may be weak is if you have a burst of low-end energy in one of your surround channels (80hz and below). But if you attempt to "fix" this by setting your crossover is set to 80 Hz, then that sound won't really appear to be coming from that speaker at all - it will be coming from your sub.

Multi-channel audio doens't really interest me. It has a "neeto" factor to it, but that's not how I experience music live or even how I "see" it when working on studio tracks (back in the day). I'd rather have 2 really good channels of music than 5 (or more) so-so channels. Many producers have enough trouble with 2 channels, so why should I trust them with my dollar to add 3 (or more) channels that I really don't want.

As for the Sig 805s....no matter how they sound, the will be limited at their low end simply by the laws of physics. And for the same amount of money, you can get a pair of Vandersteen 3A Signatures with MUCH more impressive specs (including a frequency response of 26Hz to 30kHz +-3dB and 30Hz to 22kHz +-1.5dB). Again, I haven't heard the Sig 805s, but they'd have to be blow-your-mind-amazing to take the top spot at that price point.