New to Hi-Fi, read my story!!

**Andrew Pratt** · 16 November 2004, 16:59 Tuesday

Questions: The reason I looked into the Onkyo at first was the 7.1 so when not in 7.1

Second zones are very useful so that's a wise plan.

I could power my bedroom via Zone 2. I have read that the RSX-1056 will allow me to do this with a 2-channel amp, but does it actually do 7.1?

The 1056 is capable of of decoding 7.1 but it only has 5 onboard amp channels. This means that to get 7.1 and Zone two you are going to require another amp on top of the 1056 receiver.

How will I go about hooking it up? Will I tag the Zone 2/7.1 onto the front inputs? Use a pre-out and a speaker selector? I was looking at the RB-1050 to power the 7.1 and zone 2.

Well that depends on what your budget is and if you will ever want Zone 2 and 7.1 at the same time (likely). What I would recomend is that you should purchase a 5 channel amp as well as the 1056...or move up to the 1067 receiver and buy a 2 channel amp for either the fronts or Zone 2. Either one would work well and each has some advantages over the other. I'd likely lean towards the 1067 and a cheaper amp for the second zone (it could just be an old receiver from a pawn shop)

I am stupid, a newbie, and probably not worth your audiophile god status time, but any help is appreciated

All evidence to the contrary! You've done your homework and picked some great gear using your ears and are now asking the right questions instead of blindly buying what the masses think is Hi-Fi (ie Sony receiver and Bose speakers)

**Cracking Oboe** · 16 November 2004, 20:18 Tuesday

Hi Shane,

I enjoyed your post :Z . (just kidding :rofl: !!! I like lengthy postings like mine) Your story sounds familiar. It is a bit of a shock to realize how bad some products are in their abilities to reproduce music (and how much money we have to spend to achieve our goals). You have already proven yourself an audiophile by your discriminating ear, welcome to the club… and the trials and tribulations (upgradeitis) that come with not being completely deaf, as most people must be to keep consumer brands alive! (Just wait until you have heard the DVD-A recordings of Beethoven’s symphonies performed by the BPO with Abbado conducting, you’ll be looking for a DVD- Audio player in no time).

It sounds as though you have already spent double what you were intending, so a less expensive option for now would be (as Andrew sort of mentioned), use an old stereo or surround receiver as your center rear for 7.1, and another one for your second zone, using the CD inputs of each. (High quality used 2 channel or Dolby surround receivers are going cheap). If you are using this method for 7.1, set the volume to 12 or 1 o’clock and tape the volume of the used receiver into position (less chance for volume calibration errors, or accidents). In the mean time, I'd suggest that you save up for an RB 1070/1080. (More power is often necessary for classical recordings and the 1050 may not be enough.) Then, use the redirect option in your RSX-1056’s menu to use the RB1070 or 1080 for your main Front channels and the internal amps for your center backs. The 1050 will probably be sufficient for your second zone if it is a smaller area.

Your floor plan looks like it was straight out of the “problem L-shaped room” example in a recent; What’s HI-FI magazine. Their solution was; main speaker placement exactly as you have arranged :T , and insulated/sealed doors leading to the kitchen, and the hallway (may be tough in your case). Your center backs are kinda far apart, and your side surrounds are close together – they should be the other way around. I like the area you pointed out as possible areas for your side surrounds, and those ceiling speakers could be used as center backs? Here is a link to show what Dolby labs suggests:

404 - Dolby

http://www.dolby.com/consumer/home_entertainment/roomlayout.html

Great project, and even better foresight with getting advice and the future proofing wiring. Congratulations.

Cracking!

**DrJRapp** · 16 November 2004, 20:29 Tuesday

Shane,

Yes, you have done your homework very well! I do think you need to reconsider surround speaker placement a bit more to get the all enveloping sound that is possible with todays equipment. Because of the squed nature of your surrounds the sound may seem to jump a bit on you. You need to move the LS up near where you indicated "I can put them anywhere, even in partial wall, but be sure to keep them in the ceiling, not in the wall. Then I would suggest moving both rears to the lower left corner, closely spaced. You don't have the ideal room for 7.1 surround, but I think that those locations may give you the best effect.

**bandit788** · 17 November 2004, 05:10 Wednesday

Andrew, thank your very much for your valuable time. Thank you all for your warm welcome. The reason for going with the RSX-1056 was the price. The 1067 may have to wait until grad school is complete. I entertained the 1056 path because it is just my wife and I, we are usually always doing the same thing around the house (i.e. watching a movie, or listening to music). Having separate control of the zone 2 would be a luxury, but one that I feel may need to wait if I wish to stay married (hey there is an option). Allow me to finish grad school and we will be planning the ultimate system (Shane's Megaplex Studio).

I have found a like new condition RB-1050 for $250.00. I am hypothesizing that I could utilize a channel selector and have the 1050 either power for 7.1, or have stereo 5.1 in the den, with zone 2 (bedroom) at the same time. The 1067 makes my sympathetic nervous system act up, but I think I can save $500-600 by going the 1056 route. 7.1 would be better, but I hope that 5.1 would be adequate in our den for music listening with the zone 2 active.

I just had a thought!!! when we are entertaining would stereo in the den and active zones in the other parts of the house be better, and cut the amp out of the equation. Have a selector to turn the surrounds into zone 2's. But this would completely take away my 7.1, and I am sure ambient sound from more speakers would be better listening, right? I do really like the idea of the RMB-1075 or powering the fronts of a 1067 with a two channel. Even using an older receiver for powering the zone two's would be a great option. I however feel that I should macro simplify with my budget and current knowledge. All of your options would again be of high regard, yet I think I may have to sacrifice for 2-3 years with a more simplistic budget minded approach. We plan to build again in 4-5 years after I have been out of school for several years, and our next home will be of a much grander scale. Do you think the 1056 with the 1050 amp will work if I am willing to give up 7.1 and zone 2 at the same time? I hope this is a good option. I feel that even this would make for a wonderful system that I can baby step up from.
Thanks again for all of your help.
Shane

**bandit788** · 17 November 2004, 05:47 Wednesday

Cracking Oboe, love the name:

Thanks for your reply. I cannot wait to be immersed with the sound of my music collection (limited) via the Rotel and B&W quality. I can already feel my budget line item for "CD purchasing" inflating (Can anyone with an MBA suggest how to conceal this).

I love the budget minded idea of utilizing another surround receiver, but I have yet to disclose a nasty obstacle, space. My component space underneath my television has been framed out at a limiting H 10 in. X W 40 in. With most receivers utilizing a width of approx. 17 in. I am limited. My plan was possibly the 1056 (H 6.4 in.) on one side and the 1050 amp (H 3.6 in.) on the other side, on top of maybe the RDV-1050 DVD ( H 3.6 in.). The digital cable box is anyone's guess, it measures in at H 3.25 in and could possibly go on the receiver but ugggg, why god, why. I have already purchased an omnimount WB to take the center channel out of the equation and place it above the TV just at the right corner on the wall. I know this is not ideal of a center but hear again my room design has limited my acoustic ability. The center will be placed high (7-8 ft.), angled down, and only be approx. 6 in. from the top corner of the TV, and will be placed in a direct corner, which I feel will maybe help direct the sound to the listening area, approx. 8-10 ft away from it all. This could all be very wrong, and turn out sounding ever so bad, but hey I am learning, and you guys can always say we told you so!!!

Before sheet rock was hung last week I snuck in during wiring with some 2X4's and placed additional studs around this corner niche, so a shelf above/behind the TV is possible, but then IR would be needed for what ever is hidden (amp would be best choice, no IR needed, but it looks so good stacked!!!). I also do not want to suffocate my components. O.K. I must press on, it is 4:42 a.m., just got home from work an hour ago, have class in the A.M. and all of the tactical planning is depleting my limited intellect, haha. What do you think about my rough plan for components, I know it is limited compared to some of the other proposals, but it is a rough plan on a basic system that can be changed. I can reconfigure at any time, we will not be closing and moving in until mid January. Thanks Oboe.

Shane

**bandit788** · 17 November 2004, 05:58 Wednesday

Dr JRapp,

Thanks for the advice on the speaker placement. I did feel that my surrounds in the ceiling where going to be a little close so I left approx. 8-10ft of rolled cable at each end. The diagram is deceiving, the way they are placed at present is probably 8-9 ft. apart, with 4-5 ft. on each side before there is wall. That is pretty close when I think about it; the custom sectional that my wife is having built is huge, probably 9-10 ft. wide on the back side, easy. I see that these speakers should be a little more ambient from the above outside, not directly above. How far from the wall do you feel I should place them? As for the rear surrounds I am limited, I no longer have access to the partial wall with the sheet rock up, but I can put them on one side or the other of the rear walls (have attic access), or I could bring them in really close to the hall on the back walls. Any help would be much appreciated.

Shane

**Cracking Oboe** · 18 November 2004, 04:59 Thursday

Shane,

Yup, it sounds like the 'word of the day' will have to be compromise.
Space is a big issue, and stacking components is never recomended. That being said, it looks like you are going to just have to work with what you have, and the 1050 seems like a good solution to your space problem.

I don't think the centre speaker placement is a problem (if angled down), but would like you to look seriously at your surround placement (As the Dr. and myself mentioned). I think that if you draw an imaginary line perpedicular to the centre of your main speakers to the back wall, that is where your centre backs should be, and if you draw another line bisecting the first line just behind the sectional to the outer sides of the room, that is where your surrounds should be. (I hope that just made sense? - 2 A.M. after just getting home from an R.E.M. concert. Bedtime!)

Cracking

**bandit788** · 18 November 2004, 09:12 Thursday

Cracking Oboe,

Geometry has never been my strong point, but it makes perfect sense. I cannot wait to get everything installed so I can start sending pictures out. I may wait a month or so to install the 7.1. I will first get my 5.1 up and running, thanks for all of your help. I am glad a posted before I started cutting into walls in a month or so. Thanks again.
Shane

**Andrew Pratt** · 18 November 2004, 10:33 Thursday

If you do decide you want 7.1 and zone 2 in at the same time...as well as helping with the space issues I'd recomend buying one of the new digital panasonic receivers. They're digital amps are supposed to sound pretty decent and they're cheap. They also will run cool so stacking one on top or below other gear shouldn't be a problem. You'd then just utilize the 5.1 input on the back for your rears and zone two speakers.

The 1050 would be a nice amp as well and there are speaker selectors that have IR capability so you could automate that switch.

**DrJRapp** · 18 November 2004, 18:43 Thursday

I have to add a caviat to Andrews recommendation. I own a Rotel stack for my HT and a Panasonic XR25 digital receiver for my bedroom. The Panasonic is wonderful, even without considering the low price...However, and this is the caviat, the sound is different than Rotel sound. Much more forward and more crisp on the top (some may say bright). Whether this will be audible if you were to use the Panny for rear surrounds is very hard to predict.

**bandit788** · 19 November 2004, 00:43 Friday

Thanks Andrew,

I never thought about that, but I have not even gotten into reviewing selectors yet. I was unaware they made them with IR. I think I will have to look into the second receiver idea (more late night research). I understand the basic principles of utilizing an amp and what not, but much past that and I score low. By the way, does the Rotel that I am going to get (1056), have pre's that I can hook the 7.1 speakers up with via the amp. I looked at the diagram and saw it had a pre-out section, but I did not see anything labeled surround rear. If I understand 7.1 these are different signals for the rears then the surrounds. Thanks

Shane

New to Hi-Fi, read my story!!

New to Hi-Fi, read my story!!

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