Best for 2 channel music 1066 or 1055

[justaboutnow]

8O I'm new to the site and glad I found it as I could use some help. I'm building a HT system but music is a primary concern as I listen to music 80% of the time and movies 20%. I was ready to buy the RSX 1065 until I heard it next to the 1066/1075. No comparison. I was going to spring for the separates with a tuner when I saw the posts here suggesting the 1055 with a separate amp ie. the 1070. However I wasn't clear if those comparisons were for movies, HiFi, or both.
So here is where I hope someone can give some insight. Listening to 2 channel music has anyone compared the 1066/1075 vs 1055/1070 or 1055/1080? If they are comparable I'd sure rather go with the 1055 and put the extra money towards a pair of CDM 1NT's or 805's. Any insite is greatly appreciated.

[Danbry39]

Justaboutnow,

First, a big welcome to HTG. ;h Hope you enjoy your stay here and that you post more frequently and check out the other forums here.

Before answering your question, I own the 1066 matched with a Parasound amp.

I've heard the 1055 a few times and couldn't tell much, if any, sonic differences. My feelings are that more sonic improvement might be yielded by applying the extra cash to upgrading your speakers.

The reasons for this include:

1. The money: Not only is the 1055 less expensive in and of itself, but you also save on the tuner and additional cables you'd need between the tuner and amp.

2. The flexibility: By having the built in power supply, which are to a degree assignable, you won't need an extra amp if you should decide to go 6.1 or 7.1. You'll also have the option to biamp.

3. If there's an issue of rack space, you'd have only two components, the receiver and amp, instead of three, the pre-pro, amp, and tuner.

Let's face it, no matter which route you choose, you'll be getting some quality equipment, but, if I was making the choice, that's what I'd do.

Don't get me wrong, I love the 1066, but I'm also very impressed with the 1055.




Keith

[zeppelin]

The reason on why the 1066 preamp does not have a tuner is because Rotel wanna design its preamp as clean as possible without any extra circuit that may cause noise. If you look at the Higher End of a preamp processor none of them spot a tuner.
To me if you wanna hear some serious music go for seperates.

If you decided to buy a 1055, than what I suggest is to buy a seperate amps for your Front channel and use the built in amps for your centre and surround channels.

[justaboutnow]

8O Good to know I'm not the only night owl, thanks for the quick reply! Let me dig a little deeper. While I haven't heard the 1055 with an additional power supply for the mains, I was completely taken in by the 1066/1075. It was driving a pair of B&W CDM 1NT speakers and sourced from I believe a Denon 2800 dvd/cd player. I'm not certain of the cables and interconnects but I would guess they were audio quest as thats what this dealer carried. When an A/B comparison was done with the 1065, the separates were considerably better, but of course the 1066 had bigger amplifiers with the 1075. As the audiophiles say it had a better sound stage, was more open, much clearer, and had better attack.
So here I am wanting that sound without the rack space and extra cost of the separates with a tuner. I tend to agree with Zeppelin that separates should produce less noise. But to what degree and can it be offset by better amplifiers. The 1075 is a very good $1000 5 channel amplifier, but I would think the 130watt 2 channel 1070 or 200watt 2 channel 1080 would be even better. So how does it all balance out when it hits the ears. All I know is for sure is this is going to get expensive
I'd like to A/B the 1066/1075 to the 1055/1080. But I'm not sure the dealer can do that and I'm 3 Hours away from the closest dealer. So I'm hoping somebody out there has done these comparisons.
And if I can indulge a little further. Does anybody have any input on ampliers? Has anybody listened to the 1070 next to the 1080? Is the more powerful 1080 a much better listen than the 1070, and for $700 (1070) or $1000(1080) is there a better amp than the Rotel?
Ah so many questions and combinations to pounder.

[Danbry39]

All I know is for sure is this is going to get expensive

And we'll be happy to help you spend it.

Anyway, I've linked a few threads that, while they don't address exactly what you're after, will help.

As far as amps, that's a difficult call, but I would steer toward the 1075, which, if I recall, can be bridged.

http://www.htguide.com/CFBoards/index.cfm?fuseaction=Threads.viewthread&Tid=70459&Forum=25&StartRow=1&CFB=1

http://www.htguide.com/CFBoards/index.cfm?fuseaction=Threads.viewthread&Tid=68143&Forum=25&StartRow=1&CFB=1

<a href="http://www.htguide.com/CFBoards/index.cfm?fuseaction=Threads.viewthread&Tid=65995& Forum=25&StartRow=1&CFB=1" target="_blank">http://www.htguide.com/CFBoards/index.cfm?fuseaction=Threads.viewthread&Tid=65995& Forum=25&StartRow=1&CFB=1





Keith

[Andrew Pratt]

I compared the 1066 to the 1055 using seperate amps in my system and to me they sound very close to each other. On paper the 1066 does have a lower noise floor so if the budget allows the 1066 would be the better choice. Of course given that for most people budgets do play into the equation the 1055 is the clear winner given its very close sonic abilities compared to the 1066 and with the funds saved going with better cables, amps or speakers will very likely sound better. In other words with the same amp, cables and speakers the 1066 might sound slightly better then the 1055 BUT if you only have so much to spend then the cheaper 1055 paired with better amps or speakers should sound better over all. i.e. upgrading the amps or speakers with the money saved by going with the 1055 should easily off set any sonic advantage the 1066 might have if comprises have to be made on the other equipment choices.

[wng]

justaboutnow, welcome. A word of caution on the choice of amp: it's always good to have more power (greater control, i.e., damping factor, dynamic ability, etc.), but too much will stress speakers. Both the 1NT and 805 are rated 50-120W, so the 1080 will probably be overkill.

[Scarp]

danbry: the 1075 cannot be bridged. Actually bridging amps is something you want to stay away from. The 1070 stereo amp can be bridged, but its better to get a 1080 instead of two 1070's.

The 1080 is not overkill for 805's. B&W speakers are hungry and need good control. The 1070 doesnt give the control they need.
I have a 1090 and they will be on B&W 804. The 1090 sounds more musically than its smallers siblings.

You could choose to get the RSX1055 and buy a good stereo amp with it to power the front speakers.

[Glenn]

Reading all the different suggested combos of this thread, I am wondering about the following.

This may be way off, (I am still in the learning process of HT), but could the RSX-1055 @ 5 X 75W be combined with the RMB-1075 @ 5 X 120 to equal 5 X 195W? I am still trying to figure out bi-amping, and am not sure if it works like this.

What type of power would be matched/suitable for B&W 9NT's ... is 75W too little?

[Scarp]

You should only do bi-amping with two equal amps. One will drive the HF and the other the LF part (thats why there are two sets of connection terminals on your speakers, remove the connection plate between the two and wire two sets of cables from two amps to both sets).

For music you definitly want control over your speakers, which a multi-channel amp doesnt have as good as a stereo amp.

I used the 1070 on my B&W 604 and thats more than sufficient. On your CDM's you could opt for the 1080, although I recommend you trying to do a comparison on those speakers between a 1070 and 1080.

For myself I use a multichannel amp for my center and rears (with only three speakers connected on a 5 channel amp) and a stereo amp for the front speakers. This gives me great stereo performance and also good HT performance.

Btw... in stereo mode your amp could give more than just the 75w since it doesnt need to power all speakers, so just a single 1055 could be enough.

In doubt, always just pick the 1055 and you can always later on add a stereo amp if you are not satisfied.

[Glenn]

Scarp

Thanks for your reply. I got a little mixed up about the bi-amping part, so your answer really helped. I think the RSX-1055 on its own and then adding an additional amp (if needed) will be the way to go. Thanks again!

[Danbry39]

Scarp,

Being relatively new to HT myself, I really like your posts. I learn something from each one of them, so I'm sure hoping you keep it up. :T




Keith

[wng]

I have to respectfully disagree, Scarp. The 1NT and N805 both have sensitivity ratings of 88 dB, so yes, they do need some juice. But most of an amp's power goes toward driving the lower regions, and both B&Ws are bookshelf models that go down to (only) about 60 and 50 Hz, respectively. The 1070 is rated 130W but I'm sure has generous headroom, and its damping factor is 500. I really feel the 1070 should be enough. Use the money towards a good subwoofer to round out the bottom end. But as always, let your ears be the ultimate judge.

[zeppelin]

Scarp, I actually Bridge my amps to get that powerfull mono blocks. I got 5 stereo RB-970BX rated 60watts per channel, 180watts if bridge mono. Having a powerfull amps is in fact better and does not overkill. I got a 80watts 90db speakers and the amplifier is rated 180 watts. So basically my 5 speakers each got its own amplifier.
Base on my experience Bridging amps is ok, it does not do any harmfull effect. I've tried biamping and bridging to compare. To me the latter(bridge) gives me more soundstage and seperation, but on the speakers side its biwiring.
Been bridging the amps for about 5yrs now and I tell you rotel really last and worth the money.

[mickyboy]

i have 981 and 985 rotel powers denon 3802 cdm1nts, if using 981 instead of 3802 internals, i do not notice a big differance in 2 channel sterio between the 2 , have not demoed 1066/1055/1075 etc but the 1055 is meant to be better in 2 channel sterio than 3802 anyway .
so the differance may be greater 1055/1066 +1075 or 1070.

[Mike Hayes]

I auditioned the 1066/1075 combo in stereo mode with N805s and found the combo to be quite sweet. In fact, it's so sweet that I am probably going to extend the budget and purchase a 1066 this week or next. I currently have the 1075 paired with a Yamaha RXV1200 and there really is no comparison - the 1066/1075 combo simply is really a step above. I auditioned the 1055 in stereo with N805s and it sounded very good. It would probably be very close to the 1066/1075 combo if paired with a 2 channel amp. Do not expect miracles from the 1055 - you will have to add the 2 channel amp to come close to the 1066/1075 combo.

[Scarp]

@wng: You are right in saying that the 1070 could handle the 805's. It can, but a 1080 can give a better results and isnt overkill... the sound is just different from the different amps. But its also a money question. Here in europe the 1080 is two times the price of a 1070, so if you have the money go for the 1080 if after listening you find it worth the money. The increased dampingfactor also makes it better handling. But a 1070 with some 805's also makes for a sweet combination and gives you money to get a good sub (I can recommend an svs ).

@danby39: thanks for the compliment

@zeppelin: well, I tested a set of 1070's bridged against a 1080 and found the sound of the 1080 much more pleasing. The 1070 where overstressed in bridged mode. So I would always go for the true stereo amp instead of bridged ones.

So to the topic starter: a 1070 and RSX1055 plus a good subwoofer would be a sure bet for good sound. If you thinking about ever upgrading your 805's to 804's then go with a 1080, if not not then a 1070 is sufficient.

[eagle]

I went through exactly the same dilema as you. I demoed a Rotel 1066/1070 with meridian 507 and dynaudio speakers. It sounded fine but the 1070 then changed to 1080 and the difference to me was 'Night and Day'. The bas was tighter and the voices of the females singers I used at the demo was more natural.

Having originally demoed the 1055, it think it was different class of performance.

Anyways bcos of this experience, I ended up with a Rotel 1090 with a Bryston SP1 and JM Labs Cobalt 815. So if you can afford it I will say go the seperates route. You will not regret it.

[ZX 6R]

I completely agree with Scarp on this issue, the Nautilus' LOVE power....even the 805. There is a large sonic benefit from the 1080 over the 1070(in fact I wouldn't recommend anything less than the 1080 for anything Nautilus). We have a client that has a 1090 for each of his 3 805's up front.....it sounds absolutely stunning! the seperation and definition are just incredible. Having the left and right getting significantly better amping than the center definitely is not my preference but you mentioned you're like 80% music so this shouldn't be a big issue for you. If you are so inclined I'd suggest going seperates when you can afford it but in the mean time probably going with the 1055 and the 1080 is the most cost effective option for you. I know Andrew has mentioned in the past how much easier it is potentially selling a receiver VS a pre-amp, and I think that's a very good point.

[wng]

I have seemed to be "against" using the 1080. I don't doubt the advantages of the 1080 over the 1070 - I've heard this argument elsewhere and, heck, I'm even considering getting a 1080 now for my new mains, as I do 2-ch listening most of the time. My question is that is there a risk by not sticking to the speaker's power-handling rating (50 to 120W for the N805's)? And Rotel's manuals point out to make sure speakers can handle their amps' power. Just trying to follow the guidelines. Then again, if no one's blown their speakers yet....

[Scarp]

wng: I am using a RB1090 (2x380w @ 8 Ohm) on B&W 603's now (this is just temporary until my 804's arrive). I calibrated it at the normal levels (75 db as usual). As long as I dont turn up the volume completely it will not be a problem.

Anyway, if one has the money, then I would certainly listen to the 1080 or 1090. Both of them are incredible value for money and very musically and very much in control of difficult speakers.

[Danbry39]

Wng,

Scarp makes a lot of sense here. The maximum power ratings have almost seemed arbitrary at times and can be misleading. In fact, they are used inappropriately in advertising. Ever see one of the ads for, let's say, a $85 soeaker where the ad says something to the effect, "250watts maximum power." Well, a lot of consumers think, "Oh man, that's a powerful speaker."

The bigger risk to speakers is underpowering them. Causing the amplifier to strain leads to clipping which is a surefire way to cause damage. You want to make sure your amp can give enough clean power to safely drive the speakers.




Keith

[Dr C]

Couldn't agree more with Keith/Danbry 39. I'm a firm believer of always getting a more powerful amp than what is required by your speakers. Besides the usual stuff (damping factor / power in reserve when you need it / etc ...) you will find that when you crank the volume up you will need the juice to power your woofers.

On transient peaks the momentary surge in demand will not stress your woofer much (maybe bottom it out but if you hear this then it s a sign you should be lowering the volume) but woe betide you (thought I'd give a little olde english for emphasis :-) if you don't have this power in reserve as your tweeters will be fried as your amp clips.

I was involved in Pro Audio before - withSPLs in excess of 115 to 118 dB - and I have *never* seen a woofer replaced. Tweeters plenty ...

[ZX 6R]

I was involved in Pro Audio before - withSPLs in excess of 115 to 118 dB - and I have *never* seen a woofer replaced. Tweeters plenty ...

On the consumer side things.....we have seen woofers get damaged but it's definitely a rarity compaired to the tweeters.....The ratio has got to be least 20 to 1. The sad part is sometimes people are actually pleased that their amps are "so powerful" they keep blowing up their speakers...and trying to tell them different gets you nowhere. When the woofers tend to go it's usually the diaphragm near the voice coil that gets ripped. Some consumer pieces have such crappy protection circuits that they'll happilly just keep playing along even though they are clipping like there's no tommorow. The worst case we saw was an amp that actually kept playing until the speaker actually caught fire and it didn't even stop then! ....I guess the bottomline is buying a good quality amp like the Rotel stuff just seems like a good investment to me.

[sapirg]

Hi, I am Gadi, new member of this forum and new Rotel owner.
My system is:
Rotel 1066/1075 combo
Rotel RCD 1070 CD player
Pioneer DV 535 DVD player
Speakers: Front Tannoy 615
Center Tannoy Saturn S8
Surr. Tannoy Saturn S6
Center back Tannoy 603

I want to upgrade to 7.1 system and trying to choose 2ch. power amplifiers for my front (for best stereo). My options is:
Rotel RB 1070(1080)
Roksan Kandy KMA 2 MkIII
Anthem MCA 2
or Musical Fidelity A3 CR
My musical interest is jazz, fusion, progressive rock.
I'll be glad to recive your opinions for my future combination
Excuse me for my english.

[Bill Blank]

Justaboutnow,

I can't comment on the 1055 as I've never heard it. I can say that, like, you, I value music capability much more than movies. When I made the decision to integrate pieces of my 2-channel system into my home theater system I was somewhat worried. I'd be going from my Musical Fidelity Integrated to a multi-channel unit. The only option would be separates to get anything near the quality the MF produced with music.

I auditioned a few groups of seprates: B&K, Anthem, Rotel as well as some top-end receivers. I ended up with the Rotel RSP-1066 and RMB-1075 combo. It's very close to the sound of the MF, with even better control of the bass. I have been very pleased with the setup and have recently become very impressed with the new high-resolution multi-channel formats. My core components are as follows:

Mitsubishi WS-55411 HD-Ready TV
Rotel RSP-1066 Pre/Pro
Rotel RMB-1075 Power
Rega Planet 2000 CD Player
Denon DVD-2900 Universal Player
Vienna Acoustics Mozart (Front)
Vienna Acoustics Maestro (Center)
Vienna Acoustics Haydn (Surround)
Velodyne CT-120 (Sub)

Again, while I can't comment on one vs. the other, I can highly recommend the 1066/1075 combo if music is your primary concern.

Cheers!
Bill




Rotel RSP-1066
Rotel RMB-1075
Rega Planet 2000
Denon DVD-2900
Mitsubishi WS-55411
Paradigm Reference Studio 100 v3
Paradigm Reference Studio CC-470 v3
Paradigm Reference Studio 20 v3
Velodyne CT-120