Forum activity

[psychdoc]

This forum used to be worth checking every day. Now, it seems like it’s more like once a week. I figured there would be reviews of the dvd players and news/ speculation on new formats, but there is almost nothing. Just my thoughts……….

[Chris D]

(sigh) Yeah... it's really up to you all. Member participation is the name of the game! Rather telling that there were 76 views of this thread in the last day, before I got on here, but nobody bothered to reply. :roll:

I know some people out there only like to soak up information and not contribute, but hey, SOMEBODY'S got to be the one to post a thought, opinion, observation, or review!

You're right, we need people to post reviews of the new DVD players...

[slayer]

I have been thinking the same thing. Yet I still look every day for a new thread or post.

[Whistler]

Chris why don't you buy one .

[nicholtl]

I've just been so absorbed with getting a screenplay sold or my first feature financed that I rarely have time to even listen to my components anymore, much less post.

I've even considered selling the entire system for now, and taking up the audiophile hobby at a later date. Maybe when I'm 40 or something.

[Arneson]

It's not just here, other board forums have also become boring forums.
Thank god you guys hear have not gone psyco babel like I've seen others.
I read the local paper online for instance. They allow comments after articles.
It's unbelievable what comes out of the keyboard of some people, local residents, makes me think of locking some doors.

[mitch57]

I check this forum several times every day. But I haven't posted in a while. But I will be very soon once I get things worked out with a little issue I'm having with my gear.

[mikepinkerton]

I've been waiting for more info on HDMI audio switching on the C1/C2. I would love to buy a SACD player (Tommy is out on SACD!!!) but I'm not a fan of the 6-cable method....

--Mike

[Chris D]

Chris why don't you buy one .

Aha! In all honestly, I very well might have, but I've been on a 4-month military deployment. Figures... of all times that Parasound finally DOES release the DVD player! Kind of hard to drag a $3,000 piece of A/V component to war. :W

We'll have to see what happens when I go home after this.

[psychdoc]

AHA, there is life on this board! Good to see people coming back to the fold. Anyone out there own one of Parasound's DVD players? Any views or thoughts would be appreciated.

Chris, I was there for 15 months so I feel your pain. Keep your head down and don't go sight seeing. For that matter, don't go on any convoy that isn't necessary. I can't imagine that should be a problem for you since you should be 40K ft up and flying base to base if memory serves me right about what you do in the AF. Be safe and good luck. Just think, when you get back you'll have all that extra money to spend on some new components.

[mitch57]

Just think, when you get back you'll have all that extra money to spend on some new components.

I bet his significant other might have something to say about that extra money he's collecting from Hazardous Duty pay. But then again, she'll probably be so glad to see you safe and sound back home that she might let you spend it on whatever you want. :

[bhuskins]

Yep, even the sponsors are still here... :-)

[Chris D]

Yeah, the $3.50 a day really adds up. Just another 2.5 years deployed, and I can buy a D3!

[nbourbaki]

I check a few times a week. I'm a year away from buying my next piece of Parasound gear but I try to stay up to date on what's going on in the world of Parasound. I've been on the road 5 days a week so I haven't had much time to enjoy the gear that I own.

[RandyL999]

I still check the boards, but not daily. I'm in line for some new Halo gear for a new home. Just hoping that some upgrades happen before I need to buy!

Randy

[Chetk]

Personally, I think it's due to the transition phase. Nobody really wants to buy another DVD player. Parasound took WAY to long to release that peice of equipment. HD-DVD and Blu-Ray are out now. So, until Parasound can decode DTS-HD MA and/or Dolby TrueHD, what's to talk about that hasn't already been covered?

Seems the most excitement around here as of late has been getting access to remote software that really turned into a non-issue about software that wasn't really being updated anyway.

[Lex]

ok, as owner, I am not crazy about this thread title. Do you mean the Parasound/Halo area, the whole forum? I chose to change this to a title of "Forum Activity", instead of is this forum dead.

Chris has been on deployment, so to come in here asking if things are dead while he's away isnt' very fair. A lot of things have been quit, but that don't mean we have to have a visual reminder as direct as yours. I would rather see the members take interest in the forum welfare by asking questions and participate by answering others questions.

thank you.
Doug

[Vince Helm]

Great move Doug and thanks!
Vince

[Chris D]

Okay.

[psychdoc]

I apologize if this was received in any other way than it was meant. It just seems that the posts have been few and far between in the “Parasound” thread up until the point where I commented on that process by creating this thread. At that point there was a lot more activity which was nice to see. I think you may have taken this a bit too personally but you are the owner so that would be understandable. Point taken as far as future choice of topics goes...... Matt.

p.s. In no way is Chris' deployment related to board activity. Posting is the responsibility of those in the forum, not just Chris.

[nopat]

I think you're getting a little too over-sensitive about the thread title. But a point taken.

Personally, I think it is a marker of the equipment. Honestly, I check in here every once in a while, but I'm too busy actually enjoying the equipment. Walk through the Magnolia district of your local Best Buy. "Hear the difference."

A21/1068/40v3's

[Lex]

Well perhaps nopat, but things that reflect negatively on the board, reflect on me and our staff. So, from a marketing perspective, I'll always land on the side of protecting the terf. I can't comment on whether Parasound has dropped a ball or not. All I know is, they do make some great looking gear, and we offer a place to talk about it, and a great dealer to talk with too. So, anyway, carry on, I'm shutting up now after leaving you with a subliminal message (catcables catcables catcables)

thank you and good night.

[nopat]

Well perhaps nopat, but things that reflect negatively on the board, reflect on me and our staff. So, from a marketing perspective, I'll always land on the side of protecting the terf. I can't comment on whether Parasound has dropped a ball or not. All I know is, they do make some great looking gear, and we offer a place to talk about it, and a great dealer to talk with too. So, anyway, carry on, I'm shutting up now after leaving you with a subliminal message (catcables catcables catcables)

thank you and good night.

I'm used to non-profit forums where the discussion can get a lot edgier, so like I said, point taken. I'll try not to foul things up too much .

I can't see how Parasound has dropped any ball. The equipment is good, and so long as they are pushing boundaries of sound quality/performance/value, I see no reason to really comment on the activity of a couple forums. Parasound isn't entry-level. It isn't marketed as such, and you're naturally going to see a lot less activity here than you are on a receiver forum, Rotel, Adcom, et al.

Remind me to talk to you about cables. I'm just getting the courage to chop up my bookcase and need to replace the power cords I call speaker cable and interconnect. Wedding planning takes precidence right now, at least until December.

[Lex]

Pat, where is your sense of priorities, it's cables before bouquets man, always. :lol: Well, hopefully still be looking for biz then too...

Doug

[Chris D]

No worries about me. There's times where I can't get to a computer for a few days, but I try to stay up with you guys, even while I'm deployed, like now.

I'm here for YOU... help me... help YOU!

[Peter Nielsen]

...and I'm struggling with TacT. 4 out of 5 amps are bad... That's something! With Parasound 1 in 10 was damaged in shipping. (The TacT problems are factory defects. Two cosmetically bad amps and two functionally bad amps)...

Be glad you got a Parasound. If you're a perfectionist, Parasound is a safe bet!

Peter

[mitch57]

Wow Peter!!! four out of five bad amps? That's terrible. Makes you wonder how a company like that stays in business with that level of quality control going on.

[Chris D]

Yikes!

[Q-Man]

I have to admit that I just became an occasionial reader after buying a C-1 about a year ago. Before that, I was asking opinions about Anthem vs. Parasound. I like the sound, or the lack of it from my C1. I'm glad you guys convinced me to try one of the Halo controlers.

I spent years tweaking and building speakers in order to find a sound that suited me. Then came the amps and finally the C1. This last year I spent more time listening to music then I did in the 10 years proir. I think that says alot. Before this, I wasn't satisfied, and all my time was spent tweaking.

I've never been into video quality, for me it has always been about the sound. I'm now thinking about retiring my 10 year old 50" rptv. I guess it's time to get a HD-TV. I want at least a 60" Plazma or a projector and a perforated screen.

This brings me to HDMI 1.3 and 1080p resolutions. Again I want HDMI more for the sound then for the video. Will the Parasound Zhd HDMI selector work with the C1 and C2? It says it will, but I don't understand how, since the Halo controlers don't have an HDMI input. The Zhd also doesn't have the 1.3 version.

Now what to you suggest?

Q.

[Chris D]

Q, I've gotten the word straight from Richard Schram that the Zhd is fully HDMI 1.3 compliant, now that the 1.3 protocol has been finalized.

Yes, the Zhd interfaces with the C1/C2/7100. An RS-232 serial cable runs from the Zhd to the controller, and when you change a source on the controller, the Zhd automatically also switches to the corresponding source. So in that sense, it's an automated switcher. It does NOT pass audio or video information to/from the C1/C2/7100.

(that's the next upgrade we're begging Parasound to implement)

[Q-Man]

Well in that case, I'm willing to put down a grand or two for an upgrade. I'll head up to the attic and get the shipping box.
Just say when.

[Chris D]

Yeah, you're not the only one. Lots of us are waiting, checks in hand, ready to buy that kind of upgrade for the Parasound controllers.

[bhuskins]

How big is the check though? That's what Parasound has to contend with...

[hays0023]

I too am curious when that will happen...even if it is in the $1000 or so ball-park, it beats buying a new pre-amp!

[bhuskins]

Although it would be great to have a substantial upgrade for the C1/C2, (meaning major overhaul...new DSP, new DAC, full 1.3 HDMI implementation, full room correction, etc.) the likelyhood is highly unlikely. I don't think you'll see any companies go that route from the current crop of prepro's of the last 3-4 years. The ones that do offer this kind of upgrade will tend to suffer in the overall sound quality anyways (ie Anthem.) Or, they are highly upgradeable in the first place (ie Theta.)

With a full complement of board upgrades and software, you're really only left with an I/O chassis and a sweet case. The real cost of development is in those boards and software to properly implement the boards.

The upgrade that everyone wants would likely cost as much as a new unit. The case and I/O panel on the back are not the real expensive parts to produce.

As an upgrade pushes above a grand or even two grand, the lure will be much less appealing and buying a new unit makes more sense.

[Vince Helm]

Thanks for sharing what is most likely the truth; meaning that Parasound will not offer major upgrades to the C1/C2.

WOW, that is a little hard to swallow and does chap my ass a bit (not you Brent) as one of the reasons I spent $8000.00+ on the Halo gear was because Parasound really pushed the future upgrade path/idea. One more reason to go back to two channel!

Thanks for the honest assesment of the future. We need to hear more straight talk like this and I for one appreciate that!!!!!!

Kind regards
Vince

[bhuskins]

Meaning that Parasound will not offer major upgrades to the C1/C2

I'm saying that I wouldn't count on it and I'm basing this strictly on opinion and not inside info. BUT, I wouldn't completely close the door on the idea either.

One of the reasons I spent $8000.00+ on the Halo gear was because Parasound really pushed the future upgrade path/idea.

How has Parasound pushed this? I'll press you to find it anywhere in print or even in an email (directly from the company) any such pushing going on straight from Parasound. I've never once heard them promise or guarantee any sort of upgrades. Dealers on the other hand are a little different for sure.

They have updated the software substantially and now offer a seamless HDMI switching (not decoding) solution as an upgrade. BUT, at some point you make a new model to keep up in the industry. Look at the AVC-2500...the predecessor to the C1 and C2. It had several minor upgrades along the way and the last thing they released was the EX processing module to create the back channels in a stand alone box. The funny thing is that the C1/C2 still processes everything that can be bought today. Even the new HD discs aren't using the new formats yet because no one can utilize them if they did.

I try to keep it real and find it hard to see why you would be chapped due to the possibility of no more upgrades to the C1/C2 (which may or may not be true.) Although we had to wait on PLIIx, we still go it and it's one of the best implementations in the industry. That upgrade didn't come cheap to Parasound, but how much did you guys pay for it?

If you were sold on the Halo brand to begin with then stick with it and if a new processor comes out from them that has everything you want, be 1st in line to buy it. Offset the cost with the sale of your C2. The AVC-2500 still fetches close to $1000 on eBay and Audiogon. Your C2 won't be scrap metal any time soon. Trading up is really no different than physically upgrading your specific unit. It just a matter of who handles the transactions. I take trades occasionally as do other dealers or you can outright sell it. Any way you handle it...it's a win/win in the long run.

[Chris D]

I too find it funny that we have brand new high-def audio formats with Blu-Ray and HD-DVD, but they're not being encoded on discs, players aren't using the technology, and processors don't yet have the decoding ability. So I keep in mind what my ideal GOAL is for the industry, but realize that Parasound isn't exactly neglecting current technologies.

[Peter Nielsen]

How has Parasound pushed this? I'll press you to find it anywhere in print or even in an email (directly from the company) any such pushing going on straight from Parasound. I've never once heard them promise or guarantee any sort of upgrades. Dealers on the other hand are a little different for sure.

That is true. Parasound has never promised that upgrades will be available.

I can see where Vince is coming from: In the past Parasound offered upgrades for the AVC-2500, and the C1/C2 does have the expansion slot on the rear panel.

From what I've read here on this forum and in other places, it seems like some people take for granted that the expansion slot on the C1/C2 is going to be used. What they don't realize is that the expansion slot is part of the Titan design (I remember seeing another make of processors based on Titan v6 that has the exact same slot on the backside). It was not something Parasound put there because they planned to provide upgrades. My guess is that Parasound put it there because they wanted the unit to be ready, should Vinci Labs decide to produce some useful expansion/upgrade part for the Titan 6 platform...

Obviously Vinci Labs moved on to gen 7, and will probably not produce any expansion cards for gen 6...

Peter

[slayer]

What are you rolling with now Peter?

[psychdoc]

Brent,
I guess I’m consigned to the fact that I will need to buy a new pre/pro sooner than I’d hoped for. The question I would love an answer to: is Parasound even working on ANYTHING that will do all the new tricks that come with the HD DVD or BLURAY on HDMI? I really would like to stay with Parasound due to my recent and very positive experience I had while getting my 7100 repaired but I don’t want to hold out forever. I know hard facts are not available but throw a dog a bone……have you heard any rumors at all? If not with Parasound, who might you suggest in the 5k or less price range in the near (hopefully) future? Thanks, Matt.

[bhuskins]

No one can implement or even try to create a product upgrade for any product out there now until 1.3 fully settles out and the new Dolby and DTS standards settle out. This includes the creation of new gear too. The chips necessary to implement all this announced technology are not even available in developer kits and much less in quantity for production. The simple fact is that you need to think 2008 at the earliest and not now by all means. Some companies will start talking about it in 2007 but won't deliver until 2008 and most likely not even until 2009.

BR & HDDVD have had lack luster debuts as well and NONE of the software even has the new formats encoded on it. This doesn't get manufacturers excited about investing a bunch of money now while it's unproven.

Once you see Denon and Pioneer offer Receivers that utilize the full capability of 1.3 HDMI (including the color enhancements and native bitstream transmission) by offering native conversion of DTS Master Audio and Dolby HD to the amps or preouts without PCM conversion, etc. then you'll see other companies follow as well. They are always the 1st, just not the best. It's just not a great time to upgrade a prepro if HDMI, BR/HDDVD and Dolby HD/DTS Master Audio are your driving forces and it won't be for 2 years.

You guys can quote this as the first prediction of 2007 from Media Design!

[psychdoc]

Thanks Brent. I guess that will just give me more time to save and start the process of convincing the wife that an upgrade is necessary but not for a WHOLE TWO YEARS, which makes the 7100 old at that point and an upgrade even more necessary. Let the spin begin.

[Vince Helm]

I'm saying that I wouldn't count on it and I'm basing this strictly on opinion and not inside info. BUT, I wouldn't completely close the door on the idea either.

How has Parasound pushed this? I'll press you to find it anywhere in print or even in an email (directly from the company) any such pushing going on straight from Parasound. I've never once heard them promise or guarantee any sort of upgrades. Dealers on the other hand are a little different for sure.

I try to keep it real and find it hard to see why you would be chapped due to the possibility of no more upgrades to the C1/C2 (which may or may not be true.) Although we had to wait on PLIIx, we still go it and it's one of the best implementations in the industry. That upgrade didn't come cheap to Parasound, but how much did you guys pay for it?

If you were sold on the Halo brand to begin with then stick with it and if a new processor comes out from them that has everything you want, be 1st in line to buy it. .

Hi Brent,

Please know how much I value your experience in the hifi world, your insights into the Halo line and the time you put into this forum. So much so that I hope to start buying gear from you as soon as I am able. I do not wish to squabble over the upgrade issues that I (and some others) might have, but I would like to share why I thought more upgrades were coming.

Perhaps I should have not used the word "pushed". You are correct about the dealer overstating the upgradeability of the C1/C2. Perphaps I am the kind of man Simon and Garfunkel portray in thier song The Boxer with the lyric "Still, a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards all the rest."

Back in 2003 I embarked on a journey to upgrade my old Sony ES pre/pro with a "super receiver" in the $3,000 range. I fell in love with the Halo line and ended up spending $8000 + on Halo alone. In my research I did talk to a man at Parasound (do not remember his name) and among many other things, we did talk about upgrades in the future as that was an important consideration for me in spending that much money. I read everything I could get my hands on from the AV press in regards to Parasound/Halo. I concede to you that I was a bit naive thinking that the AV press was on my side. However I will quote the following:

DVD Etc... - "The C2 package with its sonic performance... hardware/software upgradeability is quite possibly the most complete processor package in the $4000 arena."

Stereophile Guide to HT - "The C2 is future-forward in every respect..."

This quote is from the Halo by Parasound full line brochure printed and released 2003, page 2 Controller - "while easy upgradability gives you peace of mind knowing that your C1(C2) will not become obsolete."

This quote from the Halo C2 rear panel - "Made in Finland", "Expansion Port For Future Technologies"

This quote from the Halo C2 owners manual page 5, Getting Started - "The digital surround processor engine can also be upgraded. And an expansion port allows for technologies that haven't even been invented yet"

Owners manual, page 62, C2 Design Overview - "Our design brief for the Halo... provide for future technical developments..." page 63, C2 Design Overview - "Finally, the C2 is highly upgradable: Its operational software can be upgraded or replaced via a built-in RS-232 serial port, its custom DSP engine is replaceable, and an expansion port stands ready to accept other technologies yet to come."

In my mind Parasound has put into print the idea that this product can and will undergo upgrades: both software and hardware.

As Peter stated, Parasound is ultimately subservient to Vinci Labs and the Titan 6 design. Did I know that in 2003, No. Did Parasound infer to this in any print form, No. Did Parasound have to imply upgrades in the owners manual, No. Did Parasound have to label the expansion port "expansion port for future technologies" No, they could have left it blank or called it a service port.

Sorry to all, but the idea that my C2 might not be upgradable does chap my back side a bit.

I do understand that Parasound is in business to make a profit and wish only the best for them!!!!!! I know that hardware upgrades might be costly to Parasound and some portion of that cost must be absorbed and also passed on to us.

Could they offer the upgrades individually $--- for the DSP, $--- for the DAC, $--- for the HDMI 1.3?????

I was one of the first in line to buy the C2 and that experience has tought me to wait for the second manufacturing batch to be released.

My new C2 sounds great, I love it and could not imagine being without it! Feature wise, I am very happy.

I would love to buy the matching D3, but?

I have put my trust in Parasound. I can only hope and trust that they will do the right thing and release some worthwhile, quality upgrades and not just take the easy way out. I do not think that I would buy another $4000 pre/pro from Parasound knowing that they "might" not support it as stated in the owners manual in regards to hardware upgrades.

WOW, that was a lot more than I was ready to write. Brent please keep up the great work!!! Peter, Please keep posting in the Club Halo!!! I love all you guys and thanks

Kind regards
Vince

[mikepinkerton]

I recall a time when getting the newest audio decoders and features like advanced video switching meant investing in high-end $$ products and consumers had to wait years for them to trickle down to the mainstream. Now it seems like every $40 budget receiver has every bell and whistle, and maybe one day we'll see them in high-end products.

Is my memory corrupt?
-Mike