new htm3s centre. sound question

[alastairh]

Hi all,

I have just purchased an htm3s to replace my LCR600, to sit with my front 703's and rear 603's. They are run off an arcam avr300, with the 6+7 spare channels biamping the 703's and all have been calibrated in correctly.

My question is concerning the audible volume of the centre when listening to dvd's or HDTV; it seems lower than the 703's by quite some way. Is this due to the lack of run-in compared to the older 703's or the lack of extra power from no biamping?

There is a big difference during quieter dialog scenes, when i have to turn up the volume to hear the centre clearly, to turning it down when soundtrack or effects kick in. To be honest something muct be wrong as the LCR600 sounded better

Any ideas or recommendations would be great. It looks good, know it should sound good but clutching at straws to make it perfect.

Best

Alastair

[Aldo]

I don't really know your receiver but it shure has pink noise right?
Then buy a Radioshack sound pressure level metter and set every speaker to 70dBs!
That way you can be shure every speaker is getting the same volume!

[alastairh]

The speakers have all been set up with the test tone and meter to all be the same. That is the odd thing. It is more of a tone/frequency thing i am guessing due to more power being need.....i think....

Alastair

[Kobus]

It certainly has nothing to do with bi-amping, in my opinion.

Kobus

[KRC]

That is interesting as that is the same route I was thinking of going. I have 703's (new purchase) and running a LCR 60 for the centre and as I am told and read about, the centre during movies produces approx 75% of the sound, so I was going to upgrade to the HTM3s (being the equal to a sideways 804)also to get past the centre channel speakers in between the line (700 and HTM4). You have checked it out using a sound meter and if the problem with sound is that obvious maybe something internal in wrong. Not much help, but I have an interest in further responses.

Kevin

[beden1]

Hi all,

I have just purchased an htm3s to replace my LCR600, to sit with my front 703's and rear 603's. They are run off an arcam avr300, with the 6+7 spare channels biamping the 703's and all have been calibrated in correctly.

My question is concerning the audible volume of the centre when listening to dvd's or HDTV; it seems lower than the 703's by quite some way. Is this due to the lack of run-in compared to the older 703's or the lack of extra power from no biamping?

There is a big difference during quieter dialog scenes, when i have to turn up the volume to hear the centre clearly, to turning it down when soundtrack or effects kick in. To be honest something muct be wrong as the LCR600 sounded better

Any ideas or recommendations would be great. It looks good, know it should sound good but clutching at straws to make it perfect.

Best

Alastair

I have the same setup as your speakers. You may want to set the center channel speaker to large. And/or, if your pre-amp has the option, try using the Dialogue enhancing option. If your center channel is above or below the mids/tweeters of your 703s, I angled (up in my case) the front of the speaker which made a big difference. I used a pair of wood door stops that I got at Home Depot. These have rubber pads on top and bottom.

[alastairh]

After a weekend of listening to DVD's and sat TV, i really enjoy the difference in experience this speaker has over the LCR600. Overall it is more involving and cinematic, especially during sound effects and music sections, i,e the typical booms and bangs of adventure films.

However, when the mood swaps to quiet dialogue there is still a drop in delivery which means i have to turn up the volume. The calibration is done via the Arcam amplifiers pink tone and all is set to match at 75. It is like a compression of dialogue frequencies rather than the normal loud bass option. There are no options on the amp for dialogue. And all speakers are only 3m's away from the listening position...

The HTM3s tweeter is only about 20cms lower than the 703's and is about head height when seated. I will angle it up a touch to see how that works and adjust the uprights toe-in to see if the room can help. I still think it is going to be the lack of similar power given to the centre as the 703's, but i cant change that unfortunately.

All of this is just seeking to get it perfect. Even as it is i would strongly recommend the upgrade i have done to anyone in a similar situation.

Any other thoughts and directions appreciated.

Thanks

[scanido]

I agree the HTM3S is a wonderful center speaker. I really had nothing to a/b it to and when i first got mine it was a night and day difference.

The problem you have may be caused by the Dolby Digital or Dynamic Range setting. You may have this set to MAX which would vary the loudness greatly from dialog to sound effects. Try setting to Normal or MIN which would keep the dialog and effects at a closer level.

Steve

[alastairh]

Thanks Steve. That sounds like a sensible direction to try. From distant memory there is a function for this on my amp but i am not sure what it is set to so that is tonights job!!

Alastair

[shades]

Try the dynamic range on the DVD player as well. Try this next part during the day.Turn the volume up a bit until the center speaker has the sound you need, now when explosions and or sound effects come into to the scene (from the left and right speaker) they should startle you being much more exaggerated than the dialouge, then adjust your dynamic range or DD until they sound about the same. I use this when i'm watching movies late in the night.

Hope this helps and Keep us posted

Peter

[alastairh]

Well i went home and had some success. There was no dynamic range option on the DVD or amp but i did reread the manual that came with the speaker! Enlightenment....

As i cannot bi amp the centre i have to single wire and use the jumper extensions provided. (Interestingly the manual recommends biamping or biwiring for this speaker). On a three way speaker, the cable from the amp should go into the top higher freq terminals and then the links down. I had mine into the bottom set and when changed there was noticable improvement. I would have thought it was nonsense if i had been told but it worked an absolute treat.

I also angled the front of the speaker up slightly and that added to the joy. So, all achieved and a lesson learnt. If such a small rearrangement can make an improvement then i do believe bi amping the centre will also be of benefit... next project.

Thanks for the assistance and hope the above may help someone out.

Alastair

[EastCoaster]

The problem you have may be caused by the Dolby Digital or Dynamic Range setting. You may have this set to MAX which would vary the loudness greatly from dialog to sound effects. Try setting to Normal or MIN which would keep the dialog and effects at a closer level.

Steve

Just out of curiosity, why would the Dynamic Range setting affect dialogue discreetly? I understand that changing this setting increases dialogue and sound effects together. So setting it to normal or minimum may muffle the dialogue even more - no?

[scanido]

Not 100% sure on what goes on from a technical standpoint, but it can be a variable to look into for the OP.

[shades]

I don't think it effects the center like it does with the other channels. I can turn mine up or down on the fly and it seems not to effect the center channel. I may be wrong but i think it just brings the effects lower of the FLR channel. It may effect the surrounds and sub too but i hear the biggest difference from the fronts

[EastCoaster]

I don't think it effects the center like it does with the other channels. I can turn mine up or down on the fly and it seems not to effect the center channel. I may be wrong but i think it just brings the effects lower of the FLR channel. It may effect the surrounds and sub too but i hear the biggest difference from the fronts

I agree - my receiver does the same. I find that the best way to tweak the set-up if I'm not happy with the dialogue coming from my center, is simply increase the output on the center. Fixes the issue, every time.