Amp for 803s or 804s... Mac SS or RB-1080?

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  • argomart
    Junior Member
    • Nov 2006
    • 2

    Amp for 803s or 804s... Mac SS or RB-1080?

    I used to own a pair of B&W 703s and drove it with a McIntosh MA6500 solid state amp. It sounded great in a 12 x 12 room (9ft ceilings); more power than I could most of the time.

    I had always planned on trading up to the 804s, but through an odd fluke, the dealer allowed me to go with a pair of 803s (the non-diamond version) instead, for the same price. What I initially thought was a godsend, has turned out to be less than ideal.

    First of all, the Mac amp does not do the speakers complete justice. The mid and high end is as expected, just wonderful, but the low end, while ample, does not have the impact that I had with the 703s. Regardless of what the B&W specs say, I believe the 803s are much hungrier than the 703s.

    Second, the 803s are just too large in three ways: 1) They are much physically larger than the 804s. 2) They require a much larger soundstage, e.g. they must sit pretty far from room’s walls and corners, making them very difficult to place unless you have a really large room, and/or have latitude to move furniture to less than ideal places. 3) Finally, I never thought I would say this, but they have too much bass for even my tastes, at least with my room characteristics.

    I plan on trading down to 804s eventually; Do you gurus think the Rotel RB-1080 will do a better job of driving my current 803s, and my eventual 804s, than my current Mac amp?

    I was told that Rotel makes high current amps better suited to the 803s and 804s. I am into two channel audio, sourced from a CD player.
  • Eliav
    Senior Member
    • Jul 2005
    • 484

    #2
    Originally posted by argomart
    I used to own a pair of B&W 703s and drove it with a McIntosh MA6500 solid state amp. It sounded great in a 12 x 12 room (9ft ceilings); more power than I could most of the time.

    I had always planned on trading up to the 804s, but through an odd fluke, the dealer allowed me to go with a pair of 803s (the non-diamond version) instead, for the same price. What I initially thought was a godsend, has turned out to be less than ideal.

    First of all, the Mac amp does not do the speakers complete justice. The mid and high end is as expected, just wonderful, but the low end, while ample, does not have the impact that I had with the 703s. Regardless of what the B&W specs say, I believe the 803s are much hungrier than the 703s.

    Second, the 803s are just too large in three ways: 1) They are much physically larger than the 804s. 2) They require a much larger soundstage, e.g. they must sit pretty far from room’s walls and corners, making them very difficult to place unless you have a really large room, and/or have latitude to move furniture to less than ideal places. 3) Finally, I never thought I would say this, but they have too much bass for even my tastes, at least with my room characteristics.

    I plan on trading down to 804s eventually; Do you gurus think the Rotel RB-1080 will do a better job of driving my current 803s, and my eventual 804s, than my current Mac amp?

    I was told that Rotel makes high current amps better suited to the 803s and 804s. I am into two channel audio, sourced from a CD player.
    I would not hurry up and blame the bass response on your amplifier. you will be surprised how correct positioning of your 803s may change the sound significantly including the lower frequencies . I know guys who are driving 802d speakers with a 100watt amplifiers and are very happy with the sound.this is not to say that a more powerful high end amp. will not sound better. I suggest you start with position experiments ( away or closer to rear and side walls mainly) before going to step 2 ( amp change/ speakers downgrade)
    Regards
    Eliav
    :T Socrat

    Comment

    • joetama
      Senior Member
      • May 2006
      • 786

      #3
      I would agree, positioning speakers can make a BIG difference. You most likely have enough power. How do you have them positioned right now?
      -Joe

      Comment

      • akhter
        Senior Member
        • Jun 2005
        • 266

        #4
        Originally posted by argomart
        I used to own a pair of B&W 703s and drove it with a McIntosh MA6500 solid state amp. It sounded great in a 12 x 12 room (9ft ceilings); more power than I could most of the time.

        I had always planned on trading up to the 804s, but through an odd fluke, the dealer allowed me to go with a pair of 803s (the non-diamond version) instead, for the same price. What I initially thought was a godsend, has turned out to be less than ideal.

        First of all, the Mac amp does not do the speakers complete justice. The mid and high end is as expected, just wonderful, but the low end, while ample, does not have the impact that I had with the 703s. Regardless of what the B&W specs say, I believe the 803s are much hungrier than the 703s.

        Second, the 803s are just too large in three ways: 1) They are much physically larger than the 804s. 2) They require a much larger soundstage, e.g. they must sit pretty far from room’s walls and corners, making them very difficult to place unless you have a really large room, and/or have latitude to move furniture to less than ideal places. 3) Finally, I never thought I would say this, but they have too much bass for even my tastes, at least with my room characteristics.

        I plan on trading down to 804s eventually; Do you gurus think the Rotel RB-1080 will do a better job of driving my current 803s, and my eventual 804s, than my current Mac amp?

        I was told that Rotel makes high current amps better suited to the 803s and 804s. I am into two channel audio, sourced from a CD player.
        When I bought my N804, the dealer had them hooked up to a Mac receiver (not a power amp), and it was honestly the best sound I had ever heard out of them. Since then, I have heard the same model speakers with Arcam (my current setup), Naim, Rotel, Denon (sad but true), but imho nothing came close to that special Mac sound. I intend to upgrade to Mac power amp as soon as budget allows it. I would consider any Rotel amp a downgrade from my current Arcam setup.

        Comment

        • argomart
          Junior Member
          • Nov 2006
          • 2

          #5
          The positioning is indeed important, but the N803s have been moved to every which way at this point, so I think I've exhausted that for the time being. Cognizant that I am sacrificing extended bass, the move to N804s is also to better my living room, where the N803s require much more space from the wall/corners than N804s (thank you eliav).

          However, joetama, where can I get more info on 'knocking them down with negative waves'? I have not tried that yet...

          akhter, the response from this forum has convinced me to do an A/B test with the Rotel 1080 stand alone amplifier vs my current Mac integrated amp. My McIntosh amp has main in / main out terminals, so I will use the same preamp stage for both the A and the B parts of this test. Granted, the RB1080 is rated at 200 watts per side vs the McIntosh at 125 per side, but I want to see if I can sense the 'high current' strengths the Rotel claims to have. I'll post results here when I'm finished.

          Thank you eliav, joetama, and akhter.

          Comment

          • jim777
            Senior Member
            • Mar 2005
            • 831

            #6
            I also have 703's and a MA6500. I listened to Rotel amps before stretching to a mac. I will be very surprised if you would now prefer a Rotel amp. In the worse case, upgrade your MA6500 to a MA6900 or save for a MC402...

            I guess that positioning will the trick, especially since you have a square room. That is your biggest problem, not amplification. You may need some form of room treatment.

            Comment

            • RobP
              Ultra Senior Member
              • Nov 2004
              • 4747

              #7
              Argomart, what size is your room? or are you in your same 12x12 space? I have 803's and have them in a room that is 13' 7" wide and the soundstage is huge and deep, now I didnt get this until I added some treatment, have you tried any treatment at all? Also you say that you almost have too much bass, have you plugged the ports with the foam plugs?
              Robert P. 8)

              AKA "Soundgravy"

              Comment

              • joetama
                Senior Member
                • May 2006
                • 786

                #8
                Originally posted by argomart

                However, joetama, where can I get more info on 'knocking them down with negative waves'? I have not tried that yet...
                Guess you've never seen Kelly's Heros....

                It's just in the sig, nothing to do with this post or anything.....
                -Joe

                Comment

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