Anyone using a PC as a transport? (Nautilus Series Owners ONLY NEED TO REPLY)

[sugarmedia]

If at all possible I would like to limit this thread to those who are fortunate enough to afford, or were disciplined enough to save for, the higher end of B&W's (Nautilus and above). I say this because I'm more interested in what people hear, than in theory and ongoing debates of the best sound cards, etc. ***Sorry, I know this will exclude many below-the-line B&W owners.****
====================

There has been much recent debate as to whether the sound quality of music played from a PC to an Amplifier is still considered a pure "audiophile quality" source, specifically if you send the music wirelessly through the air to a base station that is connected to your Amplifier. Take my setup for example... I own a 17" Apple PowerBook, with over 6,000 songs stored on it. Much of the music has been added using Apple's Lossless feature when importing from disc. The computer is also hooked up to WIFI, 100% of the time using Apple's Airport Express Base Station with "AirTunes". This means that I can connect a Monster mini-to-RCA left/right audio cable from the Aiport, to my, Musical Fidelity A5 integrated amplifier. An then from my computer, send music wirelessly over to the Base station which sends it to the Amplifer via the Monster mini to RCA.

Lastly, there is alot of prejudice against computer audio right now, and I would like to hear what many of you "Nautilus owners" think about the debate. Is it inferior listening or not? And have you noticed a difference on your Natilus' when comparing sonic quality A/B?

As for me, I am sort of undecided, but do feel it is an inferior music source.

http://www.stereophile.com/asweseeit/435/

http://www.macnewsworld.com/story/32012.html

[DrBoom]

I've tried this a few times, but my PC is about 10m from my pre/pro so I have to use a rather long digital cable. (cheap one too)
My PC has a built in soundcard with a coax digital output, and I connected this to my Rotel RSP1098.
To me, the sound was comparable to that of my $200 Panasonic DVD player, using its optical digital connection.
It was rather flat, and not very detailed when compared to using the digital coax connection of my RCD1072 cd player.

Maybe it's because of the simple onboard nForce2 soundchip, and the results would be better with a dedicated soundcard but to me it's not acceptable as high-end source. At least not in my situation.
It's more than OK if you want to play some background music or MP3's, but for critical listening I still prefer a normal CD player.
I think the difference is even larger if you would use the analog output from the soundcard if you have a normal stereo amplifier, and compared that to the analog output from a good CD player.

[Kens1]

Oops, almost replied because I also know something about this subject, but then I checked and I don't have B&W nautilus speakers.

[audioqueso]

I agree with DrBoom. The sound has is pretty flat with no detail. I have an old computer running as my music server using a Hercules sound card with only a optical connection. Without getting into details, I have setup this computer to be as close as possible to absolutely nothing but a music server. Services, etc, etc... so as to obtain the best possible music possible. I ripped all my CDs using LAME 192VBR standard alt-preset. Using my Audio Technia ATH500 headphones and my stereo, the files sound great. And those are great headphones. But listening on my 805s, that's a different story.

It sounds good. Don't get me wrong, but it completely lacks the depth or sound stage that uncompressed music has. It sounds just as it is... compressed. I compared the original CD to the album on the computer which I ripped. The bass is obviously a little shallow as my compression occurs in the lower frequnecies. The 805 REALLY show an mp3's weakness. But I still keep my music server because for just having some music around the house, it sounds great. Like I stated previously, it does sound good because well... it's the 805, but it's pointless for critical listening since it doesn't give any real detail or depth.

I love having my music server, and have it running all the time, but only for casual listening (like cooking, eating, cleaning, etc). Not when I want to sit down and LISTEN to the music.

[audioqueso]

To me, the sound was comparable to that of my $200 Panasonic DVD player, using its optical digital connection

Exactly!

[ti33er]

hmmm I keep all wireless stuff as far from my hifi as possible...I had a wireless xbox adapter and it interfered with my hifi (I had 805's/ROTEL at the time) - some people claim this doesnt happen but I and one of my best friends both got a low level buzz/ticking noise with WLAN so close to sensitive equipment (took it away about 2m and then it was fine, but that then negates the wireless environment!?)

Unfortunately compressed music SOUNDS like compressed music in general, but this is only really noticeable if you are sitting down and nit-picking?

[Dutch in USA]

copied audio

Interesting topic. Ease over Quality or just putting it in balance?

Some loose remarks: If lossless is really lossless and a copy is really a 100% copy...then why are we always reading in CDR/RW tests that the original sounds a bit more tight, or crips etc etc. So, the format technically might be the perfect, but apparantly the physical result does not always seem to prove this.

I tried to listen to compressed music along the HIFI ride, but the only one I found listenable was the 18 bit DCC format which is dead now (great technique..bad marketing). Even on a walkman I cannot listen to MP3 (maybe in the car...but I do not have any MP3's so.. . After 15 minutes I develop a serious "what the crap is this" condition. I tried to listen to an iPod (pre-lossless), but found no friend there either. I rarely listen to music via my laptop regardless of the format as that is not a good source while heavy programs are using up the available resources. I am using a HD600 to try the different machines around, so that will rule out the "quality" of the ear buds. I am sticking to WAV sofar. The lossless version is more attractive, but I want to listen 1st before I spend that money (learned the hard way..) this is not an easy task as shops do not cater for this. I will wait till I can borrow one for a session.

At home I have three types of listening: real listening, not paying full attention and just having music around me. For the 1st two I will not consider any compression. I use only original CD's/SACD's and run it through my dedicated HIFI set up 8)
The 3rd type can handle just about everything.

I use the analogue output of my CD player going into my amp to drive the 802's. Sometimes I route the digital feed into my Yamaha RX-Z1 which then uses its internal DAC's and sends the pre out signal to the same amp. The difference is enourmous. So by just changing 2 variables: DAC and pre amp, the sound already flattens out.
Using a PC, we are adding the transport as a major component (I assume you use digital out and use the same DAC as you do now). Not to mention the quality of the components, housing etc etc. When you are looking for quality, this cannot be a serious option. However, it adds a lot of flexibility to your set up. It has my interest, but I do not feel like putting up money for it. When I do, it will not run over my HIFI set-up, but over an alternative one. It just does not feel right to run PC audio over my Clase/B&W set-up :wink:

In the end you can also use HIFI rule #1...Less is more :lol: the more components you put between the source and the speaker, the more the sound will differ. Looking at your suggestion you add about 4 transport steps.
It might very well be that your system does not pose you with the same "constraints" that mine does, which might make it a far less "costly" step for you. Without all these variables known, take my opinion for what it is and use it to your advantage, what ever that might be :B

[jahlion]

Although I'm still waiting for my new 802D's, I used to own a Nautilus surround setup and had it connected to my G4 using a digital coax cable and an M-Audio Revolution 7.1 sound card. The Revolution 7.1 card sounds better then many high-end CD players. The problem is with your mini-to-RCA adapter which means the DAC being used is the one in your Powerbook. I'm sorry to say that I doubt Apple used a very high-quality one. The DAC's used in good soundcards like the Revolution 7.1 are 24-bit 192kHz, good enough for DVD-Audio.

I have all my favorite CD's imported into my G5 using iTunes and the Apple Lossless codec. I only have a pair of Sennheiser HD280 Pro headphones to listen to music at the moment, but I find the quality to be just as good as the original AIFF. Since I have a G5 with built-in Toslink output, I can just run an optical cable right to my digital amp for CD or DVD. You can read more about my plans for my new setup on my blog...

http://hd.blogs.friendster.com/setup_hd_workflow/

[PewterTA]

I never have a problem with listening to MP3s because I don't expect them to sound like the original. But I don't think they sound "bad." I've never had the sound stage collapse while doing listening to Mp3s when compressed well. The only thing I really notice is the highs and lows really sound compressed (I compress all mine with VBR at 320K averages). I only really use the Mp3s for a jukebox effect when playing a lot of random music, which is why I don't really mind it, since no critical listening is done... Though if I ever DO do any critical listening, I don't expect perfection since I know what the source really is...compressed!

The one nice thing I've found is I have my Rotel RSP-1098 doing the Mp3 decoding and find it sounds better than my SB Audigy 2x 24-bit 192KHz sound card, the difference is decent enough that I've left the 1098 to do the decoding when I listen (which takes a matter of 2 seconds to set the card to output the PCM stream).

I just don't see why someone would want to do critical listening to stuff from a compressed source.

Oh, and data is data...there's no difference. The reason some people say copied CDs sound "worse" is because of the added jitter effect of a cd being burned at say 24x. IF you can tell the difference and want to see for yourself, copy a disc at the max rate your burner will do, then copy it at 1x. I'll bet the 1x sounds better. Though I'm not a betting man. This is where the quickness (making the sound tight or more crisp) comes into play.

[Dutch in USA]

Oh, and data is data...there's no difference.

Nothing more true, but all digital to digital transfer processes have error correction in them. Changes in data are expected. Depending on the error, the technique used, the components and of course the target, a true 100% copy can in principle still be generated. I for one do not want to waiste time on 1:1 auditioning to see if each transfer is up to spec. Take each source for what it is. When it is a copy of some sorts I do not expect the ultimate, therefore I do not truly audition copied media.

Cheers,
D

[vmardian]

First of all, I don't own a Nautilus, but your other posters are talking about MP3 or on-board audio, neither of which have anything to do with using your computer as a HiFi source.

Why are we talking about lossy compression schemes like MP3? Storing your music on hard disc doesn't mean you have to MP3 it. There are several lossless compression schemes including FLAC, Monkey's Audio (APE), and Apple Lossless. In general, they cut down the size to 50%.

Lossless can be 100% the same as CD audio. Whether or not your drive creates a 100% exact copy depends entirely on the type of software you use. Dirty discs can create errors, and even perfectly clean discs can also create errors. CD audio is designed such that these small errors don't interupt anything. I'm pretty sure no one in the world could hear these errors. If you are paranoid, however, there are several software products that will not be satisfied with errors and they will keep reading the same portion of the disc over and over, up to 100 times (you can actually physically damage your drive by asking it to do this) until it reads through the error and gets the correct data. Two such applications are Exact Audio Copy (EAC) and Plextools (requires that you have a Plextor drive). Look for something to the effect of "paranoid mode" or "secure mode".

If you are serious about this then you will also need a $200 to $500 audio card, OR, you need a digital output and feed that through your DAC.

This is exactly what I want to do, but I need to do more research. For instance, is it better to buy the highest quality sound card money can buy, or use an external DAC and deal with jitter? I'd like to know.

The benefits should be obvious: instant access to your entire library, ability to stream your music over your network to any computer / stereo in the house, ability to transfer your music to portable music players (ipods support Apple lossless, obviously; a few others support FLAC), ability to create play lists.

[mel221]

Here's my setup.
PC with quality M-Audio Card. Optical Out connected to Krell Showcase processor with Krell 2250 Amp. The amp is driving B&W 805N speakers.

FOr software I am using Media Jukebox that is managing my library of 3000 wav files.

For me, maintaining the music in digital form for as long as possible was very important. I believe my wav files to be exact copies of the CD. The Jukebox software copies the digital data from the disk and the data remains digitial until the Showcase processor uses its DAC's to generate the analog signals. I believe the inputs to the showcase processor are the same as if I had a CD player as the digital source.


The results are fantastic. I feel like I have a CD player with only my 3000 songs on a single disk.

[vmardian]

Few questions for you!

May I ask why you chose to go with such a high end card (M-Audio) when you are simply using the digital out? Am I incorrect in assuming that all digital outs are made the same? If so, how are they different? Or perhaps you aren't sure yourself and simply wanted to play it safe by getting the best you could?

Also, why did you choose WAV instead of something like FLAC which saves you 50% space and allows you to tag the music for better display and search capabilities?

Do you think you could achieve better sound quality with a seperates versus your integrated Krell? Was the Krell better value or you do believe keeping it all together results in better sound?

Do you have your songs mirrored on multiple drives? Ripping ~300 CDs must have been tiring!

Thanks.

[Aussie Geoff]

Vmardian,

May I ask why you chose to go with such a high end card (M-Audio) when you are simply using the digital out? Am I incorrect in assuming that all digital outs are made the same? If so, how are they different?

All digital outs are not the same... The enemy of quality in a SPDIF style digital out is jitter - where the digital signal is carrying both the data and the timing and small variations in timing of the signal (jitter) translate to audible distortion (heard at low levels as loss of clarity). The better manufacturers put a huge amount of effort into transmitting and receiving the information with as close to perfect 44.1Khz clocking as possible. Studies have shown jitter (variance in timing) of as little as 1 nanosecond (some say 200 picoseconds!) as creating measurable and (to some ears) audible distortion.

This is why transports sound different, and the digital outs of different CD players, DVD players and sound cards all sound different to many peoples ears...

Geoff

[tmt]

this is exactly the stuff I've been investigating during the last few months!

Disclaimer: all the stuff I mention below is from reading forums, I don't own (yet) any of the soundcards, but I'll report my impressions when I get mine


First: ripping cds to the hard drive to WAV or a lossless compressing format (FLAC, APE) is as good or even better as using a high-end cd player, as vmardian already explained. So you're skipping the cost of an expensive transport.

Second: you need a high-end soundcard. All brands I've seen thusfar in this thread are good, but not good enough for serious hifi.
There are currently only 2 soundcards that are good enough to replace high-end cd players and pre-amps: the Lynxtwo ($1000) and the RME 9632 ($500)
The RME should be a bit more musical than the Lynx card, which sounds more 'clinical'.
These cards are best set-up with their analogue outputs connected directly to the amp, thus skipping a cd player and pre-amp altogether!
Unfortunately the software is the weak point of those PC soundcards. You'll need to control the volume using the pc and you'll have to use output devices like ASIO of kernel streaming, which bypass the evil windows kmixer (which resamples all audio!)
The RME card unfortunately does have some minor issues with volume control, which leaves the Lynxtwo as the best soundcard you can buy.
Some people on avsforum.com claim it' as good as $5000 pre-amps and cd players.
One other alternative is using digital out on those soundcards and use an external DAC, but that's like using a normal pre-amp.

Just search for lynxtwo and RME on avsforum and you'll find tons of info on that subject. I can give you some good threads if you want.

[hired goon]

G'day,

One other alternative is using digital out on those soundcards and use an external DAC, but that's like using a normal pre-amp.

That's what I intend to do -- a digital out direct to my Rotel RSP-1068 pre-amp. I don't trust the noisy environment of a PC to produce a decent analog signal. I'm guessing that the DAC in the pre-amp is better than what I'd find in a soundcard anyway.

Of course, using a pre-amp for external decoding of PCM and AC3/DTS signals means that you don't want to fiddle about with the pre-amp. If you select "music jukebox" or "dvd player" on the HTPC, then you don't want to also have to make a corresponding input selection on the HTPC. If the HTPC audio signals are fed into one source, then that source better take digital input, which means SPDIF output from the HTPC. But as Aussie Geoff notes, the trick is getting a soundcard that can send jitter-free digital signals (without upsampling or Dolby Digital encoding).

--Geoff

[weijst]

If at all possible I would like to limit this thread to those who are fortunate enough to afford, or were disciplined enough to save for, the higher end of B&W's (Nautilus and above). I say this because I'm more interested in what people hear, than in theory and ongoing debates of the best sound cards, etc. ***Sorry, I know this will exclude many below-the-line B&W owners.****

Sorry for 'clouding up' your thread here ( :demon: ) as I do not own Nautilus speakers thus, according to you, am less interested in what I hear than in theory and ongoing debates of the best sound cards, etc. (beyond any form of logic :huh: ).
IMO your opening is ridiculous, naïve and insulting. Next time you could try looking back at your post before hitting the 'submit' button...

[tmt]

I agree with weijst, I understand that you only want to look for a high-end solution, but this is not the way to explain that!

And btw you're missing on a lot of people experiences by 'excluding' them.

[sugarmedia]

Weijst, Lets not cry on a thread when no one cares. Let me guess, you don't own the Nautilus series. For god sakes it's just a forum...get over yourself! I wanted to hear from the people on here who have the top of the line B&W's...is that so difficlut for you to comprehend??

If you don't like it, you may certainly start your own thread.

[Jeff]

surgarmedia, it's important for the site, we play nice with others.

[junior77blue]

Well that's a bit redundant to start 'another' thread dealing with the same topic.

And actually a lot of us do care.

But your not here to make friends and neither am I. Personally, if you have natilus speakers why would you ever use a computer over a wireless connection? Maybe you should compress it down to 96k and just stream it. Go out and buy some nice KLH speakers and save yourself some money! At least that way you won't be able to tell the difference.

[vmardian]

Weijst, Lets not cry on a thread when no one cares.

Let me guess, you don't own the Nautilus series.

I wanted to hear from the people on here who have the top of the line B&W's...is that so difficlut for you to comprehend??

I care.

Why do you have to guess? He said he doesn't own them.

People who own top of the line B&W speakers probably never consider doing what you are considering doing. Perhaps its because they don't want to believe that a $1000 audio card can perform the same as their $5000 CD Player?

[Kens1]

With a thread opening like that I'm glad I don't own B&W Nautilus speakers - I would be too embarrased to reply. :roll:

[Mia]

I am curious about this too (and I own Nautilus), but many of you have destroyed this thread. I think it was all taken out of context and he only wanted to know if there is an audible difference on speakers where you could actually hear a difference.

Boys, ironicallly, your pen#s is weighing you down.

Back to my question. I recently inherited a pair of 802's and I'm wondering if I can take my dell laptop and play music through them? Some of you have mentioned getting sound cards, right? Will this sound card fit in my computer or is this another expense, that I'm not really wanting to take on at this point.

Thank you,



Mia Harpel

[Kens1]

My mistake again. I forgot you can only hear differences on B&W speakers because as we all know they are be all - end all of high fidelity. Give me a break.
Surely people who have experimented with this, dare I say, without B&W speakers, and can hear a difference in musical quality. Then logic would suggest you will also hear a difference (maybe more pronounced) on B&W speakers.
Some people do indeed need to get over themselves.

[Mia]

Kensi, isn't this Club B&W? Can you telll me what you are doing? you comment alot, but haven't mentioned what you use. I am hoping to get my music playing by later this evening.

Thank you,


Mia Harpel

[vmardian]

It's in his public profile.

[vmardian]

Back to my question. I recently inherited a pair of 802's and I'm wondering if I can take my dell laptop and play music through them? Some of you have mentioned getting sound cards, right? Will this sound card fit in my computer or is this another expense, that I'm not really wanting to take on at this point.

First of all, your laptop already has sound, so there need not be any expense. If you want decent sound, however, you'll have to upgrade. No, a sound card will not fit in your laptop. You will need to find a PCMCIA audio card. Presumably, it would have better sound than your on board audio. I don't know of any "HiFi" PCMCIA cards, althought I've never looked for one. You could try for a PCMCIA card that has a digital out and then use an external DAC. If I had to guess, I would say that this would produce better sound. PCMCIA cards are tiny.

Edit: Forget this and go with USB like the next poster suggests.

[jahlion]

to clairify my original post:

I couldn't hear the difference between uncompressed AIFF/WAV and Apple Lossless on my old N802's when using a good PCI soundcard with coaxial digital cable output to my digital amp.

If you are using a laptop you could use an external USB/FireWire device like this http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_u...ater-main.html

The problem I have with using the Apple AirPort Express with Air Tunes and Apple Airport Express Stereo Connection Kit w/Monster Cables is that I don't know about the quality of the mini-to-RCA or Toslink. I don't even understand how they convert the mini to Toslink???

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0002GDIII/ref=pd_sbs_e_1/103-3319644-8487022?v=glance&s=electronics

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B0002GDQZI/ref=pd_bxgy_text_1/103-3319644-8487022?v=glance&s=electronics&st=*

Summary:

There is no problem with using the computer as transport or using the Apple Lossless codec (which fits the Wi-Fi bandwidth), but try using a good soundcard or external device. Stay away from mini RCA jacks!

[mel221]

>> May I ask why you chose to go with such a high end card (M-Audio) when you are simply using the digital out?

In the beginning, my system was not a high quality system and my receiver did not have digital in. So I needed better than average DACs on the sound card. The best I could afford at the time was this M-Audio card (something 96). As I upgraded my system and needed digital out, this card had what I needed.


>> Also, why did you choose WAV instead of something like FLAC which saves you 50% space and allows you to tag the music for better display and search capabilities?

I didn't know about FLAC(and still don't). Storage is not a concern. As for tagging, Media jukebox tracks everything I need.


>> Do you think you could achieve better sound quality with a separates versus your integrated Krell? Was the Krell better value or you do believe keeping it all together results in better sound?

The Krell showcase processor is not integrated(as I understand the term integrated). The processor had 3 things I needed; Quality decoding of the digital input, quality DACs for reproducing the signal and a remote for volume control. Since this signal is all digital on the PC, there is no volume control at the PC. The AMP is the Krell 2250.


>> Do you have your songs mirrored on multiple drives?

Good Question. NO!!!
In my opinion, mirrored drives does not provide a secure media for my valuable digital library. (music, photos, etc). Backup is the only answer. Periodically, I copy my digital library to a large USB Disk. I keep a backup at my home and another copy at my brother's house.


Ripping ~300 CDs must have been tiring!

As I only like some songs on a CD, I have ripped over 800 CDs. The process has actually been enjoyable as I would by a CD for 1 song and discovery 4 or 5 others that I enjoy as well. I have every song I like that I know of in my library. I still have all the originals CDs, but recently disposed of the Jewel boxes.

[Aussie Geoff]

Folks,

This thread has got way too intense....

Some lessons learnt here for many I think

Play nice or I'll need to lock this...

I'm only leaving it open now becuase (Nautilus owner or otherwise) the PC / digital / RF transmitted etc aspects of the topic are interesting.

Geoff

[Jason R]

Is it better ? is it worse ?

I don't think the brand of speakers anyone owns are going to be as telling as the source components you are used to, as well as whether you intend to listen critically. Personally i find it tinny and not enjoyable, again my tastes plus i am super fussy about recording qualityon cd's.

Sugarmedia if i remember correctly you purchased some Martin Logan's, what does it sound like on those ?

[PewterTA]

If you have a notebook I would recommend the PCMCIA Sound Blaster® Audigy® 2 ZS Notebook which is a 24-bit/192KHz, 104db SNR soundcard that fits in your PCMCIA slot. You'll get better quality from that than you will with the USB audio stations. Though don't get me wrong, the M-Audio cards are great!

Mel221, Mirroring is a GREAT way to a keep your songs on a disk (well disks) if you are worried about your drive dying on you. If you have SCSI HDs (or even SATA now) it will take twice the HDs, but if one drive dies, the other will still have the data, and then rebuild the new drive.

The way I do it, since I backup both my CD with an image of the disc (incase of scratches or loss or theft) as well as a 320Kbps Mp3, I backup all my data onto a tape backup. I bought a Quantum SDLT320 (160GB naitive, 320GB compressed) to keep all the music secure incase a HD dies on me. I then do full and differential backups on the files (incase I change something like an ID3 tag on an Mp3 or something). This has worked really well for keeping all the files safe with little to no worries about loosing anything.

[L01]

I use a fanless-Athlon-PC with a
A.) E-MU 0404-Soundcard as bit-correct digital-out
B.) Benchmark DAC1-Dac to convert to analog
C.) T+A integrated amp -> 802

For ripping I use EAC (exactaudiocopy) in secure-mode and correct offset into flac (a lossless compression-format).

As software I use foobar with ASIO-output (bit-correct: Windows destroys sound, so it has to be bypassed) and padding to 32bit-output.

The control-interface I built myself to manage my something like 500CDs on the box (growing every day). I attached some screenshots of the software, which I use over a wireless-palm-PC (normally).

Sound is perfect in sense of: Some of my friends also use this software-configuration (all hifi-fans) and their CD-player is not used anymore (some Teacs, Denons, ...).

cheers
Andreas

[vmardian]

I would love to get more information about the software you use, specifically the control-interface you built yourself.

[L01]

I would love to get more information about the software you use, specifically the control-interface you built yourself.

Software used:
A.) Apache as Webinterface
B.) PHP as programing-language (control and Admin-section (importing directories))
C.) MYSQL as database to keep the albums/tracks (including tags etc.)

D.) Foobar (the best audio-player for PC) with ASIO-out (everything else makes sound flat and distorted imho).

The software itself is foolproof in sense of: Once installed, no worries anymore.

You can control the musicbox via wireless-lan with a PC or Palm/PocketPC.

Atm. I only implemented support for FLAC (flac.sourceforge.net), but other formats like APE, MP3 (bbrr), ACC etc. would be implemented in seconds each (formats are open).

The software is not available on the market, because I have no time supporting it.

What would you like to know? How it works? How it looks? How to get?

[vmardian]

That sounds great. Software is the only thing I'm stuck on. I'm looking for a front end / player combo with support for FLAC. I'm considering J. River Media Center (although it does too much) as well as foobar. Are there any others I should look at?

I've actually just purchased the exact same DAC as you and I've purchased the Chaintech AV-710 card for CDN $50 shipped. Apparently this also has bit-perfect optical out. From the DAC the signal will go to a Rotel Integrated and then B&W CDM 7NTs. When using the Benchmark DAC-1 would there be any difference between my Chaintech and your Emu?

[BlazeMaster]

I'm too very interested in this topic because I'm thinking about doing the same route with the HTPC since I just picked up a Front Projector as well. Am I allowed to ask questions here, since I only have the 600s B&Ws? Or should I start a new thread only allowing people with the lower B&Ws to comment?

Regarding the particular sound card to use for decent audio performance, I've read alot of posts on the AVS forum comparing the SQ through an Audigy vs. M-Audio sound cards, most people find that Audigy tends to be the choice for PC gamers and M-Audio handles music and movies slightly better?

[tmt]

L01, how do you handle volume control? The DAC1 has a volume knob but it isn't remote controlled so either you have to stand up every time to change the volume or you have to build it in your seat or something :P

[L01]

L01, how do you handle volume control? The DAC1 has a volume knob but it isn't remote controlled so either you have to stand up every time to change the volume or you have to build it in your seat or something :P

Volume-Control is possible to integrate, but not done yet.

My DAC1 is connected to a preamp with a remote-control, still.

[L01]

That sounds great. Software is the only thing I'm stuck on. I'm looking for a front end / player combo with support for FLAC. I'm considering J. River Media Center (although it does too much) as well as foobar. Are there any others I should look at?

Maybe http://www.giantdisc.org/ which is Linux based. Problem I got is, that it is linux based (so soundcard-drivers could be a problem), the import was at least for me unstable and the whole installation was far from being unproblematic. That is why I invested two nights on my software

I've actually just purchased the exact same DAC as you and I've purchased the Chaintech AV-710 card for CDN $50 shipped. Apparently this also has bit-perfect optical out. From the DAC the signal will go to a Rotel Integrated and then B&W CDM 7NTs. When using the Benchmark DAC-1 would there be any difference between my Chaintech and your Emu?

The Chaintech AV-710 is just perfect for digital-out. The E-MU is actually overkill, because it has a very good integrated DAC, which I actually don´t use.... so the Chaintech is perfectly fine.

[L01]

Regarding the particular sound card to use for decent audio performance, I've read alot of posts on the AVS forum comparing the SQ through an Audigy vs. M-Audio sound cards, most people find that Audigy tends to be the choice for PC gamers and M-Audio handles music and movies slightly better?

At the moment you can say, that the E-MU-cards are the best bang for the buck.

I did not compare all of them, but I can say:
RME Digi 96 > Lynx L22 > M-Audio Audiophile 2496
E-MU 0404 (and 1212) > RME Digi 96

and in any case:
Benchmark DAC1 (best buy ever) > E-MU 0404

Non-pro cards like Audigy are hell for audio, because they can´t bypass windows kmixer (which resamples, and this in a very bad way).

cheers
Andreas

[Romanesq]

To answer the question, yes the actual question

Okay, I just saw this thread and can speak to the question. I currently own the 803 Nautilus, an Apple Powerbook G4 15" and about 6 plus gigs of music that is mostly CDs converted to Apple Lossless via Airport Express.

To provide the answer first: I get excellent sound quality. It's dynamic, detailed, open with great depth in the soundstage. It's not the flat sound you get from internet radio or such.

Now before I continue here's the rest of the system:
McCormack DNA-2 Deluxe Rev. A/platinum (that's 300 refined watts to you)
Space Tech Labs QA 808 (10 tube preamp)
PS Audio P300 with Multiwave II+ (the plus is killer trust me) - I plug the Apple Express into one of the four available ports here and connect to the tube preamp via RCA. I don't know if this helps, but I know it ain't hurtin.

Okay, I also own a Sony SCD777ES SACD player that has been modded twice. Does the wireless tunes beat it? No, but most things aren't going to. Does it sound very good? Absolutely.

Many people are discussing PC computers and cards and I can't comment on that at all. I'm talking about Apple's wireless option using their lossless format. In my system, it's quite enjoyable. I have some files in WMA, MP3 format but these are in the minority. High bit WMA files are superb.

The bottom line: this is a winner. I'm looking at setting up a mini as a wireless server and copy several hundred CDs over to run the jukebox from the laptop. Haven't gotten around to it yet.

So there you have it. In my system, this is quite good and most people would absolutely not know the difference. They would just say, that sounds great. When I've had parties, people love playing the 400 or so songs off the laptop as it allows them easy access and selection. I juggle between the laptop and the Sony player to mix SACD and other CDs into the mix.

No one has said hey, play more stuff from the single player Sony as good as it is and it is excellent especially after the two mods. Even though SACD is even much better than the CD sound, no one complains. :rofl:

[junior77blue]

How do you plan on controlling the 'mini' via the powerbook? I've been considering the same exact thing.

Have you tried using AAC format? How does that compare to lossless format? I typically rip at 160kb AAC, which is great for my ipod, but haven't tried playing it through a wireless connection.

[Romanesq]

Wireless options with B&W Nautilus

How do you plan on controlling the 'mini' via the powerbook? I've been considering the same exact thing.

Have you tried using AAC format? How does that compare to lossless format? I typically rip at 160kb AAC, which is great for my ipod, but haven't tried playing it through a wireless connection.

I haven't made a decision yet on the mini. It may be better to just get an old ibook and maybe an external large fire wire drive. It's on the list of ideas right now. A touch screen I've seen for about $250 is also part of the equation. I'm still awaiting more options on this and also a qc on the hard drive of the mini.

Actually, I've used both before I decided if there was a difference. AAC is fine and is what I'm doing now in order to maintain space. I may go back the other way when I get a more definitive solution.