ratings board at it again :(

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  • Andrew Pratt
    Moderator Emeritus
    • Aug 2000
    • 16507

    ratings board at it again :(

    No sex please, we're Yanks
    Censors don't allow adults to enjoy doing it
    By LOUIS B. HOBSON -- Calgary Sun
    HOLLYWOOD -- Urgent message for James Bond.

    If you come to America, you'll be allowed to have sex but don't you dare enjoy it.

    That's the message the U.S. censors passed on to cinema's most famous spy through Lee Tamahori the director of Bond's newest adventure Die Another Day.

    In order for Die Another Day to keep a PG rating in the U.S., Tamahori had to trim the sex scene between Pierce Brosnan and Halle Berry.

    "In America, the characters are not allowed to show they're enjoying the sex they're having," says Tamahori.

    "The rating board told me in the version I sent them Pierce and Halle appeared to be enjoying themselves too much and that there was too much movement in their love making."

    DVD HAS FULL SEX SCENE

    Tamahori reluctantly trimmed the sex scene so it would meet the requirements of the American ratings board.

    "This trimmed version will play across North America though I doubt we'd have had the same problems in Canada. The original version is playing abroad and will be the one featured on the DVD."

    The New Zealand director, whose films include Once Were Warriors, Mulholland Falls and The Edge, is dismayed by what he feels is disturbing hypocrisy.

    "The message the censors are sending me is that I can pierce a man's brain with a laser but heaven forbid that I should show two adults enjoying sex."

    The producers of George Clooney's sci-fi love story Solaris also found themselves butting heads with the U.S. ratings board.

    Clooney has two brief sex scenes with costar Natasha McElhone.

    In both cases, she is fully clothed but he is naked and lying on his stomach.

    "Apparently it was my bare butt that threatened to get the picture a restricted rating in the U.S. but I think the executives at (20th Century Fox) had as much to do in this case as the ratings board," says Clooney.

    "I don't doubt they asked Fox if they'd be willing to recut the scenes so the cameras did linger on me the entire time and Fox jumped at the chance to have a little controversy.

    "It certainly put a little awareness of Solaris out there."

    Director Steven Soderbergh did not make any changes to the print and on its second submission it was granted a PG rating.

    Clooney jokingly says he "demanded the nude scene. I want equal exposure for male movie stars."

    He does reveal that "in the original script, there was a great deal more nudity. I had no objections. I told Steven Soderbergh I'd do as much as he thought important to the film."

    SLAPPED WITH R RATING

    Both star and director eventually decided to include only two nude scenes.

    "The danger is not in doing movie sex scenes. It's in the selling of them, especially any form of male nudity. You almost assuredly get slapped with a restricted rating and that can greatly influence a film's box-office."

    McElhone reveals she was actually nude in several of the versions of the two scenes.

    "I was as surprised as anyone that Steven chose to use footage in which I was fully clothed. We certainly filmed versions in which I was as naked as George."

    A third sex scene for a holiday movie had U.S. censors raising concerns as well as eyebrows but this time it had nothing to do with nudity.

    In the domestic drama Far From Heaven, Julianne Moore's character discovers her husband played by Dennis Quaid is a homosexual.

    She makes the discovery by walking into his office one night to find him kissing one of his male coworkers.

    According to director Todd Haynes, in order to keep a PG rating for Far From Heaven he couldn't "linger too long on the kiss or come in too close."

    This didn't worry him because "there was never any intention to be sensational. It's meant to be a tender moment for the men and shocking one for Julianne.




  • Lex
    Moderator Emeritus
    • Apr 2001
    • 27461

    #2
    Well, this is a tough one. Certainly to some people, it can wreak of censorship on the one hand. But then, they are not saying they can't put certain elements in films. They are saying if you put them in, then your rating will be bounced to the next higher level at least. No matter how loose the guidelines are. There will always be someone saying, you mean they can't do that!?! That's rediculous!

    As to the don't you enjoy it business, I don't know what to make of that. Maybe a mis-quote. Maybe taken out of context, I don't know. Maybe just mis-stated as to the reason the scene was cut to keep the rating.

    As a parent with a daughter 17, I can say that occasionally, we've seen PG-13 rated films with more in them than I would have cared for, for my daughter to see at the time. I can't give specific examples here as we really haven't been to the movies in a while. But I can say, as a parent, I would rather see to conservative a rating, versus to liberal of one and that includes language.

    So, I have to say kudos to them for doing their rating's job. If everyone doesn't agree with the ratings, then a joint effort to establish new guidelines should be embarked on. But you can't fault them for doing what they are supposed to do and it doesn't mean I would support more liberal policies. Kids don't need to see some stuff, ya know!

    Do I want my daughter seeing men nude? no. Do I want my daughter seeing 2 men kissing? Hell no. Yes, at 17, I realize the days she can see anything she wants at any rating are coming and maybe 17 is old enough for R, is it? But during kids formative years, a parent needs strong guidelines in place to protect them when we can't be there to say, enough, your not watching this.

    I am not sure what your point was to this post Andrew, whether to say, you disagree with the ratings, the don't enjoy it comments, or what. If your looking to see who's conservative, and who's not. All I can say is, put me down to the conservative side when it comes to my daughter that's about raised now.

    Lex
    Doug
    "I'm out there Jerry, and I'm loving every minute of it!" - Kramer

    Comment

    • Andrew Pratt
      Moderator Emeritus
      • Aug 2000
      • 16507

      #3
      the point of the post was to generate discussion I'm likely as conservative as they come but I have to wonder sometimes about the logic behind what gets an R and what doesnt'...it seems we're much more likely to allow violence then sex which IMO isn't something I agree with. Not having kids yet I will likely see things differenlty later but right now I think I'd rather let my kids watch a brief stint of nudity if done properly then to see some guys head blown off. I guess I don't have a problem with the ratings being given since they serve a purpose but I do sometimes wonder if how they're doing it is the right way...afterall didn't someone once say make love not war




      Comment

      • George Bellefontaine
        Moderator Emeritus
        • Jan 2001
        • 7637

        #4
        Well said, Andrew, but once you have children you will appreciate the ratings system. Still I agree that they shouldn't see violence as okay and sex as bad. But as for me, they just better not mess with my DVDs.




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        • efarstad
          Moderator Emeritus
          • Jun 2001
          • 2231

          #5
          I like to see nude people having sex and then they blow each other's heads off! :P J/K...of course. I let them rate um, and then I do some research about the movie. If I think it has any elements I don't support or agree with, then I spent my money elsewhere.

          E





          The Norwegian A/V Nut!
          E-Cinema

          The Norwegian A/V Nut!
          E-Cinema

          Comment

          • Jeff Aguilar
            Senior Member
            • Jun 2001
            • 126

            #6
            This is a really good post. Hopefully as I put my opinion out here, it comes across as to how I mean it.

            I like the rating systems to a certain extent.

            I have two boys, 5 and 8.

            We try very hard to monitor what they see and what they don't see. We also try very hard to make sure about what they hear or do not hear. I guess we are very conservative.

            I do not want to shield them so much that they do not know how to handle the world, but I want to protect them as much as I can. There will be plenty of time for them to be exposed to the things that I want to protect them from. They already have a lot to deal with without some grown up concerns.

            We try really hard not to swear in our house, because I want them to know that there are other words that can be used than swear words. I know they hear them at school and on the bus and EVERYWHERE we go, and on tv, ect, ect... But that doesn't mean that we have to say them in our house.

            I do not think my kids need to deal with same sex relationships right now or with heterosexual sex scenes in movies or much of the violence in movies. Hey, I have not even let my 8 year old watch Jurassic Park yet! We do also try to shield him from violence.

            We really try to stick to PG movies, sometimes. (There is always exceptions to this-like Spiderman that is PG-13) Now that Tim is 8, he is getting some pressure from other kids in the neighborhood about not seeing movies like MIB or JP. I do not want him to picked on, so now is the time we are going to slowing start exposing him to some of this stuff. We have now watched MIB together in a couple of settings, to see how he takes this stuff. I just want to take this stuff slow and be there with him so he really understands that this stuff is not real.

            The ratings help me decide what may or may not be appropriate for him to watch. I still try and watch everything before he does and with him to make sure it is something I want him exposed to in our house. Kids grow up so fast these days and have so much more pressure than they need to. I just want to make sure that he has a chance at a good childhood, not one filled with things that he could deal with later.

            When it comes to exposing our kids to the world; There is a time for everything, the challenge is for us to figure out when that is.

            I am not here to completely shield them from everything until they move out on their own, but to provide a stable and safe place for them to retreat to. A safe place that they can call home. If I can filter some of the junk out and help them have a well rounded perspective on things so that they have the tools to deal with most issues, then I will be happy with the job that I have done raising them.

            I guess it just comes down to be involved with them.

            Maybe I ventured a little off topic? ops:

            Jeff

            Comment

            • George Bellefontaine
              Moderator Emeritus
              • Jan 2001
              • 7637

              #7
              Well said, Jeff. After raising three children, I can understand your thinking and your actions.




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              • Brandon B
                Super Senior Member
                • Jun 2001
                • 2193

                #8
                Originally posted by Jeff Aguilar
                I have two boys, 5 and 8.

                ...

                We really try to stick to PG movies, sometimes. (There is always exceptions to this-like Spiderman that is PG-13)
                I have an almost 5 year old son, and would say you are actually not very conservative. I am somewhat more liberal than you. My kid has seen MIB at home, where we can zap through some parts, but has seen all the Star Wars movies, which he loves. I do feel they are beyond the level of acceptable violence for him, and in fact do not let him see other movies I consider no more violent than these, but really could not wait another few years of shielding him from these when I watch them so frequently.

                We have more than one set of friends though who would not even let their 8 year olds see these and other movies, so I would say you are following a respectable and healthy course. One 5 year old friend of my son's is not allowed to even see anything PG, and if fact his parents prefer that he not see SPirit, the horse movie due to the cavalry attacking the indians village so callously (which I can also understand).

                Out of curiosity, would you allow either boy to see LOTR, either theatrically or at home?

                BB

                Comment

                • Jeff Aguilar
                  Senior Member
                  • Jun 2001
                  • 126

                  #9
                  Brandon,

                  Both of my kids have seen the animated version of Lord of the Rings. I personally LOVE this movie and the books. I think for us, my wife and I, it may be a little too scary for the kids. I cannot wait for them to experience this movie with me someday. I really like the story.

                  My kids are STAR WARS kids. They have seen all the movies, many, many times. In fact, when my wife was pregnant with the younger one is when I got those movies on Laser. We must have watched it 100 times (not really) with my older son. By the time the 2nd one was born, he really knew the music. He would calm down immediately when he heard the music to the movie. When Darth Vader would make his appearance in Star Wars, it use to literally scare my youngest son. It was strange. It did not scare him for the first, maybe 3 years, but then it did. That is when we really had to start RE-THINKING what they were watching. It seems to be a continual process. It changes all the time.

                  One of the things that we really appreciate about movies like Star Wars, is that even though they are being shot and killed, you do not see the GORE. There is definitely more killing in Star Wars than MIB, but the reason why we waited on that was because of the SPLAT factor. I guess.

                  Jeff

                  Comment

                  • David Meek
                    Moderator Emeritus
                    • Aug 2000
                    • 8938

                    #10
                    The one thing we've always stressed to the kids is that what they see on the screen is not reality - it's a movie, and to not take what they see as a proper portrayal of life. 'Course the kids are 15 and 17 now, so censoring is a much less time-consuming job.




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