So, you thought you had a great deal with Net Flix? Well, do ya?

[Lex]

It seems that depends upon how much you use it. sort of a catch 22. To be a great deal, you have to use it enough to make it payout at least what it would cost to rent locally, which granted, that wouldn't be to hard to do. But be a Netflix "Speed renter", that means turn them around as soon as they get here, view them, mail them, make next selection over and over again, and what happens?

you may get "Throttled".

Say a person was renting 18 to 22 DVDs a month. Then, the company's automated system identified him as a heavy renter and begin delaying his shipments to protect its profits.

The same Netflix formula also shoves a person to the back of the line for the most-wanted DVDs, so the service can send those popular flicks to new subscribers and infrequent renters.

The little-known practice, called "throttling" by critics, means Netflix customers who pay the same price for the same service are often treated differently, depending on their rental patterns.

There's a class action suite filed in California:

http://www.cnn.com/2006/US/02/10/netflix.renters.ap/index.html

Sound off, what do you all think about this practice?

Does it seem like this is "Unlimited Rentals" as Netflix claimed?

Oh, you'll note that Netflex changed it's declared policies in Jan this year, you know, the legal mumbo jumbo, I presume in answer to the lawsuite, and disgruntled people from being throttled.

Don't you think that netflix would be better served to treat everyone equal, and just absorb the loss from the lesser percentage that can turn movies around on a dime and return same day or next day?

Of course, Netflix whines about postage being .78 cents per DVD to and from, well, it was part of their original business model. They couldn't anticipate just how many DVDs a person could rent? Oh, I think they could. I mean this is a publically traded company now. I think they knew quite well, it's just they got greedy, and wanted to tweak their profits for shareholders, and I might add, at the Frequent Renter's expense-

[Alaric]

Well.....

My first thought , when Netflix came to my attention , was to sign up and copy as many movies for my library as possible.Now that we all know that's naughty , and all those poor producers and actors are panhandling to make ends meet. My second thought was-you may not always get what you pay for , but you almost never get what you don't pay for. If it sounds too good to be true it probably is.
However , Netflix left themselves open for retaliation when they were "throttling". It was greed on thier(Netflix) part and greed on the part of those who wanted 20+ movies a month for a "too good to be true" price. The problem with most cases of greed is the greedy seldom look at who has the most to lose-in this case Netflix. The profit in movie rentals is finite-the amount saved by not having brick & mortar stores will be somewhat balanced by not having instant availability and the "browsing" experience-also , you don't need to be online or even speak English to recognize a Blockbuster sign and rent movies. Netflix is a long ways from the market saturation BlkBstr has.I think both parties wanted more than a fair business model can offer. Most new ventures fail because of that. In the end , Netflix adjusted their policies to cover their behinds and they will absorb the cost of the lawsuit-treble damages if awarded in a California court-and move on. Some people at Netflix will probably end up looking for a job because they started "throttling" and got caught.If they hadn't got caught they'd probably get a raise. So it goes.......
:dancenana: I'm addicted to banana smileys.......Anybody know of a banana smiley 12 step group.......?

[aud19]

Aaaah we haven't even got Net Flix north of the 49th yet so... "meh" :lol:

[PewterTA]

What about the people that can watch basically a movie a night... why should they be discriminated against, because they are "high volume" renters? Would there be a limit if they went to BlockBuster and rented a movie a night??????

This is why it's worth buying....

[junior77blue]

I wonder how does blockbuster handle their suscriptions??

I think I will have to switch over...now I know why I'm still waiting on movies that have been #1 in my cue and still have a 'very long' wait time.

[rick c]

i use blockbuster and they pretty much send you the dvd's in the order you request them as long as they're available,the new releases are always available.It's also a very quick turnaround.I usually rent about 10-15 a month depending how fast we're able to watch them.

[stantheman2]

TANSTAAFL!

Let's see...

1. You want unlimited rentals for a fixed (low) price, even acknowledging that a company would lose money under those circumstances. What are you saying - if a company is that stupid, you have no problem taking advantage of them?

2. You want to copy any media any time you want for free, regardless of copyright or other laws.

3. You tout Blockbuster, when they have engaged in business practices at least as egregious as Netflix's, not the least of which is undercutting Netflix to try to drive them out of business.

Before you decry actions by a company as unethical, you might consider how you own actions, or the actions of competing companies, might be viewed.

[junior77blue]

TANSTAAFL!
1. You want unlimited rentals for a fixed (low) price, even acknowledging that a company would lose money under those circumstances. What are you saying - if a company is that stupid, you have no problem taking advantage of them?

What their doing is wrong and unfair...I've had certain movies in my cue FOR A VERY LONG WAIT....while other people get them RIGHT AWAY?? And now they also want to slow it down, by delaying shipments as well???? Well, that's just dirty business!!

If that's the case, don't say 'unlimited' rentals....say MAX of XX rentals per month. It's false advertising, plain and simple!

[dyazdani]

I have NetFlix and have never experienced any delays or had to wait for a new release.

I am not a high volume renter.

[RobP]

I dont rent anymore, I just buy em and keep em.

[Shane Martin]

This is why it's worth buying....

The # of poor titles out now makes it not worth buying blind anymore. The ratio of bad movies to good movies coming out is getting slimmer by the day. Most of the movies coming out now aren't worth rewatching or buying for that matter. This comes from someone with over 400 movies on dvd and LD.

As far as netflix goes, I'm getting unlimited rentals right now. 2 at a time $10 a month. I'm already at 6 rentals for this month so I'm already in the black. Go to blockbuster and start renting and tell me how soon $10 goes(that's 2 rentals if you do the math).

I really don't see the problem here.

Those that need 1 movie a night on average are likely burning them anyway.

If that's the case, don't say 'unlimited' rentals....say MAX of XX rentals per month. It's false advertising, plain and simple!

Read the user license. I'm probably end up with 10 rentals this month for my $10. Ballbuster and Hollywood can't touch that.

[Alaric]

No , no , no...

I only used Blockbuster as a handy comparison. I really don't know who is more wrong. I got long-winded and lost track of the point. And I have very few copies of anything-and they were backups for the 5 yr. old's Scooby Doo collection. I certainly don't condone taking advantage of anybody. I just tried to see both points of view.

[wildfire99]

Without TV (no cable locally and satellite access is spotty) I use Netflix for most of my TV watching. I am definately a "high volume" renter, and depending on film length, it's not unusual for me to go through two or even three movies a night.

With my habits, I pay for the 8-at-a-time plan, and come out at less than the cost of a lot of cable TV plans. While I do notice throttling, it hasn't been a deal-breaking thing. I get one-day shipping, being near a distribution center. When I'm throttled, I notice two things happening: the distrib. center doesn't acknowledge return of a movie for a day or two (common amongst many Netflix'ers), or there will be a mysterious one day gap before sending out a selection.

I don't get new movies. If a film is recently out and I really want to have it, I just buy it. Netflix, throttled or not, is a bargain given my tastes. I break even just renting two anime discs (usually $25+ to purchase) a month. After that, it's gravy. And my queue is currently around 450+ discs. I find Netflix's selection to be nearly insane (though I can't seem to convince them to carry "Space: Above and Beyond"), and there's not a time I visit the site that I don't see something that looks neat that I want to see and enqueue.

The whole Netflix throttling thing is old news. I'm not really sure why it's come up again, is it the license change in January? That said, I've only had two films that took more than 2 weeks to get due to high demand and my own account being undoubtably flagged as high-usage. And for those, I didn't miss them, as I was still sent other lower-demand movies from my queue in the interim.

I think a lot of people complaining are those with 2-at-a-time plans, for whom there may indeed be a gap in having any films at all to watch. For those people I can only say: don't be a cheapskate. If you want more films, pay for more discs at a time. With my 8-disc plan, I always have something, and I still feel the price is fair.

The only people that should be complaining about Netflix in any serious way are the movie studios. My purchasing of DVDs has fallen substantially since getting Netflix. I only buy "hot" titles now, or titles that are less than $10.

[junior77blue]

Well, my question is how does block-buster handle their online service? Do they throttle??

[Andrew M Ward]

I dont rent anymore, I just buy em and keep em.

A-Men, Brother...

I see above some folks have made note: "They rent 15 or more movies a month"
Man, I'm slackin' I havent watched 15 movies in a year... I can't find 15 good movies... :

[H.Donald]

I'm with you Andrew...15 movies in a month???I am hard pressed to find that many in a year that interest me.That many in a month would be a chore for me....

[DrJRapp]

i'm living just a few miles from one of Nextflix main distribution centers and I am able to turn around my movies twice a week for about 18-24 rentals a month. We've never had any problem other than finding something to watch that we haven't seen before. I have to refil my que twice a month!

[Shane Martin]

I'm with you Andrew...15 movies in a month???I am hard pressed to find that many in a year that interest me.

Expand your horizons and look at older titles. I'm wanting to finish up the AFI Top 100 pretty soon and netflix will help with that.

[RobP]

Alot of my DVDs are older titles, I am always searching the bargain bins for older movies, you can pick them up for a couple of bucks. We have a place up here that has new releases for $9.99 one day only when they come out so thats where I get my new movies. I usually buy any movie, I may not like all of them but I like to have a large variety for folks when they come over. My DVD collection is knocking on the 1000 mark.

[KeithM]

I use that blcokbuster unlimited in-store rental service. Same thing, except I have to ride my bike out there. I can easily get 60 movies a month in if I wanted to.

[Lex]

Stan, I wasn't sure who you were addressing. It would be nice to know if you were addressing anyone in particular?

I was wondering if you were somehow saying I was copying movies? Since I did post this. No I don't.

Anyway, it's really just a news posting from me, I don't rent movies, I just buy the few I have time for now. I still thought the practice sucked of throttling.

[Burke Strickland]

I think "throttling" rentals of high volume customers sucks, even though I've never rented a DVD. However, I've found that PURCHASE "throttling" sucks too. As unbelievable as it may seem, at least one on-line retailer would do it to their regular customers whose pre-order business they started taking for granted.

I used to do a LOT of "digital buys" with an on-line DVD sales outfit that shall remain nameless here, purchasing a lot of catalog titles and pre-ordering new releases. They got into a pattern of assuming they had my business locked in, and when new title week came, my pre-ordered discs didn't show up.

Despite having placed my orders well in advance, they'd make excuses about having too many orders to fulfill in a short period of time, having to take care of NEW customers first (actually had the balls to say that in writing), having problems with their distributor, etcetera.

What really ticked me off was finding the same titles locally for less money during the first week, tax included, when my pre-ordered discs hadn't even shown up. Then when I'd cancel the delayed order, they'd ship it anyway a couple of weeks later despite both phone and email notices to cancel and give me a hassle about returns (e.g., not accept them -- send them back to me and charge me again, or claim my return must have gotten lost in the mail and refuse to credit my account, etcetera).

So although I had done a lot of business with them over the years, after several iterations of their delays, feeble excuses and empty promises that they had changed their procedures and would do better next time only to experience the same BS from them again, I vowed not to order anything more from them. And I haven't and will not -- ever again.

Ironically, the owner had been sending emails saying he was aware that there are a lot of places I could buy DVDs and he was pleased I had chosen them. Of course, he was right about one thing; there are a LOT of other places to buy DVDs -- at better prices and with better service. The other places have been getting my business since then -- thousands of dollars I might have spent at his site if I had been treated right as a customer.

Burke

[Andrew M Ward]

Expand your horizons and look at older titles. I'm wanting to finish up the AFI Top 100 pretty soon and netflix will help with that.

Almost all I watch are older movies... of course I consider movies from my childhood "older movies" so basically the 60's & 70's

Cactus Flower
Harold & Maude
Hopscotch
The bachelor and the Bobby Soxer
Blazing Saddles
Young Frankenstein
Dr. Strangelove
Barry Lyndon
Full Metal Jacket
The Frisco Kid
West World
Silver Streak

I have what I would consider a load of movies, (200~ish) most of them are from the above era (or so)

So regarding your comments, I'm not sure which horizons I need to expand....?

[Lex]

purchase throttling huh Burke? Geesh, I guess we have heard it all now. Here, you want this movie? Commit to buy it now, and we may sell it to you at this rate. Oh sorry, we were just kidding, we really didn't want to sell it to you for that price! GMAB! (give me a break)

I don't blame you for being incensed Burke, I would be too.

[Holland]

Iam not suprised about these practices. Ofcrouse netflix and blockbuster will throtlle. They only care about the money they make, not about if all the customers are happy. Ofcourse they compensate with people who don't rent much against high volume renters but I presume most people will be renting more then the brake even point so they have to get their money some were else, hence the throttling. This happens everywhere in different ways. I would say to all who are unhappy with their dvd provider to stop doing bussiness with them, the only downside is that blockbuster being the one having stores they probably survive and when netflix is gone don't expect their good service to last (being their dvd send out service).
I have nothing but good words for the people working at my local blockbuster store by the way!

[Cowanrg]

Iam not suprised about these practices. Ofcrouse netflix and blockbuster will throtlle. They only care about the money they make, not about if all the customers are happy.

when i go into a business venture, all i care about is making people happy. the hell with the money, you can get that anywhere!

geez people, they are in the business of making money, not making peope enjoy movies... so if someone rents a billion movies a month, they will automatically scale them back, big deal. netflix is the greatest thing ive ever paid for. ive been a member since 2000, and had very few problems (a few scratched discs, etc). i used to rent a TON, and sometimes new releases wouldnt be available right away, i would have to wait for them. but it wasnt a big deal, the next movie in my queue would show up, and that was that.

we are talking movie rentals here, nothing very important. PLUS, i still average around $1.50 - $2 a rental after taxes and everything. hell, blockbuster is $5 a pop and you get reamed if you dont get it back on time, AND, you gotta drive there and their selection SUCKS compared to netflix.

[Shane Martin]

we are talking movie rentals here, nothing very important. PLUS, i still average around $1.50 - $2 a rental after taxes and everything. hell, blockbuster is $5 a pop and you get reamed if you dont get it back on time, AND, you gotta drive there and their selection SUCKS compared to netflix.

this month I'll be near $1 per rental. I agree that Netflix is one of the best deals going.

[Cowanrg]

this month I'll be near $1 per rental. I agree that Netflix is one of the best deals going.

agreed, 100%

i mean, you get the movie shipped TO you, then you get to ship it BACK, both for free. AND, you get to watch a movie. all for a buck. stamps are $0.39 each now. im sure they get a bulk rate, so lets say $0.25 each way. thats still $0.50 for delivery, and leaves only $0.50 for the rental.

you cant blame them for trying to minimize losses. and whats funny is the same people who complain about their "illegal tactics" would be the first to stop subscribing or drop their membership if they raised their prices a few bucks to compensate...

here is the social critique, people dont understand value anymore. they expect to get something for nothing, or at least be able to cheat the system. people want to get a movie for $0.50, and still be entitled to the new release the DAY it comes out, because dammnit, its their hard-earned money they are paying, and its the right thing to do. who cares if the company makes money or stays in business, I want MY movie on time, and i dont want to pay a lot for it.

[Shane Martin]

You are quite right. Let's not forget the time and trouble it takes to get the movie and hope it's in stock not to mention how much gas costs nowadays and will cost in the future.