Check out these NuForce amp pics

[jimmyp58]

Hey fellas, check the pics on the Ref. 9 amps from NuForce. These are but three of the colors you can get. You can special order others as well.



By the way, they are releasing a new pre/pro in November 2005. Preliminarily, they'll offer a "package" deal --- pre/pro + 5 monoblock amps but the pre/pro, by itself, will have an MSRP at or around $1,200.

Jim

[David Meek]

Nice Jim!

Were you able to do any listening to the Ref 9? If so, what did you think?

[jimmyp58]

We get ours this coming Monday. I'll post findings on this after we do a couple a/b's.

[gostan]

Jim:

We will all be interested to read your impressions of these tiny powerhouses. I am still not sure that I fully understand how the NuForce switching technology works, but if they sound as good as some of the initial reviews, then, the other issue will be longevity, because if something goes wrong with the amp, I assume that the entire circuit will require replacement.

Stan

[Drewbert]

oh my that gold is gody.... I can see lil John advertising it...... yyeeeeaaaahhhhh

lol

If you dont get that you might be too old :rofl:


But the black one does look good!

[jimmyp58]

I'm 47 and I don't get it....

[DrJRapp]

We get ours this coming Monday. I'll post findings on this after we do a couple a/b's.

Jimmy, have you gotten the 8s yet? or are you just going for the 9s? I'm most interested how well the 9s sonically match the 8s.

I'm currently waiting for a Rotel 1077 to arrive to see if it's everything it's cracked up to be.

[jimmyp58]

I am only getting the 9's for now.....

[Andrew Pratt]

Jim what happened to "nighty night"?

[jimmyp58]

Oooppsss... :cry:

[K~J]

Hello all!

I've been part of HT Guide for a while now, but for the most part I've been quietly observing. I've been keeping up with the recent developments behind Nuforce, so I thought I'd chime in a little bit in order to help answer some of your questions. If you're really into technology, I'd recommend reading their detailed FAQ pages at www.nuforce.com. They have some mind boggling stuff! 8O If you'd like a more summarized version, read the next two paragraphs. If you want to skip straight to the point, read the last paragraph.

One of the core technologies behind the Nuforce amplifier is it's Switch Mode Power Supply (SMPS). These power supplies were designed to switch at incredibly high frequencies compared to the huge linear power supplies found in most components today. Because a common power supply is limited to a slower, fixed carrier signal frequency it cannot discharge power quickly enough without incorporating large capacitors, transistors, etc. All those huge power transistors have inherent noise which eventually adds up and influences audio performance. The technology of the Nuforce amp eliminates the need to use these traditional methods to discharge power. Nuforce refers to this technology as analog switching (it's not digital).

Another technology Nuforce uses is a closed-loop response system. The amplifier is constantly aware of speaker impedance changes at any given instant based on "feedback" from the speaker terminals. At one moment, the speaker's impedance might be really low. At another moment, really high. Therefore, the amp has the ability to present the speaker with a highly accurate voltage resulting in accurate reproduction of the intended signal.

So, what does this all mean exactly? Well, it means you have a lighter, cooler running amp that is capable of adapting dynamically and reproducing a highly accurate music signal. Less heat, less space, less cost. Does this analog switching technology really work? I can't wait to see. Stay tuned...

-Kevin

[K~J]

As a follow up, my brother is demoing the new Reference 9s today. I'll get his reaction and summarize his thoughts later.

-KJ

[Wayne E]

oh my that gold is gody.... I can see lil John advertising it...... yyeeeeaaaahhhhh

lol

If you dont get that you might be too old

No, us old folks got it. However, we are taken aback by how bad the spelling has gotten by the younger folks, though - and, have realized how bad of a job the public schools are doing for the young folks today. It's actually gaudy.

[Snap]

Dew, Spelling has always been a hard thing for me to do. Math, History no problem, spelling...not so good. I actually went to get some help with spelling and I was told that it was how I was taught to read and spell when I was little that is hurting me. "Sight Recognition" or "Word Recognition" something like that. Any ways, I do not sound out the words, I look and recognize what I think the word is. Mean ole wayne....

(I must be to young I did not get it...)

And Einstein himself did not spell to well, or get that good of grades in anything other than math. Not to mention that he quit school at 15. So spelling is not everything. (sorry a little sensitive on the subject. Plus spelling does not really have anything to do with this thread. At least it shouldn't)

[Aussie Geoff]

Dr Rapp,

I have actually heard both the Ref 8s and dealer demo Ref 9s. The Ref 9s sound very similar to the Ref 9s but with more of that "big amp" sound, giving even tighter bass / mid bass. They are also a little "punchier" in general on harder to drive speakers. I would be confident that you could mix the Ref 8s as rears and Ref 9s as fronts and not really tell. Mind you I am tempted personally to buy 7 of the Ref 9s "just becuase"...

Geoff

[jimmyp58]

Quite a ringing endorsement Geoff.

[Aussie Geoff]

Jimmy,

You are right - I am seriously impressed with them.... I have to rely on my memory of amps like the Krell FBP series class A amplifiers to remember something that matches them in sound quality... So for the price they are a revelation... All that is holding me off buying them is waiting to see what others I trust think (in case I have "lost it") - plus making a speaker decision...

Geoff

[jimmyp58]

One amp we will be comparing the Ref. 9's to is a Krell FBP 400cx. Heck, even if we think it is ~ 85 - 90% it is a steal!!!

[bhuskins]

Hi Guys,

I spent all day today comparing several amps, preamps and speakers with another 15 guys here in Fort Worth. Needless to say, one of the highly anticipated items we thoroughly reviewed was the NuForce Ref 9's that just came in. The pair was directly compared to several different amps and we controlled the amps with several different line stages. We used the Cary Audio SLP-98P Preamp, Dodd Audio Reference Preamp, Resolution Audio Opus 21 CD (with and without variable output), Cary Audio 303/300 CD (with and without variable output, both tube buffered and solid state outputs) along with several nice speaker selections including the Anthony Gallo Ref3's, Salk Sound Veracity HT1, Dunlavy SC-IV/A and several others. Top notch power conditioning and cables were used throughout. The amps we swapped in and out included the NuForce Ref 9's ("Digital Amp", $2,400 MSRP pair), Halcro Logic MC20 (2 Channel Digital Amp, $4,490 MSRP), Cary Audio CAD 500 MB ($6,000 MSRP pair), PS Audio GCA-250 (2 Channel Digital Amp, $2,995 MSRP), Parasound Halo JC1's ($7,000 MSRP pair), Dodd Audio 120 Watt Tube Mono Blocks ($5,200 MSRP pair).

After several hours of testing, there were definitely LOTS of opinions among the group of veteran audiophiles as to what was preferred. One consistency was that everyone kept coming back to the Gallo Ref 3's with amazement as to how such a relatively small speaker sounds so surprisingly big. It was definitely a winner for the day. The other big surprise for me was how awesome the Dodd Audio gear was. What an incredibly rich sound. The preamp is near flawless. Now the bad news, the glaring consistency within the group was how disappointed everyone was with the NuForce Ref 9s (no exaggeration - 100% of the attendees.) The Ref 9s just didn't live up to all their hype. I personally thought they created a very narrow sound stage and showed little to no life. I rarely say this about any brand, much less one for which I had high expectations. I really think they need to go back to the drawing board. This result was not consistent with the other "digital" amps. The Halcro and PS Audio units were awesome and really held their own against the big monoblocks. They had differences in sound in comparison to the monoblocks, but still a completely full soundstage with rich, extended bass (something the Ref 9s lacked.)

Sorry to disappoint as I know some of you have high expectations as I had, but figured you guys would want to know.

Feel free to ask questions while I have a fresh memory of the gear.

thanks,

Brent Huskins
Media Design
HTGuide Sponsor

[jimmyp58]

I don't think it is disappointing Brent but an interesting observation nonetheless. No doubt this is not the first time someone has found them not to their liking and won't be the last yet everyone has had similar experiences with other equipment too. This is though one of the first 'publicized' negative demos of them. As you stated, there is a lot of hype with these amps.

We'll be posting our observations as well shortly.

Thanks for giving us something to consider.

[Snap]

morning Jimmy :later:

Look forward to hearing it

[nfjason]

Hmm, another Brent's identical post here in this thread.
The Texas Audio Jam was started by a bunch of people on audiocircle.com To find out what people at the jam really said about the whole situation, go read the postings there!
Read the postings here
They (including the host of the Jam) confirmed what I said about the situation.

[jimmyp58]

I'll post more later but for now, WOW.

[Aussie Geoff]

Jim,

So you like them then.... :banana:

I'm glad it is not just me in HTGuide who has listened and been impressed

Geoff

[bhuskins]

Hi Jason,

If you'll look at the times and dates...this is the 1st place I posted it.

Then, I posted it again on the other thread you've already commented on...you’ll note on that posting I commented that it was duplicated from this thread.

I feel like you think I have a hidden agenda which is far from the truth.

I would however like you to point me to any positive reviews from the Texas Jam. I haven’t seen any over there, but maybe I missed it. I think a lot of people are just being nice by not saying anything at all.

Again though...My offer still stands to thoroughly and properly review a production set under a controlled environment and with proper break-in.

I really feel that my negative experience is a result of a pre-production set that wasn't up to snuff for whatever reason.

I'll be the 1st to eat crow in retrospect. Some of the pro reviews are impressive and I personally would like to be proved wrong so to speak. I think you guys have a good concept and have no problem giving it a fair shot.

Brent Huskins
Media Design
HTGuide Sponsor

[jimmyp58]

Here is some initial thoughts on my NuForce Ref. 9 demo last night.

I am truly amazed at these little pieces of audio dynamite. I have read a lot of the very positive reviews and I have also recently read a rather negative one about a recent jam. I was prepared for just about anything.

My VMPS R40's have had the fortune of being powered by what I consider some very good amps --- Bryston 14B SST and Krell 400FBP cx since I got them late last year. As many others have, I became intrigued when I started reading about NuForce at the various venues on the Internet and I thought to myself, there was no way in he*& I was going to miss out on trying these babies on for size and bring them into the fold of the products I offer my customers. I am no genius but when I made that decision, I should have also gotten on the next plane to Vegas and bet my brains out!

I took them out of the box and fired them up. I noticed a little harshness on the high end about 15 minutes into the demo session. I didn't put a lot of stock into it knowing I just pulled them out of the box but I did take a mental note as a reference point. From that point on, whoa......

Kevin, one of the gents that works with me at Next Level, has been to my house a number of times including the time he visited me to audition the RM40's when he was deciding on buying VMPS. So he knew how good the sound was from these speakers (powered by a Bryston 14B SST at the time). He's also heard some of the cuts I normally use in my demos so he has a reference point there too. He came in and I had Mr. Beethoven stuff going and I noticed this boyish grin from ear to ear. He was astonished. He said "and that is only after about 1/2 an hour"?! Yep!!!

The clarity and precision was truly noteworthy and spectacular. I was concerned going in as to whether these amps could provide a deep and lush bass from the RM40's. Absolutely zero problems there. Soundstage, well, OUCH!! The Ref. 9's seemed to create space in my room that physically isn't there. The entire spectrum, to me, opened up like I never heard my RM40's sound before --- wider, greater depth, clearer, and so much more apparent. I truly heard sounds, rifts, instrumentation, etc. that I truly and honestly never heard before. No joke!

We plan on taking these 'beasts' to a couple other sites this weekend. We'll listen to them on some VMPS RM30's and compare them to a Bryston amp and then onto another stop where we'll listen to them power some Dynaudio speakers and compare the sound to a HALO amplifier.

We'll report back our findings.

This is and was a truly unbelievable experience and I look forward, eagerly, as to how they'll sound in a month from now!

Last night, as Kevin and I were talking, also gave me some marketing 'tricks' that given the circumstance might employ.

Later my friends....

Jim

[David Meek]

Brent - Jason. Enough. This stops here and now. Am I understood?

You have both stated your opinions. If you have to continue this, take it offline and away from The Guide.

HTG Moderator

[David Meek]

Now, back to the topic at hand. . . .

Jimmy, can you tell me a bit more about the R40's? How efficient are they, etc? I'm running Aerial Acoustics 7Bs and they are a bit of a load at times (pun intended : ).

[K~J]

David,

The VMPS line is quite efficient. Jim's RM40s and my RM30Ms are 90db efficient as an entire system (I believe the tweeter and ribbon mids reach 93 and 96db efficiency respectively. I'll double check). The Ref 9s had zero problems pumping the bass out of his twin towers. We played some Donald Fagen cuts that sounded really tight. I can't wait to plug them into my system and hear the results. I'm hoping I'll be able to eek a bit more bass from mine given the ample juice these babies put out. Stay tuned...

-Kevin

[jimmyp58]

Thanks Kevin....

[tmueller]

This weekends audition

David,

It should be interesting when we put them on my Dynaudios. As you, and other ht guiders already know Dynaudio (in general) makes some power hungry speakers. They are a nominal 4 ohm load and non-bi-wiring. I’m curious and excited to try them on my Contour 5.4s as I am completely thrilled with how my Halo A51 currently powers them.

Tyler Mueller