DVD Player Question

[Adz]

If one is interested in high end (yes, I know, a term used loosely) state of the art DVD player to achieve top notch PQ and SQ, but not interested in the universal multichannel players that incorporate SACD/DVD-A technology, does such a product line exist?

[junior77blue]

Not that i've seen....

Denon 5910 appears to be the "creme de le creme"

[JonMarsh]

I'd say such products exist, but implemented in very different ways. There are many different ways to make "high end" depending on the system it will be interfaced with, and what the best video options are for the display device. This itself will be a matter of controversy and opinion. Additionally, in some cases, like my own with a CRT front projector, additional interface devices like transcoders, scalers, or DVI to RGBHV converters may be needed.

Perhaps your best plan of attack is definining what you need and want for a "high end" player-

Is it freedeom from obvious bugs like the MPEG chroma bug present in many players? (the Faroudja chipset for de-interlacing and scaling filters this so well that it isn't noticeable in many cases)

Is it having a high clock rate oversampled analog component video output? (12 bit, 108 or 216 MHz- Ayre Acoustics pioneered this in their D1 DVD player; many units are available now with D/A converters using this technology)

Is it having the best possible video source de-interlacing? (while film de-interlacing in principle is just inverse 3:2 pull down, video source material like concert music videos, many TV shows on DVD, etc, require motion adaptive de-interlacing, and even a lot of film base material is misflagged- the Faroudja set is much better than most at handling this, to the extent I wouldn't buy a DVD player without it, unless I was running it into an external high grade scaler)

Build quality- is a strong heavy chassis and analog power supply your thing, or would you save a few hundred dollars if you could get the specific video performance you want with more mundane construction?

What kind of display to you have? How good is it's upsampling, if its' higher resolution than DVD? If only have a standard TV, no matter how large or expensive, you're never going to see the video quality that DVD can offer from even average players- you must have an HDTV capable or equivalent display.


The best 480P DVD player I know of right now at anything faintl resembling a reasonable price is the Ayre Acoustics D7 - it is sold as a DVD transport; no decoders built in, with options for DVI and SDI output, in addition to the wideband 12 bit component outputs.

http://www.ayre.com/products_detail.cfm?productid=10

To really appreciate the quality of the component outputs, you need a high end CRT projector, one without digital signal processing (like conversion A/D of the signal for intenral scaling and display, which leaves out most RPTV). Most digital projectors are only 8 bit A/D on video input.

As a transport, the Ayre is also designed to be used with scalers accepting DVI or SDI inputs, like the better iScan and Lumagen models. Charlie Hansen thinks that there are issues with even these scalers design, which reduce the overall picture quality, even when doing a good job of upscaling, but whether you'd see it that way depends on your display. (Charles is the chief designer at Ayre). They demo the DX7 using a Mitsubishi CRT front projector straight in, using the RGB outputs (yes, the Ayre has analog RGBHV outputs as well as component.

A PDF with more details is available here , and the owners manual can be downloaded from their site.

~Jon

[Adz]

Hi Jon,

I was asking more of a general question. For example, I have a Bryston pre/pro which has no video switching capabilities / circuitry at all as they choose to concentrate solely in the audio realm (and so by comparison I was asking if there existed a DVD player whose sole objective is to deliver top notch video and audio quality for DVDs).

But to focus a bit more of the discussion on a very popular technology, I have a DLP Front Projector - 720p display which has its own Faroujda scaler and it has DVI inputs. With that info, how would the Ayre check out? Would it be an improvement in terms of PQ (and perhaps SQ) over my Denon 5900 which I currently watch DVDs using the DVI connection.

[Adz]

Hey Junior,

As for the 5910, here is a link to a review of it in Secrets. I'd categorize the review as great, but not spectacular.

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/cgi-bin/shootout.cgi?function=search&articles=121

[junior77blue]

Well it did make #1...must count for something.

[DrJRapp]

You may want to take a look at the Marantz DV9500. Far less mony than the Denon 5910 and excellent PQ combined with top notch audio performance.

I'll quote right out of the Secrets report : "The core performance of this player is just about perfect. There is absolutely no pixel cropping, which is an extreme rarity these days, and there is no Y/C delay at all. The analog video frequency response is outstanding and one of the best we’ve seen at any price point."

And here is what Secrets said about the 5910 : As to the analog side of this player, the core tests went well, but there is some room for improvement. The player does have some pixel cropping that is exaggerated by the player’s output setup. If you leave the player in a default mode, it is clipping a combined 7 pixels from the sides of the image and 1 from the top.

I have a hard time understanding why Secrets rated the DV9500 so low relative to the 5910 when their write ups on both units screams otherwise.

From my own perspective, I have had the opportunity to audition the 9500 in my own home and was formidably impressed with its performance. It would be very difficult for me to justify the difference in cost.

[jimmyp58]

While the author is a great resource and does great reviews, he owns a Denon 5910!!!

Jim

[Adz]

I have a hard time understanding why Secrets rated the DV9500 so low relative to the 5910 when their write ups on both units screams otherwise.

I suspect the 5910 is simply being held to a higher standard.
You may want to email the author and ask.
I have emailed these guys before and they respond quickly.

[junior77blue]

Doesn't the marantz have the legendary 'chroma-bug'?

[DrJRapp]

While the author is a great resource and does great reviews, he owns a Denon 5910!!!

Jim

Pehaps that explains the author's apparent bias towards the Denon machines, which if you go elsewhere and read reviews and user comments seem to be frought with problems that many of the other machines that Secrets reviews don't have.

I purchased a Denon 2900, partially based on the favorable reviews given to it in Secrets. When it works, it is great. However, in the past year it has plain out stopped functioning twice (would not turn on, or would turn on and not play). The first time it was returned from Denon quickly after a so-called, repair, only to fail again within a few weeks. The second time it was out to Denon from early October until last week. Denon's turn around time has gotten horrendous because of the large number of faulty 2900s, 2910s and 3910s being returned for repair. My machine has about 300 hours playing time total. It now sits in a box on my theater room floor, and I am wondering if it is worth the effort to even install it.

[jimmyp58]

Geez Jerry, it seems lately that if it weren't for bad luck, you wouldn't have any luck at all with some of your equipment.

I owned the 2900 and had zero issues (other than the very annoying and unusually slow start-up/disc recognition problem) and the same can be said for my 5900. I have sold a 3910 recently and haven't had a problem with it but that is merely three units.

But yes, the reviewer owning the 5910 may explain his bias.

Jim