CP-800 spec sheet and white paper

[beden1]

Why not use the XLR out on the BDP-95? I have one and I think it is really really good. Good enough that it made my CDP-502 look silly in terms of cost/value. It does however need to warm up for at least one hour before sounding really good and it is very sensitive to correct polarization of the power plug - however that only applies if you have the ability to turn the power plug 180 degrees at the wall socket.
Also please remember to put it in pure audio mode when listening. Makes a difference.

What would using the XLR cables buy me over using HDMI. Using the XLR would be analog stereo and would not let me use my subs?

[aarsoe]

What would using the XLR cables buy me over using HDMI. Using the XLR would be analog stereo and would not let me use my subs?

Most if not all of the extra cost (double DACs) in the bdp-95 is for the balanced output. So I strongly suggest at least to try it.

I know some people are using/promoting HDMI but there are significant jitter issues with HDMI that does not always ensure you a consistant result.

In regards to using your sub, then I don't see why not. It depends on which preamplifier/processor you have. It can be done using analogue out - and since this is a thread for the CP-800 I assume that is what you have and there is no issue with that unit.

[beden1]

Most if not all of the extra cost (double DACs) in the bdp-95 is for the balanced output. So I strongly suggest at least to try it.

I know some people are using/promoting HDMI but there are significant jitter issues with HDMI that does not always ensure you a consistant result.

In regards to using your sub, then I don't see why not. It depends on which preamplifier/processor you have. It can be done using analogue out - and since this is a thread for the CP-800 I assume that is what you have and there is no issue with that unit.

I have the SSP-800.

[beden1]

It's raining here so I had the chance to connect the Oppo BDP-95 to my SSP-800 via XLR cables with the Pure Audio setting in the Oppo. The bass management works in the SSP-800 to enable the subs through the XLR connection. Comparing the the Sony XA9000ES SCD/CD/Multi-Channel player connected to the SSP-800 via a single RCA Digital cable with the digital filter set to normal.

Listening to the Beatles new enhanced Abbey Road stereo CD, and the Jimi Hendricks "Are You Experienced" original MCA CD.

I have come to the same conclusion as before...the Sony clearly wins. The Oppo sounds great, and if I did not do a side-by-side comparison, I would be very happy with the Oppo, But, I did do the comparison and the Sony has just a much more refined sound. In fact, most systems playback of the Hendricks CD, and largely the Beatles CD, is a chore to listen to because it usually sounds a bit distorted with harsh passages. Not with either player, but particularly through the Sony CD, it's fluid.

My previous use of comparing the two players to cars, the Sony as a Rolls Royce sedan and the Oppo as a BMW 7 Series sedan still holds true IMO. The Rolls cruises by you like a faint whisper and when the BMW cruises by, you hear the tire noise and and the mechanicals working. Both are very good cars, but the Rolls is just exceptional.

[aarsoe]

Beden
Before you make your call I suggest trying analogue passthrough on your ssp-800. Or at least ensure that you have the same settings on both inputs. Remember eq settings etc.
Technically your oppo should beat the crap out of the Sony. Much, much better DA and implementation.

[RebelMan]

Most if not all of the extra cost (double DACs) in the bdp-95 is for the balanced output. So I strongly suggest at least to try it.

I know some people are using/promoting HDMI but there are significant jitter issues with HDMI that does not always ensure you a consistant result.

Jitter is not an issue with the SSP, Alan Clark saw to that. He's also responsible for squashing USB induced jitter on the CP-800 which can be worse. You'll get better performance out of the SSP with HDMI than you will XLR.

[HedgeHog]

Jitter is not an issue with the SSP, Alan Clark saw to that. He's also responsible for squashing USB induced jitter on the CP-800 which can be worse. You'll get better performance out of the SSP with HDMI than you will XLR.

I find that the Oppo BDP-95 -> XLR -> SSP-800 passthrough sounds better than the BDP-95 -> HDMI -> SSP-800. It has better imaging and just sounds better. IMHO, of course.

-H

[beden1]

Beden
Before you make your call I suggest trying analogue passthrough on your ssp-800. Or at least ensure that you have the same settings on both inputs. Remember eq settings etc.
Technically your oppo should beat the crap out of the Sony. Much, much better DA and implementation.

Maybe it has to do with something like the Sony weighs 35 lbs. 12 oz. (just CD player) and the Oppo weighs only 15.4 lbs. (CD & DVD player)? The other thing that impresses me about the Sony is the CD drawer is very sturdy and does not wiggle or move when handled, unlike the kinda flimsy one on the Oppo?

Where did you see the specs on the "DA and implementation" for the Sony as compared to the Oppo that shows how the Oppo does it "much, much better"? The proof may not be in the pudding if that is in deed the case?

I came back today and compared the two players again after reading your comment. I also checked to make sure the settings for each input in the SSP-800 were the same (they were). I then listened to the Beatles enhanced stereo CD of Let It Be. This CD has some very irratable passages to listen to on most systems. Unfortunately, this was partly true while listening through the Oppo. It was on the in your face side, whereas again, the Sony was a true pleasure to listen to with it's refinement while revealing all of the detail and depth. I was listening to both at the same moderate volume setting of 55 dB on the SSP-800.

[alebonau]

It's raining here so I had the chance to connect the Oppo BDP-95 to my SSP-800 via XLR cables with the Pure Audio setting in the Oppo. The bass management works in the SSP-800 to enable the subs through the XLR connection. Comparing the the Sony XA9000ES SCD/CD/Multi-Channel player connected to the SSP-800 via a single RCA Digital cable with the digital filter set to normal.

Listening to the Beatles new enhanced Abbey Road stereo CD, and the Jimi Hendricks "Are You Experienced" original MCA CD.

I have come to the same conclusion as before...the Sony clearly wins. The Oppo sounds great, and if I did not do a side-by-side comparison, I would be very happy with the Oppo, But, I did do the comparison and the Sony has just a much more refined sound. In fact, most systems playback of the Hendricks CD, and largely the Beatles CD, is a chore to listen to because it usually sounds a bit distorted with harsh passages. Not with either player, but particularly through the Sony CD, it's fluid.

My previous use of comparing the two players to cars, the Sony as a Rolls Royce sedan and the Oppo as a BMW 7 Series sedan still holds true IMO. The Rolls cruises by you like a faint whisper and when the BMW cruises by, you hear the tire noise and and the mechanicals working. Both are very good cars, but the Rolls is just exceptional.

I own the sony scd-xa9000es, and also an oppo 95.

your description is very apt. fluid is how I would describe the sony.

the sony is very tokyo hi-end.

refined, smooth luxurious...

exceptional is the word.

players like the oppo 95 might come and go from my system. but the sony has been many years in my system now. and theres no chance its leaving anytime soon

[bigburner]

I then listened to the Beatles enhanced stereo CD of Let It Be. This CD has some very irratable passages to listen to on most systems.

Can you us some examples of the irritable passages on Let It Be?

Nigel.

[beden1]

Can you us some examples of the irritable passages on Let It Be?

Nigel.

I have been listening to Beatles albums since they were originally available for sale in the 1960's through many systems and formats including vinyl records, 8 tracks, cassettes, reel-to-reel, Sony Walk Man, CDs, and now through an Apple iPod. Some were good playback systems and some were bad, and through the years, there are passages in songs that I just expect to sound grating to my ears. It is always a pleasure to be surprised when the opposite happens, and the music becomes a total pleasant listening experience.

If you really need me to point out these challenging passages and songs on the CD, I will when I get the time, but congratulations if you have always listened to the "Let It Be" Beatles album through great systems from day one, and you have never heard what I am referring to.

[beden1]

I own the sony scd-xa9000es, and also an oppo 95.

your description is very apt. fluid is how I would describe the sony.

the sony is very tokyo hi-end.

refined, smooth luxurious...

exceptional is the word.

players like the oppo 95 might come and go from my system. but the sony has been many years in my system now. and theres no chance its leaving anytime soon

Thank you for your comments, especially coming from someone who has experienced how wonderful this Sony player sounds. I was thinking about having my ears checked when I didn't think the Oppo BDP-95 (the Holy Grail, end all player of the Internet Audiophile Community) didn't sound all that special, once I had the chance to do a side-by-side comparison with a really special player in the Sony.

I still use the first ES generation Sony DVP-S9000ES player in my stereo system as it too is a very special player. Fortunately, there are some components we buy that stand the test of time.

[aarsoe]

Beden

You still did not try the analogue pass through on the SSP. Now you are limited by the AD's in the SSP and they are lower res compared to the output of the Oppo.
Love my SSP-800 but anything being digitized in the SSP-800 have a reduced band with compared to the by-pass mode.
And before Rebelman jumps in, then please take a look at the specs at the Classe website.

20Hz – 200kHz <0.1dB Stereo analog bypass
20Hz – 20kHz <0.2dB All other sources

[mjb]

I have been listening to Beatles albums since they were originally available for sale in the 1960's through many systems and formats including vinyl records, 8 tracks, cassettes, reel-to-reel, Sony Walk Man, CDs, and now through an Apple iPod. Some were good playback systems and some were bad, and through the years, there are passages in songs that I just expect to sound grating to my ears. It is always a pleasure to be surprised when the opposite happens, and the music becomes a total pleasant listening experience.

If you really need me to point out these challenging passages and songs on the CD, I will when I get the time, but congratulations if you have always listened to the "Let It Be" Beatles album through great systems from day one, and you have never heard what I am referring to.

40-50 year old albums are what they are - "let it be" was mostly recorded in mono in 1969 and later re-mixed by Phil Spector in 1970 and then released in that year. Conversations about pico seconds of jitter between one medium or the other in 2011 are almost laughable considering the equipment used to record the master all those years ago. I should imagine "challenging passages" were challenging for the recording equipment of the day, and if you've listened to it on equipment that brings a "pleasant listening experience", its very possibly because this equipment is not being faithful to the original and is coloring the reproduction. Something about pigs and lipstick springs to mind.

I would also be very interested to know what you consider these "challenging passages and songs" to be. Please, when you have time, enlighten us

[beden1]

40-50 year old albums are what they are - "let it be" was mostly recorded in mono in 1969 and later re-mixed by Phil Spector in 1970 and then released in that year. Conversations about pico seconds of jitter between one medium or the other in 2011 are almost laughable considering the equipment used to record the master all those years ago. I should imagine "challenging passages" were challenging for the recording equipment of the day, and if you've listened to it on equipment that brings a "pleasant listening experience", its very possibly because this equipment is not being faithful to the original and is coloring the reproduction. Something about pigs and lipstick springs to mind.

I would also be very interested to know what you consider these "challenging passages and songs" to be. Please, when you have time, enlighten us

Let me guess, you're an Oppo fan boy too? I will find the time, but in the mean time, peace out brother!

[mjb]

Let me guess, you're an Oppo fan boy too?

Not at all. I buy CD's, and rip them. But, to be honest, I'm beginning to wonder if my ears are worthy of 16bit/44khz (or better) - its all becoming very subjective.

[beden1]

Not at all. I buy CD's, and rip them. But, to be honest, I'm beginning to wonder if my ears are worthy of 16bit/44khz (or better) - its all becoming very subjective.

I'm just happy to finally realize or validate that my CDs sound great in my system. I don't get to listen to this one too often since I'm back and forth between PA and here.

I was actually hoping that the Oppo player would be great and serve as both my CD player and blu-ray player. I wanted to then take my Sony player back to PA to use in my stereo setup. After hearing the differences, I'm now not going to be able to do that. The Sony player stays put.

Is the Sony player modifying the music to make it sound better than the recording...or, is the Sony playing back the recording as it is actually supposed to sound? Whatever it is doing, I love listening to it!

I still have to try the analogue pass through on the SSP-800 as Aarso suggests before I slam the gavel down and close court.

[beden1]

Why not use the XLR out on the BDP-95? I have one and I think it is really really good. Good enough that it made my CDP-502 look silly in terms of cost/value. It does however need to warm up for at least one hour before sounding really good and it is very sensitive to correct polarization of the power plug - however that only applies if you have the ability to turn the power plug 180 degrees at the wall socket.
Also please remember to put it in pure audio mode when listening. Makes a difference.

I am going to give it an hour of playing time before giving another go against the Sony player. In reading the Oppo book, it says it sounds best after 300 hours of play time. :E Maybe after 300 hours one would forget what he/she wanted to figure out in the first place?

My Oppo player was just shipped to me earlier in the week and only has about 5 hours of play time, so maybe it has an excuse?

[Srrndhound]

I'm just happy to finally realize or validate that my CDs sound great in my system. I don't get to listen to this one too often since I'm back and forth between PA and here.

I was actually hoping that the Oppo player would be great and serve as both my CD player and blu-ray player. I wanted to then take my Sony player back to PA to use in my stereo setup. After hearing the differences, I'm now not going to be able to do that. The Sony player stays put.

Is the Sony player modifying the music to make it sound better than the recording...or, is the Sony playing back the recording as it is actually supposed to sound? Whatever it is doing, I love listening to it!

I still have to try the analogue pass through on the SSP-800 as Aarso suggests before I slam the gavel down and close court.

Maybe this was already covered, but how does the Sony analog sound compared with S/PDIF from the Oppo into the SSP DACs?

[beden1]

Beden
Before you make your call I suggest trying analogue passthrough on your ssp-800. Or at least ensure that you have the same settings on both inputs. Remember eq settings etc.
Technically your oppo should beat the crap out of the Sony. Much, much better DA and implementation.

I used the "bypass select" which the SSP-800 owner's manual says is an analogue passthrough" setting. The Oppo player is connected with the XLR cables.

I waited until after an hour of the Oppo playing in the background before sitting down to compare the two players again (the Sony player was only powered on during the same time). I first listened to the entire Beatles "Let It Be" CD through the Oppo and listened to it again through the Sony player.

Through the Oppo, John Lennon's vocals in both "Dig A Pony and "I've Got A Feeling", and to quote John Lennon remarking on some of their early songs, sounded like "Rubbish"! Through the Oppo, it sounds like there was a high pass filter accentuating the mid and high frequencies (like the equalizer had all of the mid/high slides maxed out). Or, like I was sitting near the speakers on their stage. It was not enjoyable in the least.

The Oppo BDP-95 sounded better with the SSP-800 doing the decoding instead of the Oppo.

The Sony player made me feel all warm and fuzzy and safe again in the confines of my listening chair. Thank God!

I then listened again to the same two songs I previously listed through each player to just fixate on the instrumentation. I wanted to determine the level of detail through each player. This is something that will take multiple listening sessions in order to legitimately evaluate, but, a high degree of fine detail is present through each player. The Sony however, lets you visualize and enjoy the instrumentation because it is so fluid, whereas the Oppo places the instruments right up in your face.

The Oppo BDP-95 is a great blu-ray player and I'm very pleased with it for that.

[beden1]

Maybe this was already covered, but how does the Sony analog sound compared with S/PDIF from the Oppo into the SSP DACs?

I didn't use the analog stereo connection from the Sony through the SSP-800 to compare the two players, but I will when I get the chance. I did listen to the Oppo BDP-95 using the XLR connections, and using the HDMI connection through the SSP-800 to compare the Sony using the single RCA digital connection.

[alebonau]

I used the "bypass select" which the SSP-800 owner's manual says is an analogue passthrough" setting. The Oppo player is connected with the XLR cables.

I waited until after an hour of the Oppo playing in the background before sitting down to compare the two players again (the Sony player was only powered on during the same time). I first listened to the entire Beatles "Let It Be" CD through the Oppo and listened to it again through the Sony player.

Through the Oppo, John Lennon's vocals in both "Dig A Pony and "I've Got A Feeling", and to quote John Lennon remarking on some of their early songs, sounded like "Rubbish"! Through the Oppo, it sounds like there was a high pass filter accentuating the mid and high frequencies (like the equalizer had all of the mid/high slides maxed out). Or, like I was sitting near the speakers on their stage. It was not enjoyable in the least.

The Oppo BDP-95 sounded better with the SSP-800 doing the decoding instead of the Oppo.

The Sony player made me feel all warm and fuzzy and safe again in the confines of my listening chair. Thank God!

I then listened again to the same two songs I previously listed through each player to just fixate on the instrumentation. I wanted to determine the level of detail through each player. This is something that will take multiple listening sessions in order to legitimately evaluate, but, a high degree of fine detail is present through each player. The Sony however, lets you visualize and enjoy the instrumentation because it is so fluid, whereas the Oppo places the instruments right up in your face.

The Oppo BDP-95 is a great blu-ray player and I'm very pleased with it for that.

in the case here, your definitely prefering the sound via the 800 than via the oppo using its dac and analog stage. look as much as people go on about best dacs and what not. you have to trust your ears and go with what sounds best. regardless of what anyone else might say

[alebonau]

I didn't use the analog stereo connection from the Sony through the SSP-800 to compare the two players, but I will when I get the chance. I did listen to the Oppo BDP-95 using the XLR connections, and using the HDMI connection through the SSP-800 to compare the Sony using the single RCA digital connection.

srrndhound does have a point. it will be worth comparing both players via analog. though am sure the sony is a very good transport. a lot of its goodness lies in its analog stage

[RebelMan]

I find that the Oppo BDP-95 -> XLR -> SSP-800 passthrough sounds better than the BDP-95 -> HDMI -> SSP-800. It has better imaging and just sounds better. IMHO, of course.

-H

How did you level match the inputs and outputs between AB tests? People ALWAYS mistake louder for better. That's not to say you did. But people often overlook this key step.

[diononiz]

When I had a chance to do an in home demo of the CP-800, I compared its internal DACs to the following. (each of the below was connected via the analog inputs to the CP-800)

CDP-102 (mine)
CDP-202 (borrowed from a freind)
Oppo 95 (on loan from Best Buy)
Sony XA-5400 (neighbor who was curious about the CP-800)

It was not close, the CP-800 was better in every imaginable way, detail, soundstage, dynamics. I was so impressed I wound up placing an order for the CP-800)

I compared the CD players above to CDP-102 used as a transport connected to the CP-800 via the SPDIF connection (coaxial digital)

[busby]

Jitter is not an issue with the SSP, Alan Clark saw to that. He's also responsible for squashing USB induced jitter on the CP-800 which can be worse. You'll get better performance out of the SSP with HDMI than you will XLR.

On the CP-800 the significance of jitter is very different between the "conventional" (SPDIF etc.) and USB digital inputs.

For the former, the clock originates in the source and is sent along with the data. The CP-800 has no control over the data rate and must deal as best it can with the jitter inherent in the source and further jitter accumulation on the interface (cables, connectors, optical transmitters and receivers etc). Although the CP-800 does a very good job in this regard (by virtue of Alan Clark's expertise) it can never be completely immune to deficiencies of the source or interconnects. Thus, different sources, cables and choice of interface (e.g. AES/EBU versus SPDIF) may sound different. (Whatever may be claimed elsewhere, it is impossible to completely remove jitter from a data stream that is not rate-controlled by the de-jittering device - unless, say, the whole stream [track?] is buffered locally.)

The CP-800 USB sources are handled differently: Audio data is played from an internal buffer at a rate determined by the very low jitter master clocks within the CP-800. Only these clocks, the DACs and other CP-800 circuitry have a bearing on the sound quality. As long as the buffer has sufficient data, the replay system does not even care where the data came from. The USB sub-system has the job of maintaining the buffer size at a suitable level by adjusting the rate at which data is supplied over USB. Thus, the USB source does not "own" the data rate and, in effect, becomes merely a container for (and means of selecting) the digital audio data. The quality of the source clocks, power supply, USB cables etc. is irrelevant. Provided that the original files are uncompressed or lossless and that nothing within the source alters the data before it is sent over USB (e.g. the media player or operating system on a computer source) the resulting sound is determined only by the CP-800.


Chris

[beden1]

How did you level match the inputs and outputs between AB tests? People ALWAYS mistake louder for better. That's not to say you did. But people often overlook this key step.

That brings up a question for me. When I was comparing the Oppo connected with the XLR cable, was it getting a 6dB gain over the Sony which was connected with a RCA digital cable?

[aarsoe]

It should not have done that as the SSP takes that into account when using the balanced input compared to the unbalanced inputs.

[HedgeHog]

How did you level match the inputs and outputs between AB tests? People ALWAYS mistake louder for better. That's not to say you did. But people often overlook this key step.

I was only aware of dB gain difference between RCA and XLR....didn't realize there would be anything significant comparing XLR with digital. I've just sent Classe an email asking what to do. In the meantime, I'll try to use a test disc and my SPL meter to see if I need to change the volume up/down to compensate.

Having said that, my ear tells me the volume is pretty close but the details are different. Not that the Classe DACs are bad, it's just the Oppo sounds more spacious....not louder.

Cheers,
-H

[Thumper]

Thanks for the information Chris. Are a Classe employee? You seem very knowledgeable on the internals of the CP-800.

On the CP-800 the significance of jitter is very different between the "conventional" (SPDIF etc.) and USB digital inputs.

For the former, the clock originates in the source and is sent along with the data. The CP-800 has no control over the data rate and must deal as best it can with the jitter inherent in the source and further jitter accumulation on the interface (cables, connectors, optical transmitters and receivers etc). Although the CP-800 does a very good job in this regard (by virtue of Alan Clark's expertise) it can never be completely immune to deficiencies of the source or interconnects. Thus, different sources, cables and choice of interface (e.g. AES/EBU versus SPDIF) may sound different. (Whatever may be claimed elsewhere, it is impossible to completely remove jitter from a data stream that is not rate-controlled by the de-jittering device - unless, say, the whole stream [track?] is buffered locally.)

The CP-800 USB sources are handled differently: Audio data is played from an internal buffer at a rate determined by the very low jitter master clocks within the CP-800. Only these clocks, the DACs and other CP-800 circuitry have a bearing on the sound quality. As long as the buffer has sufficient data, the replay system does not even care where the data came from. The USB sub-system has the job of maintaining the buffer size at a suitable level by adjusting the rate at which data is supplied over USB. Thus, the USB source does not "own" the data rate and, in effect, becomes merely a container for (and means of selecting) the digital audio data. The quality of the source clocks, power supply, USB cables etc. is irrelevant. Provided that the original files are uncompressed or lossless and that nothing within the source alters the data before it is sent over USB (e.g. the media player or operating system on a computer source) the resulting sound is determined only by the CP-800.


Chris

[busby]

Thanks for the information Chris. Are a Classe employee? You seem very knowledgeable on the internals of the CP-800.

I got pretty much all the information from the Classé "White Paper" (see the start of this thread) and interpreted it in terms of jitter performance. However, I have done some high-end audio design.

[beden1]

Maybe this was already covered, but how does the Sony analog sound compared with S/PDIF from the Oppo into the SSP DACs?

After listening for the past 5-6 days off and on, I prefer the Sony in analog best of all (stereo RCA connection through SSP-800 in Bypass Select). It sounds smooth (but not overly so) with great body and detail, and has the most realistic and exceptionally enjoyable playback overall, IMO. The soundstage is about 10 rows back of front and center, and it is extremely enjoyable to listen to the same CD over and over again as you pick up little nuances each time.

The only feature missing with this connection is the subs are not active, which makes me now wish I had the 801Ds instead of the 803Ds.

The Sony through the SSP-800 in digital is my second favorite in overall sound. After listening now for hours, I realized that it tends to come off a bit too fluid. The detail is not lost, but it kind of reminds me of looking at an LCD HDTV that is not calibrated properly, and the picture looks unreal because it is too smooth and almost cartoonish. The signal may be getting a bit too processed in the Sony and then again through the SSP-800, but the sound is still exceptional.

My least favorite is listening through the Oppo player with the balanced XLR connection through the SSP-800 in Bypass Select. It comes through as a CD mixed with the gain maxed out, and similar to how the Amy Winehouse "Back To Black" was produced.

The best sound from the Oppo player came through with the HDMI connection to the SSP-800 and with the SSP-800 doing the primary processing. But, this playback was not up to par as compared to the Sony as I posted beforehand.

After going back to see if I could determine with my ears if the Oppo was receiving more gain through the XLR connection, I have to say that it did not appear to be the case.

This has been an interesting experiment for me to discover for myself at least, that there are differences in the quality of digital playback that I could readily hear between two players. From reading many forum posts, I was previously under the impression that this was not really the case, and that the real differences were only in comparing analog playback.

* I did not have any SACDs with me here to compare the OPPO versus the Sony players.

* I just remembered that I had the Digital Filter on (normal setting) in the Sony player with playback in digital. I'll have to listen with the filter off to see how it sounds with just the SSP-800 doing the processing.

[Gump]

I got pretty much all the information from the Classé "White Paper" (see the start of this thread) and interpreted it in terms of jitter performance. However, I have done some high-end audio design.

Scotland + high-end design = Linn Engineer, perhaps?

[Gump]

Hey beden1, thanks for the comparison of the OPPO vs Sony players. I've been intrigued by the Sony since Kal reviewed it awhile back and was curious how it stacked up against the OPPO. Thanks again!

[Thumper]

Scotland + high-end design = Linn Engineer, perhaps?

Perhaps Linn and/or B&W? Lets play guess the engineer.

[beden1]

Hey beden1, thanks for the comparison of the OPPO vs Sony players. I've been intrigued by the Sony since Kal reviewed it awhile back and was curious how it stacked up against the OPPO. Thanks again!

You're welcome. Links for the current Sony ES CD player that replaced mine.

http://www.stereophile.com/content/sony-5400-es-sacd-player-1

http://store.sony.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10551&storeId=10151&langId=-1&partNumber=SCDXA5400ES

[diononiz]

Beden1,
Thanks for reviewing the Oppo. I guess from your feedback I should continue to use the CDP-102 as my transport.

[beden1]

Beden1,
Thanks for reviewing the Oppo. I guess from your feedback I should continue to use the CDP-102 as my transport.

I have not listened to the CDP-102 other than during an audition at a dealer a couple of years ago, but I'm sure it is a great CD player. I would keep what you have for music judging from what I heard out of the Oppo BDP-95.

[beden1]

I read the Sony SCD-XA9000ES owner's manual section on Digital Filters. There are two options of either Standard (provides a wide frequency range and spatial feeling) or Option (provides smooth and powerful sound with clear image position). I had been listening to the Standard Digital Filter option. There is no option for turning the digital filter off when playing a conventional CD.

The only time when the digital filter is innactive is when playing a SACD. I don't have any SACDs here so I'll see if I can pick one up this weekend for a comparison through the SSP-800.

[RebelMan]

On the CP-800 the significance of jitter is very different between the "conventional" (SPDIF etc.) and USB digital inputs.

In response to aarsoe's comment that the HDMI interface results in inconsistent performance, I indicated this to be a non-issue for the SSP. I added further that USB induced jitter can be worse suggesting that HDMI connections aren't as detrimental as aarsoe may like you to believe. The CP-800's design of handling USB data asynchronously is what sets it apart from typical implementations.

[RebelMan]

I was only aware of dB gain difference between RCA and XLR....didn't realize there would be anything significant comparing XLR with digital. I've just sent Classe an email asking what to do. In the meantime, I'll try to use a test disc and my SPL meter to see if I need to change the volume up/down to compensate.

Having said that, my ear tells me the volume is pretty close but the details are different. Not that the Classe DACs are bad, it's just the Oppo sounds more spacious....not louder.

Cheers,
-H

Loudness is the psychoacoustics of the matter. The louder sounds are the more that is perceived, in your case spaciousness. As you noted there is no line-level input "gain" between XLR and digital as there is between XLR and RCA. However, there will be variances of gain between different input sources and both can be compensated for in terms of "offsets". I was curious as to how you managed this in your evaluation. The outputs in both cases would be managed by the volume control and the changes would be universal so the test disc would have to be used on both sides of the inputs and measurements taken and compensated (with offsets) for each case accordingly.

[sc2]

Beden

20Hz – 200kHz <0.1dB Stereo analog bypass
20Hz – 20kHz <0.2dB All other sources

If I recall, this is the extents of human hearing...

[aarsoe]

Which is why B&W and many more have spent a lot of money making super tweeters..
We may not hear a single very high tone, but they do make a difference anyway.

Anyway this thread have been dead a long time. Let it rest.