Turntable for CAP 2100...

[LMAP]

Hello everybody from Spain;

Wich turntable would you recommend for my CAP 2100 amplifier?. I´m thinking of buying a REGA P5, PRO-JECT 9.1 or similar in Thorens, Clearaudio...
I read that I need to install a phone cartridge inside the amp. Can I install it or maybe must do it a technician of my Classe´s dealer?.

Thank´s everybody and very sorry for my bad english ops: .

[Glen B]

Installation of a Classé phono stage is do-it-yourself for anyone who can follow simple instructions and use an allen wrench. If you're not comfortable installing the board yourself, you can get a technician or knowledgeable friend to do it for you. You can use ANY turntable/phono cartridge combination of your choice with the amp.

[LMAP]

Ok. Than you for your fast reply.

[altanpsx]

I tried Classe's own phono cartridge, but I think seperate phono stage's are doing better job. Of course I am not talking about 100 usd phono stages. I also suggest you to use tube phono stages. Project and Roksan turn tables and phono stages are good also.

[Glen B]

You mean phono "stage" not phono "cartridge". Making a blanket statement that separate phono stages do a better job does not help. Give specific examples. The sky is the limit when it comes to outboard phono preamps, and at some point, there are ones that are going to be better than a Classé internal phono stage.

The phono stages for the upper tier Classé preamps are superior to those of the lower tier preamps and integrated amps, and I have owned both. I found my current Classé internal phono stage to be more transparent than the $900.00 Monolithic Sound model PS-2 outboard phono stage and HC-1B power supply setup I previously owned.

[LMAP]

Hi all;

So; if I understand correctly, Is better a stage than a cartridge of Classé inside the amp?. I read that the phono cartridge is marvellous, because the sound of the turntables through this device is very amazing. Is it true?.

Thank´s and sorry for my poor expression in English and any mistakes.

[Glen B]

Classé makes pretty good phono stages; you don't have to worry about that. However, as I said above, at some price point, there is going to be an outboard phono preamp that sounds better than your internal phono stage. Whether you want to go with an outboard phono preamp versus internal phono stage depends on how much you are willing to spend on the outboard unit and what level of sonic refinement you are looking for.

[LMAP]

Classé makes pretty good phono stages; you don't have to worry about that. However, as I said above, at some price point, there is going to be an outboard phono preamp that sounds better than your internal phono stage. Whether you want to go with an outboard phono preamp versus internal phono stage depends on how much you are willing to spend on the outboard unit and what level of sonic refinement you are looking for.

Ok. I´m looking for a level of sonic refinement better than I have now, and now is quite high because I am a music lover with an excellent musical ear and sensibility.
Another thing is the budget and if you really justify a large expense in it or not.
What would you recommend if I say that my hi-fi system consists of CAP 2100, CDP 100 and B&W 803 D?. What is the payment to be done by adding a player (turntable) to match the circunstances?

Thak´s again

[Glen B]

The turntables you mentioned above are a good place to start. You also need to match up the 'table with a suitable cartridge. Do you have a preference for moving magnet or moving coil cartridges ? Have you heard any that you like ? I recommend you find a dealer that has vinyl playback equipment and do some auditioning to get an idea of what to expect at different price levels. Phono equipment is very subjective and no amount of recommendations can replace listening.

Phono preamps like the Pro-Ject Tube Box SE II, and EAR-834P range of models are popular units ranging between $700.00 and $2,200.00. Forum Member Kpodolski installed the Classé internal phono boards ($500.00) in his CAP-2100 a while back (see link below) and seemed happy with it. Maybe you should touch base with him and get some feedback. Also check out the Vinylengine Forum.

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=30490&highlight=phono

http://www.vinylengine.com/phpBB2/

[LMAP]

Yes. I Know the link of the forum member Kpodolski, and I think that he is very happy whith his instalation.
Thank you very much for your link to vinylengine. Did not know it and I think it is interesting.
Looks very educational to me here, because I am aware of many things that I did not know before about this matter .
Tomorrow I will speak with a spanish expert in this world of high-end to give me his opinion. But I fear that this expert is going to ask me to spend much money on the expansion.
I think you're right when you say that I must listen to different devices.
In relation to the capsules MM or MC, I do not know very well what is the difference, and which of them is better than the other one.

Regards.

[Glen B]

There are some very good moving magnet cartridges, and many people are quite happy with them, though when it comes to finer high end sound, a lot of people prefer moving coil cartridges. Grado and Audio-Technica are but two popular and well regarded makers of MM cartridges.

MM cartridges generally have higher output than MCs but are sensitive to loading. MC cartridges tend to have lower output and require additional signal boost above that of MM, in the form of an MC head amp, or transformer.

Because of the lower output and additional amplification required, MC setups may also have lower signal-to-noise ratios. MC cartridges also tend to have non-replaceable stylii, versus MM cartridges.

In the end, its all about getting the right synergy between turntable, cartridge, and phono preamp.

[altanpsx]

You mean phono "stage" not phono "cartridge". Making a blanket statement that separate phono stages do a better job does not help. Give specific examples. The sky is the limit when it comes to outboard phono preamps, and at some point, there are ones that are going to be better than a Classé internal phono stage.

The phono stages for the upper tier Classé preamps are superior to those of the lower tier preamps and integrated amps, and I have owned both. I found my current Classé internal phono stage to be more transparent than the $900.00 Monolithic Sound model PS-2 outboard phono stage and HC-1B power supply setup I previously owned.

In my country CPM is 1000 usd. There are lots of alternatives around. I listened Classe CPM, Roksan Caspian, Project Tube Box, Ear, and ASR mini Basis. Ear and the ASR were the better ones. Especially ASR was the best one. If in Spain Classe CPM costs 1,000 usd. Try Ear or ASR, these are far more better.

[LMAP]

In the end, its all about getting the right synergy between turntable, cartridge, and phono preamp.

Indeed. This is the main problem.

Thanks for everything and I will inform you of the decision that I take.

With regard to the opinion of altanpsx (by the way, what country are you from?), the ear product is around the price of the Classé, but the mini Basis, its price is much higher.

Today I spoke with a B&W´s engineer and he recommended the pre-Classe. Obviously, Classe and Bowers is the same and it is reasonable to recommend products that they own. The price of the unit to install is 570 €, or 740 $ more or less. I Think is not an excessive price for a great electronic component. The turntable that was recommended to me is the Rega P 5 minimum. What do you think about this?.

Regards.

[lawoftrust]

@lmap

I had the Rega P5 and it is a fine piece of equipment. I used it with the additional external power supply (TTPSU) and the Rega Exact cartridge. However, seeing from what existing equipment you come from, I would strongly advice for a Rega P7 to start with. It has much of the technology of the P9 for a significantly lower price. The TTPSU is included. The sound is marvelous. Though I liked by Exact cartridge, as an MM type it has certain limitations regarding resolution etc. Maybe you should ask your dealer to demonstrate a good MM cartridge vs a good MC cartridge. A Benz would of course be a good one but there are so many others out there that sound lovely.

The Majik LP12 is another way to got as it fits beautifully with the Classé system and it would be a complete set including the Linn Addikt (a very fine MM system which I used when starting my Linn turntable career).

But you should demo and compare eg a Rega and a Linn, a Rega is much easier to handle whereas a Linn seems to offer more musicality and is entirely upgradeable to a LP12 SE.

Hope this helps.

[LMAP]

@lmap

I had the Rega P5 and it is a fine piece of equipment. I used it with the additional external power supply (TTPSU) and the Rega Exact cartridge. However, seeing from what existing equipment you come from, I would strongly advice for a Rega P7 to start with. It has much of the technology of the P9 for a significantly lower price. The TTPSU is included. The sound is marvelous. Though I liked by Exact cartridge, as an MM type it has certain limitations regarding resolution etc. Maybe you should ask your dealer to demonstrate a good MM cartridge vs a good MC cartridge. A Benz would of course be a good one but there are so many others out there that sound lovely.

The Majik LP12 is another way to got as it fits beautifully with the Classé system and it would be a complete set including the Linn Addikt (a very fine MM system which I used when starting my Linn turntable career).

But you should demo and compare eg a Rega and a Linn, a Rega is much easier to handle whereas a Linn seems to offer more musicality and is entirely upgradeable to a LP12 SE.

Hope this helps.

Thank you for your contribution.
What is the difference between REGA P5 and P7?. Would it be smarter to spend 1000 € more on a turntable just a step above?.

Regards