Official SSP-800 Thread

[RebelMan]

I would agree I think that would give them more customers and nail the Denon? How can we ask Classé to consider to include the Audyssey MultiHQ

Start a poll?

[sc2]

Start a poll?

Do include the Dolby Volume.

Steve

[rompower]

Anyone can comment CA-5100 VS CA-5200 ?
Speakers: 803D
PReamp/pro: SSP-800(coming)
thanks

[Gump]

Hi rompower,

The 5100 is a very nice amp and would make your 803D's sound great, but the 5200 will really take control of them and open them up.

It's kinda like if you're gonna buy a Mustang or the new Camaro coming out would you go for the peppy V6 or that nice big V8?

More power, more speed, oh yea---more money!

Demo them and then decide.

BTW, you probably should've started another specific thread for your question cause it doesn't really pertain to the SSP-800 topic...just FYI so that you might get better feedback.

Anyone can comment CA-5100 VS CA-5200 ?
Speakers: 803D
PReamp/pro: SSP-800(coming)
thanks

[rompower]

yeah but the problem is... no dealer keeps them in demo... I can only find the CA-5200...
Looks like it's expensive to have them all

[wettou]

Start a poll?

Yes, RebelMan could you please start a poll, if gather enough interest Classé might feel it is worth including with the upgrade?

"Classé: Could you please include the Audyssey MultiEQ XT and Audyssey Dynamic EQ in the SSP-800"

Audyssey MultEQ XT:
When performed by a professional installer using MultEQ Pro software, MultEQ XT has the capability to deliver the highest quality sound. Because the calculations are performed on a PC, there is an abundance of processing power for a large number of measurements to cover even the most demanding custom installations.

MultEQ XT, using the receiver interface, takes up to 8 measurements around the listening area and uses high resolution equalization filters for satellites and subwoofers. This is the most powerful built-in version of MultEQ. http://www.audyssey.com/technology/multEQ_products.html

Audyssey applies hundreds of correction points

The first step in correcting the effects of the room on the loudspeaker response is to generate the control points that will be used to morph the response into the desired shape. To capture some of the finer details in the response fluctuations, it is necessary to use hundreds of points. MultEQ dynamically applies the points where they are needed most, typically in the lower frequencies. MultEQ applies hundreds of correction points to each speaker's frequency response curve.




Parametric EQ produces an imprecise fit to the response

Even the most sophisticated parametric EQ systems in receivers today only have a maximum of 10–12 bands. These are not enough to capture the response and the result is a representation that misses many of the problems.

http://www.audyssey.com/technology/graphs/graph1.html

What is Audyssey Dynamic EQ?
Audyssey Dynamic EQ is the first loudness correction technology to solve the problem of deteriorating sound quality as volume is decreased by taking into account human perception and room acoustics.

"How is Dynamic EQ different from other loudness methods?
Other loudness correction methods have been proposed, but Audyssey Dynamic EQ is the first to address all of the five major problems required for proper loudness correction.

Other methods fall short for the following reasons:

• They have no method of room measurement. Other loudness controls do not have a method for measuring the actual playback volume in the room your system is set up in. Audyssey MultEQ first measures playback levels, then provides this information to Dynamic EQ for proper loudness correction.
• They have no method of room equalization. Variations in the response of a room can be as large as 10 dB or more at some frequencies. Without proper equalization, the effectiveness of loudness correction will vary immensely from seat to seat.
• They have no real-time analysis of audio content. Film and music pieces are typically made at reference volumes much louder than typical listening volumes. At reference level, loud sounds can be near 100 dB SPL, while soft sounds can be much softer, near 50 dB SPL. If a consumer listens at softer levels such as 20 dB down, loud sounds will need less loudness correction than softer sounds. This must be analyzed continuously to ensure the correct octave-to-octave balance is sustained as the content is playing."
• For more information: http://www.audyssey.com/technology/dynamicEQ.html

http://www.dolby.com/consumer/techno...ume-works.aspx

[rompower]

Answer from Classé...

"I cannot provide a schedule for the arrival of the DSP that is able to decode the next generation HD audio formats, but I can confirm that the DSP is actively in development and that we sincerely hope it will be available before the end of the year."

So... good news!

[wettou]

Answer from Classé..."I cannot provide a schedule for the arrival of the DSP that is able to decode the next generation HD audio formats, but I can confirm that the DSP is actively in development and that we sincerely hope it will be available before the end of the year." So... good news!

Yes very good news

[RebelMan]

Yes, RebelMan could you please start a poll, if gather enough interest Classé might feel it is worth including with the upgrade?

I will wait to evaluate the PEQ in the SSP-800 first. Something you need to keep in mind. Room correction systems are designed to deal with the first three octaves because they are more difficult or nearly impossible to fully treat with conventional means. The fact that the Audyssey tampers with the midband and up should concern you. Furthermore, optimal use the MultiEQ feature requires professional software AND calibration. Maybe Classé was on to something? :W

[wettou]

I will wait to evaluate the PEQ in the SSP-800 first. Something you need to keep in mind. Room correction systems are designed to deal with the first three octaves because they are more difficult or nearly impossible to fully treat with conventional means. The fact that the Audyssey tampers with the midband and up should concern you. Furthermore, optimal use the MultiEQ feature requires professional software AND calibration. Maybe Classé was on to something? :W

Sounds good let me know when do you expect your SSP-800? My dealer told me first week in June and I am the first one on his list to call and may be take it home to demo

It helps that I spent $35K with him, we negotiated otherwise it would have been $40K

[rompower]

Wettou, do you know which number you are on the Classé list? Weird that your dealer can told you a date since no one knows when in june it will be available...

Beside...I'm 52th eheh kinda anxious to get my ssp-800, especially since I'm buying a new new new house with a dedicated room in the basement! , 9X14&16X20
14&16... front of the room will be 14' and back, 16... so nothing perpendicullar

[sikoniko]

Sounds good let me know when do you expect your SSP-800? My dealer told me first week in June and I am the first one on his list to call and may be take it home to demo

It helps that I spent $35K with him, we negotiated otherwise it would have been $40K

Thats rather optimistic at best. I don't expect classe to begin shipping until the 2nd or 3rd week of June. My guess is that it goes to disti, then to dealers, so maybe he meant 1st week of July?

[dmccombs]

Yes, RebelMan could you please start a poll, if gather enough interest Classé might feel it is worth including with the upgrade?

"Classé: Could you please include the Audyssey MultiEQ XT and Audyssey Dynamic EQ in the SSP-800"

Wettou,

Have you used Audessey in a system, or are you just going off the literature? I do hope all this fuss is from practical experience.

I have the Audessey on my Denon AVP. I keep trying it because it is "supposed" to be better. In the end, I think it does some things well, but often times comes off as artificial/digital.

Overall, I prefer Augessey off for 2-ch and multi-channel music. I think Audessey is a slight plus overall for movies.

Given my experience, I don't really care if Classe had Audessey implemented. It would be nice if there was a manual EQ though for rooms that have big nodes to tame though.

Some of the readers here know, I plan to audition the Classe. The lack of Audyssey in the Classe will not impact my decision to switch to the Classe, or not.

Darrell

[beden1]

Wettou,

Have you used Audessey in a system, or are you just going off the literature? I do hope all this fuss is from practical experience.

I have the Audessey on my Denon AVP. I keep trying it because it is "supposed" to be better. In the end, I think it does some things well, but often times comes off as artificial/digital.

Overall, I prefer Augessey off for 2-ch and multi-channel music. I think Audessey is a slight plus overall for movies.

Given my experience, I don't really care if Classe had Audessey implemented. It would be nice if there was a manual EQ though for rooms that have big nodes to tame though.

Some of the readers here know, I plan to audition the Classe. The lack of Audyssey in the Classe will not impact my decision to switch to the Classe, or not.

Darrell

Darrell,

Does this mean that you are not satisfied with the Denon AVP, particularly in the way that it sounds in 2 channel?

[wettou]

Wettou, do you know which number you are on the Classé list? Weird that your dealer can told you a date since no one knows when in june it will be available... Beside...I'm 52th eheh kinda anxious to get my ssp-800, especially since I'm buying a new new new house with a dedicated room in the basement! , 9X14&16X20 14&16... front of the room will be 14' and back, 16... so nothing perpendicular

Congratulation, cool room non parallel surfaces the sound should be outstanding! I don't know which number I am for the SSP-800, all I know is that this dealer is their biggest dealer in South California.

[wettou]

Wettou, Have you used Audyssey in a system, or are you just going off the literature? I do hope all this fuss is from practical experience. I have the Audyssey on my Denon AVP. I keep trying it because it is "supposed" to be better. In the end, I think it does some things well, but often times comes off as artificial/digital. Overall, I prefer Audyssey off for 2-ch and multi-channel music. I think Audyssey is a slight plus overall for movies. Given my experience, I don't really care if Classé had Audyssey implemented. It would be nice if there was a manual EQ though for rooms that have big nodes to tame though. Some of the readers here know, I plan to audition the Classé. The lack of Audyssey in the Classé will not impact my decision to switch to the Classé, or not. Darrell

Interesting are you saying the Audyssey doesn't work? What kind of speakers do you have hooked up?

[dmccombs]

Darrell,

Does this mean that you are not satisfied with the Denon AVP, particularly in the way that it sounds in 2 channel?

Beden,

Not at all. I am a happy camper right now. The Denon has very good sound quality, and everything works perfectly. You don't see that combination too often with higher end gear (odd isn't it?).

I have tried the the 2-CH Analog inputs with a Krell SACD mkIII, and it sounded very nice. It was better then running my Denon 3930ci via the Denon Link3.

I will get to test it more on Friday when I have a PS Audio DLIII DAC (Cullen modified) on hand. I will use both my Denon 3930ci and my Sonos as transports.

But, there is much hype about how great the Classe is going to sound. I am always open to improving my system. If people here love the SQ after they have done some auditions, I will want to audition it against the Denon.

Regards,
Darrell

[dmccombs]

Interesting are you saying the Audyssey doesn't work? What kind of speakers do you have hooked up?

I am not saying Audessey doesn't work. It does some things very well, but there are trade-offs. In short, I feel you gain detail and seperation in the instruments, but lose texture and realism in the music. Some people like the trade-offs. I don't when listening to music. I do make the trade for movies.

I am running the following:
Fronts: B&W 802D - Classe CAM-350 amps
Center: B&W HTM2D - Classe CAM-350 amp
Rears: B&W 804S - Classe CAM-201 amp

I know it isn't your usual recommendation (5 x 802Ds or 5 x 800Ds), but its what I got, and it should suffice for running Audessey.

Darrell

[wettou]

I am not saying Audyssey doesn't work. It does some things very well, but there are trade-offs. In short, I feel you gain detail and separation in the instruments, but lose texture and realism in the music. Some people like the trade-offs. I don't when listening to music. I do make the trade for movies. I am running the following: Fronts: B&W 802D - Classé CAM-350 amps, Center: B&W HTM2D - Classé CAM-350 amp, Rears: B&W 804S - Classé CAM-201 amp

Cool, set-up:T Does that mean you are trading your Denon AVP for a SSP-800? I am going to try a Denon receiver that has the Audyssey this way I can experience it for myself.

I know it isn't your usual recommendation (5 x 802Ds or 5 x 800Ds), but its what I got, and it should suffice for running Audyssey. Darrell

I see, now worries, I don't have a usual recommendation again I like to have the same three front speakers the same that is all. My recommendation would be three Nautilus but I am a bit short on $$$.8)

[dmccombs]

Cool, set-up:T Does that mean you are trading your Denon AVP for a SSP-800? I am going to try a Denon receiver that has the Audyssey this way I can experience it for myself.

No, see my reply to Beden, 3 posts up.

[beden1]

Beden,

But, there is much hype about how great the Classe is going to sound. I am always open to improving my system. If people here love the SQ after they have done some auditions, I will want to audition it against the Denon.

Regards,
Darrell

Darrell,

I think your comparison with the Denon vs. the Classe SSP-800 will be very interesting and helpful. When the time comes, you will have had enough time for your brain to ingrain the Denon sound, so the Classe audition should readily reveal any differences.

I look forward to your impressions.

Thanks,

Brooks

[Marco Lisi]

I think your comparison with the Denon vs. the Classe SSP-800 will be very interesting and helpful.

At High End München I had the pleasure of sitting in on a presentation of the new pro/power combo. It was demonstrated along with Denon's new blu-ray platform on 4 803D's, the HTM2D center and a ASW855 sub.

My first impression was that the setup didn't convince at all! Ofcourse I know you have to be carefull with first impressions, let alone an impression on a trade fair! I want to hear more of these machines...

The demo was a music DVD from Robin Williams that I personaly own and when the public applauded, it sounded like tin cans. Because of the companies reputation this is and cannot be right!? For a top notch processor???

I really hope that someone has had other experiences!

:T

[wettou]

At High End München I had the pleasure of sitting in on a presentation of the new pro/power combo. It was demonstrated along with Denon's new blu-ray platform on 4 803D's, the HTM2D center and a ASW855 sub. My first impression was that the setup didn't convince at all! Ofcourse I know you have to be carefull with first impressions, let alone an impression on a trade fair! I want to hear more of these machines... The demo was a music DVD from Robin Williams that I personally own and when the public applauded, it sounded like tin cans. Because of the companies reputation this is and cannot be right!? For a top notch processor??? I really hope that someone has had other experiences! :T

Well this can't be right! But could be worrisome ! May be Denon might win after all Oops!

[beden1]

Well this can't be right! But could be worrisome ! May be Denon might win after all Oops!

You may want to read Marco's first impression of the Denon again. He said that the Denon set-up did not sound very good, albeit in a less than ideal setting.

Since the Denon pre-pro does have all the bells and whistles, it will be interesting to learn about comparisons with the Classe SSP-800 when available.

[wettou]

You may want to read Marco's first impression of the Denon again. He said that the Denon set-up did not sound very good, albeit in a less than ideal setting. Since the Denon pre-pro does have all the bells and whistles, it will be interesting to learn about comparisons with the Classe SSP-800 when available.

Oh I thought he was talking about the Classé, ok I feel better Yes I can't wait to hear the comparaison.

[rompower]

NOW IN JUNE! lol

[RebelMan]

I will have a status update later today. It will also include a picture or two (hopefully more). Stay tuned! :T

[rompower]

Let's go Rebel... day is going by! eheheh

[RebelMan]

Update III

Classe' has graciously provided a few more details surrounding the SSP-800 and it starts with the DSP engine.

It should be clear by now that the SSP-800 will initially ship with a mono-DSP board. It will use a 1st Generation Texas Instruments (TI) digital signal processor from the Aureus family and is designated the TMS320D610A. The core is drawn from the 2nd Generation TMS320C6000 Floating-Point DSP family, namely the TMS320C6713. (TI offers three performance tiers in the TMS320C6000 family, the floating-point being the most advanced (and expensive) of the bunch.)

The dual-DSP board is based on the 2nd Generation Texas Instruments (TI) digital signal processor from the Aureus family and is designated the TMS320D710A. The core is drawn from the (current) 3rd Generation TMS320C6000 Floating-Point DSP family, namely the TMS320C6727. The DSP class and performance tier is an important point to make because variations between Aureus DSPs can be capacious. Therefore, casual comparisons should not be made between various makers of Aureus driven pre-amplifier/processors because they will lead to the wrong conclusions.

As sophisticated as the TMS320D610A is the TMS320D710A running at the same clock speed is considerably more efficient (can do more work per clock cycle) and significantly more powerful (can process more complex instructions). Keep in mind that the DSP upgrade board is going to be equipped with two of these advanced DSPs! (EDIT: Between the 610 and 710 chips overall performance is improved by 50%. This translates to a dual-DSP upgrade board that is 200% (3x) faster than the stock module!!! :E) Therefore, it behooves one that is comparison shopping for their next surround sound processor to do their homework. One better know the caliber of the engine that's running or face the ole' saying... you get what you pay for.

The DSPs used in both MDS modules are built on a 64-bit double-precision floating-point architecture. This enables the SSP-800 to perform fast and accurate calculations for PEQ room correction and bass management. These are two very important parameters to get right in an advanced pre-amplifier/processor. This is just one, albeit very important, distinguishing capability that separates the SSP-800 from the wannabes.

(The dual-DSP board is not quite 50% larger than mono-DSP board making it possible to share the same mounting holes and connection spaces.)

Classe' also revealed that Cirrus Logic's (flagship) CS5381 chip will make up the differential A/D converters. It's another carry over from the statement SSP-900 (no surprises here). I said it before, the SSP-800 is a reference class pre-amplifier/processor that makes NO compromises to sound quality! The proof is in the pudding (and the listening - according to my source).

Classe' decided to forgo the AES/EBU interface on the SSP-800 because few sources have it. They have also determined that it seldom gets used. Since the new pre/pro re-clocks the data any advantages the interface would have provided are effectively negated and it would have unnecessarily taken up valuable back panel space.

The USB port on the back panel is for control purposes only. No data transfers.

Unfortunately, units are not yet ready to ship. The hardware is being built and the software is going through the cyclical paces of testing and fixing. The hardware is rock solid and assembly is proceeding smoothly. This is a strong indicator of long term reliability. As someone who is very familiar with hardware and software symbiosis, hardware is rarely a trouble spot. Software, on the other hand, is (nine times out of ten) not so lucky.

Each new build puts the processor closer to the finish line but anyone familiar with software development will tell you, the process is inherently unpredictable. Classe' is not going to be hasty and release the processor prematurely to meet a deadline. Quality is their utmost priority. As vigilant as Classe' may be I still expect a few minor bumps along the way to full maturity. It happened with the previous generation so it is possible it will happen again especially when one considers the magnitude of the SSP-800's design.

As such there is no firm ship date but a June release is still imminent until further notice. For now enjoy this factory picture of some SSP-800's hot off the press. :T

Later I'll get around to updating the opening post with this information along with a few more pictures.

[rompower]

:E ;x(

[RebelMan]

I've added some pics to the opening post. Enjoy.

[Z Man]

I do have to say that the SSP-800 is by far the sexiest looking processor I have seen. And I'm sure it will sound amazing as well. While it's missing some key features and functions that I and others want/need, it should prove to be a very good product for its target audience.

[rompower]

What can I say.... m.m.m Anxious to get it? few weeks left!

[RebelMan]

While it's missing some key features and functions that I and others want/need, it should prove to be a very good product for its target audience.

Z Man, I just reviewed your rather nice system. If you'll indulge me for a moment I'd be curious to know (features wise) what this combination (Denon DVD-2500BTCI & Denon AVP-A1HDCI) gives you that this combination (Denon DVD-3800BDCI & Classe' SSP-800) wouldn't (besides $2K in your pocket)? I am only interested in the things that appeal to you. For the sake of simplifying this discussion let's assume that room correction could be achieved equally between the two.

[Z Man]

Z Man, I just reviewed your rather nice system. If you'll indulge me for a moment I'd be curious to know (features wise) what this combination (Denon DVD-2500BTCI & Denon AVP-A1HDCI) gives you that this combination (Denon DVD-3800BDCI & Classe' SSP-800) wouldn't (besides $2K in your pocket)? I am only interested in the things that appeal to you. For the sake of simplifying this discussion let's assume that room correction could be achieved equally between the two.

Thanks.

Basically HBR decoding done in the pre/pro is what the 2500/AVP gives me. This is one of the many reasons I went for the 2500 and AVP-A1HDCI. The 3800 is a very nice player that has all the goodies built in, but for me I still want the decoding to be done by the pre/pro rather than the player (it's personal preference). Now once the SSP-800 gets the dual board upgrade for HBR decoding, if each was paired up with a 2500, then it would basically come down to which sounds better for movie playback.

I love Classe' products, and the SSP-800 would have been a top contender for me had it offered HBR decoding right out the gate, 6 HDMI inputs, A/D conversion on the EXT IN, THX processing, and at least the ability to play lossless music files via the USB port. I love the AVP-A1HDCI's ability to scale and process video signals, and Audyssey is a way cool feature, but I could have lived without those things and gone with an SSP-800 had it at least offered the other things I really wanted.

I value excellent sound quality, and because of this I was very interested in the SSP-800. But when I learned about all the things that it would not have, I sadly scratched it off my list. Maybe these things aren't important to a lot of people, but they are very important for my needs.

I have been very impressed with what the 2500/AVP combination does for movies. TrueHD and DTS-HD MA are phenomenal. Now once the SSP-800 is able to decode these audio formats, I know that it's going to sound nothing short of spectacular. Had the SSP-800 had the above mentioned features, I very well could have been here with you all patiently waiting for one.

But I have to say that I am very happy with my choice, the AVP gives me everything that I want and need, has tons of flexibility, and sounds amazing. Plus everything is working great!

I think all of you that are waiting to get your SSP-800's are going to be smiling from ear to ear once you all get yours. It's going to be an excellent product, and I can't take anything away from the design team that brought it to life. A lot of R&D went into it I'm sure.

And I believe everyone here on this thread is super happy to have you as the one keeping them all informed about this new product. I have to say my hats off to you, you're doing an excellent job! :T


Seth

[RebelMan]

Thanks for the kind words Z. :P

[Z Man]

You're welcome.

[hifiguymi]

Basically HBR decoding done in the pre/pro is what the 2500/AVP gives me. This is one of the many reasons I went for the 2500 and AVP-A1HDCI. The 3800 is a very nice player that has all the goodies built in, but for me I still want the decoding to be done by the pre/pro rather than the player (it's personal preference). Now once the SSP-800 gets the dual board upgrade for HBR decoding, if each was paired up with a 2500, then it would basically come down to which sounds better for movie playback.
Seth

I don't know if you have the ability to demo a DVD-3800BDCI at home or not but if you can you should give it a shot. The reason I say that is in my store we have a DVD-3800BDCI paired up with an AVR-3808CI. The AVR-3808CI has, just like all of the pieces above it, the D.D.S.C.-HD surround decoder. The same one is in the DVD-3800BDCI as well. We have done numerous comparisons between the decoder in the receiver and the decoder in the BD player. The DVD-3800BDCI is better, and not by a small margin. I don't have an AVP-A1HDCI on display so I can't do the comparison here.

This isn't an argument on which is better in general, a (any) BD players decoder or one in a processor. It's just an observation between two pieces here and a curiosity with another.

Eric

[Z Man]

I don't know if you have the ability to demo a DVD-3800BDCI at home or not but if you can you should give it a shot. The reason I say that is in my store we have a DVD-3800BDCI paired up with an AVR-3808CI. The AVR-3808CI has, just like all of the pieces above it, the D.D.S.C.-HD surround decoder. The same one is in the DVD-3800BDCI as well. We have done numerous comparisons between the decoder in the receiver and the decoder in the BD player. The DVD-3800BDCI is better, and not by a small margin. I don't have an AVP-A1HDCI on display so I can't do the comparison here.

This isn't an argument on which is better in general, a (any) BD players decoder or one in a processor. It's just an observation between two pieces here and a curiosity with another.

Eric

Actually my dealer has only gotten the transport, and doesn't have the 3800. So unfortunately I don't have access to a 3800 to do a comparison. But you're right, it would be interesting to see how the AVP fares against the 3800.

[rompower]

Rebel, any ETA yet? :P Considering pictures you posted on first page... You certainly have good contact @ Classé

Anxious to sell my Rotel amp!

[RebelMan]

Sorry, no new news.

[RebelMan]

Nothing concrete on it yet but start thinking July.

[rompower]

They should remove it on their webpage then

[RebelMan]

The SSP-800 is going through the finishing stages of certification and looking good so far and as expected. All of the major software hurdles have been jumped. Only minor details and unexpected sequence issues remain. It may be June after all.

[rompower]

Yeah... Classé replied me it should go in production at the end of june.. so with holidays here in Quebec, we should see some SSP-800 mid-july

Can't wait to get it.. allready sold my amp! lol