BASH or Dayton sub amp?

[oneplustwo]

Hey folks,

Any strong opinions about the BASH vs. Dayton 500W sub amps? I'm going to build my first sub with the Dayton Reference HF 12" driver using Zaph's archived design. The Bash is quite a bit cheaper so I'm leaning that way. Some of the reviews say that it's relatively flimsy and would flex with the pressure of the sub so I'm planning on isolating the amp from the actual enclosure.

Happy to entertain other options as well, but 500W seems to be the right number if you have others in that range.

Thanks!

[Hunter12]

Totem Accoustics use the Bash in their $1700 sub, don't know
if this is a good thing or not. They only sell these in high
end stores in Toronto. Friends of mine who buy Totem
product annual income would be in the 100K range.

http://totemacoustic.com/english/hi-fi/sub-woofers/tribe-sub/

How do the SR71 compare to the ZDT3.5, they both look
incredible.

[Rick Craig]

Hey folks,

Any strong opinions about the BASH vs. Dayton 500W sub amps? I'm going to build my first sub with the Dayton Reference HF 12" driver using Zaph's archived design. The Bash is quite a bit cheaper so I'm leaning that way. Some of the reviews say that it's relatively flimsy and would flex with the pressure of the sub so I'm planning on isolating the amp from the actual enclosure.

Happy to entertain other options as well, but 500W seems to be the right number if you have others in that range.

Thanks!

I like the O Audio version of the BASH amp. Separate EQ and parametric filters for superior flexibility.

[BOBinGA]

+1 on the O Audio.

-Bob

[oneplustwo]

Thanks for the thoughts, I was looking at O-audio as well... looks like a great value. That's probably my new top choice at the moment.

@Hunter12: The ZDT and SR71 are both great! The mids of the ZDT are hard to beat though. Not surprising given they're 3.5 vs. TM though. Also, I feel like the paper woofers on the SR71 offer a different kind of sound. It's subtle though... and could be purely psychological on my part.

[Hunter12]

Thank's for the feedback, maybe I should be more blunt, if your house
was on fire which set of speakers would you grab.

I just remebered my wealthy stock broker brother has a 500 watt
Bash in a custom high end sub and loves it. Sorry the names of
all his equipment I have never heard of before and cannot remember
them. Cambridge rings a bell but he moved on to more expensive stuff
that never really gave him the added benefit.

[oneplustwo]

Hmmm... I really love the look of my SR71's and they were my first build. Plus, they're smaller and would be easier to carry out of the house in a fire!

That being said, I would probably rather listen to the ZDTs.

It's kinda like picking your favorite kid.

[BobEllis]

Nothing against any of the brands mentioned, but don't be overly influenced by the tastes of wealthy people. I have a few wealthy friends who love their systems. One is a B@$# thing that's best quality is that it is fairly unobtrusive visually, the other features 3" MTMs LCR, cheap in wall surrounds and a 10" 150 subwoofer in a 2,000 square foot room with a 110" front projector. The whole sound system cost less than one of his chairs. A third was in awe of some large Dunlavys at a shop that to me sounded like at least one tweeter was cooked. All claim to not hear smoother response, lower distortion and greater extension of my system, but sat motionless with big smiles during their demos.

That said, they might give you the opportunity to listen to something you might not otherwise hear, for better or worse.

My preference is a (used) pro amp just to avoid the high pass filters in so many of the plate amps. I'll EQ in my crossover if needed

[Hunter12]

This will make you smile. A friend of mine who I sail with allowed
me to have my wedding at his Yacht Club, just 30 odd people.
My brother brought down the first system he bought when he
was young and poor, he didn't care if it got rained on or damaged.

The weather was perfect, my wife is from Germany and brought the
music, Brazilian or something, great food and lots of wonderful
people. At the end of the evening my brother stated that that was the
best sound he has ever heard in his twenty years of throwing 10's
of thousand of dollars into the game.

He couldn't believe it, he is deeply embarrased with how much he
has spent on all the system's he has experimented with.


Bob, what brands of Pro Audio do you recomend?.

[BobEllis]

Yep, that got a smile.

FWIW, I am one of those who believes that believe that you don't need a great amp for subwoofer duty.

I have a 28 year old Hafler DH-500 doing my sub duty. Not the most powerful thing, but it does the job for me. It's fan isn't noticeable 98% of the time - only when it kicks up high after an extended rumblefest. Normally it makes much less noise than my RPTV.

For new production, there are the usual suspects depending on your budget. The Behringer EP series seems to have a good following, as do Crown and QSC (all available from Parts express). www.diycable.com has a selection of amps that seem to be solid as well. I haven't used any of them since I had a Crown DC300A in the late 70s, though.

[Hunter12]

This is really good to know, I almost ordered two RSS210 for a dual
sub set up designed by Paul Carmody and I read through all the reiews
of the Bash amp at PE and I became kinda worried. Many of them dropped
dead in a year or so. I'd rather spend a bit more and have some peace of
mind ie. look into the used pro stuff.


Just to clarify the Yacht association, I helped a friend build a 34' schooner
and have decades of sailling experience but am not well to do. Wealthy
people call me because they are afraid of taking out their large sailboats
and they know if something breaks I can usually fix it. The sad thing is
they own these large vessels but don't have a lot of time to enjoy them,
they are always envolved with work.

[john trials]

My preference is a (used) pro amp just to avoid the high pass filters in so many of the plate amps. I'll EQ in my crossover if needed

I bought a plate amp for my initial sub (Parts Express SA240), because I didn't have a receiver/processor with LFE outputs at the time. Now that I have a receiver with LFE out, I use an old receiver (200W/channel) for my sub amp, and it works great. The SA240 is kind of a piece of junk...but what do you want for only $100 on sale? With LFE outputs, all you need is an amp (no filters or anything).

So I'd recommend a power amp, like BobEllis, if you have a receiver/processor with LFE out. Just be aware that power amps with huge power capabilities will have a 20A plug, which might not fit the outlets in your home. Don't go too big with the power amp...check the plug style.

I also built a sub with the RSS315HF, same volume as Zaph's (but with the amp separate from the sub cabinet for flexibility in amplification)...it's nice! You should be happy with it.

[oneplustwo]

Thanks for the tips. I thought about going with a power amp, but thought the flexibility of having the filters would be good if I want to integrate the sub into a non-HT setup. I like your idea of using an old receiver as a de-facto sub amp! I have one, but it's really old and doesn't have much power behind it so it probably wouldn't have worked well for me. Might have been worth a try though!

I think I'm probably going to go with the O-Audio. No hurry though... just got my driver yesterday and have lots of other work to keep me busy before I need to pull the trigger.

[john trials]

The receiver I'm using is 28 years old (and still works perfectly).

[Silver1omo]

With no high pass the driver may get some damage exceeding XMax in some HT content. Most of the guys using a pro amp use some form of eq/filtering.

http://htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=18218&highlight=deq2496

[Deward Hastings]

I've got a BASH 300 driving a 315HF in 3 cu ft (an old Dahlquist DQ1W box) and it works fine . . . the amp easily pushes the driver to "mechanical" suspension noises below 15 Hz. It won't flex the windows and crack the plaster like my IB sub will, but for music it is excellent . . . as good as anything I've heard.

[oneplustwo]

Hey folks,

Now that I've finished my sunflowers and have deemed the bass capabilities more than adequate for music, I think I'm going to try to use my old receiver as a sub amp since I'll just use the .1 signal. It's an old onkyo tx-38 with 122 watts per channel at 4 ohms. Not a ton but worth a try at least. Question is, how should I hook this up? Should I Y the .1 signal and wire the L/R in parallel with the sub? (doesn't have any "bridge" verbiage on the back and I haven't found any manuals except the service manual which isn't helpful.)

[fjhuerta]

I have a BASH 300, and have had a Dayton (the one that put out 272W RMS at 4 Ohm).

I prefer the BASH. It's lighter, prettier and cooler. I've had it for 4 or more years. Zero problems.

I'd pick the Dayton 500 just becuase of the parametric EQ, though...

[john trials]

Hey folks,

Now that I've finished my sunflowers and have deemed the bass capabilities more than adequate for music, I think I'm going to try to use my old receiver as a sub amp since I'll just use the .1 signal. It's an old onkyo tx-38 with 122 watts per channel at 4 ohms. Not a ton but worth a try at least. Question is, how should I hook this up? Should I Y the .1 signal and wire the L/R in parallel with the sub? (doesn't have any "bridge" verbiage on the back and I haven't found any manuals except the service manual which isn't helpful.)

I'm just using one channel of my receiver to power the sub. The other channel is doing nothing.

[oneplustwo]

Thanks John,

Sounds like your amp is a bit more powerful than mine but I'll give one channel a shot. I'm not a huge bass head anyway so hopefully 120W into 4 ohms will be plenty for my current setup. It doesn't look like my amp is bridgeable anyway.

[john trials]

Thanks John,

Sounds like your amp is a bit more powerful than mine but I'll give one channel a shot. I'm not a huge bass head anyway so hopefully 120W into 4 ohms will be plenty for my current setup. It doesn't look like my amp is bridgeable anyway.

Mine is 200W/channel into 4 ohms, but I'm not running it anywhere near maximum. I have a medium size room, and I'm not into going deaf. I just like to get the house shaking a little during movies!

[oneplustwo]

Ah, ok. Good to know. I'll probably be fine then. Time to start building again...

[Eric S]

Hey Jason,

Those sunflowers look great - I like the "butcher block" top to the baffle! :T

For your sub, you should try using your old amp both as mono and with a "Y" cable. You might find one arrangement gives you a bit more flexibility, output, whatever. I used a 20-year-old integrated stereo amp for my sub for a number of years until I experimented with different amps for the sub. I was really surprised at how poor of a job my old amp did with the sub (it was really a cheap and junky amp, though). The difference of going to a stronger and more substantial amp was quite large. The smaller amp was unable to control my sub the way that a larger amp can. Bass notes seemed to "linger" longer than they were intended to and the older amp made nothing but noise out of the sub anywhere near 20Hz. It sounds like your onkyo is a better fit than my old amp was, but its worth experimenting with.

Eric

Hey folks,

Now that I've finished my sunflowers and have deemed the bass capabilities more than adequate for music, I think I'm going to try to use my old receiver as a sub amp since I'll just use the .1 signal. It's an old onkyo tx-38 with 122 watts per channel at 4 ohms. Not a ton but worth a try at least. Question is, how should I hook this up? Should I Y the .1 signal and wire the L/R in parallel with the sub? (doesn't have any "bridge" verbiage on the back and I haven't found any manuals except the service manual which isn't helpful.)