any one have experience with Fi IB subs

[peterS]

https://ssl.perfora.net/www.ficaraudio.com/sess/utn;jsessionid=154ab00b4949ce4/shopdata/0050_Speakers/0050_IB3/product_overview.shopscript

cant decide between these and peerless xls

[ThomasW]

The IB subs are specifically designed to be used in IB applications. Don't put them in smallish sealed or vented boxes.

[peterS]

forgot to mention I'm looking at H or U frame

[ThomasW]

forgot to mention I'm looking at H or U frame

And... ?

[peterS]

and its an IB application

[JonMarsh]

too bad no Le spec. With 30 mm Xmax, Le "might" be rather high. Sensitivity of the 18 is good, 15 so-so, and 12 fairly abysmal IF those figures are accurate. If the Le of the 18 is reasonable, it could be intriguing for that price in a dipole app. If Le is as high as one might expect, then these are just IB sub drivers. Nice ones at a reasonable price.

[peterS]

yes Ive asked them for that along with freq plots. If they cant provide that I don't feel like being the guinea pig- I was hoping someone else had tried them on here

[ThomasW]

A few hundred are being successfully used in IB subs.

[peterS]

ok thanks

[peterS]

too bad no Le spec. With 30 mm Xmax, Le "might" be rather high. Sensitivity of the 18 is good, 15 so-so, and 12 fairly abysmal IF those figures are accurate. If the Le of the 18 is reasonable, it could be intriguing for that price in a dipole app. If Le is as high as one might expect, then these are just IB sub drivers. Nice ones at a reasonable price.

they replied and stated they dont have Le or frequency response measurements. In addition no shorting rings so Ill just assume the worst....

new candidate AE IB 15" vs peerless xls 12"

[Paul Ebert]

You might want to consider this one as well:

Exodus DPL-15

[peterS]

XBL^2- been a while since ive seen that. Is the patent still owned by Dan Wiggens?

[JonMarsh]

Yeah, I've had my eye on the DPL 15 for another weird project idea- Arvo Part rising from the dead, with some twists... some of which I'm still pondering. I think it has potential, but the proof is in the measurement- I've measured several XBL^2 drivers that were distinctly not so hot with regards to distortion. The implementation isn't easy.

[ThomasW]

they replied and stated they dont have Le or frequency response measurements. In addition no shorting rings so Ill just assume the worst....

You know what they say about assumptions....

The people who make up Fi have a LONG history of making good drivers

They made the units for Blueprint (Destijl engineering), they were part of the build house that made the original XBL drivers for Adire (Resonant Engineering). Several years ago Scott and Nick left RE to form Fi (it's in the same city block as RE.

Fi can build using any motor technology they want. They specifically chose not to use shorting rings for performance reasons not to save a buck.

Unlike other companies selling subs Fi custom builds each driver to order and will recone/rebuild damaged drivers for a fraction the cost of a new unit. Besides Fi, AE is the only other company I know that offers this service

[mikela]

They specifically chose not to use shorting rings for performance reasons

Would you please expand on this.

Thanks,
Mike

[ThomasW]

This is what Scott had to say about motor designs

I have been using XBl since its inception and have built many different subs and drivers with it. I know that tech VERY well and was licensed to use it for a long time. LMT is a TC proprietary tech, so its not something Ill use. For the past couple of years I have been using the split coil approach to linear BL in subs and mids. Works as good as anything else... but even with that I have found that many people do not like the sound of a linear BL motor (but it seems on mids/midbass most prefer it). For subs it looks good on paper, but just not to many peoples ears (Ive done AB testing and 80% of people seem to like a LGLC (long gap, long coil) better). I will continue to design drivers with linear BL motors, but mostly for OEM. I have several motor/driver designs collecting dust with it, but Im not sure if they will ever see the light of day. As for a shorting coil (to be powered at the same time) I have never used in production, only in testing. I have and currently use shorting rings as well as a secondary wind on the voicecoil for adjustment as well. I may impliment a couple more tricks in the HT only stuff shortly.

[peterS]

You know what they say about assumptions....

The people who make up Fi have a LONG history of making good drivers

They made the units for Blueprint (Destijl engineering), they were part of the build house that made the original XBL drivers for Adire (Resonant Engineering). Several years ago Scott and Nick left RE to form Fi (it's in the same city block as RE.

Fi can build using any motor technology they want. They specifically chose not to use shorting rings for performance reasons not to save a buck.

Unlike other companies selling subs Fi custom builds each driver to order and will recone/rebuild damaged drivers for a fraction the cost of a new unit. Besides Fi, AE is the only other company I know that offers this service

Yes I am aware of all of this

except that I question how omitting shorting rings helps performance

the Le has to be through the roof on these without.
this seems very important given the excursion demands

I am aware that the Le on the IB (v1) was .89 mH or so iirc- so that makes me believe there was shorting rings or is this a result of split coil topology?

I wish they were more forthcoming with the info i am looking for...

i dont buy his argument with the subjective AB testing. Most people will pick a grossly misaligned sub given only initial listening impressions... with more time it becomes fatiguing but by then they have already bought it

[seattle_ice]

This is what Scott had to say about motor designs

Quote:
I have been using XBl since its inception and have built many different subs and drivers with it. I know that tech VERY well and was licensed to use it for a long time. LMT is a TC proprietary tech, so its not something Ill use. For the past couple of years I have been using the split coil approach to linear BL in subs and mids. Works as good as anything else... but even with that I have found that many people do not like the sound of a linear BL motor (but it seems on mids/midbass most prefer it). For subs it looks good on paper, but just not to many peoples ears (Ive done AB testing and 80% of people seem to like a LGLC (long gap, long coil) better). I will continue to design drivers with linear BL motors, but mostly for OEM. I have several motor/driver designs collecting dust with it, but Im not sure if they will ever see the light of day. As for a shorting coil (to be powered at the same time) I have never used in production, only in testing. I have and currently use shorting rings as well as a secondary wind on the voicecoil for adjustment as well. I may impliment a couple more tricks in the HT only stuff shortly.

Where is he using these then?

[penngray]

I have 4 Fi Q18 drivers in an IB array....they are nothing short of great.

I also own other divers like the AE AV15X, Many Original TC2000 15" drivers.

Scott from Fi is a great and honest guy that will customize his driver for use in IB designs. There are other choices for ported or sealed but for IB only Fi and AE speakers have the best choices period. Displacement is your friend when it comes to IB designs.


btw, The IB15 fom AE Speakers is a good choice too!

[penngray]

they replied and stated they dont have Le or frequency response measurements. In addition no shorting rings so Ill just assume the worst....

new candidate AE IB 15" vs peerless xls 12"

You would be making the wrong assumption.

If your choice an IB design then the AE choice or the Fi choice are head and shoulders above the rest.

[peterS]

You would be making the wrong assumption.

If your choice an IB design then the AE choice or the Fi choice are head and shoulders above the rest.

its there choice not to disclose Le and freq response graphs...

[penngray]

its there choice not to disclose Le and freq response graphs...

That is true but Scott and Fi are well known in the IB circles. We are just saying you are wrong to assume the worst.

You can choose to buy what you want but in the end Displacement is king and you wont have that with other choices. I already posted that AE makes incredible drivers so just go that route if you really need Le and Freq response graphs up front.

[peterS]

That is true but Scott and Fi are well known in the IB circles. We are just saying you are wrong to assume the worst.

You can choose to buy what you want but in the end Displacement is king and you wont have that with other choices. I already posted that AE makes incredible drivers so just go that route if you really need Le and Freq response graphs up front.

ill probably buy all four mentioned in this thread eventually
for this project ill pass

would be nice if someone had a site like zaph for subs