Finally bought my table saw... what can I do with it?

[fjhuerta]

Besides rip cuts, of course!

Got this one.

https://web.archive.org/web/20100316181549/http://www.ryobitools.com/catalog/power_tools/table_saws/BTS12S

It was the cheapest one I could find, so basically, the only one I could justify buying. :lol:

I was a bit disappointed by it - I didn't notice the table itself was plastic, not metal. And the biggest cut it can handle is 10 3/4". Still, I guess I can learn with it.

These are the issues I've had....if you could help me with them I'd be very grateful.


1) Yesterday I tried to build a box using 45° corners. Apparently, the table saw isn't that precise, since I needed a lot of force in order to place the saw at that angle - and it didn't stay that way for long. Same thing for 0° - my father had to help me place the saw and then lock it! Are all table saws the same?

2) What's the preferred method of building a box? 45° corners, or 90° cuts? I suppose 45° is used when plys like baltic birch are used, and 90° for everything else. Am I right?

3) Can I use the table saw to do facet cuts, like Jon's M8ta's?

Thanks for all help!

[Teran]

Don't force the tool. Double check the blade tilt adjustment. It should be two piece, lock and adjust. Make sure the lock is completely off before adjusting, make sure the adjust is at a good stop position, and then apply the lock.

If you don't buy your sheet goods pre-cut, then I would recommend complimenting the table saw with a circular saw of the same blade diameter. Also buy or build a locking edge guide/ruler. Then use your table saw to clean up the edges.

The first thing to make with your new table saw are all the little attachments you will need to get the most out of it. They are good practice, too. Try to use harder woods for these so they are accurate and last. Featherboard, crosscut sled, etc.

[fjhuerta]

Whee!!!

My first box came up... well, looking like a box!

Frankly, I needed some help. My father (who has no experience either) helped me build them. They are the Recession Buster cabinets. Once the glue dries I'll start doing the routing stuff.

I'm happy!

[ttan98]

Javier,

From your signature, you are located in Mexico City, if so the spread of Flu virus there must have some impact on yr life style.

Best policy is to stay in-doors and build speakers!!

Take care all the best.

[Hank]

For your safety and future enjoyment, please find someone with experience with a table saw. If you have to, go to a cabinet maker's shop and ask to observe/learn.
The effort will be worthwhile.

What do you do with it?? Make sawdust, of course! And maybe a few speaker cabinets.

[BigguyZ]

I'm going to sound like a snob here, but I'd say the first thing you can/ should do is return it, and save up to buy a better one used. Seriously, that's a horrible saw, and if you want to to any sort of project that will require accuracy and /or safety, I'd go with a contractor's saw that will have more power, weight to it... Or even a used BT3000 or BT3100, if you have one in your area. Try Craigslist...

Just my opinion, but better to wait longer and get something that will actually do you well for the next few years than to use that.

[savage25xtreme]

I'm going to sound like a snob here, but I'd say the first thing you can/ should do is return it, and save up to buy a better one used. Seriously, that's a horrible saw, and if you want to to any sort of project that will require accuracy and /or safety, I'd go with a contractor's saw that will have more power, weight to it... Or even a used BT3000 or BT3100, if you have one in your area. Try Craigslist...

Just my opinion, but better to wait longer and get something that will actually do you well for the next few years than to use that.

my momma taught me to not say anything at all if I didn't have anything nice to say.

I think the saw till work fine until you find yourself out preforming the saw i.e. wanting to make cuts more accurately than the saw will do. This is a big step up from say.... having home depot cut the boards for you... make some dust and be safe :T

[Undefinition]

I just inherited this same table saw from my grandfather a few weeks ago. I already have a simple "benchtop" table saw, so I'm sort of scratching my head as to what to do with it.

I mean, these little benchtop table saws are not terrible. They're certainly not the most accurate contraptions on earth, but like any table saw, they make building stuff go REALLY FAST!

Besides, if you plan for 1/8" of slop, a flush trim router bit will make things look like you knew what you were doing all along. :W

Still, I can't help but wish to be able to do wider rips... and maybe with better accuracy.

[chasw98]

Javier:
I got my first table saw from the side of the road where it was destined for the trash pile. I made it work and finessed it for over 2 years. Then I got a chance to get a Grizzly cabinet saw for less than $600.00 that is just perfect in cutting straight and 45 angles, etc. You will learn how to make the saw cut for you and then you will probably buy the next step up eventually. Have fun with it and be safe!

[---k---]

Flipping through a couple woodworking books at the local library and watching TV shows like WoodWorks on DIY did a lot to help me learn how to use my saw safely, easier ways of doing things, and new ideas.

And for what it is worth, I have a more expensive Rigid saw that everyone loves. I still can't make a perfectly square box. Its not the saw, it is all me - I'm a hack! I don't put much effort into getting perfection from my woodworking, because that doesn't bring me joy. I believe that someone with a lot of patients and a little extra effort can have great results while using sub-par tools.

[djg]

I have built many cabinets with an ancient Delta table saw (made in USA!). It belongs to the FBO where my company rents hangar space. The fence is just awful, needs to be squared with a construction square for each cut. The table is much bigger than yours, though. If this is all you can afford, with practice you can compensate for the saw's shortcomings.

I would also suggest that you amend your construction techniques to avoid 45 degree cuts, that might be a bit much for that saw to handle.

[1Michael]

I'm going to sound like a snob here, but I'd say the first thing you can/ should do is return it.
I would use a different adjective than snob :roll:

I have been using a cheapo Storm saw for quite awhile now with good results. Just cut slow and careful :T

[MT Speakers]

2 years ago we had our house resided. My Mom wanted a door on the side of the garage. She asked the guy doing the residing too install a door.

Now our garage is finished with insulation and the inside is paneled. He did not want to do it. So he hired an Amish friend of his to do it. I watched him do it. He cut the hole for the door thouugh the complete side of the garage with a hand saw. And it only took a short time because I watched this after school.

The Amish guy put the perfect pieces of paneling aside to install after the door was installed. My Dad measured everthing when he got home. He said everthing was cut and square to a 1/16 inch.

I asked my Dad about this. He said it is not how fancy your tools are, its how well you know how to use them.

[Dennis H]

it is not how fancy your tools are, its how well you know how to use them.

Words of wisdom! :T

[kingpin]

Its not the saw, it is all me - I'm a hack!

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Oh man!
that made my night.
i love when people can just say the truth and not bs.
:T to you my friend!

Mike

[1oldguy]

And remember,"If the women don't find you handsome they should at least find you handy".

[BigguyZ]

Man, people are sensitive here. What I meant was he could find more value from a used heavier-duty saw than he could from that Ryobi. Not only more value, but more safety, more accuracy, and more confidence. You can't compare a used cast iron saw for $200 and that plastic and aluminum saw for $100. Especially when you're looking at cutting down large panels of a heavy material like MDF.

Hey- I made my first speakers with nothing but a router and a straight edge. But if you're going to invest in tools, why not make sure you get the best value and end up with something that will do much better for you in the end?

[ahaik]

First and most important thing is you should always use one of these:

Image not available

A couple of useful links:

https://web.archive.org/web/20091212223743/http://www.woodworkingonline.com/2007/05/14/podcast-21-5-things-you-didnt-know-you-could-do-with-your-table-saw/

Video not available

The web site in the first link has a lot of useful information and videos about woodworking, just click on the different issues on the left side of the screen.

Originally Posted by ---k---
I still can't make a perfectly square box. Its not the saw, it is all me - I'm a hack!

Ryan, if you are not using a sled you should, it makes a hude difference for me in getting square cuts.

Edit:

I'm going to sound like a snob here, but I'd say the first thing you can/ should do is return it, and save up to buy a better one used. Seriously, that's a horrible saw, and if you want to to any sort of project that will require accuracy and /or safety, I'd go with a contractor's saw that will have more power, weight to it... Or even a used BT3000 or BT3100, if you have one in your area. Try Craigslist...

Just my opinion, but better to wait longer and get something that will actually do you well for the next few years than to use that.

I second that !!!
Asi.

[ThomasW]

Man, people are sensitive here.......Try Craigslist...

And at least one is insensitive to the OP's situation.

Javier lives in Mexico City. And as strange as it seems for a city of 20 million people, there are far fewer used power tools available there compared to a small mid western city in the US.

[DeathMonk]

I bought this one:

Image not available

After reading several reviews, I went with this one.. Accurate cuts (good stock fence) and easy to move--which was really important to me.

[savage25xtreme]

3) Can I use the table saw to do facet cuts, like Jon's M8ta's?

Thanks for all help!

I too would like to know how to make the facets with "standard" wood working tools. Is there a way to do it other than with a mark on the wood and a hand saw? like how JonW did the Spassvogel MT

[ThomasW]

I too would like to know how to make the facets with "standard" wood working tools. Is there a way to do it other than with a mark on the wood and a hand saw? like how JonW did the Spassvogel MT

Jon has the long discontinued Ryobi BT3100. It does the faceted cuts as a function of it's unique design.

If you search some of the threads where faceted baffles are made, you'll see some are done with tools as basic as a hand saw following a metal angle guide.

[savage25xtreme]

Ya that's basically what JonW did. I will search some more. If they are 45 degrees then I would think a jig to hold the baffle in the other angle for the side facets that slides in the miter channel would work well... Just how I envisioned it anyways.

[jyqureshi]

I bought this one:

Image not available

After reading several reviews, I went with this one.. Accurate cuts (good stock fence) and easy to move--which was really important to me.

Me too. I tried two of this portable Ryobis, first one's locking nut for the blade alignment was loose, and the second saw's blade was permanently out of alignment. It has 30" rip capacity on the right and for $250 it wasn't a bad deal at all, and recently it was on sale for $179, great deal for a starter table saw, if things are aligned in it properly.

But then I settled for that Ridgid after reading the reviews on home depot's website, a little heavier than Ryobi, but the Fence is solid, easy to align, locking the saw after angle adjustment doesn't make the blade out of alignment, that was another problem with the Ryobi.

[evilskillit]

I work part time at the Home Depot and between what I hear our customers say, my personal experience and the online reviews Ridgid stuff seems to be pretty darn good for the money, and if you register it, you get a lifetime warranty so usually when I buy a tool, if I have the cash I just go ahead and get the Ridgid stuff. Usually to get something better you have to spend quite a bit more.

In the shop at my full time job they use almost all Ridgid tools and the 18volt drills we use here have probably drilled and tapped several thousand holes in metal panels each and still work pretty darn well.

[BigguyZ]

And at least one is insensitive to the OP's situation.

Javier lives in Mexico City. And as strange as it seems for a city of 20 million people, there are far fewer used power tools available there compared to a small mid western city in the US.

Thomas,

I didn't notce the OP's location and figured he went to a local HD and would thus be in an area that would be likely to have some used tools available (as most sreas do, with CL being a valuable resource to find what's available). Given the OP's location, I now totally understand.

Please realize I was just trying to give him some honest advice- something I wish I would have gotten. I've had tools that were poor quality that worked poorly and broke down far too quickly. I was then pointed to looking for a used tool that was more heavy duty, and I've benefited from that.

I'll drop off this thread, as I don't want to go OT, but I still think the advise I gave is sound.

To the OP/ whomever: Here's a good resource about kickback, one of the primary dangers when working with a table saw. http://www.bt3central.com/articles/l...p?ArticleId=85

Make sure you read up on using your power tool prior to using it. And always wear these- Safety Glasses. :B

[fjhuerta]

Javier,

From your signature, you are located in Mexico City, if so the spread of Flu virus there must have some impact on yr life style.

Best policy is to stay in-doors and build speakers!!

Take care all the best.

Yes... it's definitely had an impact. My wife and son are at home since last Friday. I don't know what I'm doing at work - apparently, people here still think telecommuting as something out of Star Trek It's kinda scary - restaurants are closed, most buisnesses are empty and people walking on the streets are wearing masks. I wish I was at home!

I'm going to sound like a snob here, but I'd say the first thing you can/ should do is return it, and save up to buy a better one used. Seriously, that's a horrible saw, and if you want to to any sort of project that will require accuracy and /or safety, I'd go with a contractor's saw that will have more power, weight to it... Or even a used BT3000 or BT3100, if you have one in your area.

I have to say you are partly right. It's almost impossible to do 45° cuts, unless I use a set square (actually, I need to measure the angle of the saw relative to the table all the time - the table isn't accurate at all). Then again, by double-checking things, I've been able to make decent cuts. At least I can use it to learn the basics.

And yeah, the first thing I got was a mask, safety googles and a pair of gloves!

And for what it is worth, I have a more expensive Rigid saw that everyone loves. I still can't make a perfectly square box. Its not the saw, it is all me - I'm a hack! I don't put much effort into getting perfection from my woodworking, because that doesn't bring me joy. I believe that someone with a lot of patients and a little extra effort can have great results while using sub-par tools.

I surely hope so! I can't justify spending any more money than in Ryobi (cheap, cheap, cheap!). My router is fine, though it's not very accurate when setting up the depth of the cut.

I would also suggest that you amend your construction techniques to avoid 45 degree cuts, that might be a bit much for that saw to handle.

I'll be avoiding them. Considering I won't be using anything but MDF I suppose this won't be a problem. Then again, even 90° accurate cuts are a bit difficult with the table!

Javier lives in Mexico City. And as strange as it seems for a city of 20 million people, there are far fewer used power tools available there compared to a small mid western city in the US.

It's actually not that strange. Tools and other stuff are far more expensive (due to taxes, shipping, etc) over here so most DIY hobbies aren't popular - including, well, cabinet and furniture making. Most people who buy power tools do it for their jobs, and they'll use them until they literally fall apart. It's very difficult to find them used due to this situation. I'm actually amazed at the kinds of things I find when I browse Craigslist!

Ahaik, thanks for the links! They'll be extremely useful to me.

[BigguyZ]

Glad to know that we're all on the same page now

Javier, you mentioned using gloves. I've never tried that, but I've always heard it's a no-no. But making your own push block out of a scrap piece of wood is something that I would definitely recommend.

Stay safe down there!

[fjhuerta]

Glad to know that we're all on the same page now

Javier, you mentioned using gloves. I've never tried that, but I've always heard it's a no-no. But making your own push block out of a scrap piece of wood is something that I would definitely recommend.

Stay safe down there!

I didn't know that. But I guess you are right - every video I've seen by now regarding table saws never mentions gloves as safety equipment.

I found the panel cutting slide to be an extremely interesting thing...

Video no longer available

No more accuracy issues with one of those. I'm definitely building one.

[ThomasW]

Wearing gloves while operating a tablesaw is a no go....

This is the 600lb gorilla of power tool woodworking forums. You'll find lots of info there

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/forumdisplay.php?f=3

If you do a search on that forum you'll find lots of ideas for table saw sleds, outfeed tables, and all kinds of other DIY accessories

[Mike B]

So far I have built 17 speakers with my $99 cheapie "Tradesman" table saw as well as numerous other projects around the house. Got it set up on my portable sawhorse workshop out on the front porch. When not in use, I hang it up on a wall in the garage. Works for me.



Here's the latest speak, a 2.2 cu-ft vented box for a Quatro 12

[savage25xtreme]

99 dollar table saw with a 120 dollar blade? :B

[gimpy]

undefinition, you mentioned having the saw as an extra. Many people use the extra saw with a dedicated blade; i.e., maybe a dado blade or whatever so they do not have to change it out all of the time.

Also, you can google "frankensaw", not sure of the spelling. I think this is the combination of two saws put together. If I recall correctly, they used two ryobi bt3100's.

[Mike B]

Nah,

A $30 Diablo. I wore out the cheap OEM blade and replaced it with this.

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=100055325

[fjhuerta]

That table looks better built than mine!

[Bear]

Jon has the long discontinued Ryobi BT3100. It does the faceted cuts as a function of it's unique design.

It's not quite as discontinued as some might think (according to BT3Central), though it has certainly come up in price. I bought mine on sale over the Christmas holidays for about $200 less than the current price.

http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_00921829000P?vName=Tools&cName=Bench+Power+Tools&sName=Table+Saws

Wearing gloves while operating a tablesaw is a no go....

Absolutely! You don't want any loose materials snagging into moving machinery. Besides, if you need the gloves so that you can improve your gripping force, you are doing something horribly, horribly wrong with a table saw (back to your comment about infeed and outfeed tables, etc.). It may be a big tool, but treat a table saw more like a scalpel than a chainsaw.

[Biff]

helpful thing

Javier - a friend of mine built a table using an old door with a cutout that nestles around his small saw for jobsite work. It sits level with the deck and you can manuever larger pieces without them changing angle to the blade, you can clamp straight edge to the table as a fence for bigger cutlines, etc. At night he just slides the saw out and puts it away, pretty darn handy.

[JonP]

Sounds like you're getting a lot of good advice...

I'll be echoing a lot of it, but what I'd underline:

1. Get a good book, or find some good tutorials on line.. on use, safety, and jigs and techniques... and safety!!

2. Get whatever info, manual, etc.. you can for your saw, on "setup" and squaring the blade, etc. Buy a good engineering square or at least a good try square and use it to get the saw set for perfect 0deg to the table, and perfect parallel to the miter slot... Also how to adjust your fence so it's parallel to the blade...

Those are the core accuracy settings that make the saw right. Once it's dialed in right, you have a good saw, and it will be so much easier to make good accurate cuts.

There will be still a learning curve... but do a lot of practice cuts on scrap, and it will all fall into place.

The big woodworking magazines, and other sites can be good sources for projects, jigs, and tips and tricks...

And, always make yourself follow the safety guidelines... till you make them a habit. Treat that sucker with respect... cause an accident can be a split second away if you do things wrong, get distracted, or make an exception to safe practices.

And, have fun!! It's very cool to make straight, clean cuts... fast and easy!

[Undefinition]

Javier - a friend of mine built a table using an old door with a cutout that nestles around his small saw for jobsite work. It sits level with the deck and you can manuever larger pieces without them changing angle to the blade, you can clamp straight edge to the table as a fence for bigger cutlines, etc. At night he just slides the saw out and puts it away, pretty darn handy.

Biff,
I like that idea. I found this while googling "Frankensaw." I found it extremely interesting because the saw this guy used is one of the ones I have on-hand.

http://wood.jclement.ca/files/e70ea89b0577625c894ffe9ed5ef7063-15.html

Anyway, my big question about constructing a new, larger table is I don't know the best way to attach it to the bench-saw housing, and square it to the blade.

[WinstonSmith]

Glad to know that we're all on the same page now

Javier, you mentioned using gloves. I've never tried that, but I've always heard it's a no-no. But making your own push block out of a scrap piece of wood is something that I would definitely recommend.

Stay safe down there!

Actually you gave good advice. It's just that it isn't practical. Anyone who thinks tools are irrelevant hasn't done much woodworking. Nevertheless, for this fellow, things are what they are.

You are correct about gloves. NEVER wear them.

Do...
Wear eye protection.
Wear ear protection.
Wear a dust mask.

Don't...
Wear long sleeves or clothing which could be caught in the blade.
Wear jewelery which could do the same. Chains, bracelets, rings etc.

Watch out for kickback. If the blade binds the wood, it will most likely shoot out, and if you are in the way you could be looking at someone extracting a board from your abdomen. While it's not likely with what you are using, it could still rupture a spleen. Not good.

Sawmill Creek is a good place, but not exactly the only 600lb gorilla. My favorite haunt is Woodnet

If you have questions regarding tools or their use, check us out.