Trying for figure out my TSPs? Unidentified TC sounds sub

[rodH]

OK, I am in a weird situation where I bought some speakers off of fleabay for a good price.

He says they are TC2+ from Oaudio with an ECLIPSE logo, BUT they are NIB and came in Audiopulse boxes. Meaning, I know they are NOT Oaudio TC2+ speakers (I emailed them), they may not be actual eclipse version of the TC1000 because they were done a long time ago and these came with in Audiopulse boxes. I also understand that TC Sounds at the end just through some parts together and got rid of stuff, so this could be any variation on the TC1000/TC2+ plateform.

I will include some pictures below, but if that doesn't work, anyone in Southern California have one of those Part Express units to measure TSPs?

Here is the information on the listing (the guy is going off of the Oaudio site for his info, but Oaudio doesn't think they are the same):

__________________________________________________ ____________________

BNIB Pair of Eclipse, TC Sounds TC2+ 12" Subwoofers NR!

Brand New in Box, Dual 4 ohm voice coils. These are TC Sounds/AudioPulse built TC2+ subwoofers which are the same as the TC-1000 and identical to the new AudioPulse Epic which retails for over $250 each!

FS: 22.7Hz
SPL: 88.7Db
RMS: 400 watts (Can easily take 600 daily)
Xmax: 31mm peak-to-peak
Mounting Depth: 6.375"



Here is a link to a website with specs, remember, they're Dual 4 ohm. http://www.oaudio.com/TC2_PLUS.html
__________________________________________________ ___________________

[rodH]

ECLIPSE I see with this design seem to have 3" voice coils, the TC1000 I think has a 2" VC, and this picture looks more like a 2" not a 3" (My guess).

Here is the 88120DVC, the magnet looks different, and the Voice Coil definitely looks bigger:

Image not available

Image not available

[rodH]

Here is the other Eclipse that is supposed to be made by TC sounds, I actually did find the specs on this and it does in fact have the 3" Voice Coil and a different magnet it is a SW8122DVC (newer version of the 88120DVC).

Image not available

[rodH]

Here is a small picture of an actual TC1000 (notice the VC size and magnet size and shape)

[rodH]

Some information I found on an ebay auction in the Philipines on the TC1000 (not avail on the TC sounds sight any longer):

TC Sounds Subwoofer Driver
TC-1000 Dual 4Ω voice coil

From The Manufacturer
The accurate, smooth and historic TC driver

The TC-1000 is the ideal driver for anyone looking for powerful clean bass with superb quality for either the home or mobile environment. With a standard 135 ounce magnet structure, 2" wide all aluminum 4 layer voice coil, and up to 1.5" of highly linear excursion, this driver simply obliterates the competition. Its innate low distortion quality makes it seemly intended for high fidelity applications, but because of its high efficiency, impressive power handling and class leading displacement, the TC-1000 simply embarrasses retail SPL drivers costing twice the price with motors half its size! It can handle 400 watts of continuous power, but don’t be afraid to feed it 1000 clean watts as the voice coil will harness that power and deliver surprising sound pressure levels. With adequate headroom, the dynamic capability of the TC-1000 will demonstrate ultra high quality bass typically found in high end home theater subwoofers. Did we mention we even hand build these drivers in California too?

The TC-1000 subwoofers are engineered for sealed, ported or passive box enclosures and designed with medium to high power capabilities in mind. We recommend an amplifier between 200 and 1000 watts RMS per driver.

Advanced high excursion soft part system

• High excursion 8.0" linear roll poly-cotton spider
• Intergraded woven leads to prevent lead-slap
• 2" diameter, 4-layer aluminum wire voice coil with an anodized aluminum former
• Single or dual 3.7Ω (4 ohm nominal) voice coil configuration
• Lightweight brushed and powder coated aluminum cone
• 1" wide long throw, highly durable NBR surround
• High quality thermal flexible epoxies to ensure longevity which can't match the TC-1000's distortion vs. SPL performance...

Performance
• Effective motor force of 60 Newtons2 per watt (BL2/Re)
• 400 watts continuous power (1200 watts peak)
• 24mm BL XMax (voice coil, one-way)
• 37mm XMech (mechanically limited, one-way)

Key Features
• 60 Newtons2/watt Motor Force
• 400 Watts Sustained Power
• 2" Anodized Aluminum Voice Coil
• 24mm XMax
• Single Dish Aluminum Cone
• High Excursion 1" NBR Surround
• 135 Ounce Magnet Structure
• Copper Shorting Ring
• Cast Aluminum Frame
• 8.0" Diameter Suspension System

Dimensions

Driver 12TC-1000
Cutout Diameter 11.05"
Basket Diameter 12.65
Gasket Height 0.65"
Mounting Depth 6.25"
Displacement 0.09 ft3
Weight 19.9 lbs

Specifications

12" TC-1000

Qts
0.282
Qes
0.305
Qms
3.78
Fs
19hz
Res
3.70Ω
Ls
2.38mH
Lp
3.51mH
Rp
2.99Ω
Dia
240mm
Vas
132l
mms
153g
cms
460um/N
bl
15.4T*m
Spl
86.9dB

[rodH]

another pic of the TC1000

Image not available

[rodH]

and a picture and TSPs for the Audiopulse Epic (TC1000)

Image not available

Thilo Stompler of TC Sounds raises German engineering to a new level by creating the Audiopulse line. When designing the ultimate subwoofer system, it's important to choose the right driver. Whether your bass driver application is for a car, home theater, or professional sound reinforcement, Audiopulse offers solutions for just about every price and performance level.

The EPIC is redefining "entry driver" with a reference product, by delivering world-class displacement and low-distortion at an affordable price. Matched with as little as 300 watts, EPIC delivers substantial, ultra clean low frequency bass that will surprise even the most critical audiophiles.

Specifications: *Power handling: 600 watts RMS

*VCdia: 2"
*Impedance: 4 ohms per coil
*Re: 7.6 ohms (series)
*Fs: 23 Hz *SPL: 86.1 dB 1W/1m
*Magnet weight: 140 oz
*CMS: 280 uM/N
*Mms: 165 g
*BL: 19.8 Tm
*Sd: 0.050 sq. m
*Vas: 1.62 cu. ft.
*Qms: 3.90
*Qes: .45
*Qts: .42
*Xmax: 22 mm
*Dimensions: Overall diameter: 12.60", Cutout diameter: 11.05", Mounting depth: 6.21".

* Dual 4 ohm voice coils
* High temp voice coil former
* Long throw 2" voice coils
* 8" linear suspension system
* Large 2.5" shorting ring
* One piece anodized aluminum cone
* High BL promotes small box design
* Metallic clear blue triple layer powder coated frame

[rodH]

Picture of PE version of TC1000:

[rodH]

SO, after comparing the pictures, it appears to me that these are FOR sure some variation of the TC1000/Audiopulse epic. The problem is, which one is it, they claim to be basically the same thing, but even the audiopulse epic and the TC1000 TSPs are different and even PE when they were selling both, said the TC1000 is the same as the Epic (but still listed different TSPs) ?????

[Hdale85]

Hmm.... sounds like TC Sounds is selling off their stuff on ebay

Anyways those are definitely not AudioPulse as all the AudioPulse drivers have a blue frame and what not. If they were in an AudioPulse box it would have had to of come from someone from TC Sounds as the company just recently went under and they sold off most of their remaining drivers to Parts Express. Looks like you got some stuff they were doing for eclipse when all this went down and they stuck it in an AudioPulse box. I don't think they are the same as the TC2+'s either as Eclipse's stuff is usually custom done for them. Unless they used one of the left over Eclipse cones on a TC2+ basket and motor assembly? Your best bet is going to be to buy one of those measurement things from PE that you connect up to the speaker and it measures the parameters for you. Anything else is going to be a lot of guessing.

[rodH]

WHY DO THE TSPs seem to be ALL OVER THE PLACE???? Am I worrying to much about it, are they all just close enough that it doesn't matter??? Seems odd.

and these are the TSPs when PE actually had them listed on the site (pretty close to the ones above):

Specifications: *Power handling: 600 watts RMS
*VCdia: 2"
*Le: 2.49 mH
*Impedance: 2 ohms per coil
*Re: 4.2 ohms (coils wired in series)
*Frequency range: 21-500 Hz
*Fs: 21 Hz
*SPL: 89.3 dB 2.83 V/1m
*Vas: 4.66 cu. ft.
*Qms: 4.25
*Qes: 0.41
*Qts: 0.38
*Xmax: 22 mm
*Dimensions: Overall diameter: 12-5/8", Cutout diameter: 11-1/16", Mounting depth: 6-1/4".

[rodH]

Hmm.... sounds like TC Sounds is selling off their stuff on ebay

Anyways those are definitely not AudioPulse as all the AudioPulse drivers have a blue frame and what not. If they were in an AudioPulse box it would have had to of come from someone from TC Sounds as the company just recently went under and they sold off most of their remaining drivers to Parts Express. Looks like you got some stuff they were doing for eclipse when all this went down and they stuck it in an AudioPulse box. I don't think they are the same as the TC2+'s either as Eclipse's stuff is usually custom done for them. Unless they used one of the left over Eclipse cones on a TC2+ basket and motor assembly? Your best bet is going to be to buy one of those measurement things from PE that you connect up to the speaker and it measures the parameters for you. Anything else is going to be a lot of guessing.

agree, but I don't think they are Eclipse, they seem to have 3" VC, these look like 2"

Wonder if anyone around here (Orange County) has one of those PE units? Maybe a Car Stereo Shop might have one?

[Hdale85]

I'm telling you chances are you have some sort of frankenstien driver of left over parts that TC sounds is trying to get rid of.

Another thing how many posts do you need to make? In the past 15 minutes or so you have made 12 posts almost in a row in your own thread There is an edit function.

Also just to let you know AudioPulse is actually TC Sounds. They were trying to change the company name and brand and everything just before they got shut down. But anyways they are one and the same company.

[rodH]

I'm telling you chances are you have some sort of frankenstien driver of left over parts that TC sounds is trying to get rid of.

I KNOW, thats why I need to get them measured most likely

Another thing how many posts do you need to make? In the past 15 minutes or so you have made 12 posts almost in a row in your own thread There is an edit function.

1. I wanted to give AS MUCH INFORMATION as possible, I was told that there are some really sharp people here that might beable to help, so I did as much research as I could.

2. Some sites ONLY allow 2-3 pictures per reply, this is why I divided it up, is this a problem?

Also just to let you know AudioPulse is actually TC Sounds. They were trying to change the company name and brand and everything just before they got shut down. But anyways they are one and the same company.

I know, couldn't you tell by my post(s)? :T

[joetama]

I'm telling you chances are you have some sort of frankenstien driver of left over parts that TC sounds is trying to get rid of.

Another thing how many posts do you need to make? In the past 15 minutes or so you have made 12 posts almost in a row in your own thread There is an edit function.

Also just to let you know AudioPulse is actually TC Sounds. They were trying to change the company name and brand and everything just before they got shut down. But anyways they are one and the same company.

It's not like TC wasn't known for Frankenwoofering drivers. :roll:

If you do a couple searches on caraudio.com or several other forum you can see why guessing what a TC driver is can be such a mess.

I agree with getting a Woofer Tester to figure out the specs. With a lot of the car audio companies their specs aren't always the truth.

Anyway, rodH I think you need to calm down take a breath and post more carefully. It is very hard to figure out what you are doing when you post like you have.

[Hdale85]

Well apparently they used to be an ok company but they screwed me over so no good reviews will be coming from me ever But yeah I had heard some stuff and seems so far just about all of it has come out to be true. Kind of strange its never been mentioned online though. But yeah after the closure I'm sure they had all kind of left over parts that would be trash unless they tossed them together to "invent" some new woofers they could easily sell.

[joetama]

Well apparently they used to be an ok company but they screwed me over so no good reviews will be coming from me ever But yeah I had heard some stuff and seems so far just about all of it has come out to be true. Kind of strange its never been mentioned online though. But yeah after the closure I'm sure they had all kind of left over parts that would be trash unless they tossed them together to "invent" some new woofers they could easily sell.

They used to be a great company. But, they slipped and are now in ruins.

I have a TC 12OEM still sitting in a box in my shop. I need to do something with that driver.

[Hdale85]

I ordered 2 TC 10's and PR's I got the PR's but never the subs I sent back the PR's and they were supposed to send me a TC3000 15" instead and they ran out of them and weren't making anymore so I asked for a refund and never received it and then I hear they closed and are being investigated for tax evasion and what not so yeah kind of sucks. So I talked to someone I know that used to work at TC Sounds and they said it was true they were under investigation for not paying wage taxes. I don't know still kind of ticked off I suppose. At this point I know I'll never see my money. Oh well I don't let things dwell just money right?

[joetama]

Owe... Bummer man. Good luck maybe you will get a refund in the mail someday.

[---k---]

Ahhh, put them in a huge sealed box, and you'll be fine.

[Hdale85]

Heh, well when you hear they were hiding merchandise from the IRS for some reason I really highly doubt that. But hey can be optimistic I suppose. Not a huge deal going to be redoing my speakers soon and thats always fun.

[rodH]

Anyway, rodH I think you need to calm down take a breath and post more carefully. It is very hard to figure out what you are doing when you post like you have.

I apologize if I came off too frank, I was just trying to post as MUCH information as possible so people have a good idea of what I am asking. In other words, if I just posted part of the information, people would come back and ask me for more information, research etc..... SO I was just trying to give all the information possible.

[rodH]

Ahhh, put them in a huge sealed box, and you'll be fine.

WOW, are these 2 18" soundsplinters???

Wish I had room.

WOW

[---k---]

nah, I got 2 -15". I wish I had the room for 2-18" also.

[joetama]

I apologize if I came off too frank, I was just trying to post as MUCH information as possible so people have a good idea of what I am asking. In other words, if I just posted part of the information, people would come back and ask me for more information, research etc..... SO I was just trying to give all the information possible.

It is cool man. I hope I didn't seem like a jerk posting that. You just seemed stressed out about it. :W

[joetama]

Heh, well when you hear they were hiding merchandise from the IRS for some reason I really highly doubt that. But hey can be optimistic I suppose. Not a huge deal going to be redoing my speakers soon and thats always fun.

Wow, I hadn't heard that, but I'm not surprised. :roll:

[rodH]

Anyone with any other ideas?

[---k---]

Post on the PE forum looking for someone with a Woofer Tester. Someone might come out of the woodwork. If you ship one to me, I would test it for you, but that would end up spending more than buying one. Buying one for $100 would be cheaper than the money you might loose selling them, and they are a fun toy to have.

And seriously, put them in a big sealed box and be done. You can't oversize a sealed box. If you want to take a more scientific approach, take all the TS parmeters you have, model them all for a sealed box w/ Qts= ~.55-.6 and then take the biggest box you get.

[jdybnis]

I think the answer is, you have to measure them. There is no way to tell just by looking at them because they are a mixed bag of parts from several known designs.

[rodH]

I think the answer is, you have to measure them. There is no way to tell just by looking at them because they are a mixed bag of parts from several known designs.

I think you guys are right. I should sign up for the PE forum and see if anyone has one.

I can't go too large on the box, that is why I am going sealed.

[Dennis H]

You can measure them yourself if you have a voltmeter. But, if you had the technical background to be able to do that without a lot of hand holding, you probably wouldn't have dozens of posts asking for help.

http://www.linkwitzlab.com/thor-measmt.htm

[rodH]

You can measure them yourself if you have a voltmeter. But, if you had the technical background to be able to do that without a lot of hand holding, you probably wouldn't have dozens of posts asking for help.

http://www.linkwitzlab.com/thor-measmt.htm

Ummm, interesting, I do have access to a nice voltmeter. I also took some physics and other classes in college, maybe I can figure it out? :??

[joetama]

I'm sure it's not that hard to figure out.

And you get to use that nice voltmeter!

[rodH]

Dang, maybe not. Its been a long time.